New stadium will have PSLs for season ticket holders

[eee1776]

Enjoy the next two years/ PSL's are a diaster to blue collar fans. This results in Corporate lower level seating, Ive seen this first hand in Charlotte. Better get a second job.

[dwight in philly]

Time marches on. Rich Stadium was built for 20 million ,, 1973. the NFL  is more than just a football league , its a lifestyle for a great amount of the populace. . i am from a past generation that watched the AFL, the NFL , in not that context.  I love Buffalo, and want the Bills to stay obviously , so its "bend over" .. .. people can complain about "rich owners" .. "taxpayers" all that.. bottom line , it wont affect most " everyday life" if they get it done .. which i hope they do.. 

[TheFunPolice]

Anyone complaining about tax/public money going to the stadium should remember that 1.1 billion dollars of their tax dollars went to Yankee Stadium.

 

Why should WNY suffer to "prove a point"? 

 

Edited September 24, 2021 by TheFunPolice

[Curt]

I read recently a couple of articles who both studied PSL's. Their conclusion was that In almost every cases it's a very bad investment for the buyer.

[Doc]

3 minutes ago, Curt said:

I read recently a couple of articles who both studied PSL's. Their conclusion was that In almost every cases it's a very bad investment for the buyer.

By that token, buying a ticket is a bad investment when you can see the product on TV for free. 

[muppy]

3 hours ago, Jester said:

I wonder if the PSL will allow them to open up season tickets to people outside the 716.  

I would like to know the answer to this too.

[DrDawkinstein]

41 minutes ago, Curt said:

I read recently a couple of articles who both studied PSL's. Their conclusion was that In almost every cases it's a very bad investment for the buyer.

 

If anyone is thinking of a PSL as a true investment, then Ive got some homemade bitcoins to sell them. Half off current market value even.

 

 

Best case scenario with a PSL is you get your money back if/when you find someone to buy your tickets instead of turning them back in.

[stuvian]

you can thank Jerry Jones 

[Augie]

47 minutes ago, Curt said:

I read recently a couple of articles who both studied PSL's. Their conclusion was that In almost every cases it's a very bad investment for the buyer.

 

I would never consider it to be an investment. I would consider it part of the cost of entertainment. People are willing to pay for entertainment. I can find better investment options. 

[BillsShredder83]

2 hours ago, wjag said:

 

For sure.  There is an entire market place set up to resell.  The waiting list in Baltimore for seasons is 3,000 long.  So if you want to jump the waiting list, you go to the marketplace to buy someone's seasons and their PSL.  The PSLs are all sold out in Baltimore.  No shortage of folks wanting the tix.

If you're the type of person who's getting seasons regardless, then that's great news.

 

It's discouraging to the lower middle class guy that struggles keeping them year to year, as his one justified form of entertainment. I feel like that's a little less than half of our fan base. 35-40%ish if I was to make a guess

2 hours ago, ColoradoBills said:

 

It looks like there are 3rd party PSL resale sites out there.

FWIW.

http://www.seatdibs.com/

Wish GB was on there to compare. Might not be on the site with something to do with the community owning the team? Maybe there's no PSL fee, it's just a right to purchase seasons minus the fee, that everyone is on the waiting list for 🤔

[without a drought]

At least you still get to sit outside in Orchard Park.

 

I think they may be regretting their stadium decision by 2035.

[BillsShredder83]

1 hour ago, Curt said:

I read recently a couple of articles who both studied PSL's. Their conclusion was that In almost every cases it's a very bad investment for the buyer.

I mean the word investment there is pretty vague, and depends on perspective.

 

Investment as in, growing money. No, absolutely terrible lol ever hear of anyone adding PSLs to their 401k? 😆

 

Investment as in ability to go to games. Yes I think it's that. People looking at this like it's just another expense are being short sided. A fee is when you pay and get ZILCH in return.  If venture to say 95% of the time you are going to atleast break even on a PSL, or make a few bucks on it.

To the "it's just a fee crowd", ok then pay it and I'll keep the title to the PSL... oh wait, you want it? Oh it has value you can extract capital back from? Yes? Than acting like it's a fee is stupid. It's inconvenient, and annoying.

I'm willing to be inconvenienced and annoyed to build a stadium, because that's the only way we're keeping the team.

[Max Fischer]

7 hours ago, BuffaloBillies said:

What a business. I would love to see the skid marks in front of me if I told my clients, "Yes, I want your business, but you first need to pay me in order for me to take your business."

You mean the NFL and other major sports teams are not like other businesses?  Thanks, this is a helpful exercise. 

3 hours ago, Curt said:

I read recently a couple of articles who both studied PSL's. Their conclusion was that In almost every cases it's a very bad investment for the buyer.

But PSL are not an “investment” so . . .”

[Giuseppe Tognarelli]

7 hours ago, Virgil said:

I don’t care how many teams do it.  This is the definition of greed 

Sure is. They can 100% afford to NOT do this and not even feel the financial hit; instead, they are going to price MANY fans out. It's unethical, selfish, greedy behavior. Just because it's lawful and common doesn't make it right.

Edited September 25, 2021 by Giuseppe Tognarelli

[Estro]

I live in Southern NJ, about 6.5-7 hours from the stadium and have had season tickets for 20 years.  I tend to go to 2-4 hone games and sell the others usually on Stubhub.

 

Stubhub used to charge about 20% (10% taken from the seller, and a 10% markup to the buyer) 10 or so wears ago. Not exactly cheap, but you could manage to make a little profit on the seats you sold.  Now, stub hub is charging 40-48% (15% taken from seller and a 25-33% markup to the buyer). This has evaporated any ability to cover the cost, as all the profit gets vacuumed up by StubHub.

 

I was already on the fence about keeping my seasons and I'm pretty certain PSL's will be what does me in. Won't be able to justify forking that type of dough over when I know I have no ability to recoup the money for the games I don't go to.

[BaaadThingsMan]

I hate this.

 

The Bills and NFL will be making a ton more money with a new stadium. 

 

Pegulas net worth and Forbes evaluation of the team will likely go way up as well. 

 

It's greedy. 

 

 

***** PSLs 

[billsfanmiamioh]

6 hours ago, Curt said:

I read recently a couple of articles who both studied PSL's. Their conclusion was that In almost every cases it's a very bad investment for the buyer.

Yep of course it is. Anyone that thinks of it as investment probably has a couple time shares in Mexico. It is however a reality of the modern NFL and if you want to play you’ll have to pay. There will be enough people willing to pay. There’s a reason why this stadium will be 60-62k not 70-72k…They know how many people will buy em and how much they are willing to pay. 

[Passepartout]

Question is will this become a reality?! Hope it is as it is way beyond long overdue.

[BarleyNY]

12 hours ago, DrDawkinstein said:

Is anyone surprised by this?

 

At least it's only a one-time charge and transferable.

Totally expected it.  The issue arises when the team has an extended rough patch.  Then the buyers for PSLs dry up and fans who move away or no longer want to buy season tickets have to eat the cost of the PSL.  Then it reverts back to the owners who can sell it again when the team gets better and the market picks up.

 

PSLs not only pass along some of the cost of the stadium to fans - which is fair - but they also are a nice revenue stream for owners.  They very much encourage season ticket holder to keep buying when the team falters and they are a nice boost when a team emerges from a long term slump. 

[Curt]

I live near Seattle and the Seahawks sold licenses when they built their stadium 20 years ago (they are called CSL's - Charter seat license down here) only on the best seats in the house but they were really and I mean really expensive though. Pretty much only lower bowl between the 2 x 10 yard line. Other than that it was license free even in the end zone. I bought seasons in the upper bowl right in front of the 50 yard line (So I can still watch live football once in a while without having to make a long trip to see my beloved Bills and I paid nothing, only my annual season ticket holder invoice. 

Edited September 25, 2021 by Curt

[purple haze]

12 hours ago, Virgil said:

I don’t care how many teams do it.  This is the definition of greed 

It’s pro sports.  It’s business.   Some might be priced out of season tickets, unfortunately.    This is the main reason PSE proposed the stadium type/location that they did. To keep costs as low as possible while sill raising them.  Put a roof on that added cost will show up in the PSL rates and ticket/parking costs.

[StHustle]

I'm sorry but from a selfish standpoint this is good news for me. I was very worried since season tickets sold out that I may be on the outside looking in for years to come. Instead it's sounding like I get a fresh shot at it and can even swing my weight around and secure some great seats.

 

But I know where I came from and definitely feel for those who now can't afford to keep their seats. It sucks but it's evolution and even tho I wouldn't like it if it cost me my seats, I'd understand it. If everyone stadium built since 2009 has done this, why the hell would anyone here reasonable expect the Bills not to. We have been spoiled with THE cheapest tickets in the league for years. We can't want a great team and expect to keep that going. Greatness comes with a price...for the players, coaches and the fans alike.

[Patience]

20 minutes ago, StHustle said:

I'm sorry but from a selfish standpoint this is good news for me. I was very worried since season tickets sold out that I may be on the outside looking in for years to come. Instead it's sounding like I get a fresh shot at it and can even swing my weight around and secure some great seats.

 

But I know where I came from and definitely feel for those who now can't afford to keep their seats. It sucks but it's evolution and even tho I wouldn't like it if it cost me my seats, I'd understand it. If everyone stadium built since 2009 has done this, why the hell would anyone here reasonable expect the Bills not to. We have been spoiled with THE cheapest tickets in the league for years. We can't want a great team and expect to keep that going. Greatness comes with a price...for the players, coaches and the fans alike.

 

Agreed on all points.  My brother and I now are likely to take the plunge and get season tickets in the new place.  

[nucci]

13 hours ago, WhoTom said:

 

We have rich owners ... and they want to stay rich.

 

 

don't think they're in any danger

[BigDingus]

18 hours ago, DrDawkinstein said:

Is anyone surprised by this?

 

At least it's only a one-time charge and transferable.

 

18 hours ago, Southtown Tommy said:

A PSL is a one-time charge, right?  If so, it's reasonable based on ~$1,000 for the least expensive license.  Price of doing business and having an NFL team in your backyard. 

 

Exactly. Not surprising, and Bills tickets will likely still be cheaper than elsewhere in the league. PSL's are a weird concept in general (paying for the right to buy a ticket), but if I recall, the Rams put a decent spin on their's that made them actually semi-valuable. I cannot remember for the life of me what that was, and it could be it's the exact opposite (maybe it was way worse than your usual PSL's), but I thought it was an improvement.

 

Either way, can't be bothered to Google it right now. I'm on my last hour & a half at work & feeling burnt out.

[Doc]

5 hours ago, StHustle said:

I'm sorry but from a selfish standpoint this is good news for me. I was very worried since season tickets sold out that I may be on the outside looking in for years to come. Instead it's sounding like I get a fresh shot at it and can even swing my weight around and secure some great seats.

 

But I know where I came from and definitely feel for those who now can't afford to keep their seats. It sucks but it's evolution and even tho I wouldn't like it if it cost me my seats, I'd understand it. If everyone stadium built since 2009 has done this, why the hell would anyone here reasonable expect the Bills not to. We have been spoiled with THE cheapest tickets in the league for years. We can't want a great team and expect to keep that going. Greatness comes with a price...for the players, coaches and the fans alike.

Life is about choices. If you know that your seat/s will require a PSL and you want to keep it /them, start saving now.

[WhoTom]

3 hours ago, nucci said:

don't think they're in any danger

 

You'll get no argument from me on that, but that's how the uberwealthy operate. Money is power, so they pull the strings and they get the breaks.

 

[Mr. WEO]

6 hours ago, StHustle said:

I'm sorry but from a selfish standpoint this is good news for me. I was very worried since season tickets sold out that I may be on the outside looking in for years to come. Instead it's sounding like I get a fresh shot at it and can even swing my weight around and secure some great seats.

 

But I know where I came from and definitely feel for those who now can't afford to keep their seats. It sucks but it's evolution and even tho I wouldn't like it if it cost me my seats, I'd understand it. If everyone stadium built since 2009 has done this, why the hell would anyone here reasonable expect the Bills not to. We have been spoiled with THE cheapest tickets in the league for years. We can't want a great team and expect to keep that going. Greatness comes with a price...for the players, coaches and the fans alike.

 

Not a very meaningful boast.  There are 6 other teams within 10 bucks of the average Bills ticket.  For another $25 or less, you can get a seat for either LA in their gleaming new stadium---or a Cowboys game at Jerry World.

 

The true price outliers are at the top, not the bottom.  And a huge chunk of the secondary market will still be STH's who want to make money hawking their tickets even after they have to pay PSL.

Edited September 25, 2021 by Mr. WEO

[TXBILLSFAN]

11 hours ago, BaaadThingsMan said:

I hate this.

 

The Bills and NFL will be making a ton more money with a new stadium. 

 

Pegulas net worth and Forbes evaluation of the team will likely go way up as well. 

 

It's greedy. 

 

 

***** PSLs 

 

The NFL is not a non-profit organization.

 

 

 

[Mrbojanglezs]

I'll be watching at home

[Utah John]

The money from the sale of PSLs should be counted toward the percentage paid by the people (taxpayers, ticket buyers) and not the owners.  

[Matt_In_NH]

On 9/24/2021 at 12:55 PM, Virgil said:

I don’t care how many teams do it.  This is the definition of greed 

 

It's Capitalism, it can look like greed sometimes and there are lines.  Not sure this crosses that line.  Its supply and demand.  There will be people willing to pay.

[Boatdrinks]

10 minutes ago, mattynh said:

 

It's Capitalism, it can look like greed sometimes and there are lines.  Not sure this crosses that line.  Its supply and demand.  There will be people willing to pay.

Exactly. The Bills are just now catching up to the rest of the NFL, and that’s just how it is. Nobody needs to attend a football game, so it’s hardly the definition of greed. 

[Einstein]

On 9/24/2021 at 12:08 PM, PromoTheRobot said:

 

Why? It's very likely that PSL's can be spread over a few seasons. So the impact will be blunted. It will be an extra bump of $10-20 per ticket. Personally I've been expecting this. But they better make this stadium worth it.

 

If what you’re saying is correct, then it certainly would have been better for them to avoid the buzzword of “PSL” at all.

 

Simply raise the price of tickets $10-$20 and let that be that.

[ColoradoBills]

1 minute ago, Einstein said:

 

If what you’re saying is correct, then it certainly would have been better for them to avoid the buzzword of “PSL” at all.

 

Simply raise the price of tickets $10-$20 and let that be that.

 

It has more to do on how the gameday tickets and PSLs are divided by the owners.

[Captain Caveman]

13 minutes ago, Einstein said:

 

If what you’re saying is correct, then it certainly would have been better for them to avoid the buzzword of “PSL” at all.

 

Simply raise the price of tickets $10-$20 and let that be that.

They'll do both, raising 100-200 million with the PSLs, and then a similar amount each year which will pay for their portion of the stadium (and then some.)

[Virgil]

If this is the help support paying for the stadium, does that mean the PSL goes away after it’s built and tickets become available again? 😛. 
 

If you’re going to feed me BS, don’t tell me it’s candy 

[Allen2D̶i̶g̶g̶s̶TBD]

You're better off buying a nice tv and a comfy recliner to watch Bills games because at the end of the day you'll actually own those. 

[Boatdrinks]

38 minutes ago, Allen2Diggs said:

You're better off buying a nice tv and a comfy recliner to watch Bills games because at the end of the day you'll actually own those. 

Unless you enjoy going to the games in person (and all that experience includes ) more than watching on TV. 

[Einstein]

1 hour ago, ColoradoBills said:

 

It has more to do on how the gameday tickets and PSLs are divided by the owners.

 

Ahh.