If this continues then how can OC interviews be anything but a complete sham?

[Albany,n.y.]

Right now Joe Brady is earning the permanent OC job, but according to NFL rules the Bills have to interview for the OC job and they must interview minorities. 

If Brady's offense continues to win, then every interview is a sham since Brady will be a lock for the job.  

Unless the goal of the interviewee is to get the QB coach job, why would anyone interview for a job someone else is a lock to get?  This part of the enhanced Rooney Rule is a total joke. They might as well ask Les Frazier to interview for the OC job as a favor to the team.  

 

[Your Brown Eye]

dems' da rulz

[SWATeam]

It all depends on who our new head coach will want!

[Ethan in Cleveland]

You underestimate the positive impact it is just to get to practice interviewing. It can be very helpful especially for say a young QB coach. Plus how do we know Brady doesn't bolt for a HC job in college. 

It never hurts to get a chance to present yourself. Plus these GMs all know each other. If a guy interviews really well they might let their colleagues know. Also what if someone under Beane or McDermott gets a GM or HC job somewhere else they may remember a guy that interviewed well. 

You may think it is a sham but it's any opportunity to impress someone.  

[Heels20X6]

The story goes that the Steelers were only doing their interviews as a formality before Mike Tomlin came in and blew them away. The rest is history. 

[JohnNord]

11 minutes ago, Albany,n.y. said:

Right now Joe Brady is earning the permanent OC job, but according to NFL rules the Bills have to interview for the OC job and they must interview minorities. 

If Brady's offense continues to win, then every interview is a sham since Brady will be a lock for the job.  

Unless the goal of the interviewee is to get the QB coach job, why would anyone interview for a job someone else is a lock to get?  This part of the enhanced Rooney Rule is a total joke. They might as well ask Les Frazier to interview for the OC job as a favor to the team.  

 

These are the rules for hiring the league created…in cases like Brady it really doesn’t make sense but I don’t think interviewing other candidates is a bad thing for Buffalo.  
 

For example, I know they looked at Ken Dorsey as OC back in 2017, before making him QB coach in 2019.

 

I do feel bad for the candidates (minority or otherwise) because they put in a ton of work and energy for a job that is essentially not open.   In cases like this, the Rooney rule fails.  

[Albany,n.y.]

5 minutes ago, Heels20X6 said:

The story goes that the Steelers were only doing their interviews as a formality before Mike Tomlin came in and blew them away. The rest is history. 

The difference is they didn't have an interim coach who had done a great job before they interviewed Tomlin (Who is a HOF coach and was obviously the right choice). The job was open and so were the minds of the Rooneys.  

[strive_for_five_guy]

27 minutes ago, JohnNord said:

These are the rules for hiring the league created…in cases like Brady it really doesn’t make sense but I don’t think interviewing other candidates is a bad thing for Buffalo.  
 

For example, I know they looked at Ken Dorsey as OC back in 2017, before making him QB coach in 2019.

 

I do feel bad for the candidates (minority or otherwise) because they put in a ton of work and energy for a job that is essentially not open.   In cases like this, the Rooney rule fails.  

Interviewing for an OC role is still good practice for any interested candidates, not to mention it potentially opens the door for other opportunities down the road.  Or you really impress the interviewers, maybe they figure out a role that would work for both sides more immediately?  

[Ed_Formerly_of_Roch]

48 minutes ago, Albany,n.y. said:

Right now Joe Brady is earning the permanent OC job, but according to NFL rules the Bills have to interview for the OC job and they must interview minorities. 

If Brady's offense continues to win, then every interview is a sham since Brady will be a lock for the job.  

Unless the goal of the interviewee is to get the QB coach job, why would anyone interview for a job someone else is a lock to get?  This part of the enhanced Rooney Rule is a total joke. They might as well ask Les Frazier to interview for the OC job as a favor to the team.  

 

 

If they elect to "remove the interim tag" prior to seasons end, does that get around that rule?

[Virgil]

He will definitely have the leg up, but we still have 3 games to go and potentially the playoffs.  It typically takes the league half a season to adjust to a new coordinator and how many times have we seen high powered offenses get shut down in the playoffs.  Just look at the Ravens since Lamar got there.

 

I'm not saying this to be negative against Brady, but we can't be ready to just give him the job yet.  If this production continues and he shows adjustments, then I'll for it

[msw2112]

There are two ways to approach this.  One is to say it's a sham and a waste of time.  The other is to say that it's an opportunity to get to know some of the guys out there in the marketplace that could benefit the team in the future.  Maybe a guy impresses enough to find a spot for him on the staff, or maybe Brady leaves for a HC job at some point down the road and a guy you spoke with and liked is available at that time.  And with the Rooney rule, maybe it gives a minority guy some exposure or interviewing practice that he might not have otherwise had.

 

As to whether removing the interim tag would negate the requirement to interview, I have no idea, but it would certainly make sense.  I don't think Brady is ready or going to get offers as a NFL head coach and I couldn't see him wanting to go to another team as OC, so the Bills should consider locking him up.  What OC would leave Josh Allen unless it was to become a head coach?  Brady is obviously acing the test so far.

Edited December 18, 2023 by msw2112

[since79]

If McDermott is staying, we need to lock Brady down as The OC, assistant head coach.  He was interviewed by several teams in the '21 cycle for Head coach. His resurgence here will open eyes again and get him looked at for Head Coach openings.  

 

We need to make the playoffs to make the interview process more complex elsewhere where teams are waiting. 

 

If we don't make the playoffs we need to act quick on a McDermott decision and consider him as the head coach.

 

Our interviews may not just be for an offensive coordinator to satisfy the rule  but for his replacement.  The end of the season here is getting complicated.

[Big Turk]

I don't know how they don't give the job to Brady...he has really turned things around and unlocked a new dimension to the offense.  And turned Cook into a top 5 dual threat in the NFL at RB. And unlocked some nasty along the OLine.

[Beast]

I debated starting a thread about this but decided to just put this here….

 

I believe there is a decent possibility Joe Brady will not be with the Bills next season.

 

He has already interviewed for head coaching positions in the past and the Chargers wanted to interview him for their OC spot last off-season.

 

My point being, Brady is well known around the league and teams are clamoring for the next Sean McVay, Mike McDaniel type.

 

Brady will be sought after this off-season.

 

 

[KDIGGZ]

2 minutes ago, Beast said:

I debated starting a thread about this but decided to just put this here….

 

I believe there is a decent possibility Joe Brady will not be with the Bills next season.

 

He has already interviewed for head coaching positions in the past and the Chargers wanted to interview him for their OC spot last off-season.

 

My point being, Brady is well known around the league and teams are clamoring for the next Sean McVay, Mike McDaniel type.

 

Brady will be sought after this off-season.

Which is why you should only hire OC head coaches who call the plays. If the Bills ever have a good year (which is likely every year because they have a good QB) then the OC will be up for HC gigs.

[Warcodered]

Honestly the season keeps going the way it's going who is going to want to interview for the job, knowing that unless we somehow get ***** over and he takes a job as a HC, which I'd think would be a mistake get some experience first I mean come on, the job is pretty well set in stone. I guess some guys just looking for experience applying?

[Albany,n.y.]

26 minutes ago, Ed_Formerly_of_Roch said:

 

If they elect to "remove the interim tag" prior to seasons end, does that get around that rule?

No.  The whole reason for the interim tag is because you cannot hire a permanent head coach, coordinator, or GM who is not a minority, in season.  

[PBF81]

1 hour ago, Albany,n.y. said:

Right now Joe Brady is earning the permanent OC job, but according to NFL rules the Bills have to interview for the OC job and they must interview minorities. 

If Brady's offense continues to win, then every interview is a sham since Brady will be a lock for the job.  

Unless the goal of the interviewee is to get the QB coach job, why would anyone interview for a job someone else is a lock to get?  This part of the enhanced Rooney Rule is a total joke. They might as well ask Les Frazier to interview for the OC job as a favor to the team.  

 

 

So he can't be promoted from within before the season ends and kept on?  

 

 

[Albany,n.y.]

4 minutes ago, PBF81 said:

 

So he can't be promoted from within before the season ends and kept on?  

 

 

Nope.  Here's an example: Jim Haslett 

Haslett became the St. Louis Rams' defensive coordinator to start the 2006 season. On September 29, 2008 Haslett was named the interim head coach of the Rams after Scott Linehan was fired. The Rams gave Haslett an interim coach's contract, containing a clause that promised him the permanent head coach's job if the team won at least six games that season. Within a few weeks, this clause was nullified by the NFL, because it violated the league's "Rooney Rule".

Edited December 18, 2023 by Albany,n.y.

[Buffalo03]

1 hour ago, Albany,n.y. said:

Right now Joe Brady is earning the permanent OC job, but according to NFL rules the Bills have to interview for the OC job and they must interview minorities. 

If Brady's offense continues to win, then every interview is a sham since Brady will be a lock for the job.  

Unless the goal of the interviewee is to get the QB coach job, why would anyone interview for a job someone else is a lock to get?  This part of the enhanced Rooney Rule is a total joke. They might as well ask Les Frazier to interview for the OC job as a favor to the team.  

 

To me, he's already on the team. If they just want to give him a permanent title, they should be able to having to interview other candidates just because is stupid

[BADOLBILZ]

1 hour ago, Albany,n.y. said:

Right now Joe Brady is earning the permanent OC job, but according to NFL rules the Bills have to interview for the OC job and they must interview minorities. 

If Brady's offense continues to win, then every interview is a sham since Brady will be a lock for the job.  

Unless the goal of the interviewee is to get the QB coach job, why would anyone interview for a job someone else is a lock to get?  This part of the enhanced Rooney Rule is a total joke. They might as well ask Les Frazier to interview for the OC job as a favor to the team.  

 

 

 

Assuming Brady is kept it shouldn't have to be the same kind of charade with no job gained/kept like the HC interview process because the Bills have minority offensive assistants that can be interviewed and Brady might have new minority assistants in mind.    The new guy he just got hired, Mangas, might even be a non-caucasian.

[PBF81]

10 minutes ago, Albany,n.y. said:

Nope.  Here's an example: Jim Haslett 

Haslett became the St. Louis Rams' defensive coordinator to start the 2006 season. On September 29, 2008 Haslett was named the interim head coach of the Rams after Scott Linehan was fired. The Rams gave Haslett an interim coach's contract, containing a clause that promised him the permanent head coach's job if the team won at least six games that season. Within a few weeks, this clause was nullified by the NFL, because it violated the league's "Rooney Rule".

 

Wow, pretty messed up.  You should at least be able to promote from within without issue.  

 

Thx!!

[JohnNord]

44 minutes ago, since79 said:

If McDermott is staying, we need to lock Brady down as The OC, assistant head coach.  He was interviewed by several teams in the '21 cycle for Head coach. His resurgence here will open eyes again and get him looked at for Head Coach openings.  

 

We need to make the playoffs to make the interview process more complex elsewhere where teams are waiting. 

 

If we don't make the playoffs we need to act quick on a McDermott decision and consider him as the head coach.

 

Our interviews may not just be for an offensive coordinator to satisfy the rule  but for his replacement.  The end of the season here is getting complicated.

There’s no “if,” McDermott is staying

[boyst]

31 minutes ago, Albany,n.y. said:

No.  The whole reason for the interim tag is because you cannot hire a permanent head coach, coordinator, or GM who is not a minority, in season.  

Isnt that discrimination?

[SoonerBillsFan]

I will say the ONLY k ock about last night's game, is the lack of scoring in the 2nd half.  This seems to still be a trend that has to be corrected. 

 

Loved the 8+ minute drive and I have no issues with 3 points.  But again we seemed to stall some.  Just something to keep working on is all

[SectionC3]

I want to interview Davis Webb.  Brady has the job.  But I want to pick brains about what happened this year, and to sniff around for the next hiring cycle in case Brady leaves earlier than anticipated. 

4 minutes ago, SoonerBillsFan said:

I will say the ONLY k ock about last night's game, is the lack of scoring in the 2nd half.  This seems to still be a trend that has to be corrected. 

 

Loved the 8+ minute drive and I have no issues with 3 points.  But again we seemed to stall some.  Just something to keep working on is all

Maybe.  But game management.  It was raining.  The game was under control.  Josh left with 10 minutes left.  And, for what it’s worth, Cook dropped a touchdown.  So I’m completely good with that performance. 

[Mr. WEO]

1 hour ago, Heels20X6 said:

The story goes that the Steelers were only doing their interviews as a formality before Mike Tomlin came in and blew them away. The rest is history. 

 

they need to start the interviews again.....

[Warcodered]

Brady's interview:

Wheels in a big old box T.V. with a VCR puts in a tape. "So this us in week 10...."

[BearNorth]

If the Commanders clean house at the end of the season, I suspect Bieniemy will be a Rooney Rule interviewee for a bunch of OC jobs.

[hondo in seattle]

2 hours ago, Ethan in Cleveland said:

You underestimate the positive impact it is just to get to practice interviewing. It can be very helpful especially for say a young QB coach. Plus how do we know Brady doesn't bolt for a HC job in college. 

It never hurts to get a chance to present yourself. Plus these GMs all know each other. If a guy interviews really well they might let their colleagues know. Also what if someone under Beane or McDermott gets a GM or HC job somewhere else they may remember a guy that interviewed well. 

You may think it is a sham but it's any opportunity to impress someone.  

 

This is a great response.

 

I'll add this - which was kind of alluded to...   There are probably some offensive coaches that McD would love to get to know a little better.   Interviewing them gives McD a chance to spend time with some good football minds that he hasn't yet crossed paths with.  

 

[SF Bills Fan]

It's not even a question. Hand the permanent job over now.

[peterpan]

Maybe Joe Brady could identify as a minority for the interview? Just a thought.

 

I also remember when the NFL was sued by Brian Flores because he had a sham interview with the Giants and Belicheats texts were part of it lol 

[Steptide]

McDermott may be the smartest person in the room. He mentioned back when he made the switch, that he didn't know Brady prior to him coming here. I wouldn't be surprised one bit if hiring Brady was an insurance plan if things went south with Dorsey, which they obviously did. I'm super curious what Brady could do with a full off season, but let's see what happens the rest of this season first 

Edited December 18, 2023 by Steptide

[Simon]

46 minutes ago, PBF81 said:

 

Wow, pretty messed up.  You should at least be able to promote from within without issue.  

 

Thx!!

 

It's not messed up at all; any team can promote and hire whoever they damned well please. There is nothing stopping them from doing so.

What you can't do is immediately promise/give somebody a job without just talking to other people first.

The purpose of the rule is to help out guys who have not traditionally been a part of the old boys network by just providing them with an occasion to meet and talk with executives who they never would have had a chance to interact with otherwise. That's all. Just an opportunity to talk.

The rule has given a lot of people a chance who never would have had one without it and has been a good thing for the league.

As far as I'm concerned, anybody who is dead set against just giving a black man a chance to have a conversation and hates it so much they feel the need to kvetch and complain about it? Those folks have much bigger issues that only some serious self-reflection can address.

 

[Punching Bag]

1 hour ago, Albany,n.y. said:

No.  The whole reason for the interim tag is because you cannot hire a permanent head coach, coordinator, or GM who is not a minority, in season.  

 

And that is wrong - discrimination is discrimination no matter who is being discriminated.

 

I had an interview from a company recruiting department.  Job seemed good, pay great and benefit package was great but I was told upfront that it would be multi-day interview.  I took 3 days off to interview.   First two days I met with multiple people and everything was great,  Toward end of 2nd day interviewer, a manager, needed to step away and I looked at his interview folder - excellent ratings by all interviews so far with a note "Call back when next opening occurs."

At end of day I looked through my contacts and found someone who works there.  I contacted him thru LinkedIn and he asked for my number.  He called me and told me I am one of your interviewers tomorrow and no matter how well you do you cannot get job.  Employment office has a blind eye to race, sex, creed, etc, but the manager you will be  reporting to   makes final  decisions on who to hire  and she wants  a black candidate  preferably  a woman. She's intimidated by white males.

 

I contacted company next day saying I was cancelling interviews for the day and when I was asked why I said hiring manager does not agree with company policy on hiring.   I was contacted regarding another position six months later and I told no thank you.  Evidently someone in my company has connections to your company and decided to give me a promotion and a raise with a promise made by me to stay a year.

[Ed_Formerly_of_Roch]

2 hours ago, Albany,n.y. said:

No.  The whole reason for the interim tag is because you cannot hire a permanent head coach, coordinator, or GM who is not a minority, in season.  

 

OK so that's why there was talk about removing the tag from the guy in Vegas as he qualifies as a minority.

[PBF81]

1 hour ago, Simon said:

 

It's not messed up at all; any team can promote and hire whoever they damned well please. There is nothing stopping them from doing so.

What you can't do is immediately promise/give somebody a job without just talking to other people first.

The purpose of the rule is to help out guys who have not traditionally been a part of the old boys network by just providing them with an occasion to meet and talk with executives who they never would have had a chance to interact with otherwise. That's all. Just an opportunity to talk.

The rule has given a lot of people a chance who never would have had one without it and has been a good thing for the league.

As far as I'm concerned, anybody who is dead set against just giving a black man a chance to have a conversation and hates it so much they feel the need to kvetch and complain about it? Those folks have much bigger issues that only some serious self-reflection can address.

 

 

You're the one that brought race into it, not me.

 

Your points are good, but it's also native to think that some form of a good ole boy network still doesn't exist, or sub-variations of one.

 

Take our team for example, the senior staff is entirely connected to McD via Carolina.  Dorsey was too and it's a real reach to think that he was the best candidate for the job over others that weren't. 

 

Insofar as race goes, I don't recall the interview process with him getting the gig over four others, including a black candidate, but I'd be curious whether that black candidate has done better than Dorsey here taking into account that Dorsey's had Allen.  

 

The irony is that the black candidates know that it's a sham and several have spoken out about it over the years.  IIRC one even refused to interview a number of years ago realizing that he had no real chance of actually getting the job.

 

I only asked because hiring from within should always be a free choice.  

 

Otherwise, as the OP posited, it seems that Brady's the one that they'll hire, so any such effort is obviously a charade.  There's not much ambiguity there.  

 

 

[LeGOATski]

There are always internal favorites for job postings. This is part of life even outside of the NFL, if you can believe it!

 

I know....I know.... it's a crazy world.

3 hours ago, PBF81 said:

 

Wow, pretty messed up.  You should at least be able to promote from within without issue.  

 

Thx!!

What's stopping them from promoting from within without issue?

[HomeskillitMoorman]

This is part of the reason the Dorsey disaster happened, because McD was never really open to anyone else. 

 

Interviewing a range of candidates to me is never a bad thing. Yes it does suck that many times it's not done with an open mind, but conceptually speaking it should happen. 

 

It's entirely possible that Joe Brady could be a good, but not the best coach for the job. We should always be looking for the very best. 

 

The other problem we're going to have with McD here though is if Brady finishes strong this year he might even get poached off that or after next season. And then what? We're in the same boat of our offensive fate hanging in the balance of who he hires because he's so clueless on that side of the ball? 

 

It's just a bad idea all around to move forward with McD. 

Edited December 18, 2023 by HomeskillitMoorman

[PBF81]

8 minutes ago, LeGOATski said:

There are always internal favorites for job postings. This is part of life even outside of the NFL, if you can believe it!

 

I know....I know.... it's a crazy world.

What's stopping them from promoting from within without issue?

 

Nothing to prevent, but a necessary charade, that defeats the purpose.  No?

 

Who cares, it'll happen the way that they want it.  Why are we bickering over this?