ESPN article says Bills would "obviously trade Allen, Edmunds and White for Mahomes

[K-9]

3 minutes ago, oldmanfan said:

I have a feeling Mahomes is going to come up short on Saturday.

I think he'll play well and generate points. But that defense won't be able to stop Luck and Co.. They are a sieve. The Colts' defense can at least make some plays here and there. KC's D just plain stinks. 

[Foxx]

29 minutes ago, NoHuddleKelly12 said:

Well, considering that Mahomes and Allen weren't even in the same draft and the Bills could not have come even close to completing their pre-draft evaluation work on Allen, it's not an either Mahomes or Allen question straight up, right? The premise/byline of the article becomes somewhat misleading then, no? And what is the point of bashing the Bills on this one when how many other franchises similarly passed on Mahomes before KC? 

i believe the correlation comes from the fact that the pick the Bills traded to KC was used to select Mahomes. lets not over think this. that considered, considering Mahomes could quite possibly be the MVP this year, the supposition is not that far fetched. arguments could be made to the contrary of course, such as, amongst others, would Mahomes have done as well outside of Andy Reid. again, it is not an entirely outlandish argument. 

[Bray Wyatt]

The way I read it, he said we would trade White, Jones and Edmunds for Mahomes. I think thats fair

Edited January 10, 2019 by Bray Wyatt

[jkeerie]

39 minutes ago, Southern Bills Fan said:

If the Bills had evaluated Mahomes and thought he could end up looking anything like the guy who has ripped apart the NFL this season, they obviously would have taken him with their first-round pick. Instead, they sent the 10th selection to the Chiefs for the 27th and 91st selections, along with Kansas City's 2018 first-round pick, which ended up as the 22nd pick. The Bills drafted star cornerback Tre'Davious White with Kansas City's 2017 first-rounder, and then used the other two picks in trades that eventually netted them Zay Jones and Tremaine Edmunds. Sean McDermott undoubtedly loves his two defensive building blocks, and the Bills believe that Josh Allen, their other first-rounder in 2018, can turn into a viable starter, but they would undoubtedly trade all three for Mahomes in a heartbeat.

 

 

I don't think that I would. Thoughts? BTW the article crushes the Bills over Gilmore as well.

Bill Barnwell...Enough said.?

[Ridgewaycynic2013]

While we’re on the subject, the Bills should have kept Lamonica.

[RyanC883]

39 minutes ago, Southern Bills Fan said:

If the Bills had evaluated Mahomes and thought he could end up looking anything like the guy who has ripped apart the NFL this season, they obviously would have taken him with their first-round pick. Instead, they sent the 10th selection to the Chiefs for the 27th and 91st selections, along with Kansas City's 2018 first-round pick, which ended up as the 22nd pick. The Bills drafted star cornerback Tre'Davious White with Kansas City's 2017 first-rounder, and then used the other two picks in trades that eventually netted them Zay Jones and Tremaine Edmunds. Sean McDermott undoubtedly loves his two defensive building blocks, and the Bills believe that Josh Allen, their other first-rounder in 2018, can turn into a viable starter, but they would undoubtedly trade all three for Mahomes in a heartbeat.

 

 

I don't think that I would. Thoughts? BTW the article crushes the Bills over Gilmore as well.

 

1.  There is no way the Bills would make that trade.  

 

2.  The comparison of Mahomes to the Bills sitaution is irresponsible without a comparison of the two offenses and coaching style.  Mahomes has arguably the best QB coach as his head-coach, and sat behind a veteran his rookie year.  Perhaps Allen tears up the NFL next year?  Mahomes has a better OL, how would he look here?  Mahomes had K. Hunt for a while, as well as T. Hill, S. Watkins, and a QB's best friend, a fantastic TE in Kelce.  

5 minutes ago, K-9 said:

I think he'll play well and generate points. But that defense won't be able to stop Luck and Co.. They are a sieve. The Colts' defense can at least make some plays here and there. KC's D just plain stinks. 

 

I think the Colts win.  They get up early and pound the ball on the ground the rest of the game with a few deep balls to Hilton and intermediate routes to Ebron.  The Colts D is also underrated.  

11 minutes ago, oldmanfan said:

I have a feeling Mahomes is going to come up short on Saturday.

 

I think Mahomes has come up short in all primtime games this year?  The Colts D will be on him all day.  

[row_33]

11 minutes ago, RyanC883 said:

 

I think the Colts win.  They get up early and pound the ball on the ground the rest of the game with a few deep balls to Hilton and intermediate routes to Ebron.  The Colts D is also underrated.  

 

It's always appreciated when the visiting team on Divisional Weekend makes a decent go of it.  Hopefully at least one can do it.

 

Winning on the road is another matter unless there is a Godzilla of a reason to pump up the visitors, as in Emmitt Smith sat out the first two weeks for the Cowboys and caused them to be a Wild Card Weekend entry.

[LABILLBACKER]

Take away that oline, Hill and Kelsie and all of a sudden Mahomes might look very ordinary. Lets let him marinate for a couple years before we anoint him goat....

[Dr. Who]

8 minutes ago, brianb386 said:

They focus on the Bill's because they traded the pick to KC. However there were 9 picks ahead of where Mahomes was picked and I bet those teams would rather have Mahomes than the players they drafted. Oh well, the Mahomes talk won't be going away anytime soon, IMO. We'll be hearing about it his whole career as long as he plays at this level.

If the Bills win with Allen, Edmunds, and White, the talk will go away.

[oldmanfan]

10 minutes ago, K-9 said:

I think he'll play well and generate points. But that defense won't be able to stop Luck and Co.. They are a sieve. The Colts' defense can at least make some plays here and there. KC's D just plain stinks. 

True.  Been a while since we've seen threads about how dumb it was to trade Ragland, hasn't it?

[formerlyofCtown]

48 minutes ago, Southern Bills Fan said:

If the Bills had evaluated Mahomes and thought he could end up looking anything like the guy who has ripped apart the NFL this season, they obviously would have taken him with their first-round pick. Instead, they sent the 10th selection to the Chiefs for the 27th and 91st selections, along with Kansas City's 2018 first-round pick, which ended up as the 22nd pick. The Bills drafted star cornerback Tre'Davious White with Kansas City's 2017 first-rounder, and then used the other two picks in trades that eventually netted them Zay Jones and Tremaine Edmunds. Sean McDermott undoubtedly loves his two defensive building blocks, and the Bills believe that Josh Allen, their other first-rounder in 2018, can turn into a viable starter, but they would undoubtedly trade all three for Mahomes in a heartbeat.

 

 

I don't think that I would. Thoughts? BTW the article crushes the Bills over Gilmore as well.

Ask me in a year.

How I think things are going to turn out isnt the same as knowing for a fact what Mahomes is.  If I had to make a decision today Im making the trade if Im being honest.

As far as the Gilmore thing.  Whatever.

Edited January 10, 2019 by formerlyofCtown

[Ramza86]

If you told me hed look that good in Buffalo sure....

 

but would he look that good here?

[wppete]

Can you imagine Josh Allen in KC with all those weapons??? (Especially before Hunt got released) 

The media would be freaking out. Best QB ever hahaha

 

 

Edited January 10, 2019 by wppete

[Hapless Bills Fan]

34 minutes ago, Southern Bills Fan said:

If the Bills had evaluated Mahomes and thought he could end up looking anything like the guy who has ripped apart the NFL this season, they obviously would have taken him with their first-round pick. Instead, they sent the 10th selection to the Chiefs for the 27th and 91st selections, along with Kansas City's 2018 first-round pick, which ended up as the 22nd pick. The Bills drafted star cornerback Tre'Davious White with Kansas City's 2017 first-rounder, and then used the other two picks in trades that eventually netted them Zay Jones and Tremaine Edmunds. Sean McDermott undoubtedly loves his two defensive building blocks, and the Bills believe that Josh Allen, their other first-rounder in 2018, can turn into a viable starter, but they would undoubtedly trade all three for Mahomes in a heartbeat.

 

 

I don't think that I would. Thoughts? BTW the article crushes the Bills over Gilmore as well.

 

To the OP: got a linky to that article?  Linkys are chill. (I tried briefly to find it and struck out)

 

I mean, if it was truly "obvious", surely it would have been "obvious" to the Bills that's the right thing to do?

 

What's "obvious" to me is that Mahomes was drafted into a very different situation in KC than the Bills have.  In the last 6 years, the Chiefs have a record of 96-65 and have been to the playoffs 5 of 6 years.  Their worst, non-playoff year they had a record to match the Bills best season of the last 6 years, 9-7.  The year they drafted and sat Mahomes, they had the #6 offense in the league featuring a top young WR, a top young RB, and a top TE with a good bit of tread left.

 

In the same time period, the Bills have a record of 45-51.  They have had the #10 scoring offense in the league 1x, and been to the playoffs 1x.  Their average offensive rank has been #19 (range 10-30).  Over the last 3 years, their WR corps and their OL have both been decimated and their RB is getting very worn.

 

Whether McDermott and Beane truly needed to undertake the total strip-down-and-build-up job that they did undertake can be debated, but anyone who thinks Mahomes could have been plugged into the overall talent level of the 2018 Buffalo team and had comparable offensive results, doesn't know much football. 

 

And while we're speculating wildly as the author of this article does, I'll throw out there it's just possible if Allen were drafted by the Chiefs and spent a year sitting on the bench with Andy Reid in his ear, he might have somewhat better results his first year playing.

[ProcessAccepted]

37 minutes ago, dave mcbride said:

Of course the Bills would make this trade. Mahomes is the most valuable and most dynamic player in the league right now, -- a generational talent. An equally good question to ask: would KC make this trade? The answer is never. 

 

Mahomes has had a great season, no doubt about it but there is no way that trade would happen. I value our roster higher than that. Even Allen and one of those other guys is too high a price. Allen would have much better stats if he had the type of talent around him that Mahomes has. 

[loyal2dagame]

Allen has done ok with little to no help on offense. I can see him being mentioned in the same breath as Mahomes when the bills revamp the oline and he gets the wideouts/tight ends that can catch a ball. Edmunds is showing signs of being an anchor. Tre doesn't make mistakes too often- he makes plays. 

No way would the bills trade 3 cornerstones together for anyone.  And Mahomes would look like garbage here with the current roster. 

ESPN and just about their entire staff is crazy. 

[Chuck Wagon]

That makes it look passable for what we got.

 

An argument can be made this is much closer to reality:

 

A) Mahomes / White / Edmunds / 2018 pick #53, #56, #65

 

B) Allen / Edmunds / White / Zay

 

Zay went 10 picks after White, who we clearly had higher on our board since we took him 1st, so you potentially could have gotten Mahomes AND White out of that draft.

 

This past year we could have made the same Cordy + pick #21 for pick #12 trade and gotten Edmunds.

[RPbillsfan]

The article is ridiculous.  If Patrick Mahomes would have been drafted by the Bills, sat the bench all season in 2017.  Then start with the talent level (lack of) the Bills have on offense he would have been classified as a bust, let's see:

 

TE: Clay vs Kelcie - hmmmmmmm, significant downgrade

 

WR1: Benjamin vs Hill, hmmmmmmmmm, significant downgrade

 

WR2: Zay Jones vs Sammy Watkins, slight downgrade

 

OL: Bills crap at 4 positions vs solid KC line, major downgrade

 

My guess at his stats with Buffalo would be about 30 TD's less passing, more interceptions then Allen threw and about 500 yards less rushing.

 

Plus a much worse defense now and in the future.

 

Hence, the article is complete nonsense.

[Like A Mofo]

56 minutes ago, Southern Bills Fan said:

If the Bills had evaluated Mahomes and thought he could end up looking anything like the guy who has ripped apart the NFL this season, they obviously would have taken him with their first-round pick. Instead, they sent the 10th selection to the Chiefs for the 27th and 91st selections, along with Kansas City's 2018 first-round pick, which ended up as the 22nd pick. The Bills drafted star cornerback Tre'Davious White with Kansas City's 2017 first-rounder, and then used the other two picks in trades that eventually netted them Zay Jones and Tremaine Edmunds. Sean McDermott undoubtedly loves his two defensive building blocks, and the Bills believe that Josh Allen, their other first-rounder in 2018, can turn into a viable starter, but they would undoubtedly trade all three for Mahomes in a heartbeat.

 

 

I don't think that I would. Thoughts? BTW the article crushes the Bills over Gilmore as well.

 

Clickbait 101.

 

[WhyteDwarf]

I think if you would not do the trade, you're just an ultimate homer tbh.

 

Mahomes is great, period.

[Dr. Who]

1 minute ago, WhyteDwarf said:

I think if you would not do the trade, you're just an ultimate homer tbh.

 

Mahomes is great, period.

I think your thinking doesn't go beyond tactical trolling. Hapless and others above provide context that is much more than emotive homerism. But if this is how you get your kicks, have fun.

[formerlyofCtown]

50 minutes ago, billsfan5121 said:

The thing I don’t like about stuff like this is it’s impossible to account for what a player would have been in a different environment.  I am pretty certain that some players will be great no matter where they go (Peyton Manning), but others you have to wonder if it would be the same.

 

With Mahommes, he’s in a great spot with Reid as HC and speed at offensive positions that fit his style perfectly.  Would Zay Jones, Robert Foster, and Clay match the production he got out of Hill, Kielce, and even Watkins?  I doubt it.  Would the production have been greater than what Allen produced, perhaps that is more likely.  

 

I dont know though.  Mahommes was great this year and nobody can take that away.  His stats will forever be logged in NFL record books and stat sheets.  But thinking he’d put up 5,000 and 50 in our offense is probably a little naive.  

 

Bills fans will likely view this as the Manning/Brady debate.  Is Brady as good or better than Manning, or is he a system guy?  Is Mahommes better than Allen, or is he a system guy?  Obviously Mahommes is better now, regardless of system, but if Allen is good down the road and throwing for 4200 and 35 TDS while Mahommes is throwing for 4500 and 40 TDS, who is better?  We can never know that but I guess that’s a good problem to have debating if your team has the best qb in the league!

If They traded those three for Mahomes straight up today would you be mad.  That is how I am looking at it.  Do I believe it is possible that Allen could end up the better QB, Yes.  But the problem is the word could is in there.

 

Mahomes is a legitimate MVP canidate.  You notice there is no could.

Edited January 10, 2019 by formerlyofCtown

[Boatdrinks]

White, Jones, and Edmunds for Mahomes ? Absolutely would make that trade, any GM wouldn’t be able to get the paperwork in fast enough. No problem with not re signing Gilmore. These types of decisions happen all the time, and SG isn’t a game changer / difference maker. Most CBS aren’t , and he’s definitely not Revis in his prime or anything close really. 

[Chuck Wagon]

3 minutes ago, Boatdrinks said:

White, Jones, and Edmunds for Mahomes ? Absolutely would make that trade, any GM wouldn’t be able to get the paperwork in fast enough. No problem with not re signing Gilmore. These types of decisions happen all the time, and SG isn’t a game changer / difference maker. Most CBS aren’t , and he’s definitely not Revis in his prime or anything close really. 

 

 

It's more like Allen + Zay for Mahomes + 2018 pick #53 / #56 / #65......

[machine gun kelly]

This is why I don't watch, listen, or read anything from ESPN.  Morons.  I'll watch MNF, but I watch NFLN prior to gametime.  We are fine with three developing assets.

[billsfan1959]

2 minutes ago, Dr. Who said:

I think your thinking doesn't go beyond tactical trolling. Hapless and others above provide context that is much more than emotive homerism. But if this is how you get your kicks, have fun.

(1) It is how he gets his kicks and (2) I'm not so sure I would use the term "thinking" and referencing his posts in the same sentence.

 

It is clearly not "obvious" that the Bills or anyone else would make that trade. There are arguments for both sides; however, we will have a better idea in a couple of years....

[formerlyofCtown]

54 minutes ago, NickelCity said:

 

Bout sums it up. And I like Allen a lot.

How dare you be honest about it.

[Boatdrinks]

Just now, Chuck Wagon said:

 

 

It's more like Allen + Zay for Mahomes + 2018 pick #53 / #56 / #65......

Just going by what the ESPN guy implied in his sentence. He mentioned White, Jones and Edmunds and said they would trade those 3 for Mahomes. Allen wasn’t part of that. 

[BADOLBILZ]

 

 

I believe the OP's title/premise is wrong.........the writer was saying would the Bills trade Tre White, Zay Jones and Tremaine Edmunds for Patrick Mahomes.

 

Allen has nothing to do with Chiefs trade............he was not acquired with any chips from the Chiefs trade.

 

[Kangaxx]

12 minutes ago, WhyteDwarf said:

I think if you would not do the trade, you're just an ultimate homer tbh.

 

Mahomes is great, period.

Tyreek Hill is the most talented player on the Chiefs, not Mahomes. 

 

 

[Ed_Formerly_of_Roch]

1 hour ago, DCOrange said:

I mean, Mahomes is about to be named the MVP in his first season as a starter; I think the writer is probably correct that Buffalo would take that in retrospect.

 

OK, but if the Bills had drafted Mahomes in 2017, sat him last year and started him this past season, do you think he'd have even been in the discussion for MVP right now.   

 

Prescott looked pretty amazing as a rookie to, imagine what he'll be when he gains experience they were saying.  3 seasons later he's no better, maybe even worse at least statistically.

[GoBills808]

I bet if you put this to McDermott he would decline. 

[Dr. Who]

Just now, billsfan1959 said:

(1) It is how he gets his kicks and (2) I'm not so sure I would use the term "thinking" and referencing his posts in the same sentence.

 

It is clearly not "obvious" that the Bills or anyone else would make that trade. There are arguments for both sides; however, we will have a better idea in a couple of years....

Yes, I agree it is ambiguous. Personally, I think Josh Allen will be very, very good if we surround him with talent and good coaching, so I'm fine with how things worked out.

[Chuck Wagon]

4 minutes ago, Boatdrinks said:

Just going by what the ESPN guy implied in his sentence. He mentioned White, Jones and Edmunds and said they would trade those 3 for Mahomes. Allen wasn’t part of that. 

 

 

Right.

 

The ESPN guy is a moron.  That's not what we gave up.  We still could have Mahomes / White / Edmunds.  An argument can be made we more realistically traded Allen + Zay for Mahomes + 3 picks in 2018 2/3rd rounds.  Which realistically makes it WAY worse for us.

[WhyteDwarf]

4 minutes ago, APoxOnYou said:

Tyreek Hill is the most talented player on the Chiefs, not Mahomes. 

 

 

 

This is not about Hill... 

[Solomon Grundy]

Who's the author of this nonsense, Rodak? Trade 3 potential all pro players for 1? The only sensible analyst on that station that I listen to is Darren Woodson and that's because of his name?

[Canadian Bills Fan]

I hope not

[uticaclub]

1 hour ago, DCOrange said:

I mean, Mahomes is about to be named the MVP in his first season as a starter; I think the writer is probably correct that Buffalo would take that in retrospect.

Right, I'd rather have Mahomes production then Allen's potential 

[loyal2dagame]

Just now, uticaclub said:

Right, I'd rather have Mahomes production then Allen's potential 

Mahomes would only have potential in Buffalo, not production. Not enough pieces to the puzzle here. 

[Dr. Who]

1 minute ago, uticaclub said:

Right, I'd rather have Mahomes production then Allen's potential 

But to get Mahomes production, you probably need the KC coaching staff and offensive personnel. Bring him into the situation Allen played under as a raw rookie and you're not going to hear talk of MVP.