1/2/22 Falcons at Bills

[HalftimeAdjustment]

5 minutes ago, Max Fischer said:

 

Maybe because Sanders is 34, in his 12th season and has played 175 games?

 

Losing even a half-step makes all the difference. It happens to every player, especially those who excel at getting separation. It's just unfortunate it happened to Sanders about half-way through this season and will not get better.  See John Brown and now Cole Beasley.

 

Cole Beasley had a rib injury. I wouldn't conclude he is done yet. He will catch on with another team next year.

[NewEra]

8 minutes ago, Max Fischer said:

 

Maybe because Sanders is 34, in his 12th season and has played 175 games?

 

Losing even a half-step makes all the difference. It happens to every player, especially those who excel at getting separation. It's just unfortunate it happened to Sanders about half-way through this season and will not get better.  See John Brown and now Cole Beasley.

Maybe that’s it, but is speed has been fine. I view the problem being more about ball tracking, hands and (possibly) being in the correct spot.  He just seems off.  Maybe off = old.  Idk

[Hapless Bills Fan]

20 minutes ago, NewEra said:

Maybe that’s it, but is speed has been fine. I view the problem being more about ball tracking, hands and (possibly) being in the correct spot.  He just seems off.  Maybe off = old.  Idk

 

That's been my feeling as well.  Not quite on the same page as Josh, not quite able to adjust and haul in the ball as well as he could.  Maybe it's vision, or reaction time.  Maybe it's hearing footsteps - perhaps they get louder as the years mount up. 

 

To be fair there have been times he's been wide open and Josh hasn't taken the throw, but there have also been times when he's been targeted and dropped it.

[Max Fischer]

34 minutes ago, HalftimeAdjustment said:

 

Cole Beasley had a rib injury. I wouldn't conclude he is done yet. He will catch on with another team next year.

 

Agree, I don't think Beasley is "done" a la John Brown, but he's certainly last a step or two, which is crucial for getting separation in man-to-man. Still one of the best to find a hole in zone but there's a lot of evidence Beasley is having a problem in man-to-man. 

 

OTOH, McKenzie is far less wile in zone but is much more dangerous in man-to-man. If only we could meld them together. 

[Max Fischer]

35 minutes ago, NewEra said:

Maybe that’s it, but is speed has been fine. I view the problem being more about ball tracking, hands and (possibly) being in the correct spot.  He just seems off.  Maybe off = old.  Idk

 

Probably the same thing. I don't see much difference between losing a step in speed and agility. The ability to make adjustments is also a sign of age. It happens to everyone and at a certain point the slow decline can quickly turn into falling off a cliff. Sanders may still have a few good games left but we probably shouldn't expect him to get much better than he is now. 

[Logic]

With Beasley and Davis back in the lineup this weekend, it will be interesting to see how the snaps are divided up amongst the receivers.

First things first: Davis should be WR2 and should out-snap Sanders. That much is clear to me.

In the slot, things are a little more interesting.

McKenzie seems to be the clearly superior option in terms of gaining separation in man coverage. Beasley is still the go-to guy in terms of finding soft spots in zone. Perhaps the degree to which each guy is used can and should be determined by the way that the opposing defense is playing us in a given week. If they're gonna go man-free, let McKenzie eat. If it's the two-high zone that teams were hammering us with, put Beasley in. 

Meanwhile, Sanders is another interesting option to take snaps in the slot. He might be the best of both worlds, with regard to his ability to beat both man and zone coverage. Obviously, having too many WRs and having to figure out how to feed them all is a good problem to have.

[Warcodered]

 

[Max Fischer]

2 minutes ago, Logic said:

With Beasley and Davis back in the lineup this weekend, it will be interesting to see how the snaps are divided up amongst the receivers.

First things first: Davis should be WR2 and should out-snap Sanders. That much is clear to me.

In the slot, things are a little more interesting.

McKenzie seems to be the clearly superior option in terms of gaining separation in man coverage. Beasley is still the go-to guy in terms of finding soft spots in zone. Perhaps the degree to which each guy is used can and should be determined by the way that the opposing defense is playing us in a given week. If they're gonna go man-free, let McKenzie eat. If it's the two-high zone that teams were hammering us with, put Beasley in. 

Meanwhile, Sanders is another interesting option to take snaps in the slot. He might be the best of both worlds, with regard to his ability to beat both man and zone coverage. Obviously, having too many WRs and having to figure out how to feed them all is a good problem to have.

 

Agree. At the beginning of the season, I half-expected the Bills to run a LOT of 5-wide, which clearly didn't work that well and quickly abandoned.  But as the offense has seemed to find its rhythm,  McKenzie improving, a "greater" threat to run with some effectiveness and the OLine playing better, I wonder if we'll see a few more 5-wide sets to see if it works. 

[BearNorth]

3 minutes ago, Max Fischer said:

 

I wonder if we'll see a few more 5-wide sets to see if it works. 

Not sure I want Motor or Knox out of the game, Knox was a blocking beast against NE, and Motor keeps D honest, and means they have to worry about 2 RB's with Josh.

[nucci]

5 minutes ago, Max Fischer said:

 

Agree. At the beginning of the season, I half-expected the Bills to run a LOT of 5-wide, which clearly didn't work that well and quickly abandoned.  But as the offense has seemed to find its rhythm,  McKenzie improving, a "greater" threat to run with some effectiveness and the OLine playing better, I wonder if we'll see a few more 5-wide sets to see if it works. 

5 wide sets are easier to defend against because defense knows you're passing

[Bob in STL]

12 hours ago, NewEra said:

I don’t think that really helps.  They just don’t seem to be in sync.  They need to figure it out and I don’t see how sitting will help what is going on with 17 and 1.  Jmo 

 

that said, I’d rather have Diggs, Davis, Beasley and Isaiah out there over him. He should get some run this week with Davis out again.  Maybe Cole too. I know he’s Eligible to come off but ya never know 

Continue to rotate them all and play the ones that are getting open.  I think you over reacting to Sanders.
 

He is a player in decline but he made a few plays this season and is still capable. 

Edited December 29, 2021 by Bob in STL

[Logic]

11 minutes ago, nucci said:

5 wide sets are easier to defend against because defense knows you're passing

The certainty of pass can be mitigated by the lack of depth most teams have defensively. In other words, is your 4th or 5th corner going to be able to cover his man effectively? 5-wide can also be effective if you have a QB who can run the way Allen does.

I'm  not saying it should be used all the time or anything, and obviously it hasn't been our most effective offense this year. It can be highly effective in small doses, though, imo.

[YoloinOhio]

 

 

 

 

 

Edited December 29, 2021 by YoloinOhio

[eball]

Clearly the Covid list guys weren't exhibiting symptoms, they're just unvaxxed.  Who the hell knows what's up with Star.

[Buffalo Bills Fan]

Just now, eball said:

Clearly the Covid list guys weren't exhibiting symptoms, they're just unvaxxed.  Who the hell knows what's up with Star.

Star returned today per Sean. Post above you yolo posted.

[YoloinOhio]

2 minutes ago, eball said:

Clearly the Covid list guys weren't exhibiting symptoms, they're just unvaxxed.  Who the hell knows what's up with Star.

Personal matter, he is back now.

Edited December 29, 2021 by YoloinOhio

[eball]

1 minute ago, Buffalo Bills Fan said:

Star returned today per Sean. Post above you yolo posted.

 

Just now, YoloinOhio said:

Personal matter, he is back now.

 

Yeah, you guys misinterpreted me...it was meant as an exasperated "who the hell knows WHAT is going on..." statement.

[NewEra]

15 minutes ago, Bob in STL said:

Continue to rotate them all and play the one that are getting open.  I think you over reacting to Sanders.
 

He is a player in decline but he made a few plays this season and is still capable. 

My disappointment in him has less to do with his actual play and more to do with the expectations I had for him.  I wrote, several times, that I thought he was the missing link.  That he would be the guy that allows this passing offense to take the next step and allow someone to be open on every pass play.  That wasn’t the case.  Partly because the OL regressed.  Partly because he wasn’t the player I thought we were getting.  I overestimated the impact his addition would make on the team.  
 

that said, the most important season is is right around the corner and he still has a chance to meet the lofty expectations I had for him.

[Bob in STL]

46 minutes ago, NewEra said:

My disappointment in him has less to do with his actual play and more to do with the expectations I had for him.  I wrote, several times, that I thought he was the missing link.  That he would be the guy that allows this passing offense to take the next step and allow someone to be open on every pass play.  That wasn’t the case.  Partly because the OL regressed.  Partly because he wasn’t the player I thought we were getting.  I overestimated the impact his addition would make on the team.  
 

that said, the most important season is is right around the corner and he still has a chance to meet the lofty expectations I had for him.

I understand.  He is not the guy that makes you regret doubling Diggs.   So far no one is.  After Diggs  - Sanders, Davis, Beasley, McKenzie is a pretty solid and deep group.  
 

4 solid guys competing for 2 jobs is a good thing.  Toss in Kumerow and Stevenson, and WR is not a concern right now.  

[dollars 2 donuts]

12 hours ago, stevewin said:

 

I'd like to see him throw 14

 

 

 

 

Now there is a man who knows what he wants.

 

I'm with ya!

[Greg S]

[Success]

I think the new protocols are going to save the season. Some of the recent games have been crazy w/ the # of players out.

 

We have no excuse against the Falcons if there are no big changes this week.  I think the Bills turned the corner in the 2nd half against the Bucs - I don't see them letting up or having that unpredictability we saw earlier in the season.  The division is right there in front of them, and they have (on paper) the easiest road to lock it up.

 

[Mat68]

1 hour ago, Logic said:

The certainty of pass can be mitigated by the lack of depth most teams have defensively. In other words, is your 4th or 5th corner going to be able to cover his man effectively? 5-wide can also be effective if you have a QB who can run the way Allen does.

I'm  not saying it should be used all the time or anything, and obviously it hasn't been our most effective offense this year. It can be highly effective in small doses, though, imo.

Allen would get beat up.  Free rushers without anyone capable of blocking.  Knox and Singletary add to the offense as pass catchers.  They are also vital to to the deep passing game.  They buy Allen enough time. 

[stevestojan]

I’m really curious what Star’s personal issue is. None of my business, but when it’s something really bad (death in the family, for example) it’s almost always on the news; whether that’s morally right or wrong is for another discussion. 
 

I’m starting to think he might just not want to play football anymore. 
 

He might be chatting with Vontae Davis about the best way to go about this. 
 

 

 

[YoloinOhio]

 

 

 

[YoloinOhio]

 

[Since1981]

2 hours ago, BearNorth said:

I wonder if we'll see a few more 5-wide sets to see if it works. 

Not on my vote.  5 wide gets us in trouble often, harms our D. 

knox+singletary+allen = defense has to deal with short (and mid) play makers. keeping this trio active frees the WRs. 
 

josh is nearly indefensible for run/pass option rolling with Singletary and Knox nearby in space. And while he has them flustered at short, that D hesitation opens WR long. 

[YoloinOhio]

 

[Ga boy]

4 hours ago, zow2 said:

I went to a Bills/Falcons game way back in 1989 in the old Atlanta Fulton County Stadium.  The QB's were Kelly vs Chris Miller and the Falcons also had Deion at that time.  Atlanta won that game.  Fun times back then, the Bills were getting really good like they are now.  

YES, I was there to at the old donut stadium.  Deion ran down Beebe, but I think it was because he had the angle.  I was in that endzone and saw the whole thing.  I just remember that it seemed Deion came out of nowhere.  Great Primetime moment.  Me and my 2 sons took a bed sheet and painted a big Bruce banner and hung it over the rail.  I think it said "Bruce is a bad man!"  I believe those endzone seats were 20 bucks.  Go Bills!!

 

[NewEra]

23 minutes ago, Since1981 said:

Not on my vote.  5 wide gets us in trouble often, harms our D. 

knox+singletary+allen = defense has to deal with short (and mid) play makers. keeping this trio active frees the WRs. 
 

josh is nearly indefensible for run/pass option rolling with Singletary and Knox nearby in space. And while he has them flustered at short, that D hesitation opens WR long. 

Agreed.  Our OL never holds up when we run 5 wide.  One guy always get beat off rip and our only chance is josh making magic 

[YoloinOhio]

 

Great to see FP on singletary 

[K-9]

3 hours ago, nucci said:

5 wide sets are easier to defend against because defense knows you're passing

This may surprise some, but good defenses and their coordinators pretty much know what you’re gonna do regardless. Because they know what you can’t do. This is why players trump scheme. If you have superior players with superior execution, you could tell the defense what you’re gonna run and they’d still be unable to stop it most of the time. And I’m speaking less of the QB and receivers in this equation and more of the O line. 5 wide sets have their place, but if you don’t have an OL that can hold up, it can all go to crap rather quickly. As we’ve seen. 

[BillsfaninSB]

20 minutes ago, YoloinOhio said:

 

Great to see FP on singletary 

Is Oliver going to be fine?  I know it is risky but I wonder if they should sit him and make sure he is 100% for the postseason. 

 

 

[Max Fischer]

4 hours ago, nucci said:

5 wide sets are easier to defend against because defense knows you're passing

Yes, but McKenzie is a jet sweep threat and if D plays man, Allen can run into open space. If zone, could be difficult to plug holes with many natural zone breakers. I didn't work early in the season but I wonder if you might see a few trial runs. 

[YoloinOhio]

 

[JGMcD2]

1 hour ago, YoloinOhio said:

 

I want him in Buffalo so bad. I’ve wanted him in Buffalo since before he signed with Chicago and then with Atlanta. 
 

RB, WR, KR, PR and a gunner. You’d condense Matt Breida, Emmanuel Sanders, Jake Kumerow, Marquez Stevenson, Taiwan Jones in to one player. 
 

Now you have 3 real RB active each week and 6 real WR. I think the flexibly to play RB but also split out and play WR would be an absolute nightmare in this offense. We’d have so much flexibility to run 5 WR sets with the ability to threaten run with him.  
 

At his age he probably gets $6-$7M a year for 2-3 years. The roster flexibility he would provide would be absolutely wonderful. Unfortunately I could see a bad team offering close to $10M/year and he’d be wasted. 
 

Singletary/Moss/Patterson

 

Diggs

Davis

Beasley

Patterson

McKenzie?

Stevenson/Draft Pick?

Edited December 29, 2021 by JGMcD2

[Motorin']

57 minutes ago, YoloinOhio said:

 

Great to see FP on singletary 

 

Wonder if we're taking a page out of Belechick's playbook with Vernon and Jaquan? Stay home if you're sick (and so we do t have to test ya).

[TheWei44]

2 hours ago, Success said:

I think the new protocols are going to save the season. Some of the recent games have been crazy w/ the # of players out.

 

We have no excuse against the Falcons if there are no big changes this week.  I think the Bills turned the corner in the 2nd half against the Bucs - I don't see them letting up or having that unpredictability we saw earlier in the season.  The division is right there in front of them, and they have (on paper) the easiest road to lock it up.

 

 

Totally agree - Even against very good defenses, our offense has been able to get rolling.  That's why I felt good about the Pats* rematch.

[Miyagi-Do Karate]

2 hours ago, YoloinOhio said:

 

my fantasy team this year agrees. Just need one more great game out of CP for my first title in 20 years (yes, 20 years— that’s sad, I know).

[SydneyBillsFan]

On 12/29/2021 at 12:40 AM, Greg S said:

 

 

That caption needs to finish with "FIRST DOWN ATLANTA"