LeGOATski Posted January 17, 2021 Share Posted January 17, 2021 5 minutes ago, BillsFan130 said: He’s a very good young player. He’s got flaws, (like most young players) but he’s a top 10 QB in this league and is under 25 years of age. Yes, but consider how the Ravens are using him. Are they putting him through the QB gauntlet like the Bills did with Allen the first two years? No. They paired him with Greg Roman, who's going to coddle him with a dynamic running scheme, just like he did with Kaepernick and Tyrod. So, even though he's 25 and putting up great numbers, he's not going to take that next step towards becoming an elite QB. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gunsgoodtime Posted January 17, 2021 Share Posted January 17, 2021 Is it over yet? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aceman_16 Posted January 17, 2021 Share Posted January 17, 2021 On 1/12/2021 at 9:51 PM, Jpsredemption said: This will be a real joke Saturday night when Jackson torches us. ^^this aged well!! Lmao 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PrimeTime101 Posted January 17, 2021 Share Posted January 17, 2021 Just now, Doc said: They are (and along with the Colts are the 2 best defenses they'll face in the playoffs) but the wind was a clear detriment to the Bills' passing game. Right.. So the clear answer is.. stop throwing deep balls. at least at the pace they were first half. other then that I 100% agree Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Posted January 17, 2021 Share Posted January 17, 2021 Just now, PrimeTime101 said: Right.. So the clear answer is.. stop throwing deep balls. at least at the pace they were first half. other then that I 100% agree Can't argue with that. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsFan130 Posted January 17, 2021 Share Posted January 17, 2021 Just now, LeGOATski said: Yes, but consider how the Ravens are using him. Are they putting him through the QB gauntlet like the Bills did with Allen the first two years? No. They paired him with Greg Roman, who's going to coddle him with a dynamic running scheme, just like he did with Kaepernick and Tyrod. So, even though he's 25 and putting up great numbers, he's not going to take that next step towards becoming an elite QB. I am not even saying Lamar is an elite QB, but the hate on him is surreal to me. He is inarguably a top 10 QB and is under 25 years of age, and has won an MVP, like give the kid a break bud... 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hapless Bills Fan Posted January 17, 2021 Share Posted January 17, 2021 19 minutes ago, dave mcbride said: He didn’t play well, but my god his center was a disaster. Got him injured too. Center has been a problem for the Ravens all season. Their starter, Matt Skura, got benched in Nov. after struggling with the snap. Obviously Mekari has had his own adventures. 12 minutes ago, HappyDays said: I'm not trying to dump on him. I'm just saying it is looking more and more like his style cannot carry you further than a participation trophy in the playoffs. Elite athleticism only gets you so far. Eventually you have to sit back and read the field and beat the coverage with your throw. He can't do it. You aren't, some others are. I agree overall that right now, the Ravens passing game is limited and represents a gap in their other teams can exploit 19 minutes ago, H2o said: Jackson is a quality young man, who is an amazing athlete, and enjoyed a lot of success. He's still only 24. He's going to have to get better reading defenses and as a QB in general though before he will go any further. You shut him down running and he crumbles. It's been this way for years now. I actually think Roman may be more of a hindrance in the long run if they want to actually develop Lamar. It was commented when Roman was with the Bills, by some former QBs (not sure who, but I seem to remember more than one), that there were design limitations to Roman's passing game and that what was going on with the QB didn't always match what was going on downfield. I think this is a reasonable question. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bferra13 Posted January 17, 2021 Share Posted January 17, 2021 R.I.P. Lamar. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Solomon Grundy Posted January 17, 2021 Share Posted January 17, 2021 Lamar Jackson needs his own Brian Daboll in order to ascend to the next level Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RiotAct Posted January 17, 2021 Share Posted January 17, 2021 OP is a genius Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Frankish Reich Posted January 17, 2021 Share Posted January 17, 2021 30 minutes ago, H2o said: Jackson is a quality young man, who is an amazing athlete, and enjoyed a lot of success. He's still only 24. He's going to have to get better reading defenses and as a QB in general though before he will go any further. You shut him down running and he crumbles. It's been this way for years now. I actually think Roman may be more of a hindrance in the long run if they want to actually develop Lamar. Interesting point. Here's my contrarian take on tonight's game (not on Lamar's development in general): Roman blew it by abandoning what works for the Ravens. First 3 plays of the game: 1st & 10 at BAL 25 (15:00 - 1st) (Shotgun) G.Edwards up the middle to BLT 37 for 12 yards (J.Poyer). 1st & 10 at BAL 37 (14:17 - 1st) (Shotgun) G.Edwards left tackle to BLT 47 for 10 yards (T.White). 1st & 10 at BAL 47 (13:39 - 1st) (Shotgun) J.Dobbins up the middle to BUF 44 for 9 yards (L.Wallace; T.Edmunds). 3 runs between the tackles, basically 3 first downs. Next run goes outside, playing into the Bills' strength. And then come the unnecessary passes. With the wind tonight and given that the Bills' defensive weakness is stopping the power running game, it boggles the mind that they didn't stick with what was working, and with what had proven to work against the Bills defense this year. Roman seems to want to show that he (and Lamar) can win by running a modern 2020s offense, so he got away from their strength. In bad weather like this, there's every chance that if the Ravens just stick with the run and avoid mistakes (granted, nothing much you can do about a center who can't snap the ball straight) this game is tied in the 4th quarter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Posted January 17, 2021 Share Posted January 17, 2021 11 minutes ago, Solomon Grundy said: Lamar Jackson needs his own Brian Daboll in order to ascend to the next level Jordan Palmer at least. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Call_Of_Ktulu Posted January 17, 2021 Share Posted January 17, 2021 Unless they drastically change the rules where QB that run with the football get a automatic 10 yard Lamar is done. Lamar is TT with elite athletic ability. That might get u to the playoffs but you will never win a super bowl Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Do The Reich Thing Posted January 17, 2021 Share Posted January 17, 2021 Man, I really like Lamar Jackson. The man gets criticized as much as Josh Allen by everyone. I hope he can bounce back and continue to defy expectations. He is someone I’ll always root for unless he’s playing the Bills. 7 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott7975 Posted January 17, 2021 Share Posted January 17, 2021 (edited) 38 minutes ago, BillsFan130 said: possible he wins another one. Bills figured out how to stop him hmm. Not like the huge wind had anything to do with that? Did you not notice that Allen wasn’t on his A game tonight? .. He was sacked 4 times because he couldnt read the defense. That had nothing to do with wind. He threw an INT because he stared down his receiver on a play they run all the time and never saw the corner sitting there ready to jump the ball. That had nothing to do with wind either. The guy is a great athlete but either he isnt being developed because they are happy running the football or he can't be developed because he doesn't have the arm/smarts to pass the football. Either way its not good. Stopping him means keeping him from running all over you which has nothing to do with wind either. Edited January 17, 2021 by Scott7975 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Gun Posted January 17, 2021 Share Posted January 17, 2021 18 minutes ago, BillsFan130 said: I am not even saying Lamar is an elite QB, but the hate on him is surreal to me. He is inarguably a top 10 QB and is under 25 years of age, and has won an MVP, like give the kid a break bud... Allen Herbert Burrow Rogers Watson Wilson Brady Mayfield Mahomes Prescott Soon to be Trevor Lawrence Those are the guys all GMs would take over Lamar. Then there are the maybe guys like Tua Darnold Goff Tannehill Cousins Stafford Ryan Carr He is not a top 10 QB. If he was all GMs would want him and I dont think that is the case. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsFan130 Posted January 17, 2021 Share Posted January 17, 2021 1 minute ago, Big Gun said: Allen Herbert Burrow Rogers Watson Wilson Brady Mayfield Mahomes Prescott Soon to be Trevor Lawrence Those are the guys all GMs would take over Lamar. Then there are the maybe guys like Tua Darnold Goff Tannehill Cousins Stafford Ryan Carr He is not a top 10 QB. If he was all GMs would want him and I dont think that is the case. Is this list a joke?.... 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott7975 Posted January 17, 2021 Share Posted January 17, 2021 33 minutes ago, BillsFan130 said: I am not even saying Lamar is an elite QB, but the hate on him is surreal to me. He is inarguably a top 10 QB and is under 25 years of age, and has won an MVP, like give the kid a break bud... No, he isn't a top 10 qb. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Gun Posted January 17, 2021 Share Posted January 17, 2021 1 minute ago, BillsFan130 said: Is this list a joke?.... No your a joke for thinking he is a top 10 QB. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsFan130 Posted January 17, 2021 Share Posted January 17, 2021 (edited) 5 minutes ago, Scott7975 said: He was sacked 4 times because he couldnt read the defense. That had nothing to do with wind. He threw an INT because he stared down his receiver on a play they run all the time and never saw the corner sitting there ready to jump the ball. That had nothing to do with wind either. The guy is a great athlete but either he isnt being developed because they are happy running the football or he can't be developed because he doesn't have the arm/smarts to pass the football. Either way its not good. Stopping him means keeping him from running all over you which has nothing to do with wind either. He is a vertical passer. Yes the wind had a huge impact as the bills were basically able to put 8-9 guys up close all game. INT was bad and had nothing with the wind i will give you that. But if you think the wind had nothing to do with his performance tonight, then you clearly have not watched him play much Just now, Big Gun said: No your a joke for thinking he is a top 10 QB. tua... over lamar?..... Dude..... Edited January 17, 2021 by BillsFan130 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Gun Posted January 17, 2021 Share Posted January 17, 2021 14 minutes ago, BillsFan130 said: He is a vertical passer. Yes the wind had a huge impact as the bills were basically able to put 8-9 guys up close all game. INT was bad and had nothing with the wind i will give you that. But if you think the wind had nothing to do with his performance tonight, then you clearly have not watched him play much tua... over lamar?..... Dude..... Pay attention, I put Tua in the maybe category. I'm not a Tua fan myself but I could definantly see GMs picking him over Lamar. 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Penfield45 Posted January 17, 2021 Share Posted January 17, 2021 25 minutes ago, Do The Reich Thing said: Man, I really like Lamar Jackson. The man gets criticized as much as Josh Allen by everyone. I hope he can bounce back and continue to defy expectations. He is someone I’ll always root for unless he’s playing the Bills. yup He had the back pick 6 yes but kept them in the game with those terrible high snaps. also Greg Roman has no idea how to call pass plays. Lamar is very young and will learn 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Noggin Posted January 17, 2021 Share Posted January 17, 2021 Hasn't Roman failed to develop a QB, beyond the gimmicky RPOs and Read-Options and QB designed runs, at THREE (3) different stops now? Kaepernick, Taylor, and now Jackson have all failed to progress into dangerous passers once NFL defenses adjust to the dual threat stuff. "Make him a QB" has been and is STILL the way to defense these Roman QBs. Maybe it's also the OC. Maybe. (I'm not sold, necessarily, just sayin.) 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andy1 Posted January 17, 2021 Share Posted January 17, 2021 I don’t understand the obsession some people have with trying to convince people that someone else will fail. Lamar is a talented guy with exceptional running ability and some limitations as a passer. He can still improve as Josh has. His talent will win them a lot of games. Their receiver routes are pretty basic in Romans offense too. The Bills defense was exceptional tonight. That is the story. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Frankish Reich Posted January 17, 2021 Share Posted January 17, 2021 4 minutes ago, Andy1 said: I don’t understand the obsession some people have with trying to convince people that someone else will fail. Lamar is a talented guy with exceptional running ability and some limitations as a passer. He can still improve as Josh has. His talent will win them a lot of games. Their receiver routes are pretty basic in Romans offense too. The Bills defense was exceptional tonight. That is the story. Well I hope you're ready for next weekend when the conversation will be centered on why Mahomes is simply a product of Andy Reid's scheme. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GETTOTHE50 Posted January 17, 2021 Share Posted January 17, 2021 1 hour ago, Richard Noggin said: Hasn't Roman failed to develop a QB, beyond the gimmicky RPOs and Read-Options and QB designed runs, at THREE (3) different stops now? Kaepernick, Taylor, and now Jackson have all failed to progress into dangerous passers once NFL defenses adjust to the dual threat stuff. "Make him a QB" has been and is STILL the way to defense these Roman QBs. Maybe it's also the OC. Maybe. (I'm not sold, necessarily, just sayin.) None of those guys listed could properly read a defense or throw a receiver open on a consistent basis. Roman has worked miracles to make those QBs as successful as they were. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LABILLBACKER Posted January 17, 2021 Share Posted January 17, 2021 1 hour ago, Call_Of_Ktulu said: Unless they drastically change the rules where QB that run with the football get a automatic 10 yard Lamar is done. Lamar is TT with elite athletic ability. That might get u to the playoffs but you will never win a super bowl I said from the moment he was drafted that unless he turns into a pocket qb he will eventually suffer the same fate as Vick & RG3. He's not built for the long haul. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Norcalbillsfan Posted January 17, 2021 Share Posted January 17, 2021 Honestly I like lamar, hes not cocky or aragant and he trys to win for his team. But when Harbaugh went all in on jackson for an offense i thought it was a mistake. His mvp season made me look like a fool, but I still felt like he couldn't win at the elite level with his style of play. And the bills showed it tonight, played hard nose football and completely went all in on making lamar beat you with his arm, and the bills came out on top. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Noggin Posted January 17, 2021 Share Posted January 17, 2021 1 minute ago, GETTOTHE50 said: None of those guys listed could properly read a defense or throw a receiver open on a consistent basis. Roman has worked miracles to make those QBs as successful as they were. That's definitely the broadly accepted narrative. Pretty sure I agree with it, too. Mostly. But the pattern remains. Roman's offenses plateau, rather than progress. I remember immediately after he was fired in Buffalo I waited on an 8-top table with several o-linemen--namely Incognito and Groy, but definitely another starter or two on the roster that I can't recall--and they were basically celebrating. Drinking heavily and openly pooping on Roman's play-calling, like he was a coordinator who didn't listen to his guys or focus on what they did well but wanted instead to outsmart opposing coordinators. They were not trying to hide their relief. Of course, over the years, I found Incognito in general to be louder and less professional than your average player. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Generic_Bills_Fan Posted January 17, 2021 Share Posted January 17, 2021 1 hour ago, Penfield45 said: yup He had the back pick 6 yes but kept them in the game with those terrible high snaps. also Greg Roman has no idea how to call pass plays. Lamar is very young and will learn How will he learn though? They're really not letting him...its not at all his fault Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
newcam2012 Posted January 17, 2021 Share Posted January 17, 2021 (edited) 3 hours ago, Scott7975 said: He was sacked 4 times because he couldnt read the defense. That had nothing to do with wind. He threw an INT because he stared down his receiver on a play they run all the time and never saw the corner sitting there ready to jump the ball. That had nothing to do with wind either. The guy is a great athlete but either he isnt being developed because they are happy running the football or he can't be developed because he doesn't have the arm/smarts to pass the football. Either way its not good. Stopping him means keeping him from running all over you which has nothing to do with wind either. That was pretty harsh. Lamar is a special athlete who can break a game wide open on one play. Granted its usually with his legs. He is not a great passer but he is adequate and does make plays. The wind pretty much took away much of the pass game. Even Allen struggled at times with very good protection. He was 23 for 37 for 206 and 1 TD. Not exactly great. The Lamar int was bad as he did stare down the receiver with ample time to throw. The ravens didn't execute. Several horrific bad snaps. They had many dropped balls and played very conservative on offense. The Bills had constant pressure on Lamar too. There is plenty of blame to go around. Lamar will be fine. He should improve his passing. Certainly, his legs can make up for some of his defiencies. Look at ravens record with Lamar starting. It's very impressive. He won his first playoff game too. I really don't understand the Lamar hate. Edited January 17, 2021 by newcam2012 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Starr Almighty Posted January 17, 2021 Share Posted January 17, 2021 To be fair his OL is awful and his WRs are worse. Dez? Really. Maybe if they put some players around him the opposition can't focus on the run as much. Snead lol please 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nelius Posted January 17, 2021 Share Posted January 17, 2021 It's not the end, our QB is just better. Ravens got some great things going, they just need more options at WR. Brown is kind of a bust and Willie Snead is, well pesky and pretty awesome considering his situation but he's still just Willie Snead. They've got a great D-line, decent O-line, great backfield, A+ TE in 25 year old Mark Andrews. They need a Diggs and Beasley now, basically. Bills beat a good team tonight. The Ravens should be bugging us for years to come. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monty98 Posted January 17, 2021 Share Posted January 17, 2021 1 hour ago, LABILLBACKER said: I said from the moment he was drafted that unless he turns into a pocket qb he will eventually suffer the same fate as Vick & RG3. He's not built for the long haul. Ehn if he turns into end of career Vick (Philly) I'd take that as a win for Baltimore. Once he learned to play QB in a west coast spread system like Reid ran, Vick was a solid QB. Now, if teams start following our defensive blueprint will he fade away? Last year and this year we took away his run game, and in the conditions today he clearly needed that running ability. If he can use the pocket mobility he was showing last night and throw from the pocket he may be fine. Baltimore needs a west coast scheme though I think for him to be successful Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malazan Posted January 17, 2021 Share Posted January 17, 2021 Jackson needs to be able to throw on the boundaries. He can't. The Bills showed how to beat him last season and just did it again. You'll see a lot more of it next season until he can make those deep throws on the sides. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JMF2006 Posted January 17, 2021 Share Posted January 17, 2021 1 hour ago, Nelius said: It's not the end, our QB is just better. Ravens got some great things going, they just need more options at WR. Brown is kind of a bust and Willie Snead is, well pesky and pretty awesome considering his situation but he's still just Willie Snead. They've got a great D-line, decent O-line, great backfield, A+ TE in 25 year old Mark Andrews. They need a Diggs and Beasley now, basically. Bills beat a good team tonight. The Ravens should be bugging us for years to come. They need to hope for missed assignments broken plays and blown coverages. If the Bills can do this to him the AFC North will be using this as their roadmap Good Luck Lamar you needed to work on your passing skills. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaBillsFanSince1973 Posted January 17, 2021 Share Posted January 17, 2021 not the first time the bills have knocked a QB out of a postseason game. see the "Joe who" afcc game, 1993. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
machine gun kelly Posted January 17, 2021 Share Posted January 17, 2021 29 minutes ago, jeremy2020 said: Jackson needs to be able to throw on the boundaries. He can't. The Bills showed how to beat him last season and just did it again. You'll see a lot more of it next season until he can make those deep throws on the sides. I've been saying this all week. They had a great game plan using Murphy and Epenesa as a third base LB. That was the perfect plan to bring out Lamar’s flaws. He’s had his worst two performances in two years against us. TN was able to steal our plan last year, but they couldn’t pull it off this year. Finally, this is off topic, but John Harbaugh was pure class after the game. I really like that guy. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buddo Posted January 17, 2021 Share Posted January 17, 2021 While I think that the wind helped us, in a weird way, making passing so much more difficult, and possibly being a factor in the botched snaps for the Ravens, the bottom line for the Ravens, is that as good as they can be in the run game, they really don't have a plan B when it doesn't work. Once the Bills got ahead, it was hard for them to get back into it, because they don't use all the field, with their only real weapons in the passing game, being Andrews and Brown. Admittedly the pick 6 happened at about the best time for us, but with limited options in the passing game, they were a lot easier to defend in that respect. Taron was just sitting there, and wasn't having to cover anyone. (Still an awesome play mind) The Ravens might still be capable of bulldozing their way to the playoffs for a few years yet, but they will struggle to progress further, without adding better passing elements to their offense - including pass protection, as they weren't very good there. Lamar has the arm to make all the throws, but he's not being called upon to do so, so it becomes increasingly difficult to get right, when it's needed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jpsredemption Posted January 17, 2021 Share Posted January 17, 2021 8 hours ago, Scott7975 said: ??? I was wrong. It was not hard to type that. 7 hours ago, Beast said: Come on out and take your whooping like a man! I always do. I’m not a millennial with no sense of self awareness when I’m wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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