Rumor: Bills trying aggressively to move up for a WR in round one

[NastyNateSoldiers]

6 hours ago, JBI$111 said:

Hopefully the Bill's don't give up too much, they usually get fleeced and give away more than the trade value would suggest when they make moves up or generally make a trade. Other teams know they're desperate to trade up for a wide receiver, it's a huge glaring need and of course they'll take advantage of it. The Bill's are not in a good position to negotiate fair value if they want to trade up that bad and other teams know it.

Maybe trade up a little bit and get Worthy and then trade for Metcalf or get another large receiver later on after they get Worthy. Can't let Miami get Worthy or Kansas City.

Worthy is as light as a feather I like him but won't trade up for him. I much rather stay put and take the freight train that's Xaxier Leggette 220lbs at 4.37 is serious explosiveness. Leggette was also the fastest tracked player by mileage last yr as he was tracked at over 22 miles per hour. The combo of speed and strength the blocking abilities the after the catch abilities I don't care if he's 23yrs old the man can be a monster in this game. He reminds me of a faster Eric Moulds and like Moulds coming out wasn't the best route runner coming out of college but he can learn that easily because he has the movement skills.

[njbuff]

We all know the team likes Troy Franklin a lot.

 

I think the best case scenario is for the Bills to trade back into the 2nd round (if possible) and double dip.

 

After all, they still need 2 WR's.

 

And I'm going with Troy Franklin and Roman Wilson in round 2.

 

Use the rest of the draft to build up some depth. 

 

At least this is what I would do. But I have no experience at drafting, so my plan sucks. 🤣🤣

[DJB]

4 hours ago, Alphadawg7 said:

 

Its worse...hes actually 2 inches taller at 6'1" and 165 pounds.  He is literally a stick figure thats not gonna be able to get off the line in bad weather games.

Worthy was listed at 5’11 at the combine

[SectionC3]

1 hour ago, GunnerBill said:

 

I agree with most of this though I'm not sure I buy that the Vikings are going to suck quite that bad. That pick is more likely 40-45 than 35-40 I reckon. 35 would mean they have the third worst record in the league I just don't see that. They still have a very good oline, two excellent receivers, a good tight end.... okay QB is a complete unknown but I'd be surprised if they were total suckitude with their talent. 

I agree with all of this.  I just wonder if maybe one of those receivers goes to provide extra capital to get where they want to be.  PFT suggested using Jefferson to get to #2 last night.  I'll make it in a roundabout way - perhaps they use Jefferson to get draft capital to use to flip to get to 2 or 3.  Or maybe Addison tickles the fancy of someone to move up.  Or maybe it's Addison that gets moved to acquire the extra draft capital.  Could 11, 23 and (for argument's sake) 28 get them where they want  to be?   I don't see how that doesn't get them to at least #3.

[GreggTX]

Just Beane doing due diligence. He needs to begin exploring options now. Day 1 of the draft is too late to start. He might make a deal before the draft if a great deal comes along.

[H2o]

 

[WhitewalkerInPhilly]

In the immortal words from the IT Crowd: "There were rumors, that there was a rumor but it was just bullsh*t" 

 

I believe nothing leaked to the press for the next five days until it's official.

 

But maaaaaaan I want this to be true. It's probably going to hurt but I'll take it.

[CaptnCoke11]

Worthy is more and more intriguing as the draft gets closer.  

[gobilz]

It’s on like a mofo !

[Pete]

We only have one WR who has caught passes from Josh.  We have a big friggin hole at WR 1, and two big holes in top 5 WR.  Beane is going to fill them, and upgrade 14 and Gabe

[SoonerBillsFan]

Dealing from a  position of weakness is going to cost a ton.

[NewEra]

8 hours ago, HardyBoy said:

 

To be fair I do think it was injuries largely with Watkins... which is a huge risk in the nfl obviously. 

 

He also turned out to have some pretty let's just say interesting ideas on things iirc... kinda wonder if he brought any of that into his injury rehab?

It wasn’t just injuries.  Dude had issues

[BuffaloBillyG]

8 hours ago, Logic said:

I know this is already in the "NFL draft rumors" thread, but given that it involves the team this forum is based on, and involves the position we all know they desperately need, and given that it's based on the reporting of at least one credible source....surely it deserves its own thread, no? I can't be the only one who doesn't regularly check the draft rumors thread. If it gets merged, so be it.
 

 

 

In the end I expect this to be much commotion about nothing. I'm certain Beane has called pretty much everyone about what a package to move up would look like. Gathering information. He does this every year to my knowledge. So do most GMs.

 

My best guess is in the long run this is a nothing burger. Lots of people spinning their wheels this week are building some pretty high expectations that will set themselves up for a disappointment come Thursday Night IMO.

[GunnerBill]

1 hour ago, SectionC3 said:

I agree with all of this.  I just wonder if maybe one of those receivers goes to provide extra capital to get where they want to be.  PFT suggested using Jefferson to get to #2 last night.  I'll make it in a roundabout way - perhaps they use Jefferson to get draft capital to use to flip to get to 2 or 3.  Or maybe Addison tickles the fancy of someone to move up.  Or maybe it's Addison that gets moved to acquire the extra draft capital.  Could 11, 23 and (for argument's sake) 28 get them where they want  to be?   I don't see how that doesn't get them to at least #3.

 

The problem getting into the top 3 is those 3 teams all want Quarterbacks. Both Washington and New England have taken calls and politely declined from what I hear. Maybe if the wrong one is left at #3 New England's stance on that changes on draft night. They might only like 1 guy but while there is a chance he is there they don't want to move. But realistically I think #4 is where Minnesota will end up getting. That wouldn't need a receiver thrown in and I think they'd be loathed to do it. If they end up needing to help out a rookie having Jefferson and Addison to use is no bad start. 

[That's No Moon]

2 hours ago, NastyNateSoldiers said:

Worthy is as light as a feather I like him but won't trade up for him. I much rather stay put and take the freight train that's Xaxier Leggette 220lbs at 4.37 is serious explosiveness. Leggette was also the fastest tracked player by mileage last yr as he was tracked at over 22 miles per hour. The combo of speed and strength the blocking abilities the after the catch abilities I don't care if he's 23yrs old the man can be a monster in this game. He reminds me of a faster Eric Moulds and like Moulds coming out wasn't the best route runner coming out of college but he can learn that easily because he has the movement skills.

If he can learn that easily, why has he not learned it. Dude was a 5th year senior.

[SectionC3]

7 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

The problem getting into the top 3 is those 3 teams all want Quarterbacks. Both Washington and New England have taken calls and politely declined from what I hear. Maybe if the wrong one is left at #3 New England's stance on that changes on draft night. They might only like 1 guy but while there is a chance he is there they don't want to move. But realistically I think #4 is where Minnesota will end up getting. That wouldn't need a receiver thrown in and I think they'd be loathed to do it. If they end up needing to help out a rookie having Jefferson and Addison to use is no bad start. 

 

I completely agree with all of this. My guess is that NE likes two of the top three, or one of the latter two thirds of that analysis, and they might be open to the AJ Smith model of loading up the rest of the roster now and plugging in the QB in the next year or two.  

 

On the receivers point, I agree with the odds of success favoring a young QB with that pair in place.  But, if the Vikings need to generate extra draft capital to make the move, and if they feel strongly enough about the guy they're moving for, flipping one of those guys to get it done isn't an outlandish idea.  Jefferson's intermittent friction with Cousins is in the back of my mind on this one.  If that guy didn't like Cousins, and he's approaching extension territory, then I wonder how he's going to do with Darnold as a journeyman placeholder, or with Daniels/Maye/McCarthy/whomever trying to figure things out on the fly.  

 

EDIT - 

 

I'll add this.  I'm wrestling with Jefferson's value this morning.  Is it a pair of ones?  Is it a 1 + 2?  Maybe a 1 + a future 2?  Or could it be as low as a 1 given what is likely to be an enormous financial commitment?  I don't know.  From the Bills' perspective, adding a guy with that type of salary is completely contrary to what they appear to be trying to do after getting Diggs out of the locker room.  But if I'm Beane . . . it doesn't hurt to check on the price.  

Edited April 24 by SectionC3

[finn]

I don't like trade-ups. Quarterbacks are one thing, but a costly trade for any other position is just gambling. Even if it works out, you have only one player. Trading up for Kincaid, Elam, and Ford meant that the Bills couldn't draft three other players that might have helped, maybe even a lot, given Beane's gift for finding talent late in the draft. 

 

[OldTimer1960]

9 hours ago, Warriorspikes51 said:

If Beane believes Worthy or BTJ is their guy, I’m fine with giving up 128, another late rounder and a 2025 2nd

I would not give up that much for the 165lb Worthy and I guess OK for Thomas Jr, but none of these guys are sure things.

 

 

[RichRiderBills]

Did anyone see the nice / endearing piece on NFL about Adonai Mitchell and him transferring for his daughter?

 

My first thought: Buffalo is going to be a problem. 

 

I'd cross him off our boards. 

[Sweats]

8 hours ago, Turbo44 said:

It’s crazy but we could be drafting Thursday anytime from 8:40 to not at all

 

 

 

 

Well, that pretty well covers it.

[BeastMode54]

So there seems to be a lot of smoke regarding Worthy. I'm not totally opposed to it, but have flashbacks of Goodwin and/or Graham. My question is, if Worthy ran a 4.4 40 and not the fastest ever, would he still be regarded as a 1st round wr?

[section122]

A thought I can't shake:

 

How many wrs currently in the nfl would you trade 2 1st round picks for?  It isn't many.  I get the idea of the player being cost controlled but I still have a hard time seeing it being worth it especially since it likely will cost additional picks.

[nucci]

Brilliant reporting. I never would have guessed this

[papazoid]

7 minutes ago, BeastMode54 said:

So there seems to be a lot of smoke regarding Worthy. I'm not totally opposed to it, but have flashbacks of Goodwin and/or Graham. My question is, if Worthy ran a 4.4 40 and not the fastest ever, would he still be regarded as a 1st round wr?

 

if tyreek hill  ran 4.4 instead of 4.29 would he still be called cheetah ?

 

but to answer your question..... without that 4.21 speed ...worthy would NOT be regarded as a 1st round wr.

 

speed kills.....but lots of fast guys never make it in the nfl.

 

 

Edited April 24 by papazoid

[Andy1]

Get me a WR who can perform at his best in playoff conditions in Buffalo. I’m not sure if Worthy is that guy. Pure speed doesn’t work on the snow. 

[aristocrat]

2 hours ago, njbuff said:

We all know the team likes Troy Franklin a lot.

 

I think the best case scenario is for the Bills to trade back into the 2nd round (if possible) and double dip.

 

After all, they still need 2 WR's.

 

And I'm going with Troy Franklin and Roman Wilson in round 2.

 

Use the rest of the draft to build up some depth. 

 

At least this is what I would do. But I have no experience at drafting, so my plan sucks. 🤣🤣

 

we can't go into the year with two rookies outside. get up and go for btj and then get a vet like maybe dj chark. chark doesn't have to be a legit 2 but more of a guy to take pressure off kincaid and samuel

[bills6969]

The Worthy stuff is prob a smoke screen

[Sweats]

In the words of the Virgin Mary, ".......come again?"

[Kirby Jackson]

17 minutes ago, section122 said:

A thought I can't shake:

 

How many wrs currently in the nfl would you trade 2 1st round picks for?  It isn't many.  I get the idea of the player being cost controlled but I still have a hard time seeing it being worth it especially since it likely will cost additional picks.

I think that the cost controlled IS the reason that a 2nd number 1 comes into play. The top WRs now account for like 12% of the cap (by the time Aiyuk, Higgins & Jefferson sign). It’s the 2nd most important position on the team (or at least right there with pass rusher). Top QBs, which we have, account for like 20% of the cap. It simply isn’t very easy to have both. You spend the draft capital on WR to free up cap space to spend on other areas.
 

As an example, you could use 2 firsts and 2 seconds to move up for a number 1 WR. I’m not saying that you do or don’t do this. This is a hypothetical to illustrate my point. By using that capital to get the number 1 WR you save the $30M annually that it would cost to sign someone like that. You can then spend $8M on S, $12M on a pass rusher, $4M on a CB, $4M on a RB & $2M on a DT. So while you do not have as many picks to get those positions you can buy them instead. You’ll need to have cost controlled assets somewhere and in this example it is at WR. The point being that there are multiple ways to build a roster and decisions can’t be made in a vacuum because they are all intertwined. So while the cost to go way up, limits the high end swings you can take over the next few drafts, it also frees the balance sheet to be more aggressive in FA.

 

Now obviously, if you can find elite talent without having to go up that’s even better. There’s a reason though that some prospects are universally ranked above others. If you go up you’re paying for that prospect’s ceiling and floor. 

Edited April 24 by Kirby Jackson

[NewEra]

13 minutes ago, BeastMode54 said:

So there seems to be a lot of smoke regarding Worthy. I'm not totally opposed to it, but have flashbacks of Goodwin and/or Graham. My question is, if Worthy ran a 4.4 40 and not the fastest ever, would he still be regarded as a 1st round wr?

If Tyreek ran a 4.4 would he still be a 30M man?

 

I do get your point, but the speed is why he is who he is. 

5 minutes ago, aristocrat said:

 

we can't go into the year with two rookies outside. get up and go for btj and then get a vet like maybe dj chark. chark doesn't have to be a legit 2 but more of a guy to take pressure off kincaid and samuel

BTj AND Chark?  I think you’re dreaming.  I don’t see any chance of Shakir starting the season as WR4.  He’ll be a top 3 guy for sure.  We need one outside WR.  We have another in backup Hollins and 2 others (samuel and Shakir) that can play outside on occasion.  

[WhitewalkerInPhilly]

Yeah I'm not trading up for Worthy.

 

He's not worthy 

 

Pun aside, I can come to terms with nearly any WR taken at 28 but I am only trading up for the big three, BTJ, maybe Franklin or Adonai Mitchell 

[longtimebillsfan]

Why is this draft different than 2014?  When we moved up then, the hindsight conventional wisdom was that we could have drafted just as talented receiver in the 2nd round?  Now many think a move up is a good thing.

 

No one knows which receivers will excel at the next level.

[Dr. Who]

1 hour ago, Pete said:

We only have one WR who has caught passes from Josh.  We have a big friggin hole at WR 1, and two big holes in top 5 WR.  Beane is going to fill them, and upgrade 14 and Gabe

Folks who still want defense ahead of WR in this year with the draft set up to fill those holes, and obvious need, are either always going to think Josh Allen should elevate mid-level talent or they are Sean McD.

[MikePJ76]

26 minutes ago, aristocrat said:

 

we can't go into the year with two rookies outside. get up and go for btj and then get a vet like maybe dj chark. chark doesn't have to be a legit 2 but more of a guy to take pressure off kincaid and samuel

michael gallup is the perfect 1 year replacement for gabe davis.  Similiar players.  Gallup has better hands and davis has better speed.

 

he could help bridge the gap to another young wr next year.  Get one this year and one next year.

[Dr. Who]

6 minutes ago, longtimebillsfan said:

Why is this draft different than 2014?  When we moved up then, the hindsight conventional wisdom was that we could have drafted just as talented receiver in the 2nd round?  Now many think a move up is a good thing.

 

No one knows which receivers will excel at the next level.

That is very lazy thinking. I suppose you could say that without taking into consideration the particulars of any draft. No one knows, so why trade up? But that isn't strictly true. There are tiers, and there are players with greater chances of success than others. Of course, there's always risk. You can't eliminate that in life, so you can't eliminate it from the draft. Certainly, folks who reactively think Sammy Watkins is somehow the basis of a draft law of gravity that means you should never trade up for a WR are not prudential enough. Practical wisdom is taking into consideration the precise nature of particular situations, and choosing what is best. 

 

That doesn't mean moving up for a top 3 WR is correct. The cost might be too much, but it might also be worth the risk, depending . . . so one hopes Beane makes the right calculation.

[OldTimer1960]

35 minutes ago, BeastMode54 said:

So there seems to be a lot of smoke regarding Worthy. I'm not totally opposed to it, but have flashbacks of Goodwin and/or Graham. My question is, if Worthy ran a 4.4 40 and not the fastest ever, would he still be regarded as a 1st round wr?

I think Worthy’s floor is as a dangerous deep threat and someone who you can scheme touches for.  I don’t know that he is ever going to be a high volume receiver.  His ceiling is moderately high constrained mostly by his size and durability concerns.

 

At one time I was against Worthy in the first, but I think he is as good as the other receivers likely to be there around 28.

[aristocrat]

37 minutes ago, NewEra said:

If Tyreek ran a 4.4 would he still be a 30M man?

 

I do get your point, but the speed is why he is who he is. 

BTj AND Chark?  I think you’re dreaming.  I don’t see any chance of Shakir starting the season as WR4.  He’ll be a top 3 guy for sure.  We need one outside WR.  We have another in backup Hollins and 2 others (samuel and Shakir) that can play outside on occasion.  

a guy can dream can’t he? Shakir will get plenty of snaps with injuries 

[wppete]

10 hours ago, bills6969 said:

MHJ or bust

 
I get Sammy Watkins vibes from MHJ. Id rather have Nabers.

[Peace Frog]

The latest rumor I heard from deep in the organization is that the Bills are looking to draft some potential starters at key positions.  Take it for what it's worth.

[longtimebillsfan]

16 minutes ago, Dr. Who said:

That is very lazy thinking. I suppose you could say that without taking into consideration the particulars of any draft. No one knows, so why trade up? But that isn't strictly true. There are tiers, and there are players with greater chances of success than others. Of course, there's always risk. You can't eliminate that in life, so you can't eliminate it from the draft. Certainly, folks who reactively think Sammy Watkins is somehow the basis of a draft law of gravity that means you should never trade up for a WR are not prudential enough. Practical wisdom is taking into consideration the precise nature of particular situations, and choosing what is best. 

 

That doesn't mean moving up for a top 3 WR is correct. The cost might be too much, but it might also be worth the risk, depending . . . so one hopes Beane makes the right calculation.

I disagree it is lazy thinking, but you are entitled to yout opinion.

 

For years, many posters here have lamented that the Bills should not have wasted draft capitol to move up when that draft was do deep at wr.  That sounds very similar to this draft.  "Those that don't remember history are doomed to repeat it"

 

Fans get so pumped up about certain players because these self appointed "draft experts" hype them in their mock drafts.

 

The Bills have too many needs to burn draft picks on an unnecessary move up.

 

There was another thread started recently that made the point that regardless of which wr the Bills pick in the draft, they would still need a #1 wr.  The op made a valid point in that thread.

 

This is just my opinion for what it's worth.