Elite Slot WR Kincaid.

[John from Riverside]

2 minutes ago, CountDorkula said:

The draft pick is probably really really good. The usage of the draft pick looks really really bad.

Yes, there has to be some kind of way to get a Kincaid more involved

[Bubba Gump]

Wait, who are we talking about? 

[Billz4ever]

3 minutes ago, Donuts and Doritos said:

Why wouldn't a TE be the target on the 2 pt conversion attempt? If you don't use them then, when are you going to? Beane keeps getting players the coaches don't use (it's not as bad as Lions 1st pick sitting a bench, but it's still not good enough). 

That play call sucked.

 

Should've been Harty running it anyway.

 

Shakir caught it and froze.  

[newcam2012]

40 minutes ago, Process said:

Has Kincaid caught a pass more than 10 yards down field yet? 

 

Supposed to be an elite offensive weapon. 

 

So far, Dorsey has no idea how to use him.

Look at LaPorta in Detroit. 

8 minutes ago, Billz4ever said:

That play call sucked.

 

Should've been Harty running it anyway.

 

Shakir caught it and froze.  

Harty has been disappointing too. 

[CountDorkula]

13 minutes ago, John from Riverside said:

Yes, there has to be some kind of way to get a Kincaid more involved

I don’t even know what to think anymore. I’m watching Zack Moss look like Jonathan Taylor reincarnated, Sam LaPorta catching touchdown passes every single week and yet the bills can’t find running back on a regular basis, or use their highly touted tight end

[The Frankish Reich]

1 hour ago, FireChans said:

All off-season we heard about the 12 personnel, the mismatch splitting out wide, his hands, how open he could get etc etc.

 

Hell, there were threads giving this dope a nickname. 
 

Any reason to think Kincaid isn’t a better version of Tommy Sweeney in this offense so far?

Tommy Sweeney? Come on. I think he's at least as good as Tyler Kroft in that one game when he was healthy

[FireChans]

16 minutes ago, John from Riverside said:

When we lose, there doesn’t appear to be much good
 

Sam LaPorta is playing on a ***** team where he’s actually being put in the offense

Detroit is better than us lmao

[Bangarang]

1 minute ago, FireChans said:

Detroit is better than us lmao

Ben Johnson >>>>>> Ken Dorsey

[MPT]

34 minutes ago, Big Turk said:

 

Let's wait until he plays a full season before we go off the rails shall we?

 

He is on pace for something like the 5th most catches of a rookie TE ever.

 

He's on pace for 400 yards and zero TDs. That's a 1st round bust regardless of position. It's not his fault though. He should have had double digit targets today based on the matchup and they gave him 2 short ones.

[CincyBillsFan]

7 minutes ago, Bangarang said:

Ben Johnson >>>>>> Ken Dorsey

But to be fair Johnson may be the best OC out there.

 

[nedboy7]

After week four we were talking about going 10-1, after week five we’re talking about the whole team is a bust. Idiotic all around. 

[RyanC883]

this looks like the Elam pick all over. 

[Jerome007]

I just don't get why he always has super short routes, unless we don't see his longer ones. But all his catches are short. Good point about the TE (non) use in goal line situations. 

[CEN-CAL17]

Man, LaPorta in Detroit had a great day…. Which pisses me off more!!!

[wppete]

Dorsey just refuses to use him. Pathetic. 

[CEN-CAL17]

50 minutes ago, CincyBillsFan said:

But to be fair Johnson may be the best OC out there.

 

Personally I think McDermott should be on the hot seat… obviously he’s not, but just like the end of last year I feel the same. I don’t think Dorsey under McDermott is superbowl caliber. I just don’t think it’s ever gonna happen. 
 

I’m not saying they suck, just saying there is way better OCs. 

[SirAndrew]

This entire offense is predicated on Allen and Diggs demolishing the defense. They’ve got nothing when that doesn’t happen, and Dorsey doesn’t know how to use anyone else. Other players only get involved when Diggs is putting up big numbers. It’s all up to Diggs to open up the offense. 

[ChronicAndKnuckles]

1 hour ago, Process said:

Has Kincaid caught a pass more than 10 yards down field yet? 

 

Supposed to be an elite offensive weapon. 

 

So far, Dorsey has no idea how to use him.

He’s a rookie. Sometimes players need a little time to develop. I feel like he’s being eased in there fine. People forget that he’s extremely limited in the blocking department. Those little 5 yard catches are more important than u think. 

[LabattBlue]

I want the best guys on the field every play and targeted as much as possible.  That is Diggs, Davis & Kincaid.  Screw Harty, Sherfield, Morris, Knox, Shakir and the RB group.  
 

I don’t need the ball spread around, or everyone getting snaps.  
 

Stop screwing around throwing the ball to these clowns.  None of them are going to make game changing/game winning plays. 

Edited October 8, 2023 by LabattBlue

[Einstein]

2 hours ago, FireChans said:

All off-season we heard about the 12 personnel, the mismatch splitting out wide, his hands, how open he could get etc etc.

 

Hell, there were threads giving this dope a nickname. 
 

Any reason to think Kincaid isn’t a better version of Tommy Sweeney in this offense so far?

 

For the season, the Jags give up twice the amount of yards per play against 11 personnel than 12. 

 

[FireChans]

Just now, Einstein said:

 

For the season, the Jags give up twice the amount of yards per play against 11 personnel than 12. 

 

But he’s elite

[Solomon Grundy]

1 hour ago, CincyBillsFan said:

But to be fair Johnson may be the best OC out there.

 

Ben Johnson has a consistent running game. Dorsey and the Bills keep trying to make Cook work. Detroit's TE seems to be a more consistent pass catcher too

[CincyBillsFan]

1 hour ago, Solomon Grundy said:

Ben Johnson has a consistent running game. Dorsey and the Bills keep trying to make Cook work. Detroit's TE seems to be a more consistent pass catcher too

To be fair the Lions rookie TE is being made a part of the game plan in ways Kincaid is not.  It seems to be me that when targeted Kinkaid is catching the pass.

 

[Chicken Boo]

The hype around Kincaid was so ridiculous.  Not even Hockenson did much his rookie year.

[AlCowlingsTaxiService]

28 minutes ago, Chicken Boo said:

The hype around Kincaid was so ridiculous.  Not even Hockenson did much his rookie year.

Wait. Didn’t the hype machine convince you that a first round corner that couldn’t crack the active roster was actually a secret weapon that would play at a pro bowl level once needed?

[Straight Hucklebuck]

5 hours ago, FireChans said:

All off-season we heard about the 12 personnel, the mismatch splitting out wide, his hands, how open he could get etc etc.

 

Hell, there were threads giving this dope a nickname. 
 

Any reason to think Kincaid isn’t a better version of Tommy Sweeney in this offense so far?

Yeah that’s over.

 

He can catch dump offs.

 

5 games in and we haven’t seen a route with any depth yet.

 

I still have no gauge on his game speed. 

We’ve yet to see a real route where he does anything real. 

 

We’ve got a $10M Tight End we don’t use, and a 1st around Tight End that catches 2-4 passes a game for 20 yards. 

[newcam2012]

9 minutes ago, Straight Hucklebuck said:

Yeah that’s over.

 

He can catch dump offs.

 

5 games in and we haven’t seen a route with any depth yet.

 

I still have no gauge on his game speed. 

We’ve yet to see a real route where he does anything real. 

 

We’ve got a $10M Tight End we don’t use, and a 1st around Tight End that catches 2-4 passes a game for 20 yards. 

Can't even agree with this. So true. 

[Xwnyer]

3 minutes ago, newcam2012 said:

Can't even agree with this. So true. 

Brilliance by Dorsey

[RunTheBall]

Dorsey was a friggin waste product today. I’ve been defending him first 4 games because his game plans were legit and Josh crapped the bed the first game when there were plays to be made. This one was an absolute disaster. He has ZERO ability to utilize the tight ends, can’t get away from the shotgun runs, can’t adjust when his original plan gets stymied. It’s criminal how Kincaid is being used. We don’t even see Knox hit the seams, everything is an out or a dig route. Ask my wife - since Dorsey took over I can call 75% of the plays. That’s absolutely ridiculous and I’m just an armchair Coach/GM. Defensive coordinators don’t have to guess much with Dorsey, we just have better talent than most so we overcome his lack of ingenuity. I’ll give him a few more games because he has shown some growth this season but this game was mostly on him and he f’n sucked.

 

[Jerry Jabber]

I’d like to see a pass to Kincaid that’s20+ yards. We finally got to see a deep pass to Harty today instead of the dink and dunk crap.

[KDIGGZ]

Elam is a bust. Oh wait this is a Kincaid thread. Bust, bust. Can't wait for this year's draft pick!

[PBF81]

6 hours ago, mrags said:

He’s awesome. It all just take the coaching staff 4 seasons to use him. Great draft pick. Take a guy that you don’t plan on using. Most McDermott thing ever. 

 

LOL 

 

It's funny because it's true.  

 

 

5 hours ago, zow2 said:

So far we’ve seen Reuben Kincaid.  I need Dalton.

 

... come on be happy!  

 

 

5 hours ago, Billz4ever said:

I know it's still early, but it's starting to feel like the Hines/Cook situation last year.

 

Beane drafts Cook and brings in Hines and talks about weapons in the passing game out of the backfield, then we never threw to the backs.

 

I swear it seems like Dorsey and Beane are just not on the same page.

 

If your draft picks don't match what you're trying to do, what are we doing?

 

I'd like to know what page they are on.  

 

 

Edited October 8, 2023 by PBF81

[DrPJax]

5 hours ago, Roundybout said:

Dorsey won’t use him outside of dippy flat routes and blocking. He’s one of the worst OCs in the league 

     Agree. This guy has great hands and under someone like Reid , would probably be flourishing.   I was always a Frazier critic , always very unimpressed with the Edmunds project and feel very vindicated with both changes this year.  Dorsey is the same to the offense as Frazier was in limiting the top end of the D, mark my words after seeing patterns now developing.   Have to admit tho i think Kincaid is a little “ softer “ than i expected after hearing all the overly glowing reports from the reporters/ content creators covering the Bills. May need a year to adjust to the physicality of the nfl. Was disappointed to see him not fight thru a tackle early in the game on third down and was driven out a yard short resulting in another 3 and out as the game was beginning.   If you cant drive thru or break that db tackle , then how bout being  smart enough to run the route to be beyond the sticks to begin with?  

 

     Many times they have run short , underneath routes with him and last week was his most successful converting those to first downs. Really looks to need some time to develop, but that was slightly unexpected after hearing all the post draft hype.  I still cant help but feel tho that he is being hindered, under utilized by Dorsey , and after seeing Dorsey fall flat once again today, i am  having an increasingly hard time seeing a vision of Dorsey leading this O to at one time be consistent and on the other hand believing he wont be out coached in a one loss and done playoff scenario.  

     He has games where he cant adjust to adversity in game , only to look better the next week. Not sure that is a recipe to success in the hunt for a Lombardi, and he may hang on with the bills much like Frazier as I don’t see him being some sought after HC prospect while not advancing with a talent like Allen.  All the homers will be coming for me on here as they can never handle an objective opinion, but let’s see who is right as time passes. I would be happy to be wrong , and want to be regarding this as it’s a win-win scenario,;  just not impressed when these bad offensive output games keep occurring at random intervals as DORSEY has these unexplainable clunkers.  It really has a feeling of deja vu to me like FRAZIER on the o side as i watch many examples of more creative play calling and schemes all across the league. Bills have poor timing in developing an unproven OC in the prime years of a SB chase with a true franchise Qb. 

[Mrbojanglezs]

6 hours ago, Process said:

I hate to be that guy I really do. But Laporta just caught a 31 yard TD. And has two TDs today. 

 

If we don't have an OC that knows how to use TEs, then we shouldnt be giving one $13M a year, and spending a 1st and 4th round pick on another. 

 

Beane and Dorsey need to get together and got on the same page, because they clearly are not. 

 

Wasn't Dorsey the one pushing for more 12 personnel? 

[JROC INTEL]

7 hours ago, SCBills said:

It’s fair to question the Kincaid selection. 
 

Were 5 games in.  Nobody has any idea what the plan is with 12 personnel.  
 

We bludgeoned 3 mediocre/bad defenses and looked like a JV offense against the two defenses that can stuff the run… which is something 12 personnel is supposed to unlock. 

 

He was a first round pick as a weapon on a team without a defined #2.  
 

Long season.  Still time for that role to develop.   But so far, this team is apparently a “finesse” 12 personnel offense.  That’s not gonna fly when it matters. 

I read your posts a lot and think you have one of the highest football IQ’s here. What immediate changes would you make on offense?

[Straight Hucklebuck]

7 hours ago, FireChans said:

All off-season we heard about the 12 personnel, the mismatch splitting out wide, his hands, how open he could get etc etc.

 

Hell, there were threads giving this dope a nickname. 
 

Any reason to think Kincaid isn’t a better version of Tommy Sweeney in this offense so far?

Let’s bring in the Bills Automatic Excuse Generator Sal Capaccio to explain again how the Bills have wanted this for years because they signed Jacob Hollister 37 years ago. 

[HappyDays]

You don't think Kincaid can make a simple downfield play like this? I have no idea why we've relegated him to 5 yards or less check downs.

 

Here's a crazy (awful) stat:

 

Does Dorsey actually know how to use 12 personnel? Or is he just using it because he feels obligated? We paid one TE $13 million a year and used a 1st + 4th rounder on another. Why can't Dorsey get them more involved?

 

Edited October 9, 2023 by HappyDays

[Einstein]

7 hours ago, sven233 said:

And we have our guy running dump off routes all game.....

 

 

 

Copied by the 49ers just 8 hours later. That was fast!

 

 

 

[Brand J]

40 minutes ago, HappyDays said:

You don't think Kincaid can make a simple downfield play like this? I have no idea why we've relegated him to 5 yards or less check downs.

 

Here's a crazy (awful) stat:

 

Does Dorsey actually know how to use 12 personnel? Or is he just using it because he feels obligated? We paid one TE $13 million a year and used a 1st + 4th rounder on another. Why can't Dorsey get them more involved?

 

I said at the time I thought it was a bad extension. Not because I thought Knox was a bad player, but because Dorsey/Allen had never utilized the TE all that much, so signing him for $13M/yr wasn’t going to magically change that. It was right around the time Knox’s brother passed and the franchise needed some uplifting news, so I don’t know if that played into it. I will say whenever a ball pops out of a receiver’s hands and hits the ground, I’m tired of seeing Knox or Davis on the other end of it. It’s grown very old.

[Solomon Grundy]

5 hours ago, CincyBillsFan said:

To be fair the Lions rookie TE is being made a part of the game plan in ways Kincaid is not.  It seems to be me that when targeted Kinkaid is catching the pass.

 

I was referring to Knox😎