The curious case of: Devin Singletary

[947]

Singletary missed the blitz pickup on Josh's strip/sack. After that, I imagine having a patchwork OL that was getting dominated led to Moss getting more plays due to his pass-pro skills.

[Sammy Watkins' Rib]

12 hours ago, SydneyBillsFan said:

I believe that he is criminally underrated.

 

Give him 20 carries a game and watch us grab the number 1 seed.

 

I lean towards this as well. 

26 minutes ago, 947 said:

Singletary missed the blitz pickup on Josh's strip/sack. After that, I imagine having a patchwork OL that was getting dominated led to Moss getting more plays due to his pass-pro skills.

 

Well that is interesting. And a good find. Definitely a problem if it is a trend. But I don't recall Devin having issues in pass-pro in the past. 

[NewEra]

7 minutes ago, Sammy Watkins' Rib said:

 

I lean towards this as well. 

 

Well that is interesting. And a good find. Definitely a problem if it is a trend. But I don't recall Devin having issues in pass-pro in the past. 

He’s usually solid in pass pro

[Brianmoorman4jesus]

The obsession with this unnecessary RB rotation is the reason we can’t run. It’s completely pointless. Nobody can get into a rhythm when they are out of the game every other series. I fully understand the point of giving a guy a rest for a play or two. But that’s not even close to what we do. This coach refuses to let anyone be the RB and rotates guys every other possession. What’s worse, we are rotating in a guy like Moss constantly. He’s a complete zero and does nothing but kill drives and momentum. It’s almost as if McDermott has never watched back what our run game looks like.  Anyone that has been around football would wonder why the good back is on the sidelines for half the game. No other team does that *****. It drives me crazy. That’s why we can’t run the ball.

[ColoradoBills]

2 minutes ago, Brianmoorman4jesus said:

The obsession with this unnecessary RB rotation is the reason we can’t run. It’s completely pointless. Nobody can get into a rhythm when they are out of the game every other series. I fully understand the point of giving a guy a rest for a play or two. But that’s not even close to what we do. This coach refuses to let anyone be the RB and rotates guys every other possession. What’s worse, we are rotating in a guy like Moss constantly. He’s a complete zero and does nothing but kill drives and momentum. It’s almost as if McDermott has never watched back what our run game looks like.  Anyone that has been around football would wonder why the good back is on the sidelines for half the game. No other team does that *****. It drives me crazy. That’s why we can’t run the ball.

 

The snap count numbers do not show that.  Devin is getting the same number of snaps that Derrick Henry is getting from the Titans.

Touches are another subject but as I said earlier it's more a game situation thing than an RB preference IMO.

[Marvin]

I think those who mentioned the weather and those who mentioned pass protection because of the patchwork O-Line are right for this past week.

[Augie]

10 minutes ago, ColoradoBills said:

 

The snap count numbers do not show that.  Devin is getting the same number of snaps that Derrick Henry is getting from the Titans.

Touches are another subject but as I said earlier it's more a game situation thing than an RB preference IMO.

 

They want to develop the short passing game as evidenced by the the run they took at FA McKissic from Washington and drafting Cook in the 2nd round. Devin gets a lot of touches that way, but that is only one measure of a RB.

 

As far as judging our RB’s in the run game, I think that’s very difficult to do because the OLine isn’t doing their job. Hopefully we get healthy, Kromer starts to make some progress, and we can stop ripping our hair out!   

 

Bottom line……..Devin is no Benjamin Button!

 

 

.

Edited October 1, 2022 by Augie

[mjt328]

Bills are not a running offense.  Bills are not a balanced offense.

They are a pass first, pass second and often pass third offense... only using the running game to keep defenses off balance.

 

When they do run, it's often a read-option where the QB has the ability to pull and take the ball himself.

I think defenses tend to cheat towards the RB in these situations, meaning that Josh Allen more often than not ends up the runner.

 

The few times we do see a typical handoff to the RB, the coaching staff likes to have a committee approach.

 

Devin Singletary easily has the best vision of the group.  He's also elusive and good at making people miss.  The problem is that he's not very fast, not exceptional as a pass-catcher, and not big enough to grind tough out the tough yards.  So even though he's by far the most productive guy, he's also got a limited skill-set.  The coaches haven't given up on Zack Moss, and really want him to end up the goal line/short-yardage guy.  They are also trying to gradually sprinkle James Cook into the mix, because he's got a lot of upside on passing downs.

 

Edited October 1, 2022 by mjt328

[Scott7975]

7 hours ago, gjv said:

I truly like Singletary and feel he is a valuable member of the Bills. But for this Super Bowl run season, I would gladly trade a second-round pick for Barkley.

 

While likely a better back, I dont think it helps much because this line is not good at run blocking.

[boyst]

11 hours ago, GunnerBill said:

It isn't curious. They don't run much because their run blocking sucks. 

 

The only curious bit is why Moss gets the second series every week despite clearly being a less dynamic runner.

 

I don't think Devin is in the doghouse at all. The Bills are not and are not about to be a running team. 

Didn't read all the thread. Saw this as a good post to open a 2nd tier to this with the following:

 

If we remember last year motor didn't start running until later. It wasn't until Nov he began to really produce. By the end of December and in January our offense shifted.

 

There is still time to have Singleterry run. We haven't needed him to run yet. Kromer and Dorsey have said they like the 12 packages.  Give it time. 

 

[Freddie's Dead]

2 hours ago, No_Matter_What said:

He had 67 snaps and 18 touches last week. How is he in the doghouse?

 

We talkin' 'bout running game heah.

[ArtVandalay]

https://www.playerprofiler.com/nfl/devin-singletary/

 

The fact is Singletary is just not that good. He is one of the least athletic RBs in the entire league, and he's  undersized. 

 

Many Bills fans don't want to hear it because they like to over rate their own instead of looking at players critically and unbiased. 

 

He leaves so much opportunity for yardage on the field it's gross. He loves to dance and gets run down from behind. He's horrible at eating up open space. He's poor at running up the middle. 

 

Coaching staff does a great job scheming up some outside runs for him but you can only scheme so much. He's severely limited as a player and the coaching staff knows this and plays him accordingly. 

 

They already drafted his replacement in Cook who will bring some much needed athleticism to this backfield. I expect Cook to get the most touches in the backfield after the bye. 

[No_Matter_What]

1 hour ago, Freddie's Dead said:

 

We talkin' 'bout running game heah.

Ok so he had 9 carries, Moss had 4 and Cook had one.

 

How is he in the doghouse again?

[Freddie's Dead]

It's not about total carries, it's about how the Bills offense comes to a grinding halt every time Moss goes in.

[3rdand12]

3 hours ago, Scott7975 said:

 

While likely a better back, I dont think it helps much because this line is not good at run blocking.

this is the sore thumb in Bills territory.

They have not had a decent O line to be either good at running nor especially good at pass blocking over the last few years.
 hard to judge a RB under these conditions.
The ball gets in the hands of any RB out of the backfield and he already saying wtf ?
 

[Allen2D̶i̶g̶g̶s̶TBD]

4 hours ago, 947 said:

Singletary missed the blitz pickup on Josh's strip/sack. After that, I imagine having a patchwork OL that was getting dominated led to Moss getting more plays due to his pass-pro skills.

Singletary and Moss are both very good in pass protection. I think Devin just wasn't expecting Dawkins to get beat that quickly on the edge (because it doesn't happen very often) He may have been assigned to pick up interior D-linemen considering we had a patchwork interior o-line with all the injuries.

[T master]

16 hours ago, Special K said:

 

What do you guys think is the reason for his decreased playing time?

 

Is Ken Dorsey not a fan of him?

 

Is it due to the fact he is in the final year of his contract, and he is not in the Bills future plans?

 

Is there a three way running back competition going on to determine who will be the eventual primary back?

 

Or is it something else?

 

Thoughts? 

 

It just seems they think we have Josh so screw it & the increasing thought that it's no longer a run game that can score huge points but it is something that definitely is a need if you are going to be a championship team ! 

 

Every team that has won a Super Bowl has had some version of a stud in the RB position & i think Motor can be that guy but they just get away from it IMHO way to soon .

 

I know there are those here that will poo poo it & say just air it out every play but i feel motor has shown if used correctly with in the scheme he is a very valuable piece of the championship puzzle but they use Moss on a lot of the plays i wish they would just get rid of him !

 

1 play Moss you can depend on him for 1 good gain per game and after that he's done ... Use him for a draft pick & use Motor & Cook !

[Mr. WEO]

a real head scratcher

[Straight Hucklebuck]

I think you have to trace this to the beginning with Sean McDermott.

 

He came to Buffalo trumpeting a physical run game, in snowy weather.

 

The FO went out and signed Mike Tolbert, Chris Ivory.

 

Singletary was made to sit and watch 36 year old Frank Gore pound away at 3.5 yards per carry.

 

Then comes the same type of plodder back that McDermott loves in Zack Moss.

 

And I think it’s McDermotts desire for a physical run game that continues to put Zack Moss on the field.

 

Singletary has been the best RB on the team in 2019, 2020 and 2021 and this offense has been best when he gets all the available carries. I thought the Bills finally learned this in 2021, but they’re still holding on. 

 

Going forward I agree with others on this thread, Moss needs to be inactive on Sundays.

 

I think you can keep Singletary as the starter for now, with James Cook taking all Moss reps. However, if we start to see Cook breaking plays, then I am hoping the Bills don’t hesitate and start utilizing Cook.

 

In some ways this is the same situation as Jacksonville. Finding the right balance between steady James Robinson, and Travis Etienne, although Singletary hasn’t been as Touchdown productive.

 

I do think the Bills could stand to run more, simply to reduce the number of hits on Allen, and to prepare for the Playoff games where you need more contribution that just Allen trying to be the Hulk out there and others standing and watching. 

 

 

[Thurman#1]

On 10/1/2022 at 2:43 PM, Special K said:

 

What do you guys think is the reason for his decreased playing time?

 

Is Ken Dorsey not a fan of him?

 

Is it due to the fact he is in the final year of his contract, and he is not in the Bills future plans?

 

Is there a three way running back competition going on to determine who will be the eventual primary back?

 

Or is it something else?

 

Thoughts? 

 

 

 

He's had 139 snaps, which is 64% of all of our offensive snaps. 

 

That's not what anyone should call decreased playing time. Especially as he had 60% last year.

[JoshAllin]

1 hour ago, Thurman#1 said:

 

He's had 139 snaps, which is 64% of all of our offensive snaps. 

 

That's not what anyone should call decreased playing time. Especially as he had 60% last year.

Yeah, just checked he is in the top 6 for offensive snaps, behind Barkley, Mixon, Mccaffery and Taylor. Since coaches aren't using him much as a runner they're probably using him more to block for Allen and Allen is the top qb in the league right now so can't be that bad

Edited October 2, 2022 by motorj

[uticaclub]

There’s no curious case, he’s not that good

[LeGOATski]

"It was Moss's turn."

 

- Chan Gailey, somewhere

[Iverwig]

I think its the fact that the Bills don't run the ball much.  I think they need to run the ball more than what they have been.  Motor is the best back, but none of it matters if you don't run the ball a lot.  I think if we had Saquan Barkley or Jonathan Taylor they still wouldn't run the ball a lot.

[Fan in Chicago]

With our poor run blocking and because we have aQB like Josh, we will never focus on the run game.  I believe Allen said that part of our passing game is a glorified running game.  I did notice he has been throwing short passes to the RBs and we are getting YAC. Not a bad idea.  But I still think we need better run blocking to be able to truly run when we need to

[ArtVandalay]

22 hours ago, Brianmoorman4jesus said:

The obsession with this unnecessary RB rotation is the reason we can’t run. It’s completely pointless. Nobody can get into a rhythm when they are out of the game every other series. I fully understand the point of giving a guy a rest for a play or two. But that’s not even close to what we do. This coach refuses to let anyone be the RB and rotates guys every other possession. What’s worse, we are rotating in a guy like Moss constantly. He’s a complete zero and does nothing but kill drives and momentum. It’s almost as if McDermott has never watched back what our run game looks like.  Anyone that has been around football would wonder why the good back is on the sidelines for half the game. No other team does that *****. It drives me crazy. That’s why we can’t run the ball.

I agree. But don't worry the best back will get much more run after the bye..  that's when Cook should take over for the 2 JAGs.

[Milanos Milano]

Can’t wait to move on from Singletary and Moss. Cook hasn’t shown all that much either. 

[Warcodered]

 

[mrags]

On 10/1/2022 at 1:43 AM, Special K said:

 

What do you guys think is the reason for his decreased playing time?

 

Is Ken Dorsey not a fan of him?

 

Is it due to the fact he is in the final year of his contract, and he is not in the Bills future plans?

 

Is there a three way running back competition going on to determine who will be the eventual primary back?

 

Or is it something else?

 

Thoughts? 

He pretty much sucks so…

[SACTOBILLSFAN]

16 hours ago, Iverwig said:

I think its the fact that the Bills don't run the ball much.  I think they need to run the ball more than what they have been.  Motor is the best back, but none of it matters if you don't run the ball a lot.  I think if we had Saquan Barkley or Jonathan Taylor they still wouldn't run the ball a lot.

Because passing is far and away more efficient than even the greatest running game. When you have a QB like Josh Allen calling more run plays should never be a thing. That being said, this team throws more than league trends would indicate, but they've been horrendous on 1st and 2nd downs because of this weird fascination with YAC. Josh is most effective pushing the ball down the field and its not particularly close. 

 

EDIT: I mentioned it in another thread but the Ravens have a horrific pass defense on intermediate and deep passes but best in the league at stopping short passes, yet we insisted on throwing short for the entire first half. It's why Josh's numbers look bad if you're just box score scouting.

Edited October 3, 2022 by SACTOBILLSFAN
Forgot to add something

[Aussie Joe]

55 minutes ago, Warcodered said:

 

Sounds like a 2nd contract coming Motor’s way…

 

Amirite? 

[L Ron Burgundy]

I like Singletary but our run game gets way too many runs between -3 and + 2 yards.   A lot is blocking. 

 

This may be nuts but I hope we can iron it out in one of our few easier games.  Need to see if Cook is for real too.  He may be a guy that just needs more reps.  He also may be a jag.

[ganesh]

2 hours ago, L Ron Burgundy said:

I like Singletary but our run game gets way too many runs between -3 and + 2 yards.   A lot is blocking. 

 

This may be nuts but I hope we can iron it out in one of our few easier games.  Need to see if Cook is for real too.  He may be a guy that just needs more reps.  He also may be a jag.

In the 1st month we have played some of the best defense's in the NFL (Last year and this year).....It would only be expected that we will be matched against tough opponents.  

[JerseyBills]

5 hours ago, Warcodered said:

 

I think Motor is a helluva back. He can do it all. Very reliable 

We're just a pass 1st team.

[Artful Dodger]

3 hours ago, JerseyBills said:

I think Motor is a helluva back. He can do it all. Very reliable 

We're just a pass 1st team.

 

And bright with plenty of situational awareness.  He had an opportunity to score a TD, but he had the sense to go down on the 2 yard line this week.  He's a smart player.

 

Contrast this with McKenzie who failed to get out of bounds on the last play of the Miami game. 

[Niagara Dude]

The Bills must know that both Singletary & Moss are just not fast enough and not the answer at RB position,  those who don't agree should answer why would the Bills spend a 2nd rounder on Cook if they truly believed in Moss & Singletary. Singletary is a solid player, maybe not a feature RB and Moss could be out of league in the next couple of years. Anyone else tired of watching him on 3 & short and prefer they just cut him and elevate Duke Johnson or maybe sign a street guy.

3 hours ago, JerseyBills said:

I think Motor is a helluva back. He can do it all. Very reliable 

We're just a pass 1st team.

Does not have enough burst to the hole to be a feature back in this league

[Beck Water]

On 10/1/2022 at 12:43 AM, Special K said:

 

What do you guys think is the reason for his decreased playing time?

 

Is Ken Dorsey not a fan of him?

 

Is it due to the fact he is in the final year of his contract, and he is not in the Bills future plans?

 

Is there a three way running back competition going on to determine who will be the eventual primary back?

 

Or is it something else?

 

Thoughts? 

 

? So far this season Singletary is averaging a higher % of snaps than last season 69% in 2022 so far vs 60% in 2021

73% vs Mia

88% vs Bal

 

So his playing time is increasing

 

[Heels20X6]

On 10/1/2022 at 2:10 PM, NewEra said:

He’s usually solid in pass pro

 And miles better than Moss at it.

[Beck Water]

2 hours ago, Artful Dodger said:

Contrast this with McKenzie who failed to get out of bounds on the last play of the Miami game. 

 

Let it go, Man.  The real problems there were the holding penalty that put the Bills from the Dolphins 43 to their own 47, and the lack of protection (cuz exhausted backup linemen, one playing without an ACL) that prevented Allen from hitting Diggs beyond the FG target line.   If you listen to McKenzie's interviews, he understood the situation very well, he also was very well aware that if he ran backwards OOB it wouldn't stop the clock OR gain needed distance.

[Beck Water]

20 hours ago, IronMaidenBills said:

Can’t wait to move on from Singletary and Moss. Cook hasn’t shown all that much either. 

 

I was watching the KC game last night where some 7th round pick named Isiah Pacheco was picking up 5.7 yds per carry, and the light bulb flickered:

 

Maybe the problem isn't entirely our RBs. 

Maybe the fact that Bienemy, a former RB, is the OC of the KC Chiefs, has something to do with it.

Maybe our OCs just aren't crafting a very good run game.