NFL coach ‘not sure’ Bills’ Josh Allen can consistently win as a passer

[BullBuchanan]

1 hour ago, Gregg said:

 

I would like to see Allen playing behind a solid OL like Mahomes does. 

He had a line that edged out the chiefs in 2020 and we still lost to KC. Allen is a very good QB, but the difference between him and Mahomes is more than O-line play. If Mahomes retired today, he'd already be one of the greatest of all-time. Allen isn't in that conversation and his star would fade rather quickly as he'd be remembered more for potential than accomplishments thus far.

[Success]

"NFL coach admits he doesn't watch Bills games"

 

[90sBills]

2 hours ago, Doc said:

I don't feel like clicking the link.  What idiot said this?  

Probably the same guy last offseason that said Mahomes is a 1 read qb. Let’s hope for the same result with Allen. 

[Nextmanup]

This whole conversation reminds me of the time, a few years ago, Terry Bradshaw dissed Josh on national TV.

 

He was literally outside on that stupid set they build and go on prior to the game.  He's standing out there with the other guys, and it came time for Terry to mention his 3 second sound byte for the segment.

 

He said: "For me, [as a QB] you are either accurate or not accurate, and I don't think Josh Allen is accurate" or words to that effect.

 

I keep thinking of that clip every now and again.

 

I really hate Terry Bradshaw in general and find him to add NOTHING to a football broadcast.

 

He's also dumber than dirt.  I don't know how he keeps his job.

 

 

[NoSaint]

If you gave Josh Tom Brady’s wheels, I’m not sure what he would be as a qb today… 

 

but he does not have them and is an excellent qb

[HereComesTheReignAgain]

Knowing that Allen plays his best with a chip on his shoulder...Does anyone think that the anonymous DC could be....

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

McDermott?!

[Chicken Boo]

3 hours ago, Gregg said:

 

I would like to see Allen playing behind a solid OL like Mahomes does. 

 

Even then, Mahomes takes the underneath stuff when it is available to him.  Josh, not so much.  

 

Things to take into consideration.  

[JDubya76]

If an anonymous supposed coach/executive that the writer says said it, it must be true. After all it is posted on the internet and everything on the internet is the truth. I am sincerely worried, previous performances be damned.

 

 

Clickbait garbage, I feel shame for even clicking the link.

Edited August 7, 2023 by JDubya76

[JakeFrommStateFarm]

3 hours ago, Doc said:

I don't feel like clicking the link.  What idiot said this?  

They never named the coach

[Ed_Formerly_of_Roch]

IMO that is the one thing that separates Allen from others like C Newton, Lamar Jackson, etc.  People here often post how Allen is one run away from a potential career ending injury, see Cam Newton, look what happened to him.  To me that is the one difference with Allen, he has the arm talent to still win. He may need to work a slight amount more on accuracy, but he can still be a good starting QB in the league even without running.  Likely too give a couple more years and the mental part, anticipating certain things will also improve some too so the need to run will go down.

[Shaw66]

3 hours ago, Warriorspikes51 said:

I love him, but his completion % needs to be closer to 70% like it was a few years ago.  Having WR's actually catch certainly helps 

Absolutely.  I agree with whoever that coach was who said what he said.  

 

To be an elite QB, you must be elite at moving the ball consistently with your arm.  Allen was not that last season.   The elite QBs - Brady, Peyton, Rodgers, don't have to run to be elite.  Rodgers was an effective, opportunistic scrambler, but he wasn't a runner.   But they all were great game managers and highly accurate throwers.   They had high completion percentages, in part because of accuracy, but in part because they knew the way to win was to get a completion, any completion, on every play.   The completion is more important than the yards gained.   

 

Allen didn't do that last season.   Now, we all can talk about the receivers and the oline, but Brady certainly did not consistently have great receivers, and Rodgers didn't either.   And they didn't have consistently great olines, either.   What they did do was take the easy completion that the defense gave them, play after play.   They made really easy throws a lot of the time.   Josh has to learn to do that, play after play.   It's great that he's one of the most talented throwers ever, but really that's just a plus, just like his running is.  At the core of his job is getting completions.   

 

His completion percentage has to go up.  

25 minutes ago, Nextmanup said:

This whole conversation reminds me of the time, a few years ago, Terry Bradshaw dissed Josh on national TV.

 

He was literally outside on that stupid set they build and go on prior to the game.  He's standing out there with the other guys, and it came time for Terry to mention his 3 second sound byte for the segment.

 

He said: "For me, [as a QB] you are either accurate or not accurate, and I don't think Josh Allen is accurate" or words to that effect.

 

I keep thinking of that clip every now and again.

 

I really hate Terry Bradshaw in general and find him to add NOTHING to a football broadcast.

 

He's also dumber than dirt.  I don't know how he keeps his job.

 

 

Dumb he may be, but he was absolutely right.  

[DieHardBillsFan]

3 hours ago, VaMilBill said:

I honestly think the problems with his passing last season stem from the inability of Dorsey to run a creative scheme. Especially utilizing underneath routes. 
 

I do think Josh could get way better if he were to also look short more often, though. 

Dorsey wasn't the issue here. Josh's hurt elbow affected this more than anything. More checkdowns will be an improvement this year as well.

Edited August 7, 2023 by DieHardBillsFan

[Bongo]

I couldn’t agree more (wink, wink). All opposing D coordinators should hang on every pearl of wisdom this genius puts out there.

 

[Allen2Moulds]

23 minutes ago, Shaw66 said:

Absolutely.  I agree with whoever that coach was who said what he said.  

 

To be an elite QB, you must be elite at moving the ball consistently with your arm.  Allen was not that last season.   The elite QBs - Brady, Peyton, Rodgers, don't have to run to be elite.  Rodgers was an effective, opportunistic scrambler, but he wasn't a runner.   But they all were great game managers and highly accurate throwers.   They had high completion percentages, in part because of accuracy, but in part because they knew the way to win was to get a completion, any completion, on every play.   The completion is more important than the yards gained.   

 

Allen didn't do that last season.   Now, we all can talk about the receivers and the oline, but Brady certainly did not consistently have great receivers, and Rodgers didn't either.   And they didn't have consistently great olines, either.   What they did do was take the easy completion that the defense gave them, play after play.   They made really easy throws a lot of the time.   Josh has to learn to do that, play after play.   It's great that he's one of the most talented throwers ever, but really that's just a plus, just like his running is.  At the core of his job is getting completions.   

 

His completion percentage has to go up.  

Dumb he may be, but he was absolutely right.  

I generally agree with almost everything you write, but have to disagree a little bit here, not the whole post. Just this.

 

1. NE almost always had a great Oline in front of Brady. Obviously a passing team with Brady at the helm, but the min you paid too much attention to Brady, they would rush for over 200 yards. They seemed to do that to us, on at least a few occasions. For as much credit that Brady gets, they were also very dominant/physical in the trenches on both sides. Also can't forget they had Gronk, and always seemed to have elite slot options. But yes, generally speaking, Brady could get it done with less.

 

2. Rodgers on the other hand, always had good to great weapons in the passing game, and a good to above average running game. GB olines, maybe not elite, but certainly a level or 2 above ours, especially when it comes to run blocking.

 

I think a lot of Allen's running comes from the short comings of the oline. Teams do not respect our run game and constantly dare us to run, which puts Allen at a big disadvantage, when teams can sell out vs. the pass. He's taken advantage of this, and don't believe this has anything to do with his lack of ability as a passer, but I would never say that Allen is at the level of Manning, Brady, or even Rodgers, when it comes to processing. I still put him above Burrow, and in that top tier.

 

Edited August 7, 2023 by Allen2Moulds

[Dr.Sack]

Ironman wins every way.

[FLFan]

Totally idiotic take.  I hope we play this particular Coach this year.  

[dollars 2 donuts]

3 hours ago, sonyab1974 said:

Has anybody seen this?!!

 

https://fanrecap.com/nfl-coach-not-sure-bills-josh-allen-can-consistently-win-as-a-passer-3/?e_md5=a679792a76c5caf823aeb68ac7b1b858&e_sha1=e56a975658a4508fb67d2e0534afcfb55ff48a3c&e_sha256=189e039a45c6e388df61b11bd06bcd95476a0ba40c2f888ee5ff43514a2235a5

 

 

The 138 passing TD, 54-24 record guy can't win as a passer.

 

 

[eball]

3 hours ago, Beck Water said:

 

Wow.  There are 32 defensive coordinators in the NFL (well...maybe 31?).  So because a few of them have a bad take, that means a defensive minded head coach is bad?  That's logical (Not!).

 

I sure hope you don't have a position where people management and employee evaluation is part of the job,

 

 

He has a huge, admitted personal bias against McD.  You really can’t take anything he says about McD seriously because he can’t help himself.

 

[BigAl2526]

Allen is a great QB who can also run.  I agree that Lamar Jackson needs to run to be able to function well as a passer, but I think Allen is in a different category.  I think Jalen Hurts started out more like Lamar Jackson, but is evolving into a more accomplished passer.  I don't really follow the Eagles closely enough to know how far along he is in that development.  I do admire Hurts. He got benched at Alabama because Nick Saban thought Tua Tagovailoa was a more natural passer, but Hurts moved on and proved he was good enough to be an NFL starter.

[Mr. WEO]

3 hours ago, pennstate10 said:

 

So yeah, this guy is clueless. 

it’s 6 guys….

Edited August 7, 2023 by Mr. WEO

[BUFFALOTONE]

This is Hogwash, the .13 seconds game should have told you everything you need to know. 

[Punching Bag]

4 hours ago, Beck Water said:

 

Wow.  There are 32 defensive coordinators in the NFL (well...maybe 31?).  So because a few of them have a bad take, that means a defensive minded head coach is bad?  That's logical (Not!).

 

I sure hope you don't have a position where people management and employee evaluation is part of the job,

 

 

And the poll was not just DCs but he is citing that in attempt to support argument against having a DC become a HC.

 

 

[eball]

Trash.  If there is actually a DC who believes this that’s a sad state of affairs for the franchise in question.

 

[GoBills808]

1 minute ago, eball said:

Trash.  If there is actually a DC who believes this that’s a sad state of affairs for the franchise in question.

 

I mean there are Bills fans who believe this

[Airseven]

Nothing wrong with the quote. Allen belongs in “tier 2.” And yes, the issue with him remains inconsistency, primarily related to accuracy and decision making. 

[eball]

1 hour ago, Airseven said:

Nothing wrong with the quote. Allen belongs in “tier 2.” And yes, the issue with him remains inconsistency, primarily related to accuracy and decision making. 

 

Hi-freaking-larious.

 

It’s amazing the lengths to which some trolls will go to get a reaction.

 

 

 

Edited August 7, 2023 by eball

[Utah John]

IIRC, it was Mahomes who threw a late interception against the Bills, preventing the Chiefs from coming back to win in last year's game.  

 

The only thing I can pin on Allen last year was his late fumble against the Vikings, after our D line somehow mounted a goal line stand.  That gave the game away.  Other than that, I can't think of a loss in any game, regular season or playoffs, where Allen had a chance to win or to close out a game, and failed.  

[Don Otreply]

1 hour ago, eball said:

Trash.  If there is actually a DC who believes this that’s a sad state of affairs for the franchise in question.

 

Makes one think that there is a village out there embarrassingly looking for one of their “citizens” 

 

😁

[mannc]

3 hours ago, Nextmanup said:

This whole conversation reminds me of the time, a few years ago, Terry Bradshaw dissed Josh on national TV.

 

He was literally outside on that stupid set they build and go on prior to the game.  He's standing out there with the other guys, and it came time for Terry to mention his 3 second sound byte for the segment.

 

He said: "For me, [as a QB] you are either accurate or not accurate, and I don't think Josh Allen is accurate" or words to that effect.

 

I keep thinking of that clip every now and again.

 

I really hate Terry Bradshaw in general and find him to add NOTHING to a football broadcast.

 

He's also dumber than dirt.  I don't know how he keeps his job.

 

 

In the words of the great Hollywood Henderson, Bradshaw couldn't spell "cat" if you spotted him the "c" and the "a"... 

[ngbills]

Josh is never gonna be the typical qb. Some people think that is what you have to be to win for the long haul. He still relies on the off script play. He still will miss an easy pass. He will make the wrong read. But he will make up for it when he does something amazing a play later. It is fair to ask what will happen in 5 years or more when the ability is not there? Will he be as good a qb without that attribute. Time will tell. I still take him as my qb. 

[Buffalo716]

And I'm pretty sure that nameless coach will never be a head coach in the NFL 

[Success]

I have also seen that more pundits and fans that I'd imagine barely have JA in their top 5 now. Some don't even put him in that group.

 

It's all kind of funny.  Choosing a hot take over objective information has become ingrained at this point. The Cincy game is now what people think JA is capable of.

 

Sometimes, I get a little annoyed. But then I remember how it is when either Allen or the Bills are overhyped.

 

I'll take the alternative. Better to be underestimated.

 

[Roundybout]

Was the head coach Urban Meyer? Maybe Ken Wisenhunt? 

1 hour ago, Utah John said:

IIRC, it was Mahomes who threw a late interception against the Bills, preventing the Chiefs from coming back to win in last year's game.  

 

The only thing I can pin on Allen last year was his late fumble against the Vikings, after our D line somehow mounted a goal line stand.  That gave the game away.  Other than that, I can't think of a loss in any game, regular season or playoffs, where Allen had a chance to win or to close out a game, and failed.  

 

Maybe the first Dolphins game? Otherwise agreed. 

Edited August 7, 2023 by Roundybout

[DCofNC]

5 hours ago, Beck Water said:

 

Although it does have to be pointed out (and this applies to Burrows as well) that "solid is as solid does".  Allen does his O-line no favors at times; if he took the short pass and the checkdown more at times, his line would look better.

 

I mean, I'm not saying they'd magically look great, but they'd look average or a bit better.

 

And Spencer Brown would still be an issue.

Absolutely agree, be it him, or the game plan, he holds the ball way too long, especially when it’s obvious the O-Line is being eaten alive.  Example, Bengals playoff game.   What the Bengals did the year before with Burrow hitting the 3rd step and the ball coming out, managed to cover their line deficiencies, until he had to force the ball down field late in games, then the poop stains showed.   The Bills need to have a quick passing game on tap at very least.  I don’t know if what we saw last year was JA or Dorsey, but I sure hope they get it remedied this year.

[PBF81]

It's probably Belichick.  

 

He seems to know all bout the importance of QBs that can pass well to win.  He has a degree from the school of hard knocks  

 

 

[AlfaBill]

1 hour ago, Utah John said:

IIRC, it was Mahomes who threw a late interception against the Bills, preventing the Chiefs from coming back to win in last year's game.  

 

The only thing I can pin on Allen last year was his late fumble against the Vikings, after our D line somehow mounted a goal line stand.  That gave the game away.  Other than that, I can't think of a loss in any game, regular season or playoffs, where Allen had a chance to win or to close out a game, and failed.  

He did throw a bad pass at Miami in week three that could’ve been the winner. That said JA is a top tier QB. 

[Doc]

6 minutes ago, PBF81 said:

It's probably Belichick.  

 

He seems to know all bout the importance of QBs that can pass well to win.  He has a degree from the school of hard knocks 

 

Belicheat?  The one whose defense surrendered a TD on every drive it faced in that playoff game?  No chance.  He'd give his left nut for a QB like Josh.

[MJS]

9 minutes ago, PBF81 said:

It's probably Belichick.  

 

He seems to know all bout the importance of QBs that can pass well to win.  He has a degree from the school of hard knocks  

 

 

Belichick knows better than any coach out there how elite Josh Allen is.

[AlfaBill]

1 hour ago, eball said:

 

Hi-freaking-larious.

 

It’s amazing the lengths to which some trolls will go to get a reaction.

 

 

 

He’s a toad. 

[PBF81]

1 minute ago, Doc said:

Belicheat?  The one whose defense surrendered a TD on every drive it faced in that playoff game?  No chance.  He'd give his left nut for a QB like Josh.

 

That's what I meant.  Bad humor apparently.  

 

With Jones he realizes the value of a passer.  

 

 

1 minute ago, MJS said:

Belichick knows better than any coach out there how elite Josh Allen is.

 

Yes yes, easy chief.  Poor attempt at humor on my part.  

 

Geez ...