Big Turk Posted January 16, 2023 Share Posted January 16, 2023 6 minutes ago, 78thealltimegreat said: Oh all hail bigturk and his massive football database Definitely don't hail people who make up crap and throw it at the wall to see what sticks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
78thealltimegreat Posted January 16, 2023 Share Posted January 16, 2023 2 minutes ago, Simon said: C'mon man, I was listening to that game on the radio in the truck and know what it was Well I’m glad you’re an expert on the bills running game 1 minute ago, Big Turk said: Definitely don't hail people who make up crap and throw it at the wall to see what sticks. Oh that would be half your posts Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dopey Posted January 16, 2023 Share Posted January 16, 2023 1 minute ago, oldmanfan said: Play calls should never stop momentum. The series with the two long ball incompletions did that. Whether Dorsey called that, or Josh tried to play hero ball, it was the opposite of what was needed. Gabe was wide open for a td on the second play, but Josh overthrew him. The play call didn’t stop the momentum. Josh’s lack of execution on that play did. Wide open. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Turk Posted January 16, 2023 Share Posted January 16, 2023 2 minutes ago, 78thealltimegreat said: Well I’m glad you’re an expert on the bills running game Oh that would be half your posts Nice try but no. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simon Posted January 16, 2023 Share Posted January 16, 2023 1 minute ago, Big Turk said: Nice try but no. Yes I am, dammit. Oh wait, that's not what you meant...... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Man with No Name Posted January 16, 2023 Share Posted January 16, 2023 1 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CEN-CAL17 Posted January 16, 2023 Share Posted January 16, 2023 Pretty sure I called like 85% of the run plays today… minimum Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HOUSE Posted January 16, 2023 Share Posted January 16, 2023 If I could afford a tractor, I would run him over Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Turk Posted January 16, 2023 Share Posted January 16, 2023 1 minute ago, Man with No Name said: Down...set...hut hut hut hut hut... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sven233 Posted January 16, 2023 Share Posted January 16, 2023 I will be the first to admit, I am not the biggest Dorsey fan. Today was a little tough for me, though. I have a hard time criticizing Dorsey too much. Yeah, there were a few calls that I would have liked to have seen something different, but there was some stuff I really liked. I loved the design of the Cook TD run. Took advantage of his speed and was a nice wrinkle to see. I loved the way Diggs was being used early. He caught the deep ball and followed it up with some great work on a slant. But, where I take issue is that he never really went back to some of those things that were working. Where were the slants for the rest of the game? It seems like too many times we don't do the basic stuff most NFL teams do easily at times. All that said, though, we scored 30+ points and it could have been a lot more early. If Knox holds on to that TD early (I would still argue that maybe shouldn't have been overturned, though). If Allen is just a little more accurate on a couple of the deep throws he made (just missed on a couple of bombs that would have been TDs), that would have helped. If his guys just hold on to a couple of dimes Allen threw that should have been caught, that would have been big too. This team was literally 3-4 plays that maybe should have been made that could have led to a 50 burger. I get the frustration with Dorsey for the most part. I'm right there with many of you in that he deserves his fair share of blame most of the time. But, today, I don't come away from this game with him anywhere near the top of the list to blame for things that went wrong. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eastport bills Posted January 16, 2023 Share Posted January 16, 2023 44 minutes ago, JMM said: Are you familiar with the following concepts: RB screen, TE screen, bubble screen, draw, delayed draw, quick slant, quick out, go and stop, etc. I'm no OC, but it seems to me that there are experts in the NFL that believe these are effective concepts against cover zero. Thanks for your attention. Now...back to calling your seven step drop duo go routes..... Did you watch the game? Beasley TD was a bubble screen and how many checkdown passes does Josh throw in all the games. That’s our RB screen. We get our TE down the field. Our offense wasn’t the problem (34 pts and over 350 passing with 3 TDs and a 54 yd drop. We had 3 giveaways and that made it close. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ngbills Posted January 16, 2023 Share Posted January 16, 2023 16 possessions today. We could have score 70. That is the truth. This could have been a massive blow out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mannc Posted January 16, 2023 Share Posted January 16, 2023 2 minutes ago, Eastport bills said: Did you watch the game? Beasley TD was a bubble screen and how many checkdown passes does Josh throw in all the games. That’s our RB screen. We get our TE down the field. Our offense wasn’t the problem (34 pts and over 350 passing with 3 TDs and a 54 yd drop. We had 3 giveaways and that made it close. Can we deduct anything for the strip sack fumble TD? Or the other turnovers that gave Miami prime field position? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coach Tuesday Posted January 16, 2023 Share Posted January 16, 2023 4 minutes ago, Eastport bills said: Did you watch the game? Beasley TD was a bubble screen and how many checkdown passes does Josh throw in all the games. That’s our RB screen. We get our TE down the field. Our offense wasn’t the problem (34 pts and over 350 passing with 3 TDs and a 54 yd drop. We had 3 giveaways and that made it close. Beasley’s TD was a blatant illegal pick by Diggs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LABILLBACKER Posted January 16, 2023 Share Posted January 16, 2023 44 minutes ago, VaMilBill said: Dorsey has a lot of faults. But Josh is not blameless in this either. Some questionable decisions. The interception down deep. The handoff to Cook that was supposed to be a run. He’s been making mistakes all season that we haven’t really seen for a few years. I guess I just miss the calming influence of Daboll. The shorter dump offs are open everywhere. But Dorsey & Josh seem to be locked in to "bombs away". Some worked, some were dropped and some overthrown. So much to clean up, but we move on. DL/OL must play better. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RyanC883 Posted January 16, 2023 Share Posted January 16, 2023 57 minutes ago, GoBills808 said: 34 points Could easily have been 50 that’s the maddening part. We could put ip 50 with better play calling. The O also gifted Dolphins 7 and gave them short fields. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffaloRebound Posted January 16, 2023 Share Posted January 16, 2023 Please make things easier for Josh. Run game, short passes, something that doesn’t require a highlight play almost every snap. So many parallels to Elway before Denver got him a running game. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoBills808 Posted January 16, 2023 Share Posted January 16, 2023 5 minutes ago, RyanC883 said: that’s the maddening part. We could put ip 50 with better play calling. The O also gifted Dolphins 7 and gave them short fields. Better execution imo Just need to clean it up Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billsbackto81 Posted January 16, 2023 Share Posted January 16, 2023 Bills have scored 34, 35, 35 and 32 their last 4 games. That's usually good enough to win if a Defense is doing their part. Frazier and soft zone coverage will be the end of our season. You can't continue to play that crap against playoff teams. Our front 4 without Von is pedestrian and allows even the most novice of QBs time to make plays against our "bend not break" D. Please don't spew stats at me because we all know this group is underperforming and not putting lesser competition away. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buffblue Posted January 16, 2023 Share Posted January 16, 2023 58 minutes ago, AlfaBill said: His offensive play calling also put Miami back in this game. And Frazier's decision to call off the dogs once the Bills went up 34-24 was also inexplicable. He is the definition of conservative, play not to lose mentality. The blitz was working, we're in control, but hey let's rush only Boogie and AJ against a 3rd string 7th rounder 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SCBills Posted January 16, 2023 Share Posted January 16, 2023 My question for OC Dorsey: Is it annoying to scheme up wide open receivers all over the place and have fans blame you because the players weren’t executing for half of the game? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffaloRebound Posted January 16, 2023 Share Posted January 16, 2023 5 minutes ago, buffblue said: And Frazier's decision to call off the dogs once the Bills went up 34-24 was also inexplicable. He is the definition of conservative, play not to lose mentality. The blitz was working, we're in control, but hey let's rush only Boogie and AJ against a 3rd string 7th rounder Yep. If we are gonna advance past next weekend, it’s gonna take a more aggressive style of D. And it’s gonna take a more physical brand of offense. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eastport bills Posted January 16, 2023 Share Posted January 16, 2023 18 minutes ago, Coach Tuesday said: Beasley’s TD was a blatant illegal pick by Diggs. Please don’t complain about missed calls. How many delay of game calls did they miss or the missed holding call on Beasley’s tipped pick. It all evens out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
djp14150 Posted January 16, 2023 Share Posted January 16, 2023 1 hour ago, JMM said: Are you familiar with the following concepts: RB screen, TE screen, bubble screen, draw, delayed draw, quick slant, quick out, go and stop, etc. I'm no OC, but it seems to me that there are experts in the NFL that believe these are effective concepts against cover zero. Thanks for your attention. Now...back to calling your seven step drop duo go routes..... Bessley TD was done on a WR screen. You runscreens when you think you d will over pursue. dhort pass plays can be an issue with batted balls and Allen throwing hard. the throw outs routes or option route of an out, in , or turnaround a draw is the same as a fake hand off or Allen doing a delayed run 2 seconds after the snap. thr conspt of a hot receiver relies on the rusher leaving coverage of the area the receiver goes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buffblue Posted January 16, 2023 Share Posted January 16, 2023 10 minutes ago, SCBills said: My question for OC Dorsey: Is it annoying to scheme up wide open receivers all over the place and have fans blame you because the players weren’t executing for half of the game? Not to call you out or be confrontational, but what do you make of the fact that often when we need 6 to 8 yards we seem to be unwilling/unable to do anything but throw it 40? Does that not fall at least somewhat on the coordinator? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SCBills Posted January 16, 2023 Share Posted January 16, 2023 Just now, buffblue said: Not to call you out or be confrontational, but what do you make of the fact that often when we need 6 to 8 yards we seem to be unwilling/unable to do anything but throw it 40? Does that not fall at least somewhat on the coordinator? Absolutely. He has his faults… but he called a game today that should have resulted in an absolute massacre. We also don’t know what every route was on some of those shot plays. Allen just chose to go deep, but I can’t imagine we’re just running 4 verticals all the time. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
djp14150 Posted January 16, 2023 Share Posted January 16, 2023 20 minutes ago, buffblue said: And Frazier's decision to call off the dogs once the Bills went up 34-24 was also inexplicable. He is the definition of conservative, play not to lose mentality. The blitz was working, we're in control, but hey let's rush only Boogie and AJ against a 3rd string 7th rounder The logic behind this… use the clock against them by making them do short plays burning the clock. If you go heavy pressure you run the risk of being caught on a big play 50 yd+ play Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BeastMaster Posted January 16, 2023 Share Posted January 16, 2023 They have to get Cook some screens or short passes in space...he's got the ability to take those for big gains. This Is unforgivable with the way teams are playing us 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bubba Gump Posted January 16, 2023 Share Posted January 16, 2023 (edited) The Bills running plays leave a lot to be desired. You can't run straight at Miami's front 4, yet they kept doing it. When they ran outside of the tackles was the only time they had success. They also went deep too many times today, but not sure how much of that was on Allen himself. The Bills averaged 15 yards per pass attempt. That's way too high. Edited January 16, 2023 by Bubba Gump Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steptide Posted January 16, 2023 Share Posted January 16, 2023 Starting to think that allen playing with Dorsey is like Allen and his older brother, where as Allen with daboll was more like Allen and his dad. I feel like dabolls offense was more disciplined, and dorseys is more care free. Having said that though, this bills team is technically better than last years team. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PBF81 Posted January 16, 2023 Share Posted January 16, 2023 (edited) 58 minutes ago, SoMAn said: What’s puzzling to me is that the Bills have Joe Brady and Mike Shula on staff. Both are tenured NFL offensive coaches with years of experience who should be available for counseling and mentoring the first year OC. Can they not help Dorsey to have more imagination with play design and implementation? In a previous posting I asked the question ‘is Dorsey a frustrated ex-QB who’s living vicariously through Allen and just wants to throw bombs all day?” in 2022, Josh has frequently regressed back to ‘the hero ball’ novice he was 3 or 4 years ago. He’s become impatient, careless with the ball, improvising too much, and his inconsistent accuracy has receivers often reaching high or scooping from the turf to make catches. The Bills are winning, but they’re living dangerously. Unless they eliminate sloppy play and start playIng like a Championship team, we may have just seen our last Bills victory of the 2022 season. There are a lot of good comments in this thread. I agree with you as well. What I've been left with throughout the season is that we don't particularly play with a methodical approach of any kind, something that the best coaches do. It's far too ad hoc at times. It works because it's Allen, but this playground/hero ball isn't suitable for all situations. Our D, while going into an absurd prevent type D coupled with zero ability to pass rush effectively with just 4 linemen, held the Fins to 231 total yards, yet, on that they were able to put up 31 and nearly more. I point out to my friends via text during the game that one of our guys was open underneath, say 2 or 3 yards beyond the LoS, and Allen hits him it's a 10-15 yard gain, but for somer reason either Allen's not looking or doesn't seen them because his eyes are deep. It's frequent. QBs like Brady made a living on the short-medium stuff. The deeper stuff was icing. And while Allen's got the arm, between Allen and Dorsey, they need to think about controlling the flow of the game more, not merely trying to play trackmeet style with big plays as someone already pointed out. Josh is missing, or not seeing/looking, too many easy high-percentage throws that would gain significant ground and move chains, perhaps despite not being sexy. It all leaves the impression that they rarely have any actual game plans, as if they simply show up saying "let's see what Allen has today." That's not a strategy much less a tactical methodology. It's concerning to be sure and while I wouldn't trade Allen for any QB in the game today, being subject to whether or not he's on is a risk in and of itself. Having said all that, we talk as if none of the other teams in the league have issues, but last week when we were down about certain things, Allen played better than all but one playoff QB despite not having had his best game. At the end of the day it would be far more reassuring and comforting if while they were marching down the field one got the impression that they had a methodology to what it was that they were doing. That's my take. Edited January 16, 2023 by PBF81 3 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simon Posted January 16, 2023 Share Posted January 16, 2023 32 minutes ago, buffblue said: And Frazier's decision to call off the dogs once the Bills went up 34-24 was also inexplicable. He is the definition of conservative, play not to lose mentality. The blitz was working, we're in control, but hey let's rush only Boogie and AJ against a 3rd string 7th rounder I thought they forced a lot of throwaways and wasted downs with those light rushes and loaded coverages. Miami had under 250 yrds of total offense on only 3.3 yrds/play and went 4/16 on 3rd down. Frazier was not a problem today, imo 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrPJax Posted January 16, 2023 Share Posted January 16, 2023 1 hour ago, Einstein said: His offense scored 34 points despite having 3 turnovers. Solid. Yet we were one drive from possibly losing to third string Qb , on a team with a depleted o line , depleted running backs , coached by a ROOKIE head coach as Mcd is entering his 6 th year. You can chose to just look at the final point total , but our o also gave them six points on a strip sack / fumble recovery and we lost other points because of the ints and Josh fumbling before before getting a first down on the initial drive. We played a supposedly vastly inferior opponent ( just looking at records alone , not to mention how depleted their roster was ) so actually 34 points IN THAT CONTEXT, is not that solid. I think teams like KC , San Fran would have easily hung a fifty burger on that team playing them in their home stadiums. I love the w and obviously it’s about moving on. Followed the Bills since ‘63, went to two of the superbowls , and todays quality of win could be an issue if like past seasons , trends matter. it’s funny , Before Super Bowl 27 in Pasadena against the cowboys , I got to attend a dinner with Hank Stram speaking. To my dismay and complete disbelief in the BS I thought he was spouting , he predicted the cowboys would win , easily , based on a formula he used that included a teams turnover history/ ratio. There was no way I thought the Bills could lose three in a row , that’s why I went ! Lol! Damn Stram was right ! Trends and quality of play prior to a given game can matter. Vegas counts on that type of stuff right? Watching this season I wonder if Dorsey is a little too forgiving or too lenient with Josh. It’s not been a great year of ball security by him. Just a thought; yet hard to ignore Dabolls success with turning the Giants around and Jones committing no turnovers in the win today. Dabolls offenses struggled at times last year but he sure turned things up for the playoffs and got the most out of Josh. Dorsey has done a remarkable job but it sure has been a struggle at times. The turnovers just keep coming ( don’t we have the most of the teams in the playoffs ?) and it’s hard to overcome that predisposition moving up the competition tree. It was great to not lose tho and this team is definitely getting good at that ! 👍😀 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buffblue Posted January 16, 2023 Share Posted January 16, 2023 Just now, Simon said: I thought they forced a lot of throwaways and wasted downs with those light rushes and loaded coverages. Miami had under 250 yrds of total offense on only 3.3 yrds/play and went 4/16 on 3rd down. Frazier was not a problem today, imo Not as a whole, I agree. But in that particular instance I thought he showed an abnormal amount of deference and lack of killer instinct Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BaaadThingsMan Posted January 16, 2023 Share Posted January 16, 2023 More Shakir around the los with run after catch opportunity Same for Cook please 1 1 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Playoffs? Posted January 16, 2023 Share Posted January 16, 2023 All this talk of Dorsey’s playcalling… I saw our O-Line getting blown up a lot. I wonder if he was struggling to call plays due to the unreliability on the line? Or maybe Josh was trying to improvise? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JerseyBills Posted January 16, 2023 Share Posted January 16, 2023 I just don't like that we stopped feeding 14 He had 100 or close to 100 in the 1st qtr. Ended with 115 .. I understand they tried taking him away but you gotta feed your all pros.. Even if Davis stepped up Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DapperCam Posted January 16, 2023 Share Posted January 16, 2023 44 minutes ago, SCBills said: My question for OC Dorsey: Is it annoying to scheme up wide open receivers all over the place and have fans blame you because the players weren’t executing for half of the game? Even if players are open, 50 yard passes downfield are low percentage plays. The pass has to be good and the catch had to be good. If you are winning by 3 scores kill the clock get some first downs and get the heck out of there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JerseyBills Posted January 16, 2023 Share Posted January 16, 2023 17 minutes ago, BaaadThingsMan said: More Shakir around the los with run after catch opportunity Same for Cook please Motor ran better than Cook imo I want Cook/Hines backfield. We saw it 1 game for like 15 plays and it disappeared after. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffaloRebound Posted January 16, 2023 Share Posted January 16, 2023 We really gotta find a way to get Hines involved more. I’d love to see Hines and Cook on the field together for a couple plays. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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