OT: Are you concerned about Mac Jones?

[Success]

Not sure if this is appropriate for this forum, but I was curious what other Bills fans were thinking up to this point.  It's hard for me to put in perspective because I have such a psychosis when it comes to the Pats. I was worried about Jimmy G, and even Stidham.

 

But the Mac hype is officially through the roof. When I'm on general NFL boards or twitter, it seems to be accepted that he is "the best of all the rookie QB's so far," and Pats fans think they got the steal of the draft.

 

Being obsessive about these things, I watched all of the passes from their 1st 2 games. There is no doubt he is accurate, and seems poised in the pocket.  The main thing I saw was more related to coaching - they really set the plays up for him to succeed.  He takes almost no risks at all.  Most passes are short outs or check downs (not disparaging those things, because they can be effective).   I saw nothing that made me think he could do what around 20 or so current QB's could do w/ that same coaching and in that system.

 

Which, of course, reminds me of Brady's early years. Brady transcended that and became a guy who could take over games and lead big comebacks.  I can't help but ask, was that because he was developed properly, and can New England do the same thing w/ Mac?  Or is Brady just Brady, and expecting the same progression for Mac is unlikely at best?

 

Naturally, I'm hoping we don't have a Montana/Young thing going there, and it's still extremely early. I'm just curious if anyone else has any thoughts on it so far.....

 

[BillsFan4]

He’s played well but as you said he hasn’t really been asked to do a lot. Tons of short screen passes and easy completions. Credit to the Pats for putting him in a good position but I’m not scared of anything he’s done yet.

 

Lets see how he does when the Pats are down big and need to open up the offense more.

 

It'll be years before we know what Mac Jones is anyway so it’s not worth worrying about yet. And I still have faith that Allen stays the better QB between the two. Jones doesn’t have the freak arm + athletic traits Allen does. 

[r00tabaga]

Very! You saw the Miami game. Who wouldn't be concerned for this young man's well-being. 🤕🤕🤕

[GETTOTHE50]

only if hes driving on the same road as me or a loved one

[Straight Hucklebuck]

Not right now. 

 

He's a checkdown artist, and as much as New England spent in the offseason, they don't have tons of vertical speed. 

 

Now, Brady improved his arm strength over the years, so Mac Jones may be able to do that. 

[Bangarang]

He looks like a decent game manager which isn’t bad for a rookie. Right now though, I’m not worried. 

[eball]

I'm concerned for Mac Jones if he ever needs to throw the ball farther than 5 yards.

[LeGOATski]

He hasn't shown any ability to escape the pocket. He looks like the reincarnation of Matt Cassel.

 

He'll always be compared to Brady, which obviously isn't fair. If I'm concerned at all, it's that he turns out to be decent enough to steal a game from the Bills every season. 

[Logic]

No.

[dave mcbride]

He looks quite good to me. I don't like the fact that he's on the Patriots, that's for sure. Saying he's rag-armed or being set up for success seems akin to whistling past the graveyard to me. He made a lot of great throws at Bama last year that demonstrated he could play.

1 minute ago, Process said:

What a ridiculous thing to worry about right now.

Disagree. The Pats roster is very strong top to bottom and as I said, he looks good. The Bills can definitely win the division, but they're not a shoo-in. 

2 minutes ago, LeGOATski said:

He hasn't shown any ability to escape the pocket. He looks like the reincarnation of Matt Cassel.

 

He'll always be compared to Brady, which obviously isn't fair. If I'm concerned at all, it's that he turns out to be decent enough to steal a game from the Bills every season. 

He looks much better than Cassel to me. 

[Malazan]

Who?

[teef]

i don't know why, but i really want to see him get ***** up when the bills play him.  tua ***** up.

[DrDawkinstein]

No. He's simply a rookie game manager with a good defense.

 

I worry more about the Pats defense, with the returning opt-out players, than their rookie QB.

[Punching Bag]

9 minutes ago, LeGOATski said:

He hasn't shown any ability to escape the pocket. He looks like the reincarnation of Matt Cassel.

 

He'll always be compared to Brady, which obviously isn't fair. If I'm concerned at all, it's that he turns out to be decent enough to steal a game from the Bills every season. 

 

It certainly is not fair to compare him to the GOAT Cheater.  

[CuseBill]

Given the fact that he is a rookie, I think he is showing some competence and poise.  Having said that, I'm not worried about his singular ability to beat the Bills.  I am more concerned with them as a team being able to run the ball well against us and playing good defense against us, particularly if they get Gillmore back.  I think we have much more talent overall than they do (assuming everyone stays healthy) and I think we can beat them!

[Protocal69]

Mac Jones with the Pats are in a weird spot right now. Short term I feel like especially with the Bills new found pass rush he won't be too much of a threat but by the time that he could be, will bellicheat still be coaching the team to equip Matt with a defense that can compliment his style of play. 

 

I'm more concerned about Wilson but that is still predicated on the Jets not screwing it up which they are off to a good start in doing so.

[LeGOATski]

9 minutes ago, dave mcbride said:

He looks much better than Cassel to me. 

Why?

 

I mean...Matt Cassel went 10-5 with the Pats, with 63% completions and 2:1 int ratio, but took 47 sacks. He was decent, accurate, had plenty of arm, but was a statue. Mac Jones is looking exactly the same. Having a guy like that who doesn't try to overplay his hand definitely puts them in the wild card race.

[Miyagi-Do Karate]

33 minutes ago, Success said:

Not sure if this is appropriate for this forum, but I was curious what other Bills fans were thinking up to this point.  It's hard for me to put in perspective because I have such a psychosis when it comes to the Pats. I was worried about Jimmy G, and even Stidham.

 

But the Mac hype is officially through the roof. When I'm on general NFL boards or twitter, it seems to be accepted that he is "the best of all the rookie QB's so far," and Pats fans think they got the steal of the draft.

 

Being obsessive about these things, I watched all of the passes from their 1st 2 games. There is no doubt he is accurate, and seems poised in the pocket.  The main thing I saw was more related to coaching - they really set the plays up for him to succeed.  He takes almost no risks at all.  Most passes are short outs or check downs (not disparaging those things, because they can be effective).   I saw nothing that made me think he could do what around 20 or so current QB's could do w/ that same coaching and in that system.

 

Which, of course, reminds me of Brady's early years. Brady transcended that and became a guy who could take over games and lead big comebacks.  I can't help but ask, was that because he was developed properly, and can New England do the same thing w/ Mac?  Or is Brady just Brady, and expecting the same progression for Mac is unlikely at best?

 

Naturally, I'm hoping we don't have a Montana/Young thing going there, and it's still extremely early. I'm just curious if anyone else has any thoughts on it so far.....

 

it’s a smart way to develop Him. But from this, it can go either of two ways:

 

1) Future Tom Brady, or 

 

2) Future Trent Edwards. 

[Success]

Just now, Protocal69 said:

Mac Jones with the Pats are in a weird spot right now. Short term I feel like especially with the Bills new found pass rush he won't be too much of a threat but by the time that he could be, will bellicheat still be coaching the team to equip Matt with a defense that can compliment his style of play. 

 

I'm more concerned about Wilson but that is still predicated on the Jets not screwing it up which they are off to a good start in doing so.

 

This is a good point. I think the chances that Mac becomes an elite QB are slim; he'll probably end up in the Jimmy G mode (who is a good QB, but would likely be better if he was on the Pats still).  

 

But by the time he gets to a point of being more than a game manager, BB might be retired or close to it.  Without BB, it's a whole different equation.

 

[BillsDude]

Um, throwing -5 to 5 yard passes freaks me out. I am shivering right now thinking about this kid who looks like he has no confidence to do much more. 

[msw2112]

I have not seen Jones play much this year.  He was very good at Alabama, but was playing behind an NFL offensive line and had NFL running backs and receivers at his disposal, when the opposition mostly did not.  He appears to be a smart player who is very coachable and has enough athletic ability to do the job.  A competent NFL player, but not likely a star who is going to set the world on fire.  I am not concerned.

 

His college profile is similar to that of Jake Fromm.  Jones was obviously drafted much higher, but who knows, if Fromm had the opportuntity to come to a team with a good defense and running game and was asked to make short throws and be a game manager, perhaps he could do what Jones is doing.  Fromm came to a team where his role was clearly limited to being groomed to be a backup, and the COVID situation last year, plus the availablity of a guy like Trubisky this year, has pushed him down from a #2 to a #3.

Edited September 22, 2021 by msw2112

[LeGOATski]

Just now, Miyagi-Do Karate said:

it’s a smart way to develop Him. But from this, it can go either of two ways:

 

1) Future Tom Brady, or 

 

2) Future Trent Edwards. 

3) Future Matt Cassel.

[Rico]

I believe that if the Bills lose a game right now, they have no one to blame but themselves… so no QB scares me, not even Mac Jones.

[PromoTheRobot]

I'm more concerned the Patriots will revert to some of their previous "tactics" and the league will look the other way, as they have always done.

[Rc2catch]

He’s doing what is asked of him so far. I don’t have anything negative to say. 
But we shouldn’t be concerned with anyone honestly. This team is built to beat anyone. We shouldn’t be in fear or concerned over other teams and certainly not their rookies. 

[Miyagi-Do Karate]

7 minutes ago, LeGOATski said:

3) Future Matt Cassel.

True— that is the middle mediocre “meh” way. Floor is Trent Edwards though, for sure. 

[Gugny]

No.

[oldmanfan]

Not in the slightest.  

[uninja]

[billybob71]

[JaCrispy]

His ball placement appears legit...reminds me of a young Tom Brady 

[Miyagi-Do Karate]

I watched his highlights/ all passes of his first two games. In game 1, he had maybe 1 downfield attempt, and had 2 in week 2. By downfield, I mean about 20 yards. 
 

He seems to Do a nice job at throwing short screens, curls, and dump downs. I suspect the way you confuse him is to run a lot of zone and take away a lot of the underneath stuff, and mix in a lot of confusing pressure looks. 
 

re pressure, he beat the blitz pretty well against Miami, by basically throwing quick dump offs. When the jets blitzed, the pats ran a lot of screens. 
 

I don’t know how he will develop, but I suspect that like any young QB, you can really rattle Him and throw him off his game. 

[dave mcbride]

29 minutes ago, LeGOATski said:

Why?

 

I mean...Matt Cassel went 10-5 with the Pats, with 63% completions and 2:1 int ratio, but took 47 sacks. He was decent, accurate, had plenty of arm, but was a statue. Mac Jones is looking exactly the same. Having a guy like that who doesn't try to overplay his hand definitely puts them in the wild card race.

Cassel was a very, very stiff player with a slow release. Jones is more compact, more fluid, more accurate, and already better at digesting quickly what's in front of him. He's not Michael Vick, but he's clearly better on his feet than Cassel. Cassel had a couple of attributes, but the limits on his game were more numerous than Jones's. Don't forget that the 2008 Pats' roster was coming off a 16-0 season and completely loaded still.

Edited September 22, 2021 by dave mcbride

[mushypeaches]

Always go back to the classic Mike Tyson quote:

 

"everyone has a game plan until they get punched in the mouth"

[Freddie's Dead]

No.

[foreboding]

Who seriously, except Brady, thought he'd Brady would become what he has? The realist in me says Mac Jones is a nice QB...maybe even franchise, in a controlled system. His ceiling is probably Matt Ryan. All in, a solid choice.

[GunnerBill]

49 minutes ago, dave mcbride said:

He looks quite good to me. I don't like the fact that he's on the Patriots, that's for sure. Saying he's rag-armed or being set up for success seems akin to whistling past the graveyard to me. He made a lot of great throws at Bama last year that demonstrated he could play.

Disagree. The Pats roster is very strong top to bottom and as I said, he looks good. The Bills can definitely win the division, but they're not a shoo-in. 

He looks much better than Cassel to me. 

 

I agree he looks good. Poised, making smart decisions and accurate. I think his ceiling is a kind of Matt Ryan type and most people would sign up for his career. But the Bills have a better, more talented, guy so I wouldn't say concerned.

[transient]

Am I concerned? It depends, is doughboy near my lunchbox?

 

[Bleeding Bills Blue]

I thought he played alright against Miami with what i saw.  

 

A few things to note - 

• No player on NE has an average depth of target of greater than 8 yards(Buffalo has 4 players, i doubt there's anyone in the league throwing passes shorter than this).  6 of the 8 targeted players have an ADOT of 3 or less.  318 of the 467 yards were yards after the catch.  165 of buffalos 449 passing yards were yards after catch.  
• Jones is averaging 3 air yards per pass attempt.  And completing passes at a little under 3 yards per completion.
• The entire team had 260 yards and 17 first downs against the jets.  That would be worse than the average yardage output that the jets put out in 2020, and just about the same with regards to first downs.  The jets defense is bad.

[Nineforty]

I haven't watched a snap of his yet. So no, I'm not worried, he's trash.