Clowney and the Texans are still far apart.

[Tipster19]

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2019/04/14/report-clowney-texans-not-close/

 

As the draft nears there still is anybody’s guess on what the Bills are going to do. I’m torn on what is more important for the Bills, offense or defense. Here’s a basic idea that I would like to see happen. Please feel free to tweak, edit or even disagree all together, your input is welcomed.

 

The Texans’ 1st rd pick is #23. What if the Bills would trade down with them and throw in next year’s 2nd rd pick and if needed maybe a later rd pick (5th rder?) in this year’s draft or next? The Texans and Clowney apparently are very far apart and even if they do resolve it Clowney’s contract would be expensive. Maybe both GMs, Brian Gaine and Brandon Beane can work something out fairly for both clubs.

 

Making a trade like could accomplish a few things for the Bills. First off they obtain a high impact DL who is still young but with NFL experience.

 

Secondly the Bills would be able to kill 2 birds with 1 stone, obtain a big time DL and also draft a high impact offensive rookie. If a trade like this could go down then I would love to see the Bills draft someone like WR K’Neal Harry. 

 

With their 2nd rd pick an OL like Erik McCoy would be a great addition and insurance. This opens up drafting a top talent at the TE position in the 3rd rd or even in a trade up. A RB could be in play as well. In the 3rd and/or 4th rd could still net a good talent for the DL or LB position. 

 

In any event I’m just offering up a rough draft/concept on acquiring big talent on both sides of the ball in the early part of the draft.

 

 

 

 

[purple haze]

If they swapped picks that might be all Beane would offer.  In your scenario, the Bills get Clowney, but also get the price tag that comes with him.  The Texans would get a top 10 pick with a chance to get a new Edge player on a cheaper deal for the next four years or a highly regarded OL which they desperately need.   I wouldn't throw in more than a third in 2020 because the contract would be exorbitant.

 

Edited April 15, 2019 by purple haze

[Shaw66]

The concept makes sense.  The problem is that they don't have much time left before the draft.  Bill's and Houston might agree, but Bill's and Clowney would have to agree too.  It's not clear that the Bill's would want to pay more than Houston. 

[purple haze]

3 minutes ago, Shaw66 said:

The concept makes sense.  The problem is that they don't have much time left before the draft.  Bill's and Houston might agree, but Bill's and Clowney would have to agree too.  It's not clear that the Bill's would want to pay more than Houston. 

They could throw more guarantees in whatever deal.  That would be more important to him than the overall number which is smoke and mirrors most times anyway. 

[vincec]

Both teams need an edge rusher. If Houston, who knows Clooney best, doesn’t think he’s worth what he is asking for then why would he be worth it to the Bills? If they want a new DE then draft one with their first pick.

Edited April 15, 2019 by vincec

[GimmeSomeProcess]

I’d rather have clark 

[Augie]

I don’t really follow the guy, but it sounds like Clowney wants to get paid for his hype, not his production. Mario Williams actually played well, for a while. 

[Tipster19]

13 minutes ago, vincec said:

Both teams need an edge rusher. If Houston, who knows Clooney best, doesn’t think he’s worth what he is asking for then why would he be worth it to the Bills? If they want a new DE then draft one with their first pick.

 

What I’m thinking is that we get to address 2 needs instead of just 1. We have the luxury of having the money to spend in a case like this. 

 

25 minutes ago, purple haze said:

If they swapped picks that might be all Beane would offer.  In your scenario, the Bills get Clowney, but also get the price tag that comes with him.  The Texans would get a top 10 pick with a chance to get a new Edge player on a cheaper deal for the next four years or a highly regarded OL which they desperately need.   I wouldn't throw in more than a third in 2020 because the contract would be exorbitant.

 

 

I don’t disagree with this. I’m just trying to draw up the guidelines, I’m hoping that people like you could come up with the specifics.

 

 

[Orlando Tim]

If the cost is anything near lawrence i do not want him- he is a nice talent but i do not trust him to keep up effort once paid.

[Florida Bills Fanatic]

5 minutes ago, Augie said:

I don’t really follow the guy, but it sounds like Clowney wants to get paid for his hype, not his production. Mario Williams actually played well, for a while. 

I think that you nailed it.  Nobody would argue that the guy has freakish athletic ability.  The problem is that he has not been a dominating player but wants to get paid like one. I hope Beane sees it the same way.

[Tipster19]

30 minutes ago, GimmeSomeProcess said:

I’d rather have clark 

 

14 minutes ago, Buffalo Timmy said:

If the cost is anything near lawrence i do not want him- he is a nice talent but i do not trust him to keep up effort once paid.

 

12 minutes ago, Florida Bills Fanatic said:

I think that you nailed it.  Nobody would argue that the guy has freakish athletic ability.  The problem is that he has not been a dominating player but wants to get paid like one. I hope Beane sees it the same way.

 

Well, maybe the Bills could use the same concept with another player like Clark or even someone else.

[offyourocker]

With a draft loaded at DE, I can’t see why we would even consider this

[Mat68]

49 minutes ago, vincec said:

Both teams need an edge rusher. If Houston, who knows Clooney best, doesn’t think he’s worth what he is asking for then why would he be worth it to the Bills? If they want a new DE then draft one with their first pick.

I think it's more a question of afford.  Watt massive deal, Hopkins? Watson?  I dont see them being able to pay all of them.  

[MJS]

Not sure if Clowney is worth what he wants, but certainly we need a high end edge rusher. I'm sure Beane and McDermott will figure it out, though.

[Over 29 years of fanhood]

37 minutes ago, Buffalo Timmy said:

If the cost is anything near lawrence i do not want him- he is a nice talent but i do not trust him to keep up effort once paid.

 

Its the last name right?  ? 

 

...It’s damning 

[row_33]

51 minutes ago, Buffalo Timmy said:

If the cost is anything near lawrence i do not want him- he is a nice talent but i do not trust him to keep up effort once paid.

 

Nobody ever did that in Buffalo.....

 

 

[Tipster19]

A trade down like this could possibly net the Bills some great players. 

A. Clowney or possibly Clark.

B. K’Neal Harry.

C. Erik McCoy.

D. Jaylon Ferguson.

E. ITV Smith Jr.

 

To be able to secure the last 3 of these players the Bills would probably have to bungle some of their remaining draft picks to accomplish something of this nature but it would be worth it imo.

[NewEra]

2 hours ago, vincec said:

Both teams need an edge rusher. If Houston, who knows Clooney best, doesn’t think he’s worth what he is asking for then why would he be worth it to the Bills? If they want a new DE then draft one with their first pick.

The same can be said for every single free agent.  Why would the packers want Reggie white when the eagles didn’t want him?  And so on.  Same premise.

[GunnerBill]

2 hours ago, Mat68 said:

I think it's more a question of afford.  Watt massive deal, Hopkins? Watson?  I dont see them being able to pay all of them.  

 

Indeed. Teams are built differently and are at different points in a cycle with different salary cap considerations. 

[Passepartout]

Yeah as really they would have to show him the money to keep him!

[Ethan in Cleveland]

Clowney is not worth the money.  He is not a top 10 DE. Not even close.  Yes he is better than Lawson but not at the price he thinks he is worth.  To take on his contract the most the Bills should give up is a second round pick.  But I wouldn't do it.  They have a ton of cap space next year and some of the deals signed this year and last will come off the books. Save the money for next off-season.  2019 is all about Josh Allen and determining if he is the franchise QB. That is why I was ok with them chasing AB.  With the WR signings they have made it is time to double down on TE and OT.  And draft youth on the DL.  Not overpay for hype.

[Freddie's Dead]

N'Keal, kids, N'Keal.  Enough with the K'Neal.  How can you love a guy when you can't spell his name correctly?

[thenorthremembers]

6 hours ago, offyourocker said:

With a draft loaded at DE, I can’t see why we would even consider this

Because it's not loaded with defensive ends past the 1st round.  And even then the 1st round guys all have major questions.  I would always take the known over the unknown.  And, guys like Josh Allen, Montez Sweat, and Clelin Ferrell may have a hard time getting anywhere near Clowney in the league.  

[HOUSE]

Don't tease me

[GimmeSomeProcess]

7 hours ago, Tipster19 said:

 

 

 

Well, maybe the Bills could use the same concept with another player like Clark or even someone else.

Well the difference is, Clark is had been way more productive than Clowney and actually surpasses Lawernce production as well. 

[ProcessTruster]

8 hours ago, Shaw66 said:

The concept makes sense.  The problem is that they don't have much time left before the draft.  Bill's and Houston might agree, but Bill's and Clowney would have to agree too.  It's not clear that the Bill's would want to pay more than Houston. 

shiny object.  pass. 

[Rc2catch]

I would seriously have to start doubting Beane if he acquired Clowney, oft injured and good against the run.. Kinda sounds like Lawson a little, only 100 million dollars more expensive. Clowney is not an impact pass rusher, however he is pretty elite against the run.. He also generally plays the same spot as Hughes in the 4-3 set and it’s not always effective to swap to the other side. He’s a good player, but he’s always dinged up (he does play through it generally) and hes wanting top 5 money as a defensive end. The reason Houston isn’t paying him is simple, they want to pay him as an outside 3-4 linebacker and he isn’t having it. I would expect him to play his franchise tag out this season and be gone next year 

[BuffaloBill]

9 hours ago, purple haze said:

They could throw more guarantees in whatever deal.  That would be more important to him than the overall number which is smoke and mirrors most times anyway. 

 

 

I am not in favor of big money up front guarantee contracts for guys who do not come up through your own system.  The Bills just painfully exited bad contracts and cap hell.  Let’s not put ourselves back into it.

[PromoTheRobot]

9 hours ago, Augie said:

I don’t really follow the guy, but it sounds like Clowney wants to get paid for his hype, not his production. Mario Williams actually played well, for a while. 

 

Yes, the Mario Williams experience still lingers with me. Played great for a few games, got injured, played meh, got injured again, rinse and repeat. We're better off drafting Oliver than betting a huge contact on Clowney.

[ChanticleerBillsFan]

56 minutes ago, Rc2catch said:

I would seriously have to start doubting Beane if he acquired Clowney, oft injured and good against the run.. Kinda sounds like Lawson a little, only 100 million dollars more expensive. Clowney is not an impact pass rusher, however he is pretty elite against the run.. He also generally plays the same spot as Hughes in the 4-3 set and it’s not always effective to swap to the other side. He’s a good player, but he’s always dinged up (he does play through it generally) and hes wanting top 5 money as a defensive end. The reason Houston isn’t paying him is simple, they want to pay him as an outside 3-4 linebacker and he isn’t having it. I would expect him to play his franchise tag out this season and be gone next year 

Clowney may have not had the sack totals of the other guys but he is great against the run and was 1st or 2nd in the league in pressures. I’m not completely sold but would get on board if it happened. May want Clark more due to compensation but not sure how he fits in culture wise 

[stinky finger]

6 hours ago, Freddie's Dead said:

N'Keal, kids, N'Keal.  Enough with the K'Neal.  How can you love a guy when you can't spell his name correctly?

 

Ankiel?

[PromoTheRobot]

Well I just made the mistake of disagreeing with @NateGeary on Twitter about trading for Clowney. #flamethrower

[CommonCents]

28 minutes ago, PromoTheRobot said:

Well I just made the mistake of disagreeing with @NateGeary on Twitter about trading for Clowney. #flamethrower

Giving up anything of value for Clowney would be a mistake. Paying him would be bad enough. 

[PromoTheRobot]

1 minute ago, CommonCents said:

Giving up anything of value for Clowney would be a mistake. Paying him would be bad enough. 

 

Yeah well tell that to Nate and his zombie army. I'm getting burnt to a crisp. That guy is diving into Twitter a little too deep, like you can't be a media star without coming down hard on anyone who disagrees with you.

Edited April 15, 2019 by PromoTheRobot

[Rc2catch]

1 hour ago, ChanticleerBillsFan said:

Clowney may have not had the sack totals of the other guys but he is great against the run and was 1st or 2nd in the league in pressures. I’m not completely sold but would get on board if it happened. May want Clark more due to compensation but not sure how he fits in culture wise 

The pressure stat doesn’t always tell the story though.. Sure it looks good as a stat but take Hughes for instance, he flies off the line and runs all the way around the left tackle to “pressure” the quarterback who takes two steps forward and completes a pass. Counts as a pressure but it doesn’t actually do much. It’s not in your face pressure like a Watt or Mack give you. Not dogging Hughes or clowney but that stat doesn’t tell much. I’d rather see the stats for QB knockdowns as that means they were actually close to a sack. I don’t follow Houston too closely but I do generally watch 3-5 games a year of them and clowney is mostly a no show in games I’ve seen. I couldn’t get behind bringing the guy in and paying him 100 million to line up on the same line as Hughes who has arguably been more reliable and better at a lower tiered salary. We can grab a pass rusher in rounds 1 or 2 who could match clowneys impact on a game I guess is the simplified version I should have just said 

[Jobot]

Clowney on a rookie deal - YES

 

Clowney on his next contract - No

 

As good as he is, I just don't see deals like this fitting the mold of a perennial winning organization.

[dollars 2 donuts]

11 hours ago, Shaw66 said:

The concept makes sense.  The problem is that they don't have much time left before the draft.  Bill's and Houston might agree, but Bill's and Clowney would have to agree too.  It's not clear that the Bill's would want to pay more than Houston. 

 

 

Shaw!  Players love Buffalo.  It's a no brainer he would sign here.

 

 

*sits and waits for both sides*

[bilzfancy]

I'd rather have Frank Clark, if the Bills were going this route 

[artmalibu]

Give up a top 10 pick to over pay a free agent..   No thanks!!

[ChanticleerBillsFan]

1 hour ago, Rc2catch said:

The pressure stat doesn’t always tell the story though.. Sure it looks good as a stat but take Hughes for instance, he flies off the line and runs all the way around the left tackle to “pressure” the quarterback who takes two steps forward and completes a pass. Counts as a pressure but it doesn’t actually do much. It’s not in your face pressure like a Watt or Mack give you. Not dogging Hughes or clowney but that stat doesn’t tell much. I’d rather see the stats for QB knockdowns as that means they were actually close to a sack. I don’t follow Houston too closely but I do generally watch 3-5 games a year of them and clowney is mostly a no show in games I’ve seen. I couldn’t get behind bringing the guy in and paying him 100 million to line up on the same line as Hughes who has arguably been more reliable and better at a lower tiered salary. We can grab a pass rusher in rounds 1 or 2 who could match clowneys impact on a game I guess is the simplified version I should have just said 

I can agree with that. What you think about Clark? I see him as a better fit in terms of rushing the passer