Except for Josh, is Trubisky best QB since Bledsoe?

[Kelly the Dog]

7 minutes ago, msw2112 said:

Trubisky played a fantastic half of a preseason game.  He's a guy with talent and lots of starting experience who looks to be an excellent backup for the Bills.  Can we just leave it at that?  I certainly don't want Josh to get hurt, but if he does, and Mitch plays a number of meaningful games the way he played that one half of a preseason game today, we can reopen this conversation.

Good point.
 

BUT…

GMs like Beane, who is a great one, have to make decisions on stuff they don’t know. Like you just suggested. So on this message board, we often play GM, and pontificate or predict how things may turn out. GMs have to make hard decisions without knowing what will happen either. 
 

To me it’s okay to hypothesize about how well a guy might be. We’ve only seen about a half of a preseason game with Trubisky on the Bills so of course there is no way of knowing. But he’s played 50 games in the nfl. He’s not an unknown. 

[Kelly the Dog]

11 minutes ago, NewEra said:

He’s the best playing with this offense and coaching staff.  Put him on some other bad bills teams and he may have busted even sooner than he did in Chicago 

That’s a good point. But… Even if true may still be best guy to run this Bills team. I was a Tyrod fan. I’m a huge Fitzy fan. But they are both clearly flawed as starters. I would easily have argued that Fitzy was the best #2 in the league last year. Tyrod, if not a good starter, is a very good backup. But IMO if Josh went down for a couple games, Trubisky may be a better option than Fitzy. 
 

if the Bills were worse, Fitz is the better option. Because he can win games by himself. But if you’re good, you don’t want a guy as erratic as that. You want an efficient guy who can do what you’ve been doing. 

[78thealltimegreat]

1 hour ago, Kelly the Dog said:

And almost Kelly?

 

To me, the only competition is Tyrod. And Tyrod obviously had his limitations. A lot of fans and posters here think that Trubisky is the best back up in the league. Unless you consider Tyrod a starter (and I like Tyrod more than most), that would assume Trubisky is a better option than Taylor. 
 

To me it’s very close. Neither are great. Neither might not be consistently good. But I think if I had to choose, right now, for who I’d rather lead the team if Josh went down, I may say Trubisky. 
 

Which would make him the best Bills QB since Drew Bledsoe. And maybe even Kelly. I think Trubisky would be as good as Bledsoe was at that time in his career.
 

And I don’t really think Trubisky is very good. As a starter, right now, no way. As a backup, hell yes. 

 

 

It’s preseason man EJ Manual before his ACL Tear was on track to be our best QB since Bledsoe then it all fell apart…preseason made Nathan Pederson look like Joe Montana 

[Kelly the Dog]

4 minutes ago, 78thealltimegreat said:

It’s preseason man EJ Manual before his ACL Tear was on track to be our best QB since Bledsoe then it all fell apart…preseason made Nathan Pederson look like Joe Montana 

EJ hadn’t played 50 games in the NFL. No one thought EJ was a great prospect. Not a chance his talent was a #2 overall.  EJ was a decent prospect, probably 2nd round talent, that few ever become franchise guys. Trubisky was a far better prospect than EJ. Not really close. 

8 minutes ago, 78thealltimegreat said:

It’s preseason man EJ Manual before his ACL Tear was on track to be our best QB since Bledsoe then it all fell apart…preseason made Nathan Pederson look like Joe Montana 

There is an enormous difference between Trubisky and Peterman, who shouldn’t even be in the league. 

[Kelly the Dog]

1 hour ago, Kwai San said:

 

Not gonna say that you are wrong at all - just gonna say LOCK UP DABOLL!!!!  I know it isn't going to happen....everyone on the Bills staff from the ball boy on up proally wanna see Daboll move on to a HC position.....I get it.  But DAYAM if Pegs could take care of this before it happens???  Think about the distractions that WOULD NOT be in place when our Bills are sitting and waiting for the SB to play out.....just think about that.

If you are Daboll your life goal is to be a head coach somewhere. There is no amount of money any owner can pay that would prevent you from that. Granted, a guy like Daboll may not take any job like other guys (would and should). He can afford to be a little picky. Knowing he has Josh and the roster Beane assembled he pretty much knows his stock won’t go down. 
 

But 90% chance IMO he’s gone after this year. The offense is going to dominate. Josh is very likely (because of Josh not Daboll) to look even better. Daboll will rightfully get an offer he will take. 

[GunnerBill]

I'd have Fitz ahead of him but it's close.

[LyndonvilleBill]

56 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

I'd have Fitz ahead of him but it's close.

I think I would lean more towards MT. Only for the fact he has only been in the league for what, 4 years. Tyrod had 4 years on the bench before what, his first start? That's a lot of time to learn. Fitzpatrick started maybe 3 games his first 3 years? Again, time to learn. But, as it sits today if I had the unfortunate choice for someone to come in and play for Josh, I would pick MT. His play just looks closer to JA style than the others do and so far it looks like he can run the entire playbook. Just my opinion though.🤔

[GunnerBill]

2 minutes ago, LyndonvilleBill said:

I think I would lean more towards MT. Only for the fact he has only been in the league for what, 4 years. Tyrod had 4 years on the bench before what, his first start? That's a lot of time to learn. Fitzpatrick started maybe 3 games his first 3 years? Again, time to learn. But, as it sits today if I had the unfortunate choice for someone to come in and play for Josh, I would pick MT. His play just looks closer to JA style than the others do and so far it looks like he can run the entire playbook. Just my opinion though.🤔

 

It is definitely close and I agree Mitch is the perfect backup for us now. But if asked who would I want as a starter between 2011 Fitz and 2021 Mitch I am going 2011 Fitz still.

[KenMac]

Flutie

[SirAndrew]

I’d say yes, and he’s definitely a guy I’d trust to play decent football. Trubisky isn’t going to lift up a team on his own, but he’s good enough to lead a talented roster to wins. 2011 Fitzpatrick was brilliant for the first half of the season, but everyone forgets his second half was abysmal. I think Trubisky brings consistency to the table, albeit not brilliance. Consistency would be the best we’ve had at the QB position in years apart from Allen. 

[BillsShredder83]

8 hours ago, bills6969 said:

He’s actually better than Allen too

And almost Mahomes! 😆

[H2o]

I hope Trubisky doesn't have to play meaningful snaps this year because that means Josh is hurt. But if for some reason he does, then we can have to Frank Reich comparisons as to whom was the better backup. Right now that's all Trubisky is, is a backup. 

[AlCowlingsTaxiService]

I took an oath to not overreact to preseason football …. And that goes both ways. I was happy to see him torch his former team, but I won’t make sweeping generalizations otherwise. I wonder if they’ll package the game film with a nice bow and ship it to Frank Reich? 😂

[PromoTheRobot]

10 hours ago, Kelly the Dog said:

And almost Kelly?

 

To me, the only competition is Tyrod. And Tyrod obviously had his limitations. A lot of fans and posters here think that Trubisky is the best back up in the league. Unless you consider Tyrod a starter (and I like Tyrod more than most), that would assume Trubisky is a better option than Taylor. 
 

To me it’s very close. Neither are great. Neither might not be consistently good. But I think if I had to choose, right now, for who I’d rather lead the team if Josh went down, I may say Trubisky. 
 

Which would make him the best Bills QB since Drew Bledsoe. And maybe even Kelly. I think Trubisky would be as good as Bledsoe was at that time in his career.
 

And I don’t really think Trubisky is very good. As a starter, right now, no way. As a backup, hell yes. 

 

 

 

I get the enthusiasm but no.

[hondo in seattle]

Bledsoe was really good for half a season and then wasted our time and broke our hearts.  

Tyrod was a good running quarterback for nearly a full season.  When ALynn was the HC and Tyrod the QB, the offense averaged something like 27 points/game.  Not stellar, but not chicken feed either.

 

Fitz was a great guy, a great leader, but had an erratic arm - particular on longer passes.  All those deep completions to Stevie?  I really believe Fitz grunted and heaved with all his might and then simply hoped for the best.  Johnson, for all his flaws, had a knack for tracking down a ball.    

 

Mitch played really well for the better part of one preseason game.  Personally, I'm not ready to draw any conclusions.  

 

 

Edited August 22, 2021 by hondo in seattle

[The 9 Isles]

Trubisky traded for a first before season starts. 

[ChronicAndKnuckles]

10 hours ago, Kelly the Dog said:

And almost Kelly?

 

To me, the only competition is Tyrod. And Tyrod obviously had his limitations. A lot of fans and posters here think that Trubisky is the best back up in the league. Unless you consider Tyrod a starter (and I like Tyrod more than most), that would assume Trubisky is a better option than Taylor. 
 

To me it’s very close. Neither are great. Neither might not be consistently good. But I think if I had to choose, right now, for who I’d rather lead the team if Josh went down, I may say Trubisky. 
 

Which would make him the best Bills QB since Drew Bledsoe. And maybe even Kelly. I think Trubisky would be as good as Bledsoe was at that time in his career.
 

And I don’t really think Trubisky is very good. As a starter, right now, no way. As a backup, hell yes. 

 

 

 

Yeah, after 20 years of trying to find a good QB, the Bills have somehow found 2 in the past 3 years. Praise Beane!

[Dr. Who]

Just now, The 9 Isles said:

Trubisky traded for a first before season starts. 

That would be utterly foolish. Do you want Webb or Fromm backing up Allen in a potential Super Bowl year?

You know, you build futures so you can win one of those.

[TheyCallMeAndy]

He’s always good in preseason, let’s chill.

[Chaos]

49 minutes ago, Dr. Who said:

That would be utterly foolish. Do you want Webb or Fromm backing up Allen in a potential Super Bowl year?

You know, you build futures so you can win one of those.

Nick Foles, Earl Morall, Jeff Hostetler and I am sure others helped lead teams to and through playoffs.  I think the Bills make the playoffs even if Josh misses a small number of games, regardless of who the backup is. I don't think the Bills make a run through the playoffs without Josh.  Clearly if the decision was "win the super bowl, or get a first" everyone would pick "win the super bowl".  Its not at all obvious those are the two choices. 

[Ed_Formerly_of_Roch]

I'd maybe take Trent Edwards 1st 4 games of the 2008 season.  At least that was entire games and against first stringers.  Even the entire 1st half of that year he looked pretty decent, recall he was starting even get some national props.

[Miyagi-Do Karate]

What about me??

 

[Dr.Sack]

Yes he is.

[billsfan89]

Give me Tyrod over Mitch but it is an interesting argument.-

Edited August 22, 2021 by billsfan89

[ColoradoBills]

13 hours ago, Bob in STL said:

One half of one preseason game against a below average team. 

 

All true but he was also the QB ON that below average team.  I think he is a little better than some people give him credit for.

 

[starrymessenger]

7 hours ago, H2o said:

I hope Trubisky doesn't have to play meaningful snaps this year because that means Josh is hurt. But if for some reason he does, then we can have to Frank Reich comparisons as to whom was the better backup. Right now that's all Trubisky is, is a backup. 

Right he’s a backup but in his mind I’m sure he’s a starter in waiting. And the thing is he may have upside as a starter. I’d like to see how he performs in a different system, with better support and a good OC/play-caller. I’d also be curious to see if he was able to improve on the things he struggled with in Chicago e.g throwing to the left side of the field.  Thing is MT is unlikely to see live action much, if at all, to showcase his skills. I guess I’m a little surprised that he didn’t go compete for a starting job somewhere else.

From the Bills perspective there can be little doubt that he represents a massive upgrade to the back up QB position. 

[Teddy KGB]

19 hours ago, transplantbillsfan said:

I think Fitz is better than Mitch.

Nah, Pickspatrick can’t be trusted ever 

5 hours ago, billsfan89 said:

Give me Tyrod over Mitch but it is an interesting argument.-

Hell to the naw, Trubisky drove the Bears to a missed GW FG in the playoffs.  
 

Tyrod murdered his own team playing like a scared kitten in his playoff appearance. 

Edited August 22, 2021 by Teddy KGB

[Punching Bag]

19 hours ago, Kelly the Dog said:

Yeah Fitz may be a better option as back up. Very close. Fitzy on the Bills, although he played well at times, is not the Fitzy now, who is a great backup. 
 

It’s close. I like Fitzy. So I may choose him. But if, say, in a hypothetical, this year, if you needed a QB to play two games because Josh was hurt, would you rather have Fitzy or Trubisky. I think it’s a tough call. 
 

Normally I may say Fitz. But because the Bills are so deep, you may want the less erratic guy. You may want Matt. 

 

It depends on how badly you need game and opposition strength.  Fitzpatrick has led teams to win games most said they had no chance winning.

Teams need QBs which take chances when needed but not when not needed.

 

Fitzpatrick is a QB who takes chances sometimes making throws detractors say he cannot make but he does. 

He also gets in situations where he should not take chances but does it anyways.

 

Tyrod is a QB who took chances at first, told by coaching staff to not and rely on defense and has been a protect the ball QB since.

 

Trubisky from what I have seen takes more chances than Tyrod but he is neither the leader to inspire or one who makes extraordinary performances.

 

So it is not something cut and dry.

[QCity]

Who says fans overreact to preseason games?

[OZBILLS]

I'd like to say wait until he gets a chance to play a regular season game before making a call but he will be long traded by then

[Beerball]

20 hours ago, Kelly the Dog said:

And almost Kelly?

 

To me, the only competition is Tyrod. And Tyrod obviously had his limitations. A lot of fans and posters here think that Trubisky is the best back up in the league. Unless you consider Tyrod a starter (and I like Tyrod more than most), that would assume Trubisky is a better option than Taylor. 
 

To me it’s very close. Neither are great. Neither might not be consistently good. But I think if I had to choose, right now, for who I’d rather lead the team if Josh went down, I may say Trubisky. 
 

Which would make him the best Bills QB since Drew Bledsoe. And maybe even Kelly. I think Trubisky would be as good as Bledsoe was at that time in his career.
 

And I don’t really think Trubisky is very good. As a starter, right now, no way. As a backup, hell yes. 

 

 

Jury is still out on Mitchell.  Let's see what a solid NFL organization (still not used to thinking this way about Buffalo) can do for him.  Coaching does matter.  He had a couple bad tosses yesterday, but he did slice and dice the Bears D.  Maybe Matt Nagy is Adam Gase without the googly eyes.

[Iiiiiiiiive Got a Feeeelin]

20 hours ago, Kelly the Dog said:

21 hours ago, Iiiiiiiiive Got a Feeeelin said:

cmon guys. preseason. wait til week 5 or 6 til we get the hype train on. when its necessary. until then settle down

 

He’s played a lot. 29-21 as starter on Bears is actually fairly impressive. 

21 hours ago, ScottLaw said:

i dont see how these correlate 

 

[wppete]

Yes

[Kelly the Dog]

3 hours ago, Limeaid said:

 

It depends on how badly you need game and opposition strength.  Fitzpatrick has led teams to win games most said they had no chance winning.

Teams need QBs which take chances when needed but not when not needed.

 

Fitzpatrick is a QB who takes chances sometimes making throws detractors say he cannot make but he does. 

He also gets in situations where he should not take chances but does it anyways.

 

Tyrod is a QB who took chances at first, told by coaching staff to not and rely on defense and has been a protect the ball QB since.

 

Trubisky from what I have seen takes more chances than Tyrod but he is neither the leader to inspire or one who makes extraordinary performances.

 

So it is not something cut and dry.

All true. But the Bills are in a unique situation. They have a stacked roster. In previous years you would choose Fitz because he always has the chance of elevating the players around him in his gambling style. That’s the opposite of what we need even though Josh is a gambler himself. 
 

if Josh goes down for a couple games our best bet IMO is exactly how Trubisky played against the Bears. Making the right reads and throws and letting playmakers make plays. Not a riverboat gambler like Fitz. Bad teams need Fitzy not good teams. 

[78thealltimegreat]

On 8/22/2021 at 1:03 AM, Kelly the Dog said:

EJ hadn’t played 50 games in the NFL. No one thought EJ was a great prospect. Not a chance his talent was a #2 overall.  EJ was a decent prospect, probably 2nd round talent, that few ever become franchise guys. Trubisky was a far better prospect than EJ. Not really close. 

There is an enormous difference between Trubisky and Peterman, who shouldn’t even be in the league. 

Well the Raiders disagree with you about Pederman apparently…See you don’t remember EJs play prior to his ACL tear against the Browns he was really playing well and Mitch wasn’t wanted by anyone in this league and he even said that was a reason he came here the Bills actually wanted him as the league looked at him as another first round qb bust…this is more a credit to the Bills culture and building Mitch’s confidence again 

[Mrbojanglezs]

regardless of where he ranks lets just hope he never has to play

[dave mcbride]

On 8/21/2021 at 11:56 PM, Kelly the Dog said:

He’s played a lot. 29-21 as starter on Bears is actually fairly impressive. 

Yeah Bledsoe was pretty shot when he was here. Had one half of good season with two good WR. Then sucked. Tyrod was better. 

Take out the 2018 season when the Bears had the best defense in the league BY FAR, and he's .500. They were 20th in offensive DVOA that season but first in defensive DVOA. They were also first in points allowed and turnovers forced. 

 

In 2019, the Bears D was fourth in points allowed and 8th in yards allowed, but the offense was 29th in both points and yardage. In 2020, the D was also significantly better than the offense (14th and 11th vs. 22nd and 26th).  

 

I think he's probably the best since Bledsoe, who for all of his many flaws and poor performances did have a legit good season in 2002. Tyrod Taylor has a case, however. As for "since Kelly," Trubisky is most certainly not better than Flutie was from 1998-2000 (22-8 as a starter and one of those straws that stirs drinks). Not even close.  

Edited August 23, 2021 by dave mcbride

[dave mcbride]

On 8/22/2021 at 5:12 AM, GunnerBill said:

I'd have Fitz ahead of him but it's close.

Fitz is a better player now than when he was on the Bills. Just too many picks thrown when he was in a Bills uniform. 64 picks in 53 games. 

On 8/22/2021 at 12:30 AM, Bob in STL said:

One half of one preseason game against a below average team. 

Actually, they have an above average defense by every measure. The bigger issue is "preseason." 

[freddyjj]

On 8/21/2021 at 11:40 PM, ScottLaw said:

.. Bledsoe had 8 good games and then was abysmal. His 2013 season was amazingly awful. 

Maybe because if he did play in 2013 he would have been 41 years old.   Believe you mean 2003 season.  

 

Although it is amazing how washed up Bledsoe was at 31.   Brady has shown the move to him was warranted whether it was 2001, 2011 or 2021.   Bledsoe was done in NFL  after 2006 at age 34.  TB12 is still going at age 44.  Amazing.