Tua impressing in Miami

[WotAGuy]

10 minutes ago, Miyagi-Do Karate said:

Haha— context matters.

 

Before praising Tua for throwing one of the “prettiest balls” Hill has seen, Hill made it clear that he came to Miami with low expectations.

“At first, I thought it was going to be something crazy, the ball going all over the place,” Hill said, “but Tua actually has probably one of the prettiest balls I’ve ever caught in my life. It’s very catchable. I don’t want to continue because the more I talk, the more it sounds weird. Tua is a very accurate quarterback. That’s all I’m going to say.”

 

https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2022/05/25/tyreek-hill-admittedly-had-low-expectations-for-tua-tagovailoa/

“I mean, the ball Tua throws is oblong and has really fine laces. It’s a great ball if you ask me, but now I’m sounding weird so I’ll stop”

Edited May 25, 2022 by WotAGuy

[Miyagi-Do Karate]

3 minutes ago, WotAGuy said:

“I mean, the ball Tua throws is oblong and has really fine laces. It’s a great ball if you ask me, but now I’m sounding weird so I’ll stop”

they really have tweedle dee and tweedle “dumb” over there in Miami. 

[Billy Claude]

3 hours ago, Greg S said:

 

It will be interesting to see how Wilson develops. I hope he fails obviously but the Jets are doing for him what the Bills did for Allen. 

 

Yeah, Joe Douglas appears to be trying to copy the Beane playbook with the big advantage that they didn't need to give up any additional assets to get a QB.

 

[Putin]

1 hour ago, FilthyBeast said:

 

Patriots fans never thought their reign would end either.

 

Yes the Bills have enjoyed a current stretch of dominance over the Dolphins but they've been on the brink the last few years both in terms of winning the division/making the playoffs and beating the Bills a few times.

 

I've been a vocal critic of McD but he is 12-1 in division games the last few years including the playoffs (only loss was that weird wind game last year when the Bills were in a funk). But still think it's a bit misleading because the Pats didn't have Brady, Jets were terrible and aforementioned Dolphins were in transition rebuilding. Things could come full circle this year in terms of the division being a much more difficult task to win which is why it will be a real accomplishment to win a 3rd straight division title.

I don’t think winning the division would be a real accomplishment  , not winning the division would be a HUGE HUGE DISAPPOINTMENT 

[Putin]

2 hours ago, Buffalo_Stampede said:

OTA and camp is all about hype. But don’t be shocked if Tua had a breakout season. 

What is a breakout season  from  the last place to the middle of the pack ?

[blacklabel]

Tyreek lie like a fly wit a booger in his eye. 

 

Noodlearm Tuna can chuck it 90 yards upside down underwater, I don't care. Josh Allen is gonna slap Tua's books out of his hands, take his lunch money, yank his tighty whiteys right up over his dumb head and shove him in a locker. 

[GunnerBill]

1 hour ago, FilthyBeast said:

 

Patriots fans never thought their reign would end either.

 

Yes the Bills have enjoyed a current stretch of dominance over the Dolphins but they've been on the brink the last few years both in terms of winning the division/making the playoffs and beating the Bills a few times.

 

I've been a vocal critic of McD but he is 12-1 in division games the last few years including the playoffs (only loss was that weird wind game last year when the Bills were in a funk). But still think it's a bit misleading because the Pats didn't have Brady, Jets were terrible and aforementioned Dolphins were in transition rebuilding. Things could come full circle this year in terms of the division being a much more difficult task to win which is why it will be a real accomplishment to win a 3rd straight division title.

 

So long as Josh is healthy, the Bills will win the division. 

[Big Turk]

3 hours ago, BillsFan4 said:

Not surprised to see McDaniel and Hill hyping up Tua.

 

The GM fired a successful head coach in order to hire an inexperienced yes man from a offensive system designed to make mediocre QBs successful. Then traded 5 picks for a WR and made him the highest paid receiver in history to help his struggling QB.

 

Both McDaniel and Hill are being paid to rescue Tua. 😂

 

 

 

Hill's hype job sounded more like someone being forced to read a statement at gunpoint than an actual hype job.

[PonyBoy]

16 hours ago, TBBills said:

This guy?

 

 

 

Just now, PonyBoy said:

 

 

What the duck!

[Buffalo_Stampede]

34 minutes ago, Putin said:

What is a breakout season  from  the last place to the middle of the pack ?

Who was last place?

[ddaryl]

Put the pads on Gents, get back to me

[JESSEFEFFER]

Nathan Peterman looked like a Pro Bowl caliber QB in the summer of 2018 too.

[Buffalo_Stampede]

8 minutes ago, Big Turk said:

 

Hill's hype job sounded more like someone being forced to read a statement at gunpoint than an actual hype job.

We were literally right in the same boat when players like Beasley, Brown, and Diggs came to Buffalo. The jokes were strong. All 3 WRs were better in Buffalo with Allen even though the perception around the league was poor when those players arrived.

I know the Dolphins are a rival and Tua is no where near as talented physically as Allen, but Tua can improve. Tua needs to be quicker mentally than everyone on the field. His accuracy and timing need to be top notch. The mental part and the timing part are things that typically take QBs the longest to develop. 

 

 

[FilthyBeast]

5 minutes ago, JESSEFEFFER said:

Nathan Peterman looked like a Pro Bowl caliber QB in the summer of 2018 too.

 

Not sure this is a valid comparison because Tua has actually looked more than serviceable at times and started a good chunk of games the last few years where Peterman looked like a trainwreck in most of his in game action as a rookie (i.e. the chargers game) before his 'summer of hype' in 2018 before being named the starter for the Ravens opener which was another ugly outing and pretty much made him one and done as the starter in Buffalo that year.

 

I don't necessarily agree with the comparisons, but I think a lot of Miami fans and other media are looking at Tua's first 2 seasons and comparing them to JA17's first 2 years and believe a similar jump is going to happen, especially sinces Tua's first two years were actually better than JA17.

 

At the end of the day though JA17 is truly an exception to the norm and most folks would be lying if they said they saw his breakout year coming. I don't think Tua needs to break out so to speak as much has he needs to make marginal improvement across the board for him to be viewed as a viable franchise QB and long term option in Miami.

[RobbRiddick]

5 minutes ago, FilthyBeast said:

most folks would be lying if they said they saw his breakout year coming. 

 

Look back on this forum. Nearly everyone who watched the games saw it coming. The people who only watched highlights or looked at stats were the ones who still say he sucked for his first two years. It was pretty obvious by the end of year two (at least) that he was going to be great

[GoBills808]

9 minutes ago, RobbRiddick said:

 

Look back on this forum. Nearly everyone who watched the games saw it coming. The people who only watched highlights or looked at stats were the ones who still say he sucked for his first two years. It was pretty obvious by the end of year two (at least) that he was going to be great

Correct.

[Captain Hindsight]

7 minutes ago, RobbRiddick said:

 

Look back on this forum. Nearly everyone who watched the games saw it coming. The people who only watched highlights or looked at stats were the ones who still say he sucked for his first two years. It was pretty obvious by the end of year two (at least) that he was going to be great

Yup. After year 2 I thought if he could get a consistent deep ball and hit checkdowns more often, he was very close to being a superstar. You heard guys complimenting him after every game. Players knew

[Punching Bag]

2 hours ago, Rico said:

Tua, 

 

At least he’ll always have Alabama, great college QB, can’t take that away from him.

 

If he was that good of a QB Saban would have told his buddy Cheats to sign him because he would have developed into a winner.

Coaches always talk well about their players but would talk flaws about players with friends.

[Warcodered]

2 hours ago, Miyagi-Do Karate said:

Haha— context matters.

 

Before praising Tua for throwing one of the “prettiest balls” Hill has seen, Hill made it clear that he came to Miami with low expectations.

“At first, I thought it was going to be something crazy, the ball going all over the place,” Hill said, “but Tua actually has probably one of the prettiest balls I’ve ever caught in my life. It’s very catchable. I don’t want to continue because the more I talk, the more it sounds weird. Tua is a very accurate quarterback. That’s all I’m going to say.”

 

https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2022/05/25/tyreek-hill-admittedly-had-low-expectations-for-tua-tagovailoa/

So, this basically says he knew absolutely nothing about Tua before joining the team then, like accuracy was the one thing he was positively known for.

[GunnerBill]

10 minutes ago, RobbRiddick said:

 

Look back on this forum. Nearly everyone who watched the games saw it coming. The people who only watched highlights or looked at stats were the ones who still say he sucked for his first two years. It was pretty obvious by the end of year two (at least) that he was going to be great

 

I'm not sure I was quite at great by the end of year 2 but I was sure he was going to be a franchise QB. To be honest even after what was a very uneven first year I was pretty sure the Bills had chosen wisely and I hated the pick when it was made as is well established. 

 

I think the other difference is in development. Our consistency at OC and HC in Josh's early years has been remarked upon but the thing that coaching did well was expose him to everything. They never babied Josh. They said make your mistakes we will live with them. There was just one little spell in the middle of year 2 after the New England game where he got a bit tentative and maybe in his own head for a few weeks until that Cleveland game. After that game he and McDermott sat down and McDermott told Josh to play fearless and to be honest there has barely been a single bump in the road since. 

 

On the contrary with the Dolphins they have babied Tua... as if they are scared of finding out they got the pick wrong. They took him out in crunch situations as a rookie rather than letting him face them and fail and learn. They have not given him any control at the line they have simplified playbooks.... I just don't think it is the way to develop Quarterbacks in 2022. Expose them. If they fail you find out more quickly and can move on. If they are going succeed it will set them up well for situations down the road. 

[Warcodered]

2 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

I'm not sure I was quite at great by the end of year 2 but I was sure he was going to be a franchise QB. To be honest even after what was a very uneven first year I was pretty sure the Bills had chosen wisely and I hated the pick when it was made as is well established. 

 

I think the other difference is in development. Our consistency at OC and HC in Josh's early years has been remarked upon but the thing that coaching did well was expose him to everything. They never babied Josh. They said make your mistakes we will live with them. There was just one little spell in the middle of year 2 after the New England game where he got a bit tentative and maybe in his own head for a few weeks until that Cleveland game. After that game he and McDermott sat down and McDermott told Josh to play fearless and to be honest there has barely been a single bump in the road since. 

 

On the contrary with the Dolphins they have babied Tua... as if they are scared of finding out they got the pick wrong. They took him out in crunch situations as a rookie rather than letting him face them and fail and learn. They have not given him any control at the line they have simplified playbooks.... I just don't think it is the way to develop Quarterbacks in 2022. Expose them. If they fail you find out more quickly and can move on. If they are going succeed it will set them up well for situations down the road. 

That was the game where Daboll got caught yelling at him on the sidelines and was exiled to the booth.

[GunnerBill]

Just now, Warcodered said:

That was the game where Daboll got caught yelling at him on the sidelines and was exiled to the booth.

 

I didn't think Josh played well that day and still don't. He made some plays but he held the ball for freaking ever when there were guys open. I just think he had got in his own head a bit. I think Dabes going to the booth did help a bit too. I always just think as an OC you see so much more up there. 

[Big Turk]

37 minutes ago, Buffalo_Stampede said:

We were literally right in the same boat when players like Beasley, Brown, and Diggs came to Buffalo. The jokes were strong. All 3 WRs were better in Buffalo with Allen even though the perception around the league was poor when those players arrived.

I know the Dolphins are a rival and Tua is no where near as talented physically as Allen, but Tua can improve. Tua needs to be quicker mentally than everyone on the field. His accuracy and timing need to be top notch. The mental part and the timing part are things that typically take QBs the longest to develop. 

 

 

 

He can, but the improvement will be very limited. He was already near his ceiling coming out of college. He doesn't have the physical traits to go past a certain level. QBs that have to be gameplanned around on offense due to not being able to do certain things will always be limited in how much they can improve.

[machine gun kelly]

2 hours ago, FilthyBeast said:

 

Patriots fans never thought their reign would end either.

 

Yes the Bills have enjoyed a current stretch of dominance over the Dolphins but they've been on the brink the last few years both in terms of winning the division/making the playoffs and beating the Bills a few times.

 

I've been a vocal critic of McD but he is 12-1 in division games the last few years including the playoffs (only loss was that weird wind game last year when the Bills were in a funk). But still think it's a bit misleading because the Pats didn't have Brady, Jets were terrible and aforementioned Dolphins were in transition rebuilding. Things could come full circle this year in terms of the division being a much more difficult task to win which is why it will be a real accomplishment to win a 3rd straight division title.

Beast, the Bills have beaten the Phish by an avg. of 18 pts per game for the last four years.  Do I hear five?  Yes, the Pfish improved so we’ll have To settle with a 13 pt win per game this year!  
 

McD is the best coach we’ve had since Levy.  You’re only critical as you’re not a Bills fan.  He’s third all time as until we win the SB he has to be behind Saban as he won us two AFL championships.  He also came back and improved the team agin briefly in the 70’s.  Now that’s before my time,  but I listen to guys like Chandler and Old Time Fan.  They are a wealth of info on the 60’s teams.  Knox would be 4th and Phillips 5th.

 

We’ll sweep the East again unless there is another 50 mile an hour wind game.  Doubtful in OP in January.  
 

The Jets have improved, but they most likely will be 0-6 as they have a tough beginning to their schedule unless Watson is suspended and maybe have a chance as they won’t keep Mayfield.

 

The cheats will die a miserable death for the next three years and cement the fact that Brady made the Cheats, not the other way around.  Sal was awesome manually counting up wins and losses without Brady.  71-79 including the Browns.  One of the Browns years he did finish I believe 11-5.

[H2o]

2 hours ago, FilthyBeast said:

 

Patriots fans never thought their reign would end either.

 

Yes the Bills have enjoyed a current stretch of dominance over the Dolphins but they've been on the brink the last few years both in terms of winning the division/making the playoffs and beating the Bills a few times.

 

I've been a vocal critic of McD but he is 12-1 in division games the last few years including the playoffs (only loss was that weird wind game last year when the Bills were in a funk). But still think it's a bit misleading because the Pats didn't have Brady, Jets were terrible and aforementioned Dolphins were in transition rebuilding. Things could come full circle this year in terms of the division being a much more difficult task to win which is why it will be a real accomplishment to win a 3rd straight division title.

You make it a point to talk about how this team has upgraded, that team has upgraded, and this one has too. "Oooohhh, they're all so close to us now." 😬 All the while you are acting completely oblivious to what the Bills have done this offseason. Let's break that down real quick. So the team that has basically been on the brink of the SB the last two years, the team with a Top 3 NFL QB, and talent across the board did what you ask?

 

FA:

We brought in Saffold. Surely an upgrade over Feliciano.

We retained Bates. That was key. 

We brought McKenzie back. A nice little Swiss Army Knife player.

We signed Jamison Crowder, who is one of the better and more underrated Slot WR's in the league. 

We signed Duke Johnson to add to the RB group.

We signed DaQuan Jones. An upgrade over Star.

We signed Tim Settle. Ton of potential on the interior DL.

We brought Jordan Phillips back. Best years of his career were in this defense.

We brought Shaq Lawson back. Best years of his career were in this defense.

We signed this guy named Von Miller too. Maybe you've heard of him? 

 

Draft: (only highlighting the guys I really like)

We drafted Kaiir Elam in the 1st. Elam fits the defense well and has athleticism that Levi could only dream of. 

We drafted James Cook to add to the backfield. Cook can run the ball, he can catch passes out of the backfield, he can line up out wide. 

We drafted Khalil Shakir to add to the WR group. Shakir also has value as a returner and will be groomed for that Slot WR position. 

We drafted a Punter who can flip field position completely on every 4th down snap, though they may be few and far between. 

 

So you talk about what everyone else has done to move closer, but we made quite a few moves to further separate us from the pack in the AFCE and put us closer to hoisting that Lombardi overall. 

 

[Starr Almighty]

20 hours ago, chongli said:

 

Don't forget that Mac Jones is in the best shape of his life now. Buffalo needs to be scared...very scared!

 

 

 

Now that his stomach is gone, where will his food go when he eats? 

Edited May 25, 2022 by Starr Almighty

[teef]

37 minutes ago, H2o said:

You make it a point to talk about how this team has upgraded, that team has upgraded, and this one has too. "Oooohhh, they're all so close to us now." 😬 All the while you are acting completely oblivious to what the Bills have done this offseason. Let's break that down real quick. So the team that has basically been on the brink of the SB the last two years, the team with a Top 3 NFL QB, and talent across the board did what you ask?

 

FA:

We brought in Saffold. Surely an upgrade over Feliciano.

We retained Bates. That was key. 

We brought McKenzie back. A nice little Swiss Army Knife player.

We signed Jamison Crowder, who is one of the better and more underrated Slot WR's in the league. 

We signed Duke Johnson to add to the RB group.

We signed DaQuan Jones. An upgrade over Star.

We signed Tim Settle. Ton of potential on the interior DL.

We brought Jordan Phillips back. Best years of his career were in this defense.

We brought Shaq Lawson back. Best years of his career were in this defense.

We signed this guy named Von Miller too. Maybe you've heard of him? 

 

Draft: (only highlighting the guys I really like)

We drafted Kaiir Elam in the 1st. Elam fits the defense well and has athleticism that Levi could only dream of. 

We drafted James Cook to add to the backfield. Cook can run the ball, he can catch passes out of the backfield, he can line up out wide. 

We drafted Khalil Shakir to add to the WR group. Shakir also has value as a returner and will be groomed for that Slot WR position. 

We drafted a Punter who can flip field position completely on every 4th down snap, though they may be few and far between. 

 

So you talk about what everyone else has done to move closer, but we made quite a few moves to further separate us from the pack in the AFCE and put us closer to hoisting that Lombardi overall. 

 

it's a very specific, uninteresting schtick he has.  if the bills do something positive...hold up!  we just don't know how it will work out, followed by a list of reasons why it may not work out.  if another team does something positive...hold up again!  bills fans better start worrying about the new development.

 

i mean what is this...the 4th year in a row he's done this with miami alone?

[H2o]

2 minutes ago, teef said:

it's a very specific, uninteresting schtick he has.  if the bills do something positive...hold up!  we just don't know how it will work out, followed by a list of reasons why it may not work out.  if another team does something positive...hold up again!  bills fans better start worrying about the new development.

 

i mean what is this...the 4th year in a row he's done this with miami alone?

Ahhhhh, gotcha. I guess I've never paid attention to much this poster has ever said. 

[teef]

1 minute ago, H2o said:

Ahhhhh, gotcha. I guess I've never paid attention to much this poster has ever said. 

you're a better man than i am.

[Buffalo_Stampede]

Tua has one of the lowest check down rates in the NFL, lower than Josh Allen. It’s an interesting stat knowing his throwing limitations. 
 

 

[Gugny]

5 hours ago, Big Turk said:

 

In Tua's dreams he never even attempts to make this throw because he doesn't think it's possible.  Look at how fast the ball gets there on a frozen rope.

 

 

 

Why is Josh running like a girl after the ball was caught?  Color me concerned.

[gjv001]

This is ticket sale season, and everybody is a Pro-Bowler.

[Captain Hindsight]

5 minutes ago, Buffalo_Stampede said:

Tua has one of the lowest check down rates in the NFL, lower than Josh Allen. It’s an interesting stat knowing his throwing limitations. 
 

 

Hard to check the ball down when everything called is a short pass

[Buffalo_Stampede]

6 minutes ago, Captain Hindsight said:

Hard to check the ball down when everything called is a short pass

Touché.

[GunnerBill]

28 minutes ago, Captain Hindsight said:

Hard to check the ball down when everything called is a short pass

 

Especially when it is quick game. And the Dolphins the last two years have had one of the highest quick game %s in the NFL. 

[BillsFan4]

https://www.nfl.com/news/tyreek-hill-hypes-his-qb-tagovailoa-he-throws-one-of-the-prettiest-balls-i-ve-ev
 

Quote

"I've seen a guy that's attacking the moment, a guy that really likes to play football," McDaniel said. "You hear people describe a quarterback's instinctiveness. ... I didn't quite know what that meant. Now I have a better idea of what that meant, but I still don't have a better way to describe it besides instinctiveness.

[Mr. WEO]

Sure, pettiest balls…but how thick is he now?

[BarleyNY]

I am so glad that this is finally being discussed.  The deep dive into Tua’s imminent ascension to greatness is long overdue. 

[billsbackto81]

2 hours ago, Big Turk said:

 

He can, but the improvement will be very limited. He was already near his ceiling coming out of college. He doesn't have the physical traits to go past a certain level. QBs that have to be gameplanned around on offense due to not being able to do certain things will always be limited in how much they can improve.

I agree with this assessment. Tua may very well become a competent and serviceable QB but I don't expect him to reach an elite level regardless of talent around him.

 

Even when healthy he has never shown the "WOW" factor needed that makes a team and fan base think they got a legit franchise QB. 

 

He won't lead his team from a 14 plus point deficit with his improvisation. He won't throw 50 yard strikes while rolling out towards the sidelines. He won't run or jump over defenders as he fights for the 1st down. He won't instill fire upon his teammates to rise up.

 

These are qualities Tua has yet to display. 

[Rico]

Today, Chris Simms rated Tua as the 29th best QB, that’s nothing to sneeze at.

 

https://dolphinswire.usatoday.com/2022/05/25/tua-tagovailoa-chris-simms-qb-rankings/

Behind Mitch T at #27 and Mariota at #28 though.