New offensive wrinkles for the Chiefs defense this week

[Inigo Montoya]

There are a few things that we haven't seen a lot of so far in Ken Dorsey's offense and I wonder if he is still just developing his playbook, or if he has deliberately kept some things close to the vest for this game versus the Chiefs this week so he can put some looks on the field that the Chiefs defense might be less prepared for.   Some of the things that we haven't seen a lot of, or any or this year on offense are;

 

Pre snap motion

Jet Sweeps

Empty backfield sets

Singletary and Cooks behind  / flanking Allen

Frequent screen passes

 

Going empty backfield and spreading out (pick your favorite five)  Diggs / Davis / Shakir / McKenzie / Singletary / Knox would be a nightmare for a defense to cover.  Shakir or McKenzie rocketing back into the backfield in motion and faking the pitch or actually taking the pitch from Allen with a full head of steam.   Moving Diggs all over the field before the snap to expose the defense and cause miss matches.  These are some of the things I hope we see more of on Sunday

[TYSONKO1]

Thanks, you just gave then our game plan.

[Buffalo Bills Fan]

1 minute ago, TYSONKO1 said:

Thanks, you just gave then our game plan.

 

Sure they'll read the twobillsdrive/community to see the game plans.

[John from Riverside]

When the Raiders were winning they were bust in the Chiefs with the run

[Lost]

Just now, John from Riverside said:

When the Raiders were winning they were bust in the Chiefs with the run

 

I hope McD doesn't think we're gonna go in there and replicated the same output with Moss

[atlbillsfan1975]

10 hours ago, Lost said:

 

I hope McD doesn't think we're gonna go in there and replicated the same output with Moss

I don’t think so. The Raiders blocking scheme strength appears to be the weakness for the Bills. The Bills aren’t straight ahead power blockers, they rely more on pin and pull style. This is in large part to the Bills having good athletes along the oline who are agile and mobile. 
Hoping the Bills just do what they do, there isn’t a defensive scheme that can slow down this offense when they aren’t shooting themselves in the foot. 

Edited October 12, 2022 by atlbillsfan1975

[ControllerOfPlanetX]

11 minutes ago, Buffalo Bills Fan said:

 

Sure they'll read the twobillsdrive/community to see the game plans.

Belichick does…

[JohnBonhamRocks]

I feel there has been a decent amount of motion and empty backfield sets.

 

Jet sweeps I agree, but it is going to depend how ready to go McKenzie is as he’s the main guy for those. I would not mind seeing Diggs or Shakir on one either. 
 

Always a fan of screens. Shakir and Cook seem well suited. Get them in space. 

[wjag]

I’d like to see a Diggs to Allen TD pass. 

[jjmac]

Not a Davis to Allen 98-yard TD pass?

[boyst]

Our best 5: Knox, Diggs, Singleterry, Davis, Shakir, McKenzie

 

But the shifts with sets having like Gilliam, Cook, Morris is great. Having Doyle is big, too. 

 

Dorsey has been rumored to love the 12 personnel package and I'm going to keep hammering this. We can't truly do this with Moris (though, he's blossoming!) but we can emulate some opportunities.

 

I expect Josh to have a lot of quick throws, a lot of movement with routes and timing, and keeping it more basic than we expected - including pre snap. 

[MiltonWaddams]

They will assuredly put in some new wrinkles, but they’re not going to open the whole playbook yet. Every week, there have been some new additions. Some have worked, some haven’t. But, these two teams know each other well and both defensive coordinators should be well prepared for most anything. Going to be a fun one.

Edited October 12, 2022 by MiltonWaddams

[LeviF]

Wrinkles? The *****in raiders hung 30 on that defense. 

[SageAgainstTheMachine]

We gotta run the touchdown play where Josh throws it far and a Bill catches it.

[Coach Tuesday]

8 minutes ago, Boyst62 said:

Our best 5: Knox, Diggs, Singleterry, Davis, Shakir, McKenzie

 

But the shifts with sets having like Gilliam, Cook, Morris is great. Having Doyle is big, too. 

 

Dorsey has been rumored to love the 12 personnel package and I'm going to keep hammering this. We can't truly do this with Moris (though, he's blossoming!) but we can emulate some opportunities.

 

I expect Josh to have a lot of quick throws, a lot of movement with routes and timing, and keeping it more basic than we expected - including pre snap. 

I wouldn’t expect much from Doyle on Sunday.

[boyst]

2 minutes ago, Boyst62 said:

Our best 5: Knox, Diggs, Singleterry, Davis, Shakir, McKenzie

 

But the shifts with sets having like Gilliam, Cook, Morris is great. Having Doyle is big, too. 

 

Dorsey has been rumored to love the 12 personnel package and I'm going to keep hammering this. We can't truly do this with Moris (though, he's blossoming!) but we can emulate some opportunities.

 

I expect Josh to have a lot of quick throws, a lot of movement with routes and timing, and keeping it more basic than we expected - including pre snap. 

Going on with this since I'm wasting time this evening...

 

Our best 5 by running expected simple routes like a common man thinks are as stated. Everyone gets wrapped up in having all of this massive talent on the field like the QB can hit all 5 when he may get 3 reads at best before a check down.

 

2 reads: Diggs, Davis, 3rd read Knox/Singleterry. Check down: tuck and run or dump off...

 

By putting a 2nd TE in there and having a simple 11 personnel or 12 we will get a response from the D. We can do a lot putting 2 TE's our there. Especially when Morris or Gilliam is that X factor: TE/FB.

 

We don't need to run hurry up but we have the depth to constantly keep our foot on the pedal. No huddle. Calls and checks at the LOS. This is our winning formula because we have tremendous depth at variable positions and when Crowder is back I think we go even further.

 

Bottom line: our offense is a machine. If our OL can have any integrity and Singleterry can get to 3+ ypc then that machine will take off. 

[Buffalo_Stampede]

Hear me out, Bills OL has been pretending to play bad all year. It was a smokescreen. 

[Coach Tuesday]

It’s all about the blocking upfront.  Chris Jones steals souls from weak guards and we have two of them - need to account for 95 on every play.

[Dr.Sack]

No wrinkles. Simple smash mouth football and making the Chiefs defense buckle due to size advantage. Chris Jones is the focal point. Run at him early and often by double teaming him and making him play trench defense and wear down his legs. Then get to the 2nd level and take out their LBs. When the Chiefs finally figure out the Bills are committed to running at halftime they come out and run even more with heavier personnel. Allen is not asked to be a hero and throws virtually every pass out of play action. The Bills methodically control the clock and score TDs on their first five drives. 

[SectionC3]

4 minutes ago, Coach Tuesday said:

It’s all about the blocking upfront.  Chris Jones steals souls from weak guards and we have two of them - need to account for 95 on every play.

He is their game wrecker.  Couldn’t agree more.  He gets the Aaron Donald attention from us this week. 

[JohnNord]

49 minutes ago, Inigo Montoya said:

There are a few things that we haven't seen a lot of so far in Ken Dorsey's offense and I wonder if he is still just developing his playbook, or if he has deliberately kept some things close to the vest for this game versus the Chiefs this week so he can put some looks on the field that the Chiefs defense might be less prepared for.   Some of the things that we haven't seen a lot of, or any or this year on offense are;

 

Pre snap motion

Jet Sweeps

Empty backfield sets

Singletary and Cooks behind  / flanking Allen

Frequent screen passes

 

Going empty backfield and spreading out (pick your favorite five)  Diggs / Davis / Shakir / McKenzie / Singletary / Knox would be a nightmare for a defense to cover.  Shakir or McKenzie rocketing back into the backfield in motion and faking the pitch or actually taking the pitch from Allen with a full head of steam.   Moving Diggs all over the field before the snap to expose the defense and cause miss matches.  These are some of the things I hope we see more of on Sunday

I love all of these ideas and would not be surprised if they were saving some of the playbook specifically for KC or later in the season.  The Bills, perhaps more than other teams, seem to be playing the long game

[mabden]

Watching the Chiefs Raiders game last night, you could see the Chiefs Off and Def adjusting as the game went on.  They definitely used the plays that worked, (Kelsey TDs) but they kept trying different plays/defenses to keep the raiders off balance. 

 

Whatever "wrinkles" Dorsey has in mind, he needs to keep changing up throughout the game.  But then there is Allen, who can change up things on the fly.  

 

Our defense is what needs to adapt as the game progresses.

[henry jones]

The only thing I see them changing this weekend is establishing more ball control.  We've been great so far in this regard but really, really, really have to avoid 3 and outs.  Las Vegas succeeded in the first half by keeping the ball out of Mahomes' hands.  

[CSBill]

49 minutes ago, Coach Tuesday said:

It’s all about the blocking upfront.  Chris Jones steals souls from weak guards and we have two of them - need to account for 95 on every play.

Is he better than that guy we played in week 1 from LA? 

[without a drought]

1 hour ago, Boyst62 said:

Our best 5: 1 Knox, 2 Diggs, 3 Singleterry, 4 Davis, 5 Shakir, 6 McKenzie

 

 

[Beck Water]

1 hour ago, LeviF said:

Wrinkles? The *****in raiders hung 30 on that defense. 

 

Unfortunately for the Raiders their *****in coach took a point off the wall, so they only hung 29

 

21 minutes ago, CSBill said:

Is he better than that guy we played in week 1 from LA? 

 

No.  No, he is not.  Good, though!

Edited October 12, 2022 by Beck Water

[Rubes]

There's a lot of things I'd love to see on Sunday. One of them is, weirdly, Gilliam getting a bunch of snaps. Does well with run blocking, and he's a sneaky good receiving option.

 

[boyst]

11 minutes ago, without a drought said:

They're not in order. 

[BeavercreekBillsFan]

1 hour ago, John from Riverside said:

When the Raiders were winning they were bust in the Chiefs with the run

This is why the 49ers are going to beat the chiefs up the week after we play them 

[John from Riverside]

28 minutes ago, Rubes said:

There's a lot of things I'd love to see on Sunday. One of them is, weirdly, Gilliam getting a bunch of snaps. Does well with run blocking, and he's a sneaky good receiving option.

 

I still don’t understand why he’s not our third and a yard back

[Miyagi-Do Karate]

I really don’t want them to overthink this one, especially with a bunch of cat and mouse pre-snap stuff. I feel like that is what burned us two years ago. Just go out and play our game. 

[LABILLBACKER]

3 hours ago, SectionC3 said:

He is their game wrecker.  Couldn’t agree more.  He gets the Aaron Donald attention from us this week. 

Yes we have to double Jones and I'm sure we will. It's how we react to the blitzes that will determine the outcome. 

[Boatdrinks]

2 hours ago, henry jones said:

The only thing I see them changing this weekend is establishing more ball control.  We've been great so far in this regard but really, really, really have to avoid 3 and outs.  Las Vegas succeeded in the first half by keeping the ball out of Mahomes' hands.  

Bills have ( or had) the best 3rd down % in the league on offense as of last week. They should be fine in that dept.

[ganesh]

4 hours ago, Inigo Montoya said:

There are a few things that we haven't seen a lot of so far in Ken Dorsey's offense and I wonder if he is still just developing his playbook, or if he has deliberately kept some things close to the vest for this game versus the Chiefs this week so he can put some looks on the field that the Chiefs defense might be less prepared for.   Some of the things that we haven't seen a lot of, or any or this year on offense are;

 

Pre snap motion

Jet Sweeps

Empty backfield sets

Singletary and Cooks behind  / flanking Allen

Frequent screen passes

 

Going empty backfield and spreading out (pick your favorite five)  Diggs / Davis / Shakir / McKenzie / Singletary / Knox would be a nightmare for a defense to cover.  Shakir or McKenzie rocketing back into the backfield in motion and faking the pitch or actually taking the pitch from Allen with a full head of steam.   Moving Diggs all over the field before the snap to expose the defense and cause miss matches.  These are some of the things I hope we see more of on Sunday

I think Josh is playing at a great level and will do his thing to score against the chiefs.  My biggest concern for Sunday's battle will be -  How are we going to stop Kelce.  He is coming off a 4-TD monster game;  who is going to cover him.   Will Edmunds be back in time from his injury?

[Rubes]

2 hours ago, John from Riverside said:

I still don’t understand why he’s not our third and a yard back

I remember reading somewhere that Gilliam was asked to do more on special teams this week because a number of the younger guys who usually play special teams were forced into regular roles. So they needed Gilliam more for special teams this time.

 

As we get guys back, Gilliam can get back into the offensive game plan. I really think he is more versatile than we think and really sneaky good.

 

35 minutes ago, ganesh said:

I think Josh is playing at a great level and will do his thing to score against the chiefs.  My biggest concern for Sunday's battle will be -  How are we going to stop Kelce.  He is coming off a 4-TD monster game;  who is going to cover him.   Will Edmunds be back in time from his injury?

He definitely had a great game with the 4 TDs, though at the same time he had like 7 catches for only something like 27 total yards. He was great in the red zone for sure, but the Raiders didn’t let him do much else. (Like it mattered, but still…)

 

[Richard Noggin]

4 hours ago, atlbillsfan1975 said:

I don’t think so. The Raiders blocking scheme strength appears to be the weakness for the Bills. The Bills aren’t straight ahead power blockers, they rely more on pin and pull style. This is in large part to the Bills have good athletes along the oline who are agile and mobile. 
Hoping the Bills just do what they do, there isn’t a defensive scheme that can slow down this offense when they aren’t shooting themselves in the foot. 

 

THIS is exactly what I hope Dorsey and Kromer keep working towards. It's how they finally hit their stride on offense last season, and I suspect, despite Roger Saffold's fairly zone-reliant scheme fit, that this unit is already discovering that ain't ***** changed. The current OL personnel (minus the LG) excel when NOT running the wide zone scheme McD has been seeking since he was hired. And again, conversely, we're seeing that what they CAN execute are gap/power/pin-n-pull concepts. And luckily, they have the organizational mindset to abandon preferences in favor of results. 

 

I hope they keep moving away from zone for now, in favor of what they do well. 

[GunnerBill]

We have seen plenty of screen passes. Not sure what you are watching.

4 hours ago, Coach Tuesday said:

It’s all about the blocking upfront.  Chris Jones steals souls from weak guards and we have two of them - need to account for 95 on every play.

 

And the one team we beat them.... #95 didn't play.

[JoPoy88]

5 hours ago, Inigo Montoya said:

There are a few things that we haven't seen a lot of so far in Ken Dorsey's offense and I wonder if he is still just developing his playbook, or if he has deliberately kept some things close to the vest for this game versus the Chiefs this week so he can put some looks on the field that the Chiefs defense might be less prepared for.   Some of the things that we haven't seen a lot of, or any or this year on offense are;

 

Pre snap motion

Jet Sweeps

Empty backfield sets

Singletary and Cooks behind  / flanking Allen

Frequent screen passes

 

Going empty backfield and spreading out (pick your favorite five)  Diggs / Davis / Shakir / McKenzie / Singletary / Knox would be a nightmare for a defense to cover.  Shakir or McKenzie rocketing back into the backfield in motion and faking the pitch or actually taking the pitch from Allen with a full head of steam.   Moving Diggs all over the field before the snap to expose the defense and cause miss matches.  These are some of the things I hope we see more of on Sunday

they throw screens quite a bit this year. Not sure what you’re talking about

4 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

We have seen plenty of screen passes. Not sure what you are watching.

 

And the one team we beat them.... #95 didn't play.

lol mind meld gunny

[atlbillsfan1975]

9 hours ago, Coach Tuesday said:

It’s all about the blocking upfront.  Chris Jones steals souls from weak guards and we have two of them - need to account for 95 on every play.

The guards have faced better d-linemen than Jones already. The guards have been “ok” so far. Jones is a problem, but the bigger issue is the Chiefs appear to have solid d-line depth like Buffalo. Bills haven’t faced a team yet besides maybe Miami who have several capable d-linemen. 
 

[HamSandwhich]

10 hours ago, Lost said:

 

I hope McD doesn't think we're gonna go in there and replicated the same output with Moss

I mean Randy worked well for TB12, we should give him a shot to stick on this roster. 

6 hours ago, ganesh said:

I think Josh is playing at a great level and will do his thing to score against the chiefs.  My biggest concern for Sunday's battle will be -  How are we going to stop Kelce.  He is coming off a 4-TD monster game;  who is going to cover him.   Will Edmunds be back in time from his injury?

Maybe just cover him unlike what the Raiders did?