Week 3: Buffalo (-6.5) at Washington

[harryS]

what percentage of zone has Howell seen the first two week?  a QB can look good against one type of D and horrible against the other

 

are the zone vs man stats freely available anywhere?  thanks.

[stevewin]

6 hours ago, Sierra Foothills said:

HEY!!!

 

All these airplane stories are hijacking the thread.

 

Since you brought up the subject of DB Cooper and brought back focus to how much the airlines suck...

 

The last 5 times my daughter has flown this year, her return flight got cancelled.  Every single time.   She's at the point where she plans for it

Edited September 21, 2023 by stevewin

[eball]

11 hours ago, FLFan said:

The players and background might not be similar but but the unwarranted  hype certainly is.  Smart money would bet I believe that this guy will come back to his level sooner rather than later.  

 

Come back to what level exactly?  He’s a 2nd year player making his 4th start.

 

[WhitewalkerInPhilly]

12 hours ago, stevewin said:

Became more of a UNC fan after my daughter went there - saw all of Howell's games and he is a gamer.  Rooting for the guy (when he's not playing the Bills)

 

One side note - apropos of nothing - he allegedly only eats chicken

 

I hate him already 

[Big Turk]

16 hours ago, eball said:

 

Mike White played at South Florida and Western Kentucky.  Sam Howell played in a power conference and set records at his school (UNC).

 

Yeah, they're not at all similar.

 

Doesn't really matter much.  I like McD's track record against young QBs.  Dude is gonna see stuff he didn't know existed this week.

[Sierra Foothills]

12 hours ago, stevewin said:

One side note - apropos of nothing - (Howell) allegedly only eats chicken

 

 

9 minutes ago, WhitewalkerInPhilly said:

I hate him already 

 

I hear Mike McDaniel only eats chicken. 😜

 

[DaBillsFanSince1973]

Buffalo Bills vs. Washington Commanders | 2023 Week 3 Game Highlights

 

 

 

 

Edited September 21, 2023 by DaBillsFanSince1973

[wppete]

Think it will be quick passes for Josh on Sunday to avoid that pass rush. Kincaid, Knox, Cook are going to have a big day. 

[elroy16]

19 hours ago, FrenchConnection said:

You guys remember this thread?

Zappe reminded @Einstein of Tom Brady. Then the very next week they played the Bears on Monday Night Football. Mac Jones stunk up the joint, causing Pats fans to chant for Zappe. Zappe came in and played worse. Life comes at you fast in the NFL.

 

 

That game was absolutely incredible to watch. Mac stunk up the joint, then Zappe comes in and scores two TD's and the crowd was going absolutely bonkers. They found their guy!

 

The rest of NE drives went

 

Fumble - Zappe

Punt - 3 and out

Punt - 3 and out

Interception

Interception

 

The score after Zappe's two TD's, 14-10, final score, 33-14.

Edited September 21, 2023 by elroy16

[WhitewalkerInPhilly]

1 hour ago, Sierra Foothills said:

 

 

I hear Mike McDaniel only eats chicken. 😜

 

You go to a steakhouse and you bring chicken tenders?No. Just no. Sit at the kids table. That is a worse food crime than Mahommes putting ketchup on steak. 

[The Frankish Reich]

3 minutes ago, elroy16 said:

 

 

That game was absolutely incredible to watch. Mac stunk up the joint, then Zappe comes in and scores two TD's and the crowd was going absolutely bonkers. They found their guy!

 

The rest of NE drives went

 

Fumble - Zappe

Punt - 3 and out

Punt - 3 and out

Interception

Interception

 

The score after Zappe's two TD's, 14-10, final score, 33-14.

Right.

My cautionary tale about overrating early QB performances hits a little closer to home. Kyle Allen. 

First start of 2019: 19-26, 4 TDs, 0 INT, QB rating 144.4. Carolina wins 38-20.

https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/panthers-at-cardinals-final-score-kyle-allen-throws-four-touchdowns-as-carolina-earns-first-win-of-2019/

 

Allen was phenomenal in just his second career start (his first in a "meaningful" game). Allen finished 19-for-26 for 261 yards with four touchdowns and no interceptions for an 144.4 passer rating, an incredible performance with Newton out (high ankle sprain). The Panthers had an excellent game plan for Allen, starting him out with short throws before offensive coordinator Norv Turner dialed up the playbook with some downfield throws, allowing his playmakers to take over. Olsen looked like his Pro Bowl self and McCaffrey finished with 188 total yards.

 

I remember joking here: "Wrong Josh? Who cares? We got the Wrong Allen!"

 

And then he settled in to being a perfectly adequate backup quality NFL QB. Howell's path may be different (better). But it probably won't.

[Beck Water]

15 minutes ago, The Frankish Reich said:

Right.

My cautionary tale about overrating early QB performances hits a little closer to home. Kyle Allen. 

First start of 2019: 19-26, 4 TDs, 0 INT, QB rating 144.4. Carolina wins 38-20.

https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/panthers-at-cardinals-final-score-kyle-allen-throws-four-touchdowns-as-carolina-earns-first-win-of-2019/

 

Allen was phenomenal in just his second career start (his first in a "meaningful" game). Allen finished 19-for-26 for 261 yards with four touchdowns and no interceptions for an 144.4 passer rating, an incredible performance with Newton out (high ankle sprain). The Panthers had an excellent game plan for Allen, starting him out with short throws before offensive coordinator Norv Turner dialed up the playbook with some downfield throws, allowing his playmakers to take over. Olsen looked like his Pro Bowl self and McCaffrey finished with 188 total yards.

 

I remember joking here: "Wrong Josh? Who cares? We got the Wrong Allen!"

 

And then he settled in to being a perfectly adequate backup quality NFL QB. Howell's path may be different (better). But it probably won't.

 

TBH I thought Kyle Allen showed some good stuff before he injured his ankle severely.  Mixed of course - some good games, some games where he threw for 300+ yards but also threw multiple interceptions, some games where he just threw multiple interceptions.  He's only had 2 starts since the ankle injury, for Houston, and they were both bad but on a bad team. 

 

My "take" is that he's a guy who may be able to do enough to win if the run game is clicking along and he has some time.  But fluster him and ask him to carry the team with his arm, he can't.

 

A number of QB look promising until defenses get some video on them and start breaking down their tendencies.

Edited September 21, 2023 by Beck Water

[The Frankish Reich]

1 minute ago, Beck Water said:

A number of QB look promising until defenses get some video on them and start breaking down their tendencies.

Yep. 

And looking at his game logs, as that 2019 Kyle Allen season went on:

- he followed up that incredible 4 TD performance with a few mediocre performances in a row.

- his first really poor game came in his 6th overall start (3 INTs, a passer rating of about 30)

- he rebounded and was mostly serviceable the rest of that starting season, but with only one more objectively good game and with a couple of absolute clunkers

The one thing that never happened through the rest of his career: another great game like that first "meaningful game" start with the 4 TDs.

[The Frankish Reich]

1 minute ago, SUNY_amherst said:

 

Howell has talent with the best of them. The only reason he fell in the draft was that simple, one-read, small playbook he ran at UNC. 

 

But he sat a year to learn that part of the game and now he has the best OC in the game designing and calling plays for him. 

We'll see. Dropping all the way to overall pick 144 in this QB obsessed draft world tells me something. There was no team willing to take a flyer on him with even a 2nd/3rd/4th round pick. Malik Willis, Matt Corral, Bailey Zappe were off the board ahead of him.

I think the Commanders did the right thing giving him the starting job, because there is a chance he'll develop into a good starter. But everyone seemed to agree that his ceiling is limited, hence the draft status.

But I am intrigued by the "vegetarian except for chicken" thing. Not even fish? Turkey? Quail? I demand an explanation!

[Billsfan1972]

If the Bills eek out a close win, sorry yes a wins a win, but will not bode well.  

 

Of course then the cup half full side of me will say that "The Bills learned they can't take things for granted".  

 

How many times have we "Fans" said that over the past 3 years????😉

[Process]

Oh nice. A tropical cyclone.

 

 

[wjag]

14 minutes ago, Process said:

Oh nice. A tropical cyclone.

 

 

Why...  I was hoping Bills would not get stuck playing in ridiculous weather this season.  This looks like it will be sitting right on top of the stadium at game time.  I was half tempted to go to this.  Now you can forget about it.  I have way too much experience driving in DC during weather and that's before you throw game traffic into the mix.  Diggs' homecoming game as a Bill and it will a-storming

Edited September 21, 2023 by wjag

[DaBillsFanSince1973]

 

Edited September 21, 2023 by DaBillsFanSince1973

[Sierra Foothills]

9 minutes ago, Process said:

Oh nice. A tropical cyclone.

 

 

 

Apparently I woke up in the mood to sharpshoot the basic fundamental errors of "professionals."

 

Not:

WAS v BUF

BAL v IND

NYJ v NE

 

But:

BUF @ WAS

IND @ BAL

NE @ NYJ

 

I guess writing isn't his forte?

 

 

 

[Cash]

6 minutes ago, Sierra Foothills said:

 

Apparently I woke up in the mood to sharpshoot the basic fundamental errors of "professionals."

 

Not:

WAS v BUF

BAL v IND

NYJ v NE

 

But:

BUF @ WAS

IND @ BAL

NE @ NYJ

 

I guess writing isn't his forte?

 

 

 

He’s not very sharp. He THINKS he is (hence his stage name), but he isn’t. 

[BuffaloBillyG]

Tomorrow will be key for Knox to get a practice in. If not, fire up Kincaid in all fantasy formats....

[Process]

1 minute ago, BuffaloBillyG said:

Tomorrow will be key for Knox to get a practice in. If not, fire up Kincaid in all fantasy formats....

Fire him up regardless 

[NewEra]

58 minutes ago, The Frankish Reich said:

We'll see. Dropping all the way to overall pick 144 in this QB obsessed draft world tells me something. There was no team willing to take a flyer on him with even a 2nd/3rd/4th round pick. Malik Willis, Matt Corral, Bailey Zappe were off the board ahead of him.

I think the Commanders did the right thing giving him the starting job, because there is a chance he'll develop into a good starter. But everyone seemed to agree that his ceiling is limited, hence the draft status.

But I am intrigued by the "vegetarian except for chicken" thing. Not even fish? Turkey? Quail? I demand an explanation!

His ceiling is limited?  Is he going to become Mahomes or Allen?  Of course not.  I think he has the tools to be as good or even better than Matt Ryan, Eli Manning, Kirk Cousins, Dak and Tua.  
 

He has a good arm and is more than mobile enough.  Imo, those are the 2 things that cap a players ceiling other than his mental makeup.  He had the 2nd highest wonderlic (34) in his class.  6’1 220 isn’t ideal and, imo, is the reason he slipped.   The kid is a competitor and understands the nuances of playing the position.   I don’t know if he’ll be a star, but I wouldn’t be surprised to see him as Washington’s long term starter
 

 

[Sierra Foothills]

1 hour ago, The Frankish Reich said:

We'll see. Dropping all the way to overall pick 144 in this QB obsessed draft world tells me something. There was no team willing to take a flyer on him with even a 2nd/3rd/4th round pick. Malik Willis, Matt Corral, Bailey Zappe were off the board ahead of him.

I think the Commanders did the right thing giving him the starting job, because there is a chance he'll develop into a good starter. But everyone seemed to agree that his ceiling is limited, hence the draft status.

But I am intrigued by the "vegetarian except for chicken" thing. Not even fish? Turkey? Quail? I demand an explanation!

 

8 minutes ago, NewEra said:

His ceiling is limited?  Is he going to become Mahomes or Allen?  Of course not.  I think he has the tools to be as good or even better than Matt Ryan, Eli Manning, Kirk Cousins, Dak and Tua.  
 

He has a good arm and is more than mobile enough.  Imo, those are the 2 things that cap a players ceiling other than his mental makeup.  He had the 2nd highest wonderlic (34) in his class.  6’1 220 isn’t ideal and, imo, is the reason he slipped.   The kid is a competitor and understands the nuances of playing the position.   I don’t know if he’ll be a star, but I wouldn’t be surprised to see him as Washington’s long term starter
 

 

 

It's hard to find a good comparable for Howell.

 

Of course Brady was taken in the 6th as we all know... and Tony Romo was undrafted.

 

Current Niners QB Brock Purdy was Mr. Irrelevant after being drafted 262nd and last in the 2022 draft. He and Howell have similar measurables.

 

[LeGOATski]

38 minutes ago, Sierra Foothills said:

 

Apparently I woke up in the mood to sharpshoot the basic fundamental errors of "professionals."

 

Not:

WAS v BUF

BAL v IND

NYJ v NE

 

But:

BUF @ WAS

IND @ BAL

NE @ NYJ

 

I guess writing isn't his forte?

 

 

 

Aren't both ways acceptable? If you use "vs" instead of "@" then it's "home team vs away team"

[fergie's ire]

1 hour ago, Process said:

Oh nice. A tropical cyclone.

 

 

Wasn't the same kind of storm taking aim at the Baltimore game last year?  Someone has to stop scheduling these late sept/early oct mid atlantic games.

 

[BillsSbSoon]

Cook didn’t practice either today for some reason. Edit:wasn’t spotted during viewing portion. Could be nothing 

Edited September 21, 2023 by BillsSbSoon

[Big Turk]

1 hour ago, Process said:

Oh nice. A tropical cyclone.

 

 

 

This year is starting off well again I see in terms of crazy weather games the Bills will be involved in.

 

[jletha]

https://x.com/pathammer/status/1704805206708703468?s=20

 

Just now, Big Turk said:

 

This year is starting off well again I see in terms of crazy weather games the Bills will be involved in.

 

Pat Hammer says the storm will be gone

[AuntieEm]

2 hours ago, The Frankish Reich said:

We'll see. Dropping all the way to overall pick 144 in this QB obsessed draft world tells me something. There was no team willing to take a flyer on him with even a 2nd/3rd/4th round pick. Malik Willis, Matt Corral, Bailey Zappe were off the board ahead of him.

I think the Commanders did the right thing giving him the starting job, because there is a chance he'll develop into a good starter. But everyone seemed to agree that his ceiling is limited, hence the draft status.

But I am intrigued by the "vegetarian except for chicken" thing. Not even fish? Turkey? Quail? I demand an explanation!

 

Lol vegetarian except for chicken is like saying he is great at limiting his mistakes as a oasser because all the ints he's thrown were delibritately thrown to each defender thus his completion rate should be graded higher as well.

Edited September 21, 2023 by AuntieEm

[Big Turk]

5 minutes ago, jletha said:

https://x.com/pathammer/status/1704805206708703468?s=20

 

Pat Hammer says the storm will be gone

 

It's a grass field tho isn't it?  Hopefully they will have a tarp down most of Saturday and it won't effect the field conditions too much. It's also only Thursday...we are talking only a few hours of difference between the rain being there and ending so it could EASILY shift later in the day. Hell, we were supposed to be dry here last week one day ON THAT DAY and it rained all morning.

 

9 minutes ago, BillsSbSoon said:

Cook didn’t practice either today for some reason. Edit:wasn’t spotted during viewing portion. Could be nothing 

 

Did he choose to retire also?? 😂

2 hours ago, The Frankish Reich said:

We'll see. Dropping all the way to overall pick 144 in this QB obsessed draft world tells me something. There was no team willing to take a flyer on him with even a 2nd/3rd/4th round pick. Malik Willis, Matt Corral, Bailey Zappe were off the board ahead of him.

I think the Commanders did the right thing giving him the starting job, because there is a chance he'll develop into a good starter. But everyone seemed to agree that his ceiling is limited, hence the draft status.

But I am intrigued by the "vegetarian except for chicken" thing. Not even fish? Turkey? Quail? I demand an explanation!

 

We heard the same thing with Carson Wentz...how did that ultimately turn out?

Edited September 21, 2023 by Big Turk

[NickelCity]

The chicken tender thing is too much for me. I can't get behind that sort of nonsense. 

[Process]

 

[I'm Spartacus]

Howell kind of reminds me of Jeff Garcia.

[Royale with Cheese]

2 hours ago, Billsfan1972 said:

If the Bills eek out a close win, sorry yes a wins a win, but will not bode well.  

 

Of course then the cup half full side of me will say that "The Bills learned they can't take things for granted".  

 

How many times have we "Fans" said that over the past 3 years????😉

 

Par for the course.

[AuntieEm]

26 minutes ago, Big Turk said:

 

This year is starting off well again I see in terms of crazy weather games the Bills will be involved in.

 

Seems to make perfect sense to me.  Last year Bills were impacted by some weather related games.  Now they may flip the script this year with a solid trio at rb that will secure this game and its wild weather impact on the game.  I can see Josh letting his rbs carry the team to a victory while our d feasts on passes that get whisked off target for a Washington qb desperately trying to keep up and again with less time to do it às þhe Bills decide they will be hogs in a stadium that has been known to have a soft spot for hogs in the football realm.

 

So when we e win despite bad weather be another excuse opponents will cling to as the media refuses to credit that the Bills can win without Josh carrying the team on his back.  

Edited September 21, 2023 by AuntieEm

[DaBillsFanSince1973]

 

[DJB]

22 minutes ago, DaBillsFanSince1973 said:

 

Was hoping he would have been asked why our starting MLB Kirksey retired 

Edited September 21, 2023 by DJB

[ColoradoBills]

19 minutes ago, DaBillsFanSince1973 said:

 

 

I would love to hear Morse's input when the OL is breaking down film against a team like they face this week.

I hope Josh and he have good communication this Sunday.

[buffblue]

1 hour ago, BillsSbSoon said:

Cook didn’t practice either today for some reason. Edit:wasn’t spotted during viewing portion. Could be nothing 

Just figured I'd provide the tweet. Hope Cook is good