Mayfield is << Allen

[cage]

I watched most of the Browns/Jets game tonight and this is the first time I saw Baker Mayfield outside of highlight clips.  Color me unimpressed.  I'll have to watch a bit more of him, but based on tonights game, I would consider Josh Allen the better QB, hands down.  

 

-- Less than 50% accuracy

-- Nearly got his TE killed.  I can imagine how many times we'd see that clip and the commentary if Allen made a throw like that

-- Consistently high and off target, with the exception of two long passes to OBJ

-- Poor decision making

-- Erratic while rolling right trying to evade pressure.  Allen is often at his best on those types of throws 

 

Allen would be crucified for having a game like Mayfield had tonight.

 

Edited September 17, 2019 by cage

[SCBills]

Coaching and sacrificing the OL for shiny weapons.  

 

He seems to be regressing. 

[cage]

And his few good throws are celebrated like he's a pinpoint passer...

[Ethan in Cleveland]

I had Mayfield 4th but in all honesty I had Allen and Rosen as top 3 guys.  Browns changed the history of 5 teams or more by taking Mayfield instead of Darnold.  If Browns take Darnold like many predicted, Allen probably goes 3rd to the Jets and then it is a trade war at 4 to get Rosen.  

[Reed83HOF]

13 minutes ago, SCBills said:

Coaching and sacrificing the OL for shiny weapons.  

 

He seems to be regressing. 

Does he really seem like the type of player to study & watch tape?

[Buffalo716]

1 minute ago, Reed83HOF said:

Does he really seem like the type of player to study & watch tape?

Yes. Besides the bravado and antics the dude TWICE WALKED ON at D1 programs and won starting jobs

 

You can say whatever u want about Baker and he may have regressed a little but his work ethic shouldn't be questioned

 

He obviously busts his butt in the film and weight room to get to where he is. Maybe he is losing it

[Warcodered]

4 minutes ago, Buffalo716 said:

Yes. Besides the bravado and antics the dude TWICE WALKED ON at D1 programs and won starting jobs

 

You can say whatever u want about Baker and he may have regressed a little but his work ethic shouldn't be questioned

 

He obviously busts his butt in the film and weight room to get to where he is. Maybe he is losing it

To be fair yes he had to work his ass off to make those teams but it was kind of the opposite in Cleveland they took him 1st overall.

[Protocal69]

Could it be that Mayfield is already has reached his peak. 

[Buffalo716]

3 minutes ago, Warcodered said:

To be fair yes he had to work his ass off to make those teams but it was kind of the opposite in Cleveland they took him 1st overall.

Well that's why I said it is possible he is losing it

 

But typically someone that driven who had a crazy work ethic doesn't loose it that quick... Unless he gets too full of himself too quick

 

It's also like I said pre draft... he was sooo polished it is possible he was close to being maxed out

 

Typically doesn't happen with 22 year old QBs but he already maxed out his frame, had tremendous touch and anticipation. His room for growth wasn't as much as like a guy like Allen or Lamar or even Darnold

 

He came in day 1 ready

Edited September 17, 2019 by Buffalo716

[DJB]

Not digging this thread. 

 

Feels like voodoo going on in here. 

[NewEra]

Prior to the season, I’d have laughed at this thread.  Just 2 games later and I’d have to agree.  He looks like a better QB at the moment 

Edited September 17, 2019 by NewEra

[Inigo Montoya]

Mayfield has the talent, but I don't think he has the temperament to last in this league long as a QB.   I think it's important to be able to stay even keeled over the course of a season and not get too high or too low.  I don't think Mayfield has that trait.  Everything is right now, everything is the most important thing ever, everything is either amazing or a crisis.  That's just not a recipe for success for a team that has to follow his lead.  

[ndirish1978]

TWO GAMES played this season. No reason to be too high on anyone or too low on anyone. Let's just enjoy the fact we're winning and hope we keep getting better each game, that's all I want.

[Cotton Fitzsimmons]

Gents, there’s a long way to go to hash out this 2018 QB class. They’re all going to have some ups and downs from week to week, but there’s one thing that is pretty clear. If anyone truly believed Allen would be capable of developing an accurate short to mid range game he would’ve been the top pick. 

 

His physical ability is far and away superior to any of these other guys, but we were all told he would be air mailing balls into the hospitality tent a la EJ on a regular basis. He’s not completely there just yet, but it sure looks like he’s getting drastically better at things that all the draftniks and analytics folks mocked him for. If he proves to be able to continue hitting these efficient type passes underneath, while still being able to run around and throw lasers all over the field, he’s not really going to have any limitations. The ceiling for this guy appears to be absurd... and the floor seems to be ticking up a little more every week. At this point we’re all just waiting to see if he hits his ceiling and how quickly he gets there. If he gets there while this defense is still in tact, we may not just be battling for a wildcard.

[Rock'em Sock'em]

19 minutes ago, Protocal69 said:

Could it be that Mayfield is already has reached his peak. 

I've felt this since his first 1/2 when he came in for relief of T.T.  Solid high-floor player.  Exciting to watch.  But last year I was happy with Allen (prospect) over Mayfield (prospect).  More so this year, but not by a large margin.  Jackson though... did he take a major step this year, or what?

[Jauronimo]

30 minutes ago, Reed83HOF said:

Does he really seem like the type of player to study & watch tape?

Pretty sure hes been studying his Progressive Insurance tape. 

[BruceVilanch]

18 minutes ago, Inigo Montoya said:

Mayfield has the talent, but I don't think he has the temperament to last in this league long as a QB.   I think it's important to be able to stay even keeled over the course of a season and not get too high or too low.  I don't think Mayfield has that trait.  Everything is right now, everything is the most important thing ever, everything is either amazing or a crisis.  That's just not a recipe for success for a team that has to follow his lead.  

I honestly don't think Baker would be able to pull of the win Josh did against the Jets week 1. I don't think he could overcome 4 T/O's and come back from down 16. I think he is talented but I don't think he has the belief that he can win any game like Josh does.

[Albany,n.y.]

If Allen wins us a Super Bowl I don't care if the media wants to claim Mayfield, Darnold & Jackson are better.  All that matters is Allen is the best QB for the Buffalo Bills.  Very similar to when Kelly was rated behind Elway & Marino among the class of 1983.   

[oldschoolfootball1963]

1 hour ago, Cotton Fitzsimmons said:

Gents, there’s a long way to go to hash out this 2018 QB class. They’re all going to have some ups and downs from week to week, but there’s one thing that is pretty clear. If anyone truly believed Allen would be capable of developing an accurate short to mid range game he would’ve been the top pick. 

 

His physical ability is far and away superior to any of these other guys, but we were all told he would be air mailing balls into the hospitality tent a la EJ on a regular basis. He’s not completely there just yet, but it sure looks like he’s getting drastically better at things that all the draftniks and analytics folks mocked him for. If he proves to be able to continue hitting these efficient type passes underneath, while still being able to run around and throw lasers all over the field, he’s not really going to have any limitations. The ceiling for this guy appears to be absurd... and the floor seems to be ticking up a little more every week. At this point we’re all just waiting to see if he hits his ceiling and how quickly he gets there. If he gets there while this defense is still in tact, we may not just be battling for a wildcard.

OMG this might be the post of the year in my humble opinion. 

[Haplo848]

Honestly, despite Mayfield looking like the best rookie QB last year, at this point I'm putting Mayfield at 4th in the 2nd year QB rankings.  Darnold, Allen, and Lamar Jackson all seem like better players right now.  I just can't help but feel like those three put a lot more work in to improve in the offseason, while Mayfield is still at where he was last year.

[John from Riverside]

I think it is important to remember that Josh Allen is not even a finished product

 

- Very raw coming into the league....despite that....a gamer

- He gets a little help this year....there are NO stars in that group of players Beane brought in....just solid NFL players and young guys that might develop into something....Brown is best suited as a 2.....Cole Beasely is a 3.....we do NOT have a legit number 1 receiver in this group

 

- The offensive line is giving better protection....but these guys are not like the bills SB offensive lines.....yet

 

Josh is looking pretty good right now....and I think he will look even better NEXT year as we continue to put pieces around him

 

Meanwhile....he looks equal to or has surpassed all of the QBs that were drafted ahead of him

 

We are in good shape

[CSBill]

Like many, this was the first time I watched him intently. And came away with the feeling that he is very average. He does have a stronger arm than I thought, okay accuracy, and was running around trying to avoid a less than average Jet D. One game is a small sample size, but nothng stood out to me, other than he is remarkably unimpressive.

[Monty98]

My thing with Baker is I feel like he lacks pocket presence. Against Tennessee he constantly didn't feel the rush coming and tonight he just held on to the ball a lot and kept expecting OBJ to get open. At Oklahoma and at Texas Tech he played in a system that didn't require multiple reads, so it was Brown or Lamb should be open get it to them otherwise take off. He may get better but honestly I'm not too sure. Josh last year at least showed some pocket presence with getting out or taking off from a collapsing pocket and reading his progressions. He looked lost at times, but progressed as a rookie. Also since last year Baker has thrown the most interceptions

[CSBill]

2 hours ago, Haplo848 said:

Honestly, despite Mayfield looking like the best rookie QB last year, at this point I'm putting Mayfield at 4th in the 2nd year QB rankings.  Darnold, Allen, and Lamar Jackson all seem like better players right now.  I just can't help but feel like those three put a lot more work in to improve in the offseason, while Mayfield is still at where he was last year.

 

Right now: I love our QB, but based on record, stats, and production, the clear winner right now is Jackson. And I was never a fan, and I am  glad we didn't stay put and wait for him, but right now, he is way above the rest.

 

Then again, Roman made Tyrod look good too--until Rex dumped him because he was getting credit over Rex (more evidence of what a disaster he was as a HC).

[Wayne Cubed]

So one game and you've made ya mind up? What would you say if a Cleveland fan had only watched Josh Allen's game against Green Bay last year or only saw quarters 2 and 3 of the Jest game? 

[njbuff]

7 minutes ago, Wayne Cubed said:

So one game and you've made ya mind up? What would you say if a Cleveland fan had only watched Josh Allen's game against Green Bay last year or only saw quarters 2 and 3 of the Jest game? 

 

I am not ready to crown Allen anything yet, but if you don't see. progression from year one to year two, I don't know what to tell you.

 

He already has a winning record as a starter as he continues to develop.

 

I take it one game at a time and I think we all see Cincinnati as a very favorable match-up, but in this topsy turvy NFL you never freaking know.

 

Mayfield is in the same boat right now but with a much worse OL that might get him killed.

Edited September 17, 2019 by njbuff

[Wayne Cubed]

1 minute ago, njbuff said:

 

I am not ready to crown Allen anything yet, but if you don't see. progression from year one to year two, I don't know what to tell you.

 

He already has a winning record as a starter as he continues to develop.

 

I take it one game at a time and I think we all see Cincinnati as a very favorable match-up, but in this topsy turvy NFL you never freaking know.

 

That wasn't the point of my comment. I was making a comparison. The OP watched ONE Baker Mayfield game and is judging him against Allen, after one game. I've watched more than one game of Mayfields, so I know where he's at and last season, he did things I haven't seen Allen do up to this point.  Mayfield also didn't look nearly as bad in Game 1 as his stat line would indicate, if you did actually watch the game.

 

I'm not saying Allen hasn't looked better this season and seems to be improving, he is. I'm saying if a Cleveland fan or general NFL fan picked one of Allens games to watch, a bad one, and then formed an opinion of that, every Buffalo fan would be telling them they need to watch more of him and not just the highlights.

[Thurman#1]

Way way too early.

[njbuff]

1 minute ago, Wayne Cubed said:

 

That wasn't the point of my comment. I was making a comparison. The OP watched ONE Baker Mayfield game and is judging him against Allen, after one game. I've watched more than one game of Mayfields, so I know where he's at and last season, he did things I haven't seen Allen do up to this point.  Mayfield also didn't look nearly as bad in Game 1 as his stat line would indicate, if you did actually watch the game.

 

I'm not saying Allen hasn't looked better this season and seems to be improving, he is. I'm saying if a Cleveland fan or general NFL fan picked one of Allens games to watch, a bad one, and then formed an opinion of that, every Buffalo fan would be telling them they need to watch more of him and not just the highlights.

 

I gotcha now.

 

My reading comprehension sucks.

[HOUSE]

What I learned last night is The Browns Bills game is not an automatic loss for Buffalo.

Should be a good game

[Pine Barrens Mafia]

10 minutes ago, HOUSE said:

What I learned last night is The Browns Bills game is not an automatic loss for Buffalo.

Should be a good game.

 

Exactly.

1 hour ago, Wayne Cubed said:

So one game and you've made ya mind up? What would you say if a Cleveland fan had only watched Josh Allen's game against Green Bay last year or only saw quarters 2 and 3 of the Jest game? 

 

Which one of Josh Allen and Baker Mayfield has been pushed on us as a conference championship contender?

[Wayne Cubed]

17 minutes ago, Joe in Winslow said:

Which one of Josh Allen and Baker Mayfield has been pushed on us as a conference championship contender?

 

Sooooo because the media bought into the hype of the Browns offseason, Mayfield<<Allen. Makes sense. Did I miss Baker Mayfield saying he was going to be a Conference  Championship Contender? What does this have to do with watching one game of a player and making any sort of judgment. 

 

Bills fans get all upset when national pundits only watch highlights of Allen or one game but then it's ok for us as fans to do that to other players. Again, makes sense.

[Pine Barrens Mafia]

8 minutes ago, Wayne Cubed said:

 

Sooooo because the media bought into the hype of the Browns offseason, Mayfield<<Allen. Makes sense. Did I miss Baker Mayfield saying he was going to be a Conference  Championship Contender? What does this have to do with watching one game of a player and making any sort of judgment. 

 

Bills fans get all upset when national pundits only watch highlights of Allen or one game but then it's ok for us as fans to do that to other players. Again, makes sense.

 

Take a look at the stats for the year and get back to me.

[Wayne Cubed]

4 minutes ago, Joe in Winslow said:

 

Take a look at the stats for the year and get back to me.

 

I see you addressed nothing of what I actually said, I'll pass on getting back to you, as again you've made this into a dig at Allen, which it isn't.

[TroutDog]

He held the ball 4.2 seconds (!!!!!!) on one pass play and then completely overthrew OBJ. 

 

I wasn't impressed either. 

[Bakin]

6 hours ago, Ethan in Portland said:

I had Mayfield 4th but in all honesty I had Allen and Rosen as top 3 guys.  Browns changed the history of 5 teams or more by taking Mayfield instead of Darnold.  If Browns take Darnold like many predicted, Allen probably goes 3rd to the Jets and then it is a trade war at 4 to get Rosen.  

That’s a plate full of speculation. 

 

[eball]

I'll just say this...Myles Garrett is the best player on Cleveland's roster.

[aristocrat]

baker was really inaccurate last night and not the guy i saw play last year. 

[Fixxxer]

For better or worse, Mayfield painted himself in a corner when decided to confront the media (Cowherd) instead of ignoring it and keep working hard with his teammates.

 

He's a fiery guy but he's still young, I think he needs to settle down on all the hype sorrounding his team and work on the basics, last night his mechanics were awful, hence his bad passes.

 

He still need some maturing to do. I think he will be alright.

 

I don't care if he's better or worse than Allen, I think Allen is perfect for our team.

[RunTheBall]

I'm pleasantly surprised that Allen has showed the degree of growth he has in both the mental and physical aspects of the game. This is a testament to both the player and the developmental coaching he has received. 

 

Baker is going to be a solid starter and was quicker out of the gate but his ceiling is lower than Allen's

 

Jackson has surprised me in his development but like Allen still, I'll wait to see some consistency over time before drawing conclusions. 

 

Rosen is a disaster and certainly his circumstances haven't helped

 

The one who surprises me is Darnold.  I've watched most of his games and I'm just not seeing this future pro-bowler they everyone hyped. He seems skittish in the pocket, isn't reading defenses as well as Allen so far, and only seems comfortable on the run during a broken/extended play. 

 

It's real early for all of them except Rosen who I think is done. Time will tell