ngbills Posted February 12, 2020 Share Posted February 12, 2020 It would be dumb for the Bills to pay him $15M + Even dumber for a team to trade for him to pay him $15M +. No team is going to want him that bad in my opinion. Not that much urgency to get him on their team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GunnerBill Posted February 12, 2020 Share Posted February 12, 2020 1 hour ago, thebandit27 said: Oh heck no. Beane sounded in the end of season presser as if this was not under consideration. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ethan in Cleveland Posted February 12, 2020 Share Posted February 12, 2020 53 minutes ago, atlbillsfan1975 said: Yuck. No thank you. Spend that money on a DE that can get home and find me a space eater to split time with Starr. They have $80 million in cap space. They can do both. The upside of the tag is it is only one year and no long term commitment or prorated signing bonus that hurts the cap in 2021 and beyond. Personally I would let Phillips walk and favor keeping Lawson. But I think in the end both will be gone. It would nice to get some compensation, but probably the best hey can do is comp picks. No way Lawson takes a team discount after the way he has been treated by this staff and regime. Phillips on the other hand may test the waters and find out the market isn't as high as he thinks and signing back with the Bills who have treated him well may be best step. It's amazing the duplicity of McD here. Phillips was playing better than the hot shot rookie so Phillips started. Lawson has been better than Murphy every day they have been here and yet Murphy kept getting the starts until the very end of 2019. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hapless Bills Fan Posted February 12, 2020 Share Posted February 12, 2020 40 minutes ago, ColoradoBills said: Beane has already said he will let him test FA. We will all know what's up with him in another 6 weeks. He put it a bit more positively. Here's what Beane actually said: https://www.buffalobills.com/video/brandon-beane-our-guys-are-hungry-and-we-ll-be-back About 36 minutes in Shaq: "Listen, us not picking up your option has nothing to do with us wanting you here, it's just where we are at this time, we would love for you to have a great year and sign you to a long term, so, I was very happy with Shaq and we'll obviously talk to his representatives" Jordan: "I thought Jordan really stepped his game up this year, on the field but also bringing some young guys along.....I think Jordan's still got room to grow..he had a career year sack production so, he's earned the right to see what his value is on the market, and we'll just have to see where that goes" You can't tell a guy he's "earned the right to see what his value is on the market", and then tag him and keep him from so doing. Way to breed bad will. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GunnerBill Posted February 12, 2020 Share Posted February 12, 2020 I'd be very surprised if Phillips is a Bill next season. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Over 29 years of fanhood Posted February 12, 2020 Share Posted February 12, 2020 (edited) A tenth of the cap or a mil per game? i like the guy, but I never thought to myself he is with a mil per game as a rotational DT that’s meh vs the run. 1) bills aren’t tagging anyone on the Current roster for 15 mil. 2) I don’t envision a world where CP gets anyone else to pay him that either. 3) once he learns this firsthand he might have a more reasonable figure that would be worth discussing, 4) there might be some D schemer out there that thinks he is still worth more than the Bills will believe. So be it. Edited February 12, 2020 by Over 29 years of fanhood 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dpberr Posted February 12, 2020 Share Posted February 12, 2020 17 minutes ago, GunnerBill said: I'd be very surprised if Phillips is a Bill next season. Agreed. I don't think this FO is going to pay him the guaranteed money he likely wants. I think guys who show up in contract years are the riskiest of all contracts. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BarleyNY Posted February 12, 2020 Share Posted February 12, 2020 1 hour ago, DrDawkinstein said: The 2019 Tag Number for DTs was $15,209,000. Just putting that out there for easy reference. Which would be the starting point for a new contract. There’s zero chance of that happening. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gobills404 Posted February 12, 2020 Share Posted February 12, 2020 5 minutes ago, dpberr said: I think guys who show up in contract years are the riskiest of all contracts. Not to mention he had 9.5 sacks on only 25 pressures, which is a ridiculous and unsustainable rate. This season was likely a flash in the pan for him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Florida Bills Fanatic Posted February 12, 2020 Share Posted February 12, 2020 Sounds like something that a troll or agent would throw out there. I guess they're one in the same ....lol. IMHO fat chance anyone is going to pay Phillips $15m per year or risk being stuck with that sized contract to try to facilitate a trade. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
QCity Posted February 12, 2020 Share Posted February 12, 2020 3 minutes ago, Florida Bills Fanatic said: Sounds like something that a troll or agent would throw out there. Definitely an agency trying to hype this idea that Phillips is worth $15M+ a year. What's sad is that LaCanfora falls for this crap. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hapless Bills Fan Posted February 12, 2020 Share Posted February 12, 2020 1 hour ago, QCity said: Definitely an agency trying to hype this idea that Phillips is worth $15M+ a year. What's sad is that LaCanfora falls for this crap. So earlier this year on social media, Phillips was saying by his play, he's a top-3 DT this year. A $15M AAV contract would be exactly in line with that perceived value. Phillips is currently paid as a top-16 4-3 DT at $4.5M AAV. I think the Bills might be willing to put him in the top 10 or 12 - maybe even ~Lotulelei territory. Some may find that overpaying, I think it's consistent with what Beane has said that they want to keep the roster intact and not just bring in new guys who are around the same skill level. If they have to overpay a little bit to do that I think they'll bite. But if BigJ9797 comes in and says he's got a taker willing to pay him $13-15M AAV on a 3 yr contract, I think Beane will clap him on the shoulder and tell him that's wonderful! He's truly happy for him. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beast Posted February 12, 2020 Share Posted February 12, 2020 16 million for a rotational guy? No. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsFan4 Posted February 12, 2020 Share Posted February 12, 2020 1 hour ago, Hapless Bills Fan said: He put it a bit more positively. Here's what Beane actually said: https://www.buffalobills.com/video/brandon-beane-our-guys-are-hungry-and-we-ll-be-back About 36 minutes in Shaq: "Listen, us not picking up your option has nothing to do with us wanting you here, it's just where we are at this time, we would love for you to have a great year and sign you to a long term, so, I was very happy with Shaq and we'll obviously talk to his representatives" Jordan: "I thought Jordan really stepped his game up this year, on the field but also bringing some young guys along.....I think Jordan's still got room to grow..he had a career year sack production so, he's earned the right to see what his value is on the market, and we'll just have to see where that goes" You can't tell a guy he's "earned the right to see what his value is on the market", and then tag him and keep him from so doing. Way to breed bad will. I guess it depends exactly what Beane meant when he said see what his value is on the market”. If they use the non-exclusive franchise tag, or the transition tag Phillips could still negotiate with other teams. Though using the non-exclusive franchise tag would make any other team actually signing him pretty unrealistic (since the Bills get two 1sts if they don’t match, which not matching would be a no-brainer). But a transition tag would allow the Bills the opportunity to match an offer, and it wouldn’t really restrict Phillips from seeing what his value is on the market. This year’s transition tag number is $12.3M. That’s more than I want to spend on Phillips but it’s not totally unrealistic that the Bills decide to use it (though I still doubt they do). I agree that the quote from Beane sounds more like he will let him test free agency though. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Punching Bag Posted February 12, 2020 Share Posted February 12, 2020 3 hours ago, Hapless Bills Fan said: Leaving aside the question of the Bills putting a $15M DT tag on a guy who for them, is a rotational player with Ed Oliver..... .....given what he said in his post-season presser I don't see how Beane could possibly tag Jordan Phillips and retain much in the way of credibility with players. He said, plain as plain can be, "Jordan Phillips has earned the right to test free agency". You can't say that on the record about a guy then turn around and slap a tag on him, not if you want to be seen as a straight-up guy. Not unless circumstances changed from date he said it and when he tags him and states why he changed stance. Note: I did not see/hear the post-season presser so not know if what is being circulated is entire thing he said. Press take many things out of context in effort to juice stories (i.e. "Quarterback hell"). Now if I am Phillips I sign it right away so it cannot be withdrawn. 1 hour ago, QCity said: Definitely an agency trying to hype this idea that Phillips is worth $15M+ a year. What's sad is that LaCanfora falls for this crap. Fall for it? He contributes to it. LaConjecture is a snake oil salesman. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reed83HOF Posted February 12, 2020 Share Posted February 12, 2020 39 minutes ago, Limeaid said: Not unless circumstances changed from date he said it and when he tags him and states why he changed stance. Note: I did not see/hear the post-season presser so not know if what is being circulated is entire thing he said. Press take many things out of context in effort to juice stories (i.e. "Quarterback hell"). Now if I am Phillips I sign it right away so it cannot be withdrawn. Fall for it? He contributes to it. LaConjecture is a snake oil salesman. It is basically the entire thing and exactly what he said Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hapless Bills Fan Posted February 13, 2020 Share Posted February 13, 2020 1 hour ago, Limeaid said: Note: I did not see/hear the post-season presser so not know if what is being circulated is entire thing he said. Press take many things out of context in effort to juice stories (i.e. "Quarterback hell"). I did listen to the post season presser, went back and listened to it to time-stamp the relevant portion, and accurately transcribed what was said. I am not press Feel free to do your own due diligence (I provided the link and the timestamp) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turftoe Posted February 13, 2020 Share Posted February 13, 2020 If he gets a big contract, we will get a 3rd-4th round comp pick next year, providing we lose more than we sign. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Formerly Allan in MD Posted February 13, 2020 Share Posted February 13, 2020 Not happening. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hapless Bills Fan Posted February 13, 2020 Share Posted February 13, 2020 1 hour ago, BillsFan4 said: I guess it depends exactly what Beane meant when he said see what his value is on the market”. If they use the non-exclusive franchise tag, or the transition tag Phillips could still negotiate with other teams. Though using the non-exclusive franchise tag would make any other team actually signing him pretty unrealistic (since the Bills get two 1sts if they don’t match, which not matching would be a no-brainer). But a transition tag would allow the Bills the opportunity to match an offer, and it wouldn’t really restrict Phillips from seeing what his value is on the market. This year’s transition tag number is $12.3M. That’s more than I want to spend on Phillips but it’s not totally unrealistic that the Bills decide to use it (though I still doubt they do). I agree that the quote from Beane sounds more like he will let him test free agency though. Fair point, but using either would (I think) set Phillips value above where we place it as a rotational DL. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ALF Posted February 13, 2020 Share Posted February 13, 2020 Market value for Jordan Phillips at $6.1M a year sounds fair https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/buffalo-bills/jordan-phillips-16776/market-value/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aristocrat Posted February 13, 2020 Share Posted February 13, 2020 who do we replace him with if we don't tag him? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vincec Posted February 13, 2020 Share Posted February 13, 2020 1 hour ago, aristocrat said: who do we replace him with if we don't tag him? Vincent Taylor? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CDogg20 Posted February 13, 2020 Share Posted February 13, 2020 3 hours ago, Binghamton Beast said: 16 million for a rotational guy? No. Absolutely agree. He’s going to want to get paid good money and we’re not going to pay it to him. He’s a good player but he doesn’t play enough to warrant that contract. Our defense is built on a good rotation and paying him would hurt us overall Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffaloFan32 Posted February 13, 2020 Share Posted February 13, 2020 The team is worse without Phillips. It might not be good value but tag him if it keeps him here another year. There is no way they fill up that $90M bucket this year. It’s just the owner’s money that you’re saving if you don’t spend up to the cap. He also provides some intangibles that would be missed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thurman#1 Posted February 13, 2020 Share Posted February 13, 2020 7 hours ago, DrDawkinstein said: The 2019 Tag Number for DTs was $15,209,000. Just putting that out there for easy reference. Keee-yikes! 20 minutes ago, BuffaloFan32 said: The team is worse without Phillips. It might not be good value but tag him if it keeps him here another year. There is no way they fill up that $90M bucket this year. It’s just the owner’s money that you’re saving if you don’t spend up to the cap. He also provides some intangibles that would be missed. Money that is left over under the cap this year will get rolled over into next year's cap. It doesn't just go into the Pegulas investment accounts. Agreed the team is a bit worse without him. But not $15 mill worse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsFan4 Posted February 13, 2020 Share Posted February 13, 2020 3 hours ago, Hapless Bills Fan said: I did listen to the post season presser, went back and listened to it to time-stamp the relevant portion, and accurately transcribed what was said. I am not press Feel free to do your own due diligence (I provided the link and the timestamp) You were actually right, just wrong interview. He did say “some of these guys have earned the right to test free agency”. Now, he didn’t say “all of these guys” so he left some wriggle room there. https://www.buffalobills.com/video/brandon-beane-there-are-good-players-out-here At roughly the 10:30 mark of the video. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
njbuff Posted February 13, 2020 Share Posted February 13, 2020 What's he worth with a transition tag? And does that even exist anymore? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hapless Bills Fan Posted February 13, 2020 Share Posted February 13, 2020 8 minutes ago, BillsFan4 said: You were actually right, just wrong interview. He did say “some of these guys have earned the right to test free agency”. Now, he didn’t say “all of these guys” so he left some wriggle room there. https://www.buffalobills.com/video/brandon-beane-there-are-good-players-out-here At roughly the 10:30 mark of the video. That's not the interview where he said specifically that Phillips has earned the right to test free agency. His exact words weren't free agency, they were "open market", and the link and time stamp are correctly given in my post upthread. He's said similar things about free agency in several interviews and about if we don't sign a player until FA it doesn't mean we won't, but some of the players need to see what offers they get and they completely respect that (words to that effect) well, here's the link to make it easy https://www.twobillsdrive.com/community/topic/223024-tag-for-phillips/page/2/?tab=comments#comment-6381748 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LSHMEAB Posted February 13, 2020 Share Posted February 13, 2020 2 hours ago, ALF said: Market value for Jordan Phillips at $6.1M a year sounds fair https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/buffalo-bills/jordan-phillips-16776/market-value/ Yeah. Phillips had a huge year, but my suspicion is that teams are going to be VERY leery of the one year wonder thing. The guy had a grand total of 5.5 sacks in 5 FULL SEASONS prior to 2019. I'd love to have him back on the Bills at the right price, and I think it's possible. He may very well end up disappointed if he's expecting a monster deal. Tag and trade for a guy with his OVERALL track record? Not happening. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tipster19 Posted February 13, 2020 Share Posted February 13, 2020 I wonder if Lawson gets tagged and traded first. Weak market, should drive Lawson’s value up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Putin Posted February 13, 2020 Share Posted February 13, 2020 8 hours ago, DrDawkinstein said: The 2019 Tag Number for DTs was $15,209,000. Just putting that out there for easy reference. Looks like bah-bye Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hapless Bills Fan Posted February 13, 2020 Share Posted February 13, 2020 1 hour ago, njbuff said: What's he worth with a transition tag? And does that even exist anymore? Someone upthread thought it was $12.x million to transition tag I think the Bills value on Phillips would be more like $6-8M/yr with maybe a far upper bound of $10M Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hapless Bills Fan Posted February 13, 2020 Share Posted February 13, 2020 1 hour ago, Tipster19 said: I wonder if Lawson gets tagged and traded first. Weak market, should drive Lawson’s value up. I don't think either of them get tagged and traded. But Beane sounded a lot more enthused about signing Shaq to a long deal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Brown Posted February 13, 2020 Share Posted February 13, 2020 9 hours ago, buffalostu2 said: Wouldn't the transition tag be a better option? He might be worth more to us than anyone else. I'm hoping Beane and Phillips have a good enough relationship for the Bills a chance to match whatever offer he gets without having to resort to the transition tag. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Utah John Posted February 13, 2020 Share Posted February 13, 2020 Phillips had a breakout year this season, which just happened to be in his contract year. We're seen these situations before, where a guy plays exceptionally well in his contract year and then reverts to mediocrity. If he gets the big, multi-year contract he wants from the Bills, we'll be overpaying him for years. Tagging means possibly overpaying for one year, but keeping his rights while we see if he can keep playing at that high level. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ProcessTruster Posted February 13, 2020 Share Posted February 13, 2020 16 hours ago, Buffalo716 said: Isn't it like 15mil for D Tackles? I'd pass unless a tag and trade was worked out yep. he was clearly playing not for the Bills last year, but 100% in anticipation of FA. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JinxedBill Posted February 13, 2020 Share Posted February 13, 2020 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WideRightRevenge Posted February 13, 2020 Share Posted February 13, 2020 I lovee what Phillips has done since being cut by the Dolphins and joining the Mafia ... let me repeat cut from the Dolphins ... but if can't work out more economical longer term deal .. rather than franchise .. I'd rather see the $15MM go to the other side of the ball. Granted we have large cap space .. but not sure we invest $15MM in one year's worth of performance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HOUSE Posted February 13, 2020 Share Posted February 13, 2020 (edited) 3 million per year sounds like an awful lot of money to me.. . Edited February 13, 2020 by HOUSE 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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