Trade Deadline Woes for da Bills

[IgotBILLStopay]

I wonder if trade deadline woes contributed to our play yesterday. Do the players know some of them are being discussed by Beane? Remember how Zay's family knew they were in trade talks well before the outsiders knew. Even at the time, I suspected it was affecting his play.

 

Beane mentioned confidentiality if trade talks - but even if he doesn't have leaks, they could be coming from the counter parties.

 

This might seem like finding excuses but

 

a. Yesterday (and to a small extent, even against Miami), the play on defense was significantly poor compared to earlier games.

 

b. Defensive schemes' execution depends on trust and discipline. For the first time, it did not appear the players were there for each other.

 

c. This pattern of poor play surrounding the trade deadline  has been seen the past two years as well

 

d. Questionable roster decisions and play calling -  why Foster? Why  no Mackenzie? Showcasing talent prior to trade deadline?

Edited October 28, 2019 by IgotBILLStopay

[Boatdrinks]

No. Just a good old fashioned butt whipping; zero to do with NFL trade deadline. Certainly nothing was showcased yesterday. 

[BillsFan692]

Our D got exposed for what it is. Mediocre.

 

We are great against the pass and poor against the run just like last year.

 

Schematically our defense is designed that way and good teams will always try to take advantage. 

 

We will perform better if our offense can establish and maintain a lead forcing the opponents to throw.

 

Our offense is really our teams true problem.

[Boca BIlls]

Unless the Bills can trade for a QB they are screwed.

[oldmanfan]

11 minutes ago, Boca BIlls said:

Unless the Bills can trade for a QB they are screwed.

Let's have some realistic conversation around here.

[eee1776]

13 Points will never win many game. I though the play calling was like watching a high school game. 3rd and 2 and Josh is on a QB sweep, really.

[Mrbojanglezs]

Sounds like you got it all figured out

[H2o]

13 minutes ago, Boca BIlls said:

Unless the Bills can trade for a QB they are screwed.

Really? You think Josh was the problem yesterday?  What about a defense that couldn't stop a nose bleed? What about an OC who has absolutely 0 situational awareness and calls the dumbest plays at the dumbest of times? What about receivers who decide to run their routes into coverage instead of settling in the soft spots of the zone? What about guys getting two hands on the ball, but dropping it? Yes, clearly that is all on Josh.  

[Captain_Quint]

I dont understand why we didnt have any motion or jet sweeps against Schwartz' D. Going into the game they talked about it and how vulnerable they are to it. Then McKenzie is inactive and I dont recall seeing that motion all game. Puzzling... I think the weather spooked Dabol and he started panicking. 

And come on, you run the stupid wheel route to DiMarco again??? That will work once a season. No need to keep doing it. 

[poblano]

20 minutes ago, eee1776 said:

13 Points will never win many game. I though the play calling was like watching a high school game. 3rd and 2 and Josh is on a QB sweep, really.

And the TE that can't contain his block tripping Morse who didn't get  to his player and make Allen stumble.

It's all in the execution

[LabattBlue]

Some of these topics are unintentionally hilarious.  They are on par with WGR caller talking points.  
 

???

[Billsatlastin2018]

36 minutes ago, H2o said:

Really? You think Josh was the problem yesterday?  What about a defense that couldn't stop a nose bleed? What about an OC who has absolutely 0 situational awareness and calls the dumbest plays at the dumbest of times? What about receivers who decide to run their routes into coverage instead of settling in the soft spots of the zone? What about guys getting two hands on the ball, but dropping it? Yes, clearly that is all on Josh.  

 

The fairest reaction, that people wish to ignore for their own biases, is ALL of the above.

 

#1 The D got trashed!

# 2 Allen looked lost & still can’t throw a deep ball, let alone 300 yards!

# 3 If the OC isn.’t out of his depth, he’s right there. That was amateur, 3 hours!
# 4 The Receivers have never been first rate. Even their ‘star’ would be a #2 at best, on other teams. But if you have sub par Receivers and an average, semi Rookie QB, you’re really going nowhere.

# 5 I laughed when they said that Philly was averaging giving up 20 points in the First Half. Like this pathetic office get march THREE times for TDs. First half? ?? I’m concerned that goal can be accomplished the ENTIRE game.
 

Does anyone see this meek Offense putting up 40+ points in anyone?

Edited October 28, 2019 by Billsatlastin2018

[The Firebaugh Kid]

Not using McKenzie is so damn stupid. Kid makes plays whenever he touches the ball. 

[CaptnCoke11]

1 minute ago, The Firebaugh Kid said:

Not using McKenzie is so damn stupid. Kid makes plays whenever he touches the ball. 

Nah we gotta put Duke Williams in there cause he has a cool first name 

[bigK14094]

48 minutes ago, eee1776 said:

13 Points will never win many game. I though the play calling was like watching a high school game. 3rd and 2 and Josh is on a QB sweep, really.

That situation is why we have rb's   QB should never be running that play.  If you wanted to go wide, DS is your man, not Gore.  Missing Shady.....

[Mango]

24 minutes ago, poblano said:

And the TE that can't contain his block tripping Morse who didn't get  to his player and make Allen stumble.

It's all in the execution

Or that time we spiked the ball because Allen noticed his shoe was untied. 

[Hapless Bills Fan]

1 hour ago, IgotBILLStopay said:

I wonder if trade deadline woes contributed to our play yesterday. Do the players know some of them are being discussed by Beane? Remember how Zay's family knew they were in trade talks well before the outsiders knew. Even at the time, I suspected it was affecting his play.

 

Beane mentioned confidentiality if trade talks - but even if he doesn't have leaks, they could be coming from the counter parties.

 

This might seem like finding excuses but

 

a. Yesterday (and to a small extent, even against Miami), the play on defense was significantly poor compared to earlier games.

 

b. Defensive schemes' execution depends on trust and discipline. For the first time, it did not appear the players were there for each other.

 

c. This pattern of poor play surrounding the trade deadline  has been seen the past two years as well

 

d. Questionable roster decisions and play calling -  why Foster? Why  no Mackenzie? Showcasing talent prior to trade deadline?

 

It's not unreasonable to speculate here, but remember that the Bills were still getting good stops on first and second down. 

 

Yesterday they were dealing with a guy who is arguably one of the best coaching minds in the business.  How do I know?  Because he outcoached Bill Belicheck to win a Superbowl with much of the same talent we played yesterday.

 

The flaws that were exposed on 3rd down - the runs up the gut given up, allowing the QB to release and make yards - have been flaws of the Bills D on occasion since McD has been here,  and were exploited to some extent by the Patriots in Week 4 and a Patriots-tree coach in Miami last week.

 

Astute coaches like Belicheck, Pederson, Reich etc are going to see this and pound it until we show we can stop it.

[Kirby Jackson]

The Bills could use some playmakers. I don’t really care about the position either. They need some guys that make things happen with the ball in their hands.

[Hapless Bills Fan]

I personally think the "trade deadline woes" will be if the Bills don't make a move before the trade deadline.

 

Joe B gets this part right IMO:

https://theathletic.com/1328794/2019/10/27/seven-observations-from-the-bills-loss-devin-singletary-needs-more-touches-run-defense-was-exposed-and-more/?source=shared-article

" The primary responsibility of a one-technique defensive tackle, as a bigger-bodied player, is to occupy blockers when facing double teams. If he’s in a one-on-one matchup, he needs to prioritize holding his ground and beating the block. Lotulelei and Peko have not been good enough in these essential facets of the position. Lotulelei’s issue is with moving laterally. When a team gets him moving, he has a more difficult time keeping his assignment at the line of scrimmage and he isn’t winning his one-on-one matchups. It puts more of a stress on the linebackers to bail him out, and if they’re unable, runs such as Sanders’ 65-yarder can happen. They ran that play right at Lotulelei’s gap, and the Eagles quickly brushed him aside. While he should remain a role player, they need to lighten his load — and they can’t do so with Peko as his backup. Peko is a smaller player who has a difficult time holding up at the point of attack. "

 

"The problem is not an easy fix. The Bills likely won’t find their answer on the roster — and they probably won’t luck into it as they did with Jordan Phillips on the waiver wire last year. The Bills need to look outside the roster to address the issue, which sets the stage for Tuesday’s trade deadline. If the Bills feel like they are in a winning window — which they are — general manager Brandon Beane must be proactive to find a solution from someone else’s roster. The good news for the Bills is that the market for one-technique defensive tackles isn’t a hot one. "

 

 

[Bangarang]

30 minutes ago, Kirby Jackson said:

The Bills could use some playmakers. I don’t really care about the position either. They need some guys that make things happen with the ball in their hands.

We don’t even know how to use the playmakers we already have (Singletary).

[Kirby Jackson]

18 minutes ago, Bangarang said:

We don’t even know how to use the playmakers we already have (Singletary).

He’s not a game breaker imo. Regardless, it wouldn’t make them worse to have better playmakers. 

[dave mcbride]

1 hour ago, Kirby Jackson said:

The Bills could use some playmakers. I don’t really care about the position either. They need some guys that make things happen with the ball in their hands.

I have a sinking feeling that Beane isn't going to be willing to part with the draft picks necessary to obtain an offensive difference maker that can help them win a playoff game this season. I hope I'm wrong because they really need an upgrade, but there's only one more day left before the deadline. 

[Luka]

5 hours ago, Captain_Quint said:

I dont understand why we didnt have any motion or jet sweeps against Schwartz' D. Going into the game they talked about it and how vulnerable they are to it. Then McKenzie is inactive and I dont recall seeing that motion all game. Puzzling... I think the weather spooked Dabol and he started panicking. 

And come on, you run the stupid wheel route to DiMarco again??? That will work once a season. No need to keep doing it. 

 

They did run jet sweep motion and some other pre snap stuff but the Eagles weren't buying it. It's just window dressing anyways. It's what happens after the snap that sucks.

[timekills17]

1 hour ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

I personally think the "trade deadline woes" will be if the Bills don't make a move before the trade deadline.

 

Joe B gets this part right IMO:

https://theathletic.com/1328794/2019/10/27/seven-observations-from-the-bills-loss-devin-singletary-needs-more-touches-run-defense-was-exposed-and-more/?source=shared-article

" The primary responsibility of a one-technique defensive tackle, as a bigger-bodied player, is to occupy blockers when facing double teams. If he’s in a one-on-one matchup, he needs to prioritize holding his ground and beating the block. Lotulelei and Peko have not been good enough in these essential facets of the position. 

 

"The problem is not an easy fix. The Bills likely won’t find their answer on the roster — and they probably won’t luck into it as they did with Jordan Phillips on the waiver wire last year. The Bills need to look outside the roster to address the issue, which sets the stage for Tuesday’s trade deadline. If the Bills feel like they are in a winning window — which they are — general manager Brandon Beane must be proactive to find a solution from someone else’s roster. The good news for the Bills is that the market for one-technique defensive tackles isn’t a hot one. "

 

 

 

If they can't find someone in trade, there are still options. Maybe better than trading, because opponents won't have tape to evaluate.

 

I'd go after Gerald Willis III.
He went undrafted, then signed and later released by the Ravens.
Then the Dolphins picked him up and he's on their PS.

 

Sure you say - undrafted, can't even make the Phins' roster.
But his fall was largely due to off field issues leading to his departure from Florida, and really playing only one full year at Miami (FL) after an MCL tear where he had 59 tackles with 18 tackles for a loss, four sacks and two passes batted.
That was as a 6'1" 302lb DT with limited time.

 

I think the Bills should give him a shot. We've got the locker room to bring him in to the team concept, and the defensive coaching to get the best from him.
If nothing else, he's a good size dude.

Edited October 28, 2019 by timekills17

[NoHuddleKelly12]

5 hours ago, Boca BIlls said:

Unless the Bills can trade for a QB they are screwed.

At least you're trying to keep some stand up comedy material going on this gloomy Monday on the boards. Kudos for that!  

[Kirby Jackson]

Not sure if this is relevant here but I try to share when I hear things. I was with my buddy that’s a scout for the Falcons Saturday and he said they’ve been trying to trade Beasley for weeks and can’t get anything. It looks like Jay Glazer reported something similar today. Also, there’s no chance that they’d ever consider trading Julio and they are going to cut Trufant in the offseason. 

[Bob in STL]

1 hour ago, Kirby Jackson said:

He’s not a game breaker imo. Regardless, it wouldn’t make them worse to have better playmakers. 

 

He looks like he could be.  I like to see more of him.  Especially in wind and rain, Gore and Singletary did not get enough carries, not even close.  

[Royale with Cheese]

7 minutes ago, Kirby Jackson said:

Not sure if this is relevant here but I try to share when I hear things. I was with my buddy that’s a scout for the Falcons Saturday and he said they’ve been trying to trade Beasley for weeks and can’t get anything. It looks like Jay Glazer reported something similar today. Also, there’s no chance that they’d ever consider trading Julio and they are going to cut Trufant in the offseason. 

 

What's Beasley's struggles attributed to?

[dave mcbride]

14 minutes ago, Royale with Cheese said:

 

What's Beasley's struggles attributed to?

Dunno specifically, but after his one good season (2016), he's been below average and only a part-time starter in 2017 and 2018. https://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/B/BeasVi00.htm. 

 

My guess is that he's regarded as just a generic player.

[Over 29 years of fanhood]

6 hours ago, eee1776 said:

13 Points will never win many game. I though the play calling was like watching a high school game. 3rd and 2 and Josh is on a QB sweep, really.

 

Also not in love with the designed QB runs. 

 

Maybe in on the red zone.... but with the fumbling seems like it needs to be limited. 

 

[Over 29 years of fanhood]

41 minutes ago, Kirby Jackson said:

Not sure if this is relevant here but I try to share when I hear things. I was with my buddy that’s a scout for the Falcons Saturday and he said they’ve been trying to trade Beasley for weeks and can’t get anything. It looks like Jay Glazer reported something similar today. Also, there’s no chance that they’d ever consider trading Julio and they are going to cut Trufant in the offseason. 

 

I’ve seen this out there as well. Vic and Sanu were rumored to be on the block, then Sanu moved. 

 

Had that one monster year. Otherwise seems a bust. Super fast- was wondering if he needs a different position or role ? 

[Kirby Jackson]

54 minutes ago, Royale with Cheese said:

 

What's Beasley's struggles attributed to?

He thinks he doesn’t work hard. He has some physical ability but doesn’t get any better.

[BuffaloHokie13]

2 minutes ago, Kirby Jackson said:

He thinks he doesn’t work hard. He has some physical ability but doesn’t get any better.

Sometimes these guys need a wake up call. Would a trade do that for him? Would he draw less attention on our line than Atlanta's? Who knows?

[dave mcbride]

8 minutes ago, Kirby Jackson said:

He thinks he doesn’t work hard. He has some physical ability but doesn’t get any better.

Speaking of pass rushing DEs, does the 2019 stat line here give you pause? It does for me: https://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/H/HughJe99.htm

[r00tabaga]

I love how the original poster just sets the fire and walks away.

 

If you are gonna start a thread at least stick around. 

 

Ive said it a million times, people should reply more than post.... especially after losses.

 

My 0.02

[Buffalo Barbarian]

The hot takes around this place are keeping my house heated.

 

 

[Reed83HOF]

6 hours ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

Astute coaches like Belicheck, Pederson, Reich etc are going to see this and pound it until we show we can stop it.

As they should and I hope our coaches would do the same...

[Reed83HOF]

2 hours ago, dave mcbride said:

I have a sinking feeling that Beane isn't going to be willing to part with the draft picks necessary to obtain an offensive difference maker that can help them win a playoff game this season. I hope I'm wrong because they really need an upgrade, but there's only one more day left before the deadline. 

I'm on the fence with this, I want us to either swing big or stay pat, but I still feel like next season would be the move towards the swing big. We need Edge rusher in the worst way possible, a legit #1 playmaking WR, a DT, backup LB, and a RT/LT.

 

I'm not sure I approach 1st and/or 2nd rds unless you are talking Von MIller, Julio, Khalil Mack type players and then it still leaves us with some big holes. We aren't 1 player away yet and I'm not so sure that trades for 3rd round or later talent is honestly worth aside from backup LB and a 1-tech DT...

 

New from Joe B 

https://theathletic.com/1330678/2019/10/28/help-on-the-ground-7-run-stopping-targets-for-the-bills-at-the-trade-deadline/

 

DT Andrew Billings
Team: Cincinnati (0-8)
Age: 23
Contract status: Unrestricted free agent after 2019 season
Potential compensation: Fourth- or fifth-round pick

 

DT Dalvin Tomlinson
Team: New York Giants (2-6)
Age: 25
Contract Status: Unrestricted free agent after 2020 season
Potential compensation: 4th-5th round pick

 

DT Mike Purcell
Team: Denver (2-6)
Age: 28
Contract Status: Restricted free agent after 2019 season
Potential compensation: 5th-6th round pick

 

DT Corey Peters
Team: Arizona (3-4-1)
Age: 31
Contract Status: Unrestricted free agent after 2020 season
Potential compensation: 5th-6th round pick

 

DT Abry Jones
Team: Jacksonville (4-4)
Age: 28
Contract Status: Unrestricted free agent after 2020 season
Potential compensation: 5th-6th round pick

 

DT Josh Tupou
Team: Cincinnati (0-8)
Age: 25
Contract Status: Restricted free agent after 2019 season
Potential compensation: 6th-7th round pick

 

DT Tyeler Davison
Team: Atlanta (1-7)
Age: 27
Contract Status: Unrestricted free agent after 2019 season
Potential compensation: 7th round pick

Edited October 28, 2019 by Reed83HOF

[Dante]

7 hours ago, H2o said:

Really? You think Josh was the problem yesterday?  What about a defense that couldn't stop a nose bleed? What about an OC who has absolutely 0 situational awareness and calls the dumbest plays at the dumbest of times? What about receivers who decide to run their routes into coverage instead of settling in the soft spots of the zone? What about guys getting two hands on the ball, but dropping it? Yes, clearly that is all on Josh.  

We have a couple of really decent receivers as far as keeping possession goes. Not sure why we would challenge a D line on the ground when they were getting the better of us all game.

[Giuseppe Tognarelli]

8 hours ago, IgotBILLStopay said:

This might seem like finding excuses but

Uh-huh