Eating crow x2

[NewEra]

I hereby admit defeat in 2 proclamations I made this offseason.

 

1- Deonte Harty.  Dunno if it’s the superdome turf or the way the saints used him but it looks like he’s lost of juice.  He doesn’t look nearly as explosive as he in NO.  I’d hate to see him continue to get looks when he can’t get separation and can’t make anyone miss. Can Dorsey scheme this guy some space?  Maybe he plans of having him run some streaks to catch the D off guard? If not, he should be on the bench.  He doesn’t look to have “it”.  
 

It’s only 3 games…..but I don’t see how he’s going to all of a sudden be faster.  If he’s not faster than what we’re seeing, he’s a bust.  

 

2- Terrel Bernard-  I would’ve been happy if we traded him for a 6th rd pick a month ago.  I thought he was too small and weak for the part.  His college injury history (in addition to his size) was also a big flag. Suppose that will always be a worry.
 

I wanted to roll with Dorian Williams and let him play through his mistakes at the expense of our defense because i didn’t think Bernard had his upside. 
 

Through 3 games……. I feel like we have our Mike.  He flies to the ball.  He’s decisive.  He seems to be a solid wrap up tackler. He understands zone coverage very well and communicates it to his teammates.  I don’t have a lot of confidence in him replicating Sundays performance vs Miami, but I am confidant and happy that I was wrong about him.  
 

Are you ready to chow down on some crow?

Edited September 26, 2023 by NewEra

[Solomon Grundy]

5 minutes ago, NewEra said:

I hereby admit defeat in 2 proclamations I made this offseason.

 

1- Deonte Harty.  Dunno if it’s the superdome turf or the way the saints used him but it looks like he’s lost of juice.  He doesn’t look nearly as explosive as he in NO.  I’d hate to see him continue to get looks when he can’t get separation and can’t make anyone miss. Can Dorsey scheme this guy some space?  Maybe he plans of having him run some streaks to catch the D off guard? If not, he should be on the bench.  He doesn’t look to have “it”.  
 

It’s only 3 games…..but I don’t see how he’s going to all of a sudden be faster.  If he’s not faster than what we’re seeing, he’s a bust.  

 

2- Terrel Bernard-  I would’ve been happy if we traded him for a 6th rd pick a month ago.  I thought he was too small and weak for the part.  His college injury history (in addition to his size) was also a big flag. Suppose that will always be a worry.
 

I wanted to roll with Dorian Williams and let him play through his mistakes at the expense of our defense because i didn’t think Bernard had his upside. 
 

Through 3 games……. I feel like we have our Mike.  He flies to the ball.  He’s decisive.  He seems to be a solid wrap up tackler. He understands zone coverage very well and communicates it to his teammates.  I don’t have a lot of confidence in him replicating Sundays performance vs Miami, but I am confidant and happy that I was wrong about him.  
 

🐦‍⬛ 

Here's to hoping they take that Harty screen out of the playbook

[Ethan in Cleveland]

Eating crow right with you on Bernard. 

He is everything Edmunds was not. Let's hope he can hold up to the pounding. 

 

[ChronicAndKnuckles]

Harty will gain more value as the season progresses and guys inevitably start getting injured. Bills don’t want to go into another 2021 situation where  their top WRs are all hobbled due to injuries. Having a dude like Harty is great insurance. There’s only so many balls to go around (pause) 

Edited September 26, 2023 by ChronicAndKnuckles

[ngbills]

7 minutes ago, NewEra said:

I hereby admit defeat in 2 proclamations I made this offseason.

 

1- Deonte Harty.  Dunno if it’s the superdome turf or the way the saints used him but it looks like he’s lost of juice.  He doesn’t look nearly as explosive as he in NO.  I’d hate to see him continue to get looks when he can’t get separation and can’t make anyone miss. Can Dorsey scheme this guy some space?  Maybe he plans of having him run some streaks to catch the D off guard? If not, he should be on the bench.  He doesn’t look to have “it”.  
 

It’s only 3 games…..but I don’t see how he’s going to all of a sudden be faster.  If he’s not faster than what we’re seeing, he’s a bust.  

 

2- Terrel Bernard-  I would’ve been happy if we traded him for a 6th rd pick a month ago.  I thought he was too small and weak for the part.  His college injury history (in addition to his size) was also a big flag. Suppose that will always be a worry.
 

I wanted to roll with Dorian Williams and let him play through his mistakes at the expense of our defense because i didn’t think Bernard had his upside. 
 

Through 3 games……. I feel like we have our Mike.  He flies to the ball.  He’s decisive.  He seems to be a solid wrap up tackler. He understands zone coverage very well and communicates it to his teammates.  I don’t have a lot of confidence in him replicating Sundays performance vs Miami, but I am confidant and happy that I was wrong about him.  
 

🐦‍⬛ 

Agree 100% on Harty. I was never high on him but still expected some speed on punt returns or occasional use as a speed guy. But on Sunday there was a play he could not even get separation with a LB on him. The end arounds and short stuff to him has shown nothing. Honestly looks slower and less running vision than McK.

Bernard has been on an upward trend since the second half of the Jets game. He has proven to me he can be a cover guy, blitz, etc. Still not sure how it goes vs a team that tries to bully us and establish the run. But the small sample size has been trending in the right direction. 

[Buffalo_Stampede]

5 minutes ago, Solomon Grundy said:

Here's to hoping they take that Harty screen out of the playbook

Honestly they need to take all screens away. We don’t run them well but the biggest problem is teams are scared to death of Josh Allen and don’t play aggressive. A lot of 2 high safeties and zone. Not a good match for a screen.

Harty hopefully becomes a field stretcher for us.

 

Edited September 26, 2023 by Buffalo_Stampede

[NewEra]

5 minutes ago, ChronicAndKnuckles said:

Harty will gain more value as the season progresses and guys inevitably start getting injured. Bills don’t want to go into another 2021 situation where  their top WRs are all hobbled due to injuries. Having a dude like Harty is great insurance. There’s only so many balls to go around (pause) 

If he’s injury insurance then he shouldn’t play at all right now.  He’s a midget with lots of injury history.  If he keeps playing, odds are he’s the first WR injured. I think shakir and Sherfield look like better rac options at this point. 
 

Anyone else think he was really fast in NO?  I thought he was electric. Now….. he’s just looks small.  

4 minutes ago, ngbills said:

Agree 100% on Harty. I was never high on him but still expected some speed on punt returns or occasional use as a speed guy. But on Sunday there was a play he could not even get separation with a LB on him. The end arounds and short stuff to him has shown nothing. Honestly looks slower and less running vision than McK.

Bernard has been on an upward trend since the second half of the Jets game. He has proven to me he can be a cover guy, blitz, etc. Still not sure how it goes vs a team that tries to bully us and establish the run. But the small sample size has been trending in the right direction. 

And iirc, that LB covering him on that play was Cody Barton.  Their worst start on D imo. Can’t recall if Josh was pressured and had to throw it early or not.  Seems like an early throw considering the route 

[BuffaloBillyG]

12 minutes ago, NewEra said:

I hereby admit defeat in 2 proclamations I made this offseason.

 

1- Deonte Harty.  Dunno if it’s the superdome turf or the way the saints used him but it looks like he’s lost of juice.  He doesn’t look nearly as explosive as he in NO.  I’d hate to see him continue to get looks when he can’t get separation and can’t make anyone miss. Can Dorsey scheme this guy some space?  Maybe he plans of having him run some streaks to catch the D off guard? If not, he should be on the bench.  He doesn’t look to have “it”.  
 

It’s only 3 games…..but I don’t see how he’s going to all of a sudden be faster.  If he’s not faster than what we’re seeing, he’s a bust.  

 

2- Terrel Bernard-  I would’ve been happy if we traded him for a 6th rd pick a month ago.  I thought he was too small and weak for the part.  His college injury history (in addition to his size) was also a big flag. Suppose that will always be a worry.
 

I wanted to roll with Dorian Williams and let him play through his mistakes at the expense of our defense because i didn’t think Bernard had his upside. 
 

Through 3 games……. I feel like we have our Mike.  He flies to the ball.  He’s decisive.  He seems to be a solid wrap up tackler. He understands zone coverage very well and communicates it to his teammates.  I don’t have a lot of confidence in him replicating Sundays performance vs Miami, but I am confidant and happy that I was wrong about him.  
 

Are you ready to chow down on some crow?

I don't think it's Harty's speed that's the issue. It's the usage. I totally get wanting to get him the ball in space. But he should be used as a field stretcher as well.

 

One thought I do have. Perhaps these early season screens and end arounds to him are setting up using him deeper later in the season. Sort of lull the defense into thinking it's a screen and it allows him to hit a deep ball. That's my hope anyway. I'm willing to see if Dorsey has that in his plans. 

[ChronicAndKnuckles]

1 minute ago, NewEra said:

If he’s injury insurance then he shouldn’t play at all right now.  He’s a midget with lots of injury history.  If he keeps playing, odds are he’s the first WR injured. I think shakir and Sherfield look like better rac options at this point. 
 

Anyone else think he was really fast in NO?  I thought he was electric. Now….. he’s just looks small.  

I haven’t been impressed so far either, but I’m not ruling him out either especially later in the season. I think the Bills are more focused on the development of homegrown draft picks Shakir which is good. The goal is to get the most out of rookie contracts. 

[John from Riverside]

We went from being a Linebacker Louis team, except for Milano to actually being pretty good. I throw Dorian Williams into that because I think that he is also a very good player.

[NewEra]

Just now, John from Riverside said:

We went from being a Linebacker Louis team, except for Milano to actually being pretty good. I throw Dorian Williams into that because I think that he is also a very good player.

Yeah….we thought he had the touch with DBs, but maybe mcdermotts been the LB whisperer all along.  5th rounder Milano is an all pro. Bernard looking like 2.0

 

too bad edmunds didn’t have the it factor to become great

[Process]

Harty is very disappointing. Thought he would be a better McKenzie. Right now it looks like they are forcing him into the game plan because of his contract, and nothing they are trying is working. Luckily there is an out in his contract after this year. 

 

I think that if one of JSN/Addison/Flowers fell in the draft the Bills would have taken them. Unfortunate how it played out. I am happy with Dalton, but hopefully next year is the year they properly address the WR spot. 

 

Re Bernard...yea, he looks like a stud. Hopefully he keeps it up as we start facing tougher competition. What a nice surprise he has been.

Edited September 26, 2023 by Process

[Aussie Joe]

I’m get back to you after next week…

 

Big test for Bernard ( although I have been impressed with him to date…)

 

Not quite ready to give up on Harty)

[NewEra]

8 minutes ago, BuffaloBillyG said:

I don't think it's Harty's speed that's the issue. It's the usage. I totally get wanting to get him the ball in space. But he should be used as a field stretcher as well.

 

One thought I do have. Perhaps these early season screens and end arounds to him are setting up using him deeper later in the season. Sort of lull the defense into thinking it's a screen and it allows him to hit a deep ball. That's my hope anyway. I'm willing to see if Dorsey has that in his plans. 

Sending him deep. That’s my hope too, I believe I alluded to it in my OP.  Setting it up.  I feel that way about a few things, but I’m afraid I’m probably giving them too much credit.  
 

To my eye, he just doesn’t look the same as he did in NO. 

[Mr. WEO]

I thought this was going to be a Dalton Kincaid thread....

[BillsFan130]

Apparently Harty had a bad turf toe injury last season so maybe that has something to do with it as well

 

It sure looks like he’s lost his quickness

Edited September 26, 2023 by BillsFan130

[strive_for_five_guy]

Bernard’s playmaking has been so awesome the past couple of weeks, I actually forgot we had drafted Dorian until the OP mentioned him. 
 

[LeGOATski]

The problem with Harty's plays are that they are telegraphed for the defense. This is a Dorsey problem. He's not a smooth play caller. He lacks subtlety and rhythm.

[Xwnyer]

10 hours ago, NewEra said:

I hereby admit defeat in 2 proclamations I made this offseason.

 

1- Deonte Harty.  Dunno if it’s the superdome turf or the way the saints used him but it looks like he’s lost of juice.  He doesn’t look nearly as explosive as he in NO.  I’d hate to see him continue to get looks when he can’t get separation and can’t make anyone miss. Can Dorsey scheme this guy some space?  Maybe he plans of having him run some streaks to catch the D off guard? If not, he should be on the bench.  He doesn’t look to have “it”.  
 

It’s only 3 games…..but I don’t see how he’s going to all of a sudden be faster.  If he’s not faster than what we’re seeing, he’s a bust.  

 

2- Terrel Bernard-  I would’ve been happy if we traded him for a 6th rd pick a month ago.  I thought he was too small and weak for the part.  His college injury history (in addition to his size) was also a big flag. Suppose that will always be a worry.
 

I wanted to roll with Dorian Williams and let him play through his mistakes at the expense of our defense because i didn’t think Bernard had his upside. 
 

Through 3 games……. I feel like we have our Mike.  He flies to the ball.  He’s decisive.  He seems to be a solid wrap up tackler. He understands zone coverage very well and communicates it to his teammates.  I don’t have a lot of confidence in him replicating Sundays performance vs Miami, but I am confidant and happy that I was wrong about him.  
 

Are you ready to chow down on some crow?

The problem with Harry is not lost speed it’s an OC that can’t design plays to utilize the talent.  First round pick is being waisted, key free agents getting very few looks.    Still has multiple receivers in same area not spread like the fins are doing.

Edited September 27, 2023 by Xwnyer

[SoCal Deek]

17 minutes ago, John from Riverside said:

We went from being a Linebacker Louis team, except for Milano to actually being pretty good. I throw Dorian Williams into that because I think that he is also a very good player.

Linebacker Louis?  Is that a thing? 😉

[John from Riverside]

2 minutes ago, SoCal Deek said:

Linebacker Louis?  Is that a thing? 😉

I am punished by my talk to text

[LABILLBACKER]

26 minutes ago, NewEra said:

If he’s injury insurance then he shouldn’t play at all right now.  He’s a midget with lots of injury history.  If he keeps playing, odds are he’s the first WR injured. I think shakir and Sherfield look like better rac options at this point. 
 

Anyone else think he was really fast in NO?  I thought he was electric. Now….. he’s just looks small.  

And iirc, that LB covering him on that play was Cody Barton.  Their worst start on D imo. Can’t recall if Josh was pressured and had to throw it early or not.  Seems like an early throw considering the route 

I agree, Harty has so far been underwhelming. I'd rather give Shakir & Sherfield more targets. Harty will be the return guy for the remainder of the season till Hines returns.  Find a way out of his 2nd year.

[Shaw66]

I didn't know what to expect of Harty but I agree, he's been disappointing.   It might have something to do with Dorsey (sooner or later I always come back to Dorsey!).   A guy like Harty has to get the ball in stride and in space that allows get up to speed before he has to deal with tacklers.   Instead, he seems to get the same opportunities that didn't work for McKenzie, either.  

 

As for Bernard, I hate to bring up a sore subject, but I told you so.  I mean, I had the same doubts that many people had here.   What I also had, that many people didn't, is confidence in McDermott and Beane.  If Bernard were as bad as we thought he was, McDermott and Beane would have done something to get help.  They did nothing, and as I suspected, they did nothing because they knew the defense would be fine with Bernard in the middle.   They brought in Kirksey to be a veteran backup, not to take the starting job. 

 

Did I expect him to be the guy we saw on Sunday?  No.  The Cover One video breakdown of him shows some amazing talent, both physical and mental.  

[Freddie's Dead]

Right now, Sharty is a Double D bust.  Fair caught a punt he should have returned, returned a punt he should have fair caught.  I miss me some McKittrick.

[The Wiz]

6 minutes ago, LeGOATski said:

The problem with Harty's plays are that they are telegraphed for the defense. This is a Dorsey problem. He's not a smooth play caller. He lacks subtlety and rhythm.

I'm with you on this.  I don't know if he just decides that he's going to call a play or if he's intentionally doing it to set something up 2-3 plays from the time he calls it but it always feels like he's going through the motions, then Allen pulls something off, then he decides he needs to do something different.

[LABILLBACKER]

8 minutes ago, Xwnyer said:

The problem with Harry is not lost speed it’s an OC that can’t design plays to utilize the talent.  First round pick is being waisted, key free agents getting very few looks.    Still has multiprocessor receivers in same area

Let's not forget Dorsey had no clue what to do with Hines last year. And it looks like the same now with Harty. 

[Augie]

 

I apologize

12 minutes ago, LeGOATski said:

The problem with Harty's plays are that they are telegraphed for the defense. This is a Dorsey problem. He's not a smooth play caller. He lacks subtlety and rhythm.

 

If Harty is out there, I expect something cutesy. 

[BananaB]

Hardy is just a gadget player, it’s no coincidence they cut McKenzie the day after. They thought they were getting an upgrade but it’s really not looking like it at this point. McKenzie was terrible out of the slot, but he did pretty good for a while on alot of this gadget plays. At this point I don’t think we need to be forcing gadget plays and would like to see more of Shakir and Sherfield. Just seems like we’re always going backwards when Dorsey tries to be cute

Edited September 27, 2023 by BananaB

[stevewin]

I rewatched the game today - it's kinda crazy for 3 games now Harty must average close to 0 yds production.  Almost every play he touches the ball it goes for nothing - and it is not like 1 or 2 plays a game.

 

Some of it may be being snake bit being the target of plays that had no chance regardless - but nothing has jumped so far in terms of him being dynamic

Edited September 27, 2023 by stevewin

[The Firebaugh Kid]

Harty hasn’t had nearly enough touches for me to say much about him. 

[Steptide]

Forget harty, I'm concerned about everyone behind Diggs. Even Gabe, who had a good game this past week, still isn't really showing out like he should Imo. Bills really gotta find a way to get the receivers involved more 

[Ya Digg?]

54 minutes ago, ChronicAndKnuckles said:

Harty will gain more value as the season progresses and guys inevitably start getting injured. Bills don’t want to go into another 2021 situation where  their top WRs are all hobbled due to injuries. Having a dude like Harty is great insurance. There’s only so many balls to go around (pause) 

Is it 2018? Do people still say pause after making a balls comment? 

[MJS]

It's a little early for crow eating, I think.

[Punching Bag]

23 minutes ago, Freddie's Dead said:

Right now, Sharty is a Double D bust.  Fair caught a punt he should have returned, returned a punt he should have fair caught.  I miss me some McKittrick.

 

Definitely overpriced for what Bills are getting.

[mrags]

1 hour ago, NewEra said:

I hereby admit defeat in 2 proclamations I made this offseason.

 

1- Deonte Harty.  Dunno if it’s the superdome turf or the way the saints used him but it looks like he’s lost of juice.  He doesn’t look nearly as explosive as he in NO.  I’d hate to see him continue to get looks when he can’t get separation and can’t make anyone miss. Can Dorsey scheme this guy some space?  Maybe he plans of having him run some streaks to catch the D off guard? If not, he should be on the bench.  He doesn’t look to have “it”.  
 

It’s only 3 games…..but I don’t see how he’s going to all of a sudden be faster.  If he’s not faster than what we’re seeing, he’s a bust.  

 

2- Terrel Bernard-  I would’ve been happy if we traded him for a 6th rd pick a month ago.  I thought he was too small and weak for the part.  His college injury history (in addition to his size) was also a big flag. Suppose that will always be a worry.
 

I wanted to roll with Dorian Williams and let him play through his mistakes at the expense of our defense because i didn’t think Bernard had his upside. 
 

Through 3 games……. I feel like we have our Mike.  He flies to the ball.  He’s decisive.  He seems to be a solid wrap up tackler. He understands zone coverage very well and communicates it to his teammates.  I don’t have a lot of confidence in him replicating Sundays performance vs Miami, but I am confidant and happy that I was wrong about him.  
 

Are you ready to chow down on some crow?

You and I pretty much have the exact thoughts on Bernard. Thought he was too small/undersized for MLB in the league. And while it might still turn out that way. As teams start to plan against him. I do still think he could be a liability in a more run heavy offensive gameplan. 
 

unfortunately I knew this about Harty. Unlike you and many others, I NEVER saw anything special or even quick in him in his time in NO. Everyone wants to talk about him having a full route tree and being more versatile than what we’ve had at the position. I tried telling everyone that even his best years aren’t as good as McKenzies and McKenzie sucked. I didn’t buy the thought that with a good QB he would all the sudden produce. 
 

same as Bernard, things could change throughout the season. But I don’t buy it. I also believe it won’t be long until he’s injured. He’s been injured about 1/3 of his career so he’s likely due to come down with something within the next 1-2 games and miss some time. Trust me, I wish I was wrong but I just don’t think I will be. 

[ngbills]

Why are people so quick to say it’s a Dorsey thing not Harry? He has been in the league 5 years and his best year is 36 rec for 500 yards. That is basically McK production from last year. The guy has like 800 yards total in his fifth year and it’s not him but we are not using him right? I guess no one has used him right then. 

[Airseven]

The notion that Harty was going to be an upgrade was the typical baseless wishful thinking. 

[ChronicAndKnuckles]

45 minutes ago, Ya Digg? said:

Is it 2018? Do people still say pause after making a balls comment? 

Sorry, I’m too busy to keep up w/ current trends. 

[ColoradoBills]

1 hour ago, LeGOATski said:

The problem with Harty's plays are that they are telegraphed for the defense. This is a Dorsey problem. He's not a smooth play caller. He lacks subtlety and rhythm.

 

I tend to agree.  Not sure they know how to use him.  He has had 7 catches on 10 targets and 3 jet sweeps.

The sweeps were not blocked well, and D penetration killed the plays.

Most of his swing screens were not well designed.  He does lose his footing quite a bit.

 

It may end up that Harty isn't good for the team, but right now I haven't seen him used the way I expected.

[Rigotz]

If only there were a 15 page thread about eating crow dedicated to Terrel Bernard....