The Bills have a Tre White problem

[Einstein]

8 minutes ago, John from Riverside said:

You are entitled to your opinion
My money is on Tre making a comeback

 

I hope you’re right my friend. That’s what i’m rooting for too.

[blitzboy54]

On 1/26/2023 at 9:37 AM, Back2Buff said:

The whole Tre White situation to start the year was strange at first, but then you seen him get on the field, and you realized why he wasn't playing.  The guy was not very good this year at all.  Some will blame the injury, but how many games you going to give a guy till he is back to playing up to his very large payday?

 

I think White will never be what he was.  He looked old out there, even after just playing 5 or 6 games this year.  I also think his playing style limits the entire defense on the type of defense we can play.  He does not excel in press man and needs to play off guys.  I personally think this team needs to play more press man.  Tough to transition to that when your "number 1" CB and 16 million dollar man can't play it at a top level.

 

Problem with White is, you can't get out of his contract.  His dead cap is higher than if he is on the team.

 

The only option I really see, is if Taron Johnson takes over for Poyer at safety.  Tre moves to nickel corner where he will be less exposed on an island, and you bring in another press man outside CB to pair with Elam.  Elam's strength is press man and it was really head scratching you drafted him and then played him in a zone.

 

 

 

Thank God we have Dr. Back2Buff to diagnose Tre's medical condition and his long term prognosis. I feel incredibly fortunate. 

[The Frankish Reich]

On 1/26/2023 at 7:48 AM, Back2Buff said:

 

He's not that young.  He is 28 already.  Most players play until 30 so he is on the downside, not upside.

 

There was going to be a normal regression of speed and agility, and it seems like the injury has sped that up immensely.

 

Just not sure what an offseason would do for a 28 year old to gain speed back.  He had A LOT of time to get up to speed this year, and it never came.

 

Yep. That's the inconvenient truth. 28 year old CB coming off a very serious knee injury. I think he'll be better next season, but I don't think he'll be anything like the shutdown corner he was close to being a couple years ago.

In defense of Beane: this is what happens when your team is good. Based in part on cap considerations, you sign guys to extended contracts in which the team gets excess value in the early years, and the player gets seriously overpaid in the latter/decline years. 

[Dr.Sack]

Tre is 28. Chances are he has 2-3 top end seasons left. His fluidity in and out of breaks was comprised. If he can get back to 2020 we have a chance to win in the playoffs. 

[LABILLBACKER]

I think it's realistic we get 3 very good seasons with Tre. It's completely expected for an athlete being somewhat tentative returning from an ACL.  Tre at 95% is substantially better than anything you're going to get from Dane or Cam.  And maybe Elam blows up and can take over that CB1 slot.

[Shortchaz]

If anything, tre’s timetable to return to form should help set expectations for von. Probably not going to get much out of miller until 2024. 

[Johnnyp566]

I still think he retires. 

[John from Riverside]

11 hours ago, Johnnyp566 said:

I still think he retires. 

Do you think Trey White is going to retire lol one of the worst takes ever

[Southern_Bills]

Even if it's true, what can the Bills do about it? Nothing.

 

He got the contract before the injury, is what it is.

 

I think he will regain his form but even if he don't the only answer is to never give a big contract, injuries will always be a part of it.

[Johnnyp566]

1 hour ago, John from Riverside said:

Do you think Trey White is going to retire lol one of the worst takes ever

I’d expect more from you. A question/comment fused into a “sentence” and apparently he’s now “Trey White”. My how the mighty have fallen around here. 

Edited January 29, 2023 by Johnnyp566

[McDeerInTheHeadlights]

I think we should give Tre credit for fighting like a lion since getting back on the field. Don't get me wrong, he lost many more duels that he won, but the effort was there. It's up to McBeane to assess the risk that he may never regain his previous form and find a way to mitigate that risk moving forward. Clinching their assess and hoping for the best won't work.

[JohnNord]

On 1/26/2023 at 9:37 AM, Back2Buff said:

The whole Tre White situation to start the year was strange at first, but then you seen him get on the field, and you realized why he wasn't playing.  The guy was not very good this year at all.  Some will blame the injury, but how many games you going to give a guy till he is back to playing up to his very large payday?

 

I think White will never be what he was.  He looked old out there, even after just playing 5 or 6 games this year.  I also think his playing style limits the entire defense on the type of defense we can play.  He does not excel in press man and needs to play off guys.  I personally think this team needs to play more press man.  Tough to transition to that when your "number 1" CB and 16 million dollar man can't play it at a top level.

 

Problem with White is, you can't get out of his contract.  His dead cap is higher than if he is on the team.

 

The only option I really see, is if Taron Johnson takes over for Poyer at safety.  Tre moves to nickel corner where he will be less exposed on an island, and you bring in another press man outside CB to pair with Elam.  Elam's strength is press man and it was really head scratching you drafted him and then played him in a zone.

 

 

I’d agree he didn’t look like himself but his ACL recovery seemed pretty slow as he missed over 1 year in total.  It wouldn’t surprise me if he takes a while to get back to form.  
 

I know not sometimes players don’t fully recover from an ACL until year 2.  Let’s hope that’s the case with Tre 

[Thurman#1]

On 1/26/2023 at 11:37 PM, Back2Buff said:

 

The Bills have a Tre White problem

 

 

 

Nah, we don't have a Tre White problem.

 

There's a possibility one will develop in the next year or so. Way too early to say right now. Occasionally people recover from this injury really quickly and get back to their own selves in less than a year. Those people are outliers.

 

It generally takes significantly more time than has passed.

 

There are indeed some who never recover. Again, way too early to say whether he'll be one of those.

[Billever76]

19 hours ago, Shortchaz said:

If anything, tre’s timetable to return to form should help set expectations for von. Probably not going to get much out of miller until 2024. 

I would imagine it would be harder to come back from acl for a cb who has to cut and change direction so quickly than it would a De....maybe I'm wrong 

Edited January 29, 2023 by Billever76

[Thurman#1]

On 1/26/2023 at 11:48 PM, Back2Buff said:

 

He's not that young.  He is 28 already.  Most players play until 30 so he is on the downside, not upside.

 

There was going to be a normal regression of speed and agility, and it seems like the injury has sped that up immensely.

 

Just not sure what an offseason would do for a 28 year old to gain speed back.  He had A LOT of time to get up to speed this year, and it never came.

 

 

 

Dude, cornerbacks aren't declining at 28, they just aren't, that's nonsense. Not from age, anyway. 30, 31, 32, yes. 28, no.

 

28 is the prime of the career.

 

 

[papazoid]

he ended the year not right physically and mentally

 

i say after an off-season to recover fully, he gets back close to his pro bowl form but not all the way.

 

mentally, if he gets injured again, i do think he'd retire. another one who admitted he was in a very dark place.

 

[John from Riverside]

10 hours ago, Johnnyp566 said:

I’d expect more from you. A question/comment fused into a “sentence” and apparently he’s now “Trey White”. My how the mighty have fallen around here. 

Don’t blame me because you had one of the worst takes on this board in a month

[Rebel101]

We need OL, WR, DBs, & DL. Early & often in the draft. Who we getting some picks for? Show these players that we not just making sure everyone we like has a job. They actually have to win. Right? They’re suppose to win? Diggs & Milano seemed like only 2 fighting till the end. IMO 

[CoudyBills]

1 minute ago, Rebel101 said:

We need OL, WR, DBs, & DL. Early & often in the draft. Who we getting some picks for? Show these players that we not just making sure everyone we like has a job. They actually have to win. Right? They’re suppose to win? Diggs & Milano seemed like only 2 fighting till the end. IMO 

I was on the trade Tre before he came back train.  Now that he is back you have to ride it out.

[OZBILLS]

Yes

[RiotAct]

Nope.  Not nearly ready to give up on Tre-Day yet.

[Nephilim17]

Trading White in 2023 had a dead-cap hit of almost $23 million. Not sure if the 4th round pick you might get is worth that hit to a team that is already over the cap. End of discussion.

[Nelius]

Nah. I think you've got the right idea for all of the young D-line talent though. If you can turn Zack Moss in to Nyheim Hines, then I'd like to see some more flips in general.

[Brianmoorman4jesus]

I’m good with White and Elam. I think you just figure very soon, if not now…Elam becomes the 1 and White is the 2

[vincec]

 

11 minutes ago, Rebel101 said:

We need OL, WR, DBs, & DL. Early & often in the draft. Who we getting some picks for? Show these players that we not just making sure everyone we like has a job. They actually have to win. Right? They’re suppose to win? Diggs & Milano seemed like only 2 fighting till the end. IMO 

What draft picks do you think you are going to get for him? You'd be lucky to get a mid round pick at this point.

[Big Blitz]

He was never going to be 100% this season

 

I expect peak Tre next season.  

[TheyCallMeAndy]

Food for thought, his numbers aren’t that bad. Maybe we let him rehab more over the summer? ACLs take a while. 
 

 

Link 

[KHAN]

He's 28.  Still tread on the tires IF he comes back 100% after a full off season.

 

Say whatever you want. None of us knows if he can do it. If he's not at least 95% of his former self, we do have a Tre problem considering the cap.

 

Fingers crossed.

[Brianmoorman4jesus]

Our problem is philosophical and not personnel related on defense. If that doesn’t chance, it won’t even matter. Guys just falling back giving accurate QBs all day to hit simple throws. It sounds even more ridiculous every time I say it. Hoping a QB gets bored taking easy throws….this is a grown adults mindset

[Call_Of_Ktulu]

Never wanted to sign him as a top CB. I have always said he is only a 12 to 15 ranked CB. We way over paid for him.

[Yantha]

Bumping this up peeps.....

 

I disagree with the OP and would like to morph this thread into an overall assessment of the CB position on the team.

 

Hoping to get a full opinion (no rose coloured glasses) on the entire CB squad.

 

We good??

 

What tweaks would you make to CB.  I see this as either an FA need with a proven vet or even grab a first rounder again.....  If White turns it around, great.  If not, we have a plan.  You can never have too many good corners in the NFL.  

 

Yes I know....... (O-line)

Edited January 30, 2023 by Yantha

[oldmanfan]

1 minute ago, Yantha said:

Bumping this up peeps.....

 

I disagree with the OP and would like to morph this thread into an overall assessment of the CB position on the team.

 

Hoping to get a full opinion (no rose coloured glasses) on the entire CB squad.

 

We good??

 

What tweaks would you make to CB.  I see this as either an FA need with a proven vet or even grab a first rounder again.....

 

Yes I know....... (O-line)

I’m good with Tre and Elam as starters.  Johnson is one of the best slot guys in the league.  Jackson is a decent 4th guy.  Benford will likely move to S when Poyer leaves.  We can fill a couple other guys in for backups; Lewis is Ok there.

[DuckyBoys]

should be better after more time after his surgery  Thats a big one for db

[TheyCallMeAndy]

16 minutes ago, Yantha said:

Bumping this up peeps.....

 

I disagree with the OP and would like to morph this thread into an overall assessment of the CB position on the team.

 

Hoping to get a full opinion (no rose coloured glasses) on the entire CB squad.

 

We good??

 

What tweaks would you make to CB.  I see this as either an FA need with a proven vet or even grab a first rounder again.....  If White turns it around, great.  If not, we have a plan.  You can never have too many good corners in the NFL.  

 

Yes I know....... (O-line)

As long as Elam progresses this summer, yes we good. We have a rock solid top 4.

[ShakAttack]

Admittedly, I was not as aware of the (full) recovery time from ACL injuries until we went through this with White and started hearing "it takes two full years for most players" as he struggled coming back this year.

 

That said, I also keep hearing how we expect Von Miller to be back next year, yet nobody is really bringing up the 2-year recovery concern for Von or how he probably won't be himself at first, etc.  And why is that?  What am I missing here?  

Edited January 30, 2023 by BobBelcher

[racketmaster]

This was a tough contract to hand out considering White has never had elite man to man cover skills. He has fit the Bills zone scheme very well but McDermott has been able to get effective play from late round cb picks, cheap vet UFAs, or even undrafted players. It is a scheme that does not require top tier athletic talent. So when White‘s contract came up, I was not thrilled with deal but understood because he was a core player from first draft of this regime. It was important to show team that good players that fit the culture would get rewarded and White did. Had White not been injured, maybe the first round DB Elam is not needed and the pick is diverted to offense. But the reality is that he did get injured and his play since return is average at best and not remotely close to being worth his contract. Maybe he can get a little better with more time but White did not have elite speed or length to begin with. The issue is compounded with Millers massive contract and he tearing acl. He is now a mid 30s pass rusher and that contract looks bad in hindsight. Maybe White can move to slot as suggested with Johnson converting to safety. Bills have put themselves in a hole and Beane is going to have to have one heck of a draft to start getting some young cheap talent on this team. I’m not nearly as confident as I was a few years ago as the Beane/McDermott combo has brought as a long way but may have maxed out. 

[Rebel101]

18 hours ago, vincec said:

 

What draft picks do you think you are going to get for him? You'd be lucky to get a mid round pick at this point.

I know that’s the problem. But you might get someone thinking he’ll be back in form for season start.