Turbo44 Posted March 12, 2022 Share Posted March 12, 2022 10 minutes ago, NewEra said: At least 5 elite or close to elite DEs available?? Really? Name 5 here’s a list https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/free-agents/defensive-end/ Why the angst? I’d be thrilled with any of these: the aforementioned Chandler J, Justin Houston, Calais Campbell (though I know he’s more a DT), Melvin Ingram, Gregory, Hicks, Ogbah, Reddick, clowney, von miller That’s 10, some a lot better than others but all better than what we have 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrEpsYtown Posted March 12, 2022 Share Posted March 12, 2022 1 minute ago, Pete said: Im guessing Bills sign Foley Fatukasi if we don't sign Chandler. That seems more like Beanes under the radar signing. Supposedly Foley's star is on the rise big time He’s a DT no? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsFanForever19 Posted March 12, 2022 Share Posted March 12, 2022 5 minutes ago, MrEpsYtown said: 2 days ago the Saints were 35 million over the cap and now they are 5. And they didn’t cut anybody and re-sign Carl Granderson. I’m not saying Beane will go crazy with restructures etc, but they can do anything if they want. It's Saturday. Free Agency opens on Monday. Beane's gonna do some stuff between now and then to get some wiggle room to make moves. But THAT much? No way. "They can do anything they want" is such a minimizing thing to say. It's not that simple. You need to have the contracts to make it work for both parties and you need them to agree to it. If it were as simple as that, we'd have the space right now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsFanForever19 Posted March 12, 2022 Share Posted March 12, 2022 (edited) 18 minutes ago, Big Blitz said: If the folks breaking down our cap space are correct that we could free up 30 plus million this year before an Edmonds trade then that can all be done. Here is the question we're going to very soon have to come to grips with. Do we play for '23 and beyond or do some serious splash moves to go all in now. Maybe both can still be true but I don't know. We will still be a SB contender this year but our offseason will look like last years. And if we draft Williams at 25 I'd consider it a sign we're doing just that. Looking long term. Even if we were able to land ALL those people (unrealistic), even if Beane was on the same page with you and traded Edmunds (unrealistic), even if every possible way to free up every penny was able to be done and agreed upon by those players (unrealistic) - we still wouldn't have enough cash to make all of that happen. Saquon Barkley, Chandler Jones, Rob Gronkowski, Bobby Chandler, and re-signing Harrison Phillips is insanely unrealistic. Edited March 12, 2022 by BillsFanForever19 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrEpsYtown Posted March 12, 2022 Share Posted March 12, 2022 2 minutes ago, BillsFanForever19 said: It's Saturday. Free Agency opens on Monday. Beane's gonna do some stuff between now and then to get some wiggle room to make moves. But THAT much? No way. "They can do anything they want" is such a minimizing thing to say. It's not that simple. You need to have the contracts to make it work for both parties and you need them to agree to it. If it were as simple as that, we'd have the space right now. Right. I agree. I really don’t think he will kick the can much, I am just saying he can if he wants to to. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NewEra Posted March 12, 2022 Share Posted March 12, 2022 19 minutes ago, Turbo44 said: Why the angst? I’d be thrilled with any of these: the aforementioned Chandler J, Justin Houston, Calais Campbell (though I know he’s more a DT), Melvin Ingram, Gregory, Hicks, Ogbah, Reddick, clowney, von miller That’s 10, some a lot better than others but all better than what we have Gotcha. Not angst, sorry. I just think people throw the word “elite” around there way too often. I’d really like Jones or Miller. Both worthy of elite imo. Ogbah next I suppose clowney, sure. The only rumors I’ve heard about him leaving cleveland is he wants to get paid and they aren’t willing to pay him what he’s looking for. Which is probably too rich for us. Reddick- not sure how he fits on this team. Maybe that of Lorenzo’s old role? He and ed next to eachother sounds fierce vs the pass but 😳 vs the run. Gregory is good, but I want no part of paying Gregory any kind of guaranteed money. I don’t see him as a guy McB would go after. houston, Campbell, and Ingram = I’d rather have Jerry Hughes back and he’ll be cheaper. He deserves to win the SB this year. hicks is a beast but more of a 3T for our scheme? Is he capable of playing the 1? He’s def not a DE on this team imo. 31 minutes ago, MrEpsYtown said: He’s a DT no? Would replace harrison imo. 1T with some pass rush ability 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeGOATski Posted March 12, 2022 Share Posted March 12, 2022 What's the cost of getting CMC? I don't like giving up a 1st for him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheyCallMeAndy Posted March 12, 2022 Share Posted March 12, 2022 14 minutes ago, LeGOATski said: What's the cost of getting CMC? I don't like giving up a 1st for him. His contract is a monster, I don’t think he’s an option without reworking his deal. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GimmeSomeProcess Posted March 12, 2022 Share Posted March 12, 2022 1 hour ago, ndirish1978 said: Hearing Chandler Jones unlikely to sign here per Albright. In that case I have no idea what Beane was thinking not making a move for Mack. We are desperate for a legit pass rush. Just for context, we were first or second in pressure rate and top 10 in sacks. We can use a stud but we are absolutely not desperate. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HappyDays Posted March 12, 2022 Share Posted March 12, 2022 1 hour ago, YoloinOhio said: Again, the Bills could not absorb Mack’s contract. He has a 30 mill cap hit this year. He already restructured it last year and wasn’t going to again. That is part of the deal. The Chargers are only responsible for $17.75 million of that cap hit in 2022. Joe Marino easily created $38.5 million in cap space by extending a few core players and restructuring their cap hits in 2022 in his mock offseason. So yes we absolutely could have afforded Mack and still had plenty of room left to spare. I'm hoping that Beane has another move ready to pull the trigger on, something like signing Chandler Jones or trading for Danielle Hunter. If an impact edge rusher isn't added given the choices that were available I will likely consider this offseason a failure. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsMafi$ Posted March 12, 2022 Share Posted March 12, 2022 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HappyDays Posted March 12, 2022 Share Posted March 12, 2022 1 hour ago, Big Blitz said: Here is the question we're going to very soon have to come to grips with. Do we play for '23 and beyond or do some serious splash moves to go all in now. Maybe both can still be true but I don't know. Trading for Mack would not have been an "all in" move. "All in" is what the Rams did when they gave a 1st round pick for a one year rental of Brandin Cooks, a 2nd for a one year rental of Sammy Watkins, and a 2nd and 3rd for a half a year rental of Von Miller. Restructuring a few contracts and giving up a 2nd for three years of an impact pass rusher is not the same thing. Trading a 1st for Diggs didn't mortgage our future. Neither would the Mack trade if we had pulled it off. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
njbuff Posted March 12, 2022 Share Posted March 12, 2022 Would you rather have Cox or Chandler Jones? Jones would only cost money and who knows what the price for Cox would be. Interesting. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GETTOTHE50 Posted March 12, 2022 Share Posted March 12, 2022 they will want picks for him in that case with that cap hit. im still down tho Just now, njbuff said: Would you rather have Cox or Chandler Jones? Jones would only cost money and who knows what the price for Cox would be. Interesting. both 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffBillsForLife Posted March 12, 2022 Share Posted March 12, 2022 A $40 million cap hit for a DT!? I would rather have them sign Jones as a FA than trade a bunch for Cox, personally. 1 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ridgewaycynic2013 Posted March 12, 2022 Share Posted March 12, 2022 If I want to know where any Iggles are going, I'll wait for the horse's mouth (Merrill Reese) to tell me. 🤨 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
njbuff Posted March 12, 2022 Share Posted March 12, 2022 Just now, GETTOTHE50 said: they will want picks for him in that case with that cap hit. im still down tho both Ain't gettin both. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brand J Posted March 12, 2022 Share Posted March 12, 2022 If it’s between Cox or Jones I’ll take the edge rusher. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NewEra Posted March 12, 2022 Share Posted March 12, 2022 Beast. Substantial return + his salary is scary. Maybe we could address the edge pass rush by moving Ed out to DE on early downs. And have ed and Fletcher inside on passing downs. If we’re going to pay Ed big bucks after this season, we might want to experiment some. He was a game wrecker the last 1/3 of the season. 3 minutes ago, njbuff said: Would you rather have Cox or Chandler Jones? Jones would only cost money and who knows what the price for Cox would be. Interesting. Jones by a wide margin imo. jones + the draft pick we didn’t have to trade >>> cox minus the draft pick Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turbo44 Posted March 12, 2022 Share Posted March 12, 2022 17 minutes ago, TheyCallMeAndy said: His contract is a monster, I don’t think he’s an option without reworking his deal. If we traded for him I think his cap hit would be 8.6m - 8.4 salary and 200k workout bonus. So….if they have any interest in picks and Cole in the trade he’d only be 2m add’l to cap. I’m torn though because (a) Singletary was great at the end of last what and (b) CMC running would mean less josh throwing. Though cmc catching out of the backfield for us would be unbelievable. CMC, diggs, Gabriel, knox, Gronk (if we sign him) and a wr at 25 or 57; how does a team cover all these guys? 5 minutes ago, HappyDays said: Trading for Mack would not have been an "all in" move. "All in" is what the Rams did when they gave a 1st round pick for a one year rental of Brandin Cooks, a 2nd for a one year rental of Sammy Watkins, and a 2nd and 3rd for a half a year rental of Von Miller. Restructuring a few contracts and giving up a 2nd for three years of an impact pass rusher is not the same thing. Trading a 1st for Diggs didn't mortgage our future. Neither would the Mack trade if we had pulled it off. Mack was great until the last 2 years. That would have been a lot of risk for a guy who couldn’t stay on the field the last 2 years. That’s why the draft picks traded were underwelming Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Codyny13 Posted March 12, 2022 Share Posted March 12, 2022 3 minutes ago, BuffBillsForLife said: A $40 million cap hit for a DT!? I would rather have them sign Jones as a FA than trade a bunch for Cox, personally. Dead cap hit for the eagles, not for the team that trades for him. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SCBills Posted March 12, 2022 Share Posted March 12, 2022 (edited) Philly could certainly use a young linebacker…. Sorry, had to… (half joking) Edited March 12, 2022 by SCBills 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NewEra Posted March 12, 2022 Share Posted March 12, 2022 3 minutes ago, BuffBillsForLife said: A $40 million cap hit for a DT!? I would rather have them sign Jones as a FA than trade a bunch for Cox, personally. He wouldn’t be a 40M cap hit for us. 1 minute ago, SCBills said: Philly could certainly use a young linebacker…. Sorry, had to… (half joking) You ain’t lying Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HappyDays Posted March 12, 2022 Share Posted March 12, 2022 27 minutes ago, TheyCallMeAndy said: His contract is a monster, I don’t think he’s an option without reworking his deal. Actually a team that trades for McCaffrey would only have an $8.6 million cap hit in 2022, and would have zero guaranteed money due after that season. Carolina would take the brunt of the cap hit. That's why they're reportedly seeking a 1st, it actually costs them more cap space in 2022 to trade him and the trading team would carry no real risk. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
First Round Bust Posted March 12, 2022 Share Posted March 12, 2022 decreasing productivity at the increased age of 30+ is a red flag, coupled with 2 years of 10M cap hit AND have to trade draft capital is a big no way...l ess money to re-sign Phillips (hopefully)and the big DT money goes to the younger roster resident, one Ed Oilver Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billsbackto81 Posted March 12, 2022 Share Posted March 12, 2022 4 minutes ago, SCBills said: Philly could certainly use a linebacker…. Sorry, had to… (half joking) Not a bad joke. 😋 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turbo44 Posted March 12, 2022 Share Posted March 12, 2022 Cox would pricey as his salary AP hit to the acquiring team is low from what I can tell. 2022 salary of 1.12m, roster bonus of $1m and an option of $2.9m whatever that means. I don’t think the acquiring team would be responsible for restructured done in the past the contract. So $5m for 2022 and even less in 2024 is dirt cheap snd is going to be costly. Thinking pick 25 plus Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
folz Posted March 12, 2022 Share Posted March 12, 2022 (edited) 23 minutes ago, njbuff said: Would you rather have Cox or Chandler Jones? Jones would only cost money and who knows what the price for Cox would be. Interesting. Speaking just about the players, not salary or compensation... Cox did have a down year last year statistically, so the Bills would have to determine if they think he is on the decline, or if it was instead due to him being unhappy with the Eagles, trade rumors, contract, defensive system (as has all been rumored). [He's 10 months younger than Jones---so it's really a question for both players, are they on the decline?] But, I think Cox would be a much bigger impact player for the Bills (than Jones). QBs try to get the ball out quickly against the Bills defense, so it is hard for outside pass rushers to get home. But Cox would shore us up against the run and still gets interior pressure on the QB. The man has been a beast and can disrupt a game. I would love the Bills to get Cox (if determined that his play still matches the cost). Edited March 12, 2022 by folz Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WMDman Posted March 12, 2022 Share Posted March 12, 2022 Weren’t we interested at the trade deadline? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ngbills Posted March 12, 2022 Share Posted March 12, 2022 If you can get Cox for a reasonable you do it. His cap hit would be well below the value you get from him. Edmunds and a pick for Cox then sign Wagner. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brianmoorman4jesus Posted March 12, 2022 Share Posted March 12, 2022 Cox and Ed Oliver inside. Draft a snot knocker to replace Edmunds and put that with Milano and our secondary. I like that 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aristocrat Posted March 12, 2022 Share Posted March 12, 2022 Can’t they designate him a June first trade and they won’t have as bad a cap hit this year? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HappyDays Posted March 12, 2022 Share Posted March 12, 2022 Now this is something I would be extremely interested in if Hunter is in fact available. Give them our 1st and watch this pass rush take off next year. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rc2catch Posted March 13, 2022 Share Posted March 13, 2022 No guarantees you’ll land one of the top edge rushers so I like the idea of Fletcher Cox as a backup plan. I’d even support Akiem Hicks from Chicago if he had a favorable contract here, guy single handedly shuts down run games when healthy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hapless Bills Fan Posted March 13, 2022 Share Posted March 13, 2022 1 hour ago, Turbo44 said: Cox would pricey as his salary AP hit to the acquiring team is low from what I can tell. 2022 salary of 1.12m, roster bonus of $1m and an option of $2.9m whatever that means. I don’t think the acquiring team would be responsible for restructured done in the past the contract. So $5m for 2022 and even less in 2024 is dirt cheap snd is going to be costly. Thinking pick 25 plus It's a good question, but I think the trade partner would take on the restructure bonus just as the trade partner takes on a roster bonus if the trade is finalized before it comes due. It's only amortized signing bonuses (already paid out money) that stay with the trading team I think Since posting wrong gouge on the internet is well known as the best way to get correct information, I feel certain we'll be set straight soonest Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrEpsYtown Posted March 13, 2022 Share Posted March 13, 2022 Its always tough when you have to choose between an end and a Cox. I’d take either. 1 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Not at the table Karlos Posted March 13, 2022 Share Posted March 13, 2022 2 hours ago, BuffBillsForLife said: A $40 million cap hit for a DT!? I would rather have them sign Jones as a FA than trade a bunch for Cox, personally. $40m dead cap for eagles if they move him. His cap hit is just about $15m https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/philadelphia-eagles/fletcher-cox-9822/ How many players have we signed that we were rumored to be in on before hand under Beane? IIRC we just get news of a signing with nothing before. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John from Riverside Posted March 13, 2022 Share Posted March 13, 2022 Guys.....Edmunds isnt going anywhere 4 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YoloinOhio Posted March 13, 2022 Author Share Posted March 13, 2022 (edited) 3 minutes ago, John from Riverside said: Guys.....Edmunds isnt going anywhere He’s going to play out this year and go from there. Beane isn’t changing out the captain of the D, they are all in this year. Edited March 13, 2022 by YoloinOhio 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Putin Posted March 13, 2022 Share Posted March 13, 2022 4 hours ago, BillsFanForever19 said: Even if we were able to land ALL those people (unrealistic), even if Beane was on the same page with you and traded Edmunds (unrealistic), even if every possible way to free up every penny was able to be done and agreed upon by those players (unrealistic) - we still wouldn't have enough cash to make all of that happen. Saquon Barkley, Chandler Jones, Rob Gronkowski, Bobby Chandler, and re-signing Harrison Phillips is insanely unrealistic. I’m not here to disagree with you but last year we also thought that no way will be able to keep Milano and Williams , just saying that if Bean wants to get something done he’ll figure out a way 12 minutes ago, YoloinOhio said: He’s going to play out this year and go from there. Beane isn’t changing out the captain of the D, they are all in this year. I agree with you but if we are moving on from him next year , wouldn’t it be better to get something for him instead of letting walk ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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