syhuang Posted March 7, 2021 Share Posted March 7, 2021 (edited) Mel Kiper's highest-graded quarterbacks ever for the NFL draft: John Elway ranks first since 1979, Trevor Lawrence makes the top 10 1. John Elway 2. Andrew Luck 3. Peyton Manning 4. Trevor Lawrence 5. Jim Kelly 6. Andre Ware 7. Drew Bledsoe 8. Ryan Leaf 9. Troy Akiman 10. Josh Allen Edited March 7, 2021 by syhuang 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coach Tuesday Posted March 7, 2021 Share Posted March 7, 2021 Fun to wonder about what Andre Ware could do in the modern NFL. 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boxcar Posted March 7, 2021 Share Posted March 7, 2021 Just now, syhuang said: Mel Kiper's highest-graded quarterbacks ever for the NFL draft: John Elway ranks first since 1979, Trevor Lawrence makes the top 10 Three Bill QBs are in his top 10: 1. John Elway 2. Andrew Luck 3. Peyton Manning 4. Trevor Lawrence 5. Jim Kelly 6. Andre Ware 7. Drew Bledsoe 8. Ryan Leaf 9. Troy Akiman 10. Josh Allen For all his foibles, I'll always appreciate that Mel Kiper was a Josh Allen Guy before almost anyone else. 13 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HOUSE Posted March 7, 2021 Share Posted March 7, 2021 Ryan Leaf bet the under every week 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whatdrought Posted March 7, 2021 Share Posted March 7, 2021 It would have been pretty crazy if the Colts had somehow gotten Trevor Lawrence... 5 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DCofNC Posted March 7, 2021 Share Posted March 7, 2021 28 minutes ago, Coach Tuesday said: Fun to wonder about what Andre Ware could do in the modern NFL. Could be interesting for sure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maynard Posted March 7, 2021 Share Posted March 7, 2021 28 minutes ago, Coach Tuesday said: Fun to wonder about what Andre Ware could do in the modern NFL. I was pretty young when he came into the NFL. I remember him being some kind of freak in college, but bombed in the NFL. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TailgateChef Posted March 7, 2021 Share Posted March 7, 2021 Dude knows his stuff: https://www.news-herald.com/sports/espn-analyst-mel-kiper-says-patrick-mahomes-has-highest-ceiling-among-quarterbacks-in-2017-draft/article_601bbddb-dba0-53da-aca6-7338517320e3.html But there's this too: https://touchdownwire.usatoday.com/2020/04/21/mel-kiper-jr-s-worst-bad-calls-during-the-nfl-draft/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Devilmann Posted March 7, 2021 Share Posted March 7, 2021 17 minutes ago, Maynard said: I was pretty young when he came into the NFL. I remember him being some kind of freak in college, but bombed in the NFL. He went to the Lions so that’s says it all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chongli Posted March 7, 2021 Share Posted March 7, 2021 1 hour ago, syhuang said: Mel Kiper's highest-graded quarterbacks ever for the NFL draft: John Elway ranks first since 1979, Trevor Lawrence makes the top 10 1. John Elway 2. Andrew Luck 3. Peyton Manning 4. Trevor Lawrence 5. Jim Kelly 6. Andre Ware 7. Drew Bledsoe 8. Ryan Leaf 9. Troy Akiman 10. Josh Allen Yet Kansas City drafted Todd Blackledge before Jim Kelly in 1983. LOL. 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Jokeman Posted March 7, 2021 Share Posted March 7, 2021 2 hours ago, chongli said: Yet Kansas City drafted Todd Blackledge before Jim Kelly in 1983. LOL. and the Bills drafted Tony Hunter before Kelly. 4 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charles Romes Posted March 7, 2021 Share Posted March 7, 2021 (edited) 5 hours ago, whatdrought said: It would have been pretty crazy if the Colts had somehow gotten Trevor Lawrence... they did also get to draft Jeff George #1 overall who was considered near generational - he would make many top 10 lists in terms of rating coming out. Edited March 7, 2021 by Charles Romes 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ed_Formerly_of_Roch Posted March 7, 2021 Share Posted March 7, 2021 What shocks me the most is that Kiper was doing this as far back as early 80's when Kelly came along. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whatdrought Posted March 7, 2021 Share Posted March 7, 2021 5 minutes ago, Charles Romes said: they did also get to draft Jeff George #1 overall who was considered near generational - he would make many top 10 lists in terms of rating coming out. I hadn’t thought of him! Was he a guy who people saw coming for multiple years and were like “that guy is gonna be the *****!” It’s crazy to me that they got Manning and Luck who were each shoe ins for #1 overall for years. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bferra13 Posted March 7, 2021 Share Posted March 7, 2021 (edited) 9 minutes ago, whatdrought said: I hadn’t thought of him! Was he a guy who people saw coming for multiple years and were like “that guy is gonna be the *****!” It’s crazy to me that they got Manning and Luck who were each shoe ins for #1 overall for years. Don't forget the Elway drama too. He was originally drafted by the Colts as well. Edit: you obviously knew that with your prior post Side note... I work with Jeff George's brothers through my job. Genuinely good people. Edited March 7, 2021 by Bferra13 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ExWNYer Posted March 7, 2021 Share Posted March 7, 2021 5 hours ago, whatdrought said: It would have been pretty crazy if the Colts had somehow gotten Trevor Lawrence... No team would have deserved it less. DIrty carpetbaggers. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PrimeTime101 Posted March 7, 2021 Share Posted March 7, 2021 5 hours ago, TailgateChef said: Dude knows his stuff: https://www.news-herald.com/sports/espn-analyst-mel-kiper-says-patrick-mahomes-has-highest-ceiling-among-quarterbacks-in-2017-draft/article_601bbddb-dba0-53da-aca6-7338517320e3.html But there's this too: https://touchdownwire.usatoday.com/2020/04/21/mel-kiper-jr-s-worst-bad-calls-during-the-nfl-draft/ for every one time Kiper is right... hes wrong 5 other times 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rubes Posted March 7, 2021 Share Posted March 7, 2021 A little weird that Marino didn't make the list, but I have no sense of his college career. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whatdrought Posted March 7, 2021 Share Posted March 7, 2021 39 minutes ago, Bferra13 said: Don't forget the Elway drama too. He was originally drafted by the Colts as well. Edit: you obviously knew that with your prior post Side note... I work with Jeff George's brothers through my job. Genuinely good people. Hadn’t thought of that either.... so they drafted 3 of the 10 on this list... that’s insane. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
st pete gogolak Posted March 8, 2021 Share Posted March 8, 2021 I started a topic a week ago posing a hypothetical trade between Houston and JAX (Watson straight up for Lawrence). (I know, I know, it's not going to happen. Teams aren't going to trade within the division). I got a lot of grief from folks saying "how can you trade Lawrence; he's going to be generational!" But look at this list. Ten best ranked QB's coming out of college and still a 20% bust rate. If Houston did propose the trade, JAX would be crazy not to jump on it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bferra13 Posted March 8, 2021 Share Posted March 8, 2021 23 minutes ago, st pete gogolak said: I started a topic a week ago posing a hypothetical trade between Houston and JAX (Watson straight up for Lawrence). (I know, I know, it's not going to happen. Teams aren't going to trade within the division). I got a lot of grief from folks saying "how can you trade Lawrence; he's going to be generational!" But look at this list. Ten best ranked QB's coming out of college and still a 20% bust rate. If Houston did propose the trade, JAX would be crazy not to jump on it. You also need to think about the money. Personally, I'm unsold on Sunny, but if he is what everyone says he is, that's invaluable. Getting a stud qb on a rook contract for 4 years. Watson already on his second. Think about the guy making the moves.. the gm... he now drafts a big tim qb. He has years to build the team around him. Trade for Watson... yep, ya better win now or you're fired. Gotta think about that aspect. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Over 29 years of fanhood Posted March 8, 2021 Share Posted March 8, 2021 Clearly likes the prototype size and cannon arms. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ganesh Posted March 8, 2021 Share Posted March 8, 2021 12 hours ago, Boxcar said: For all his foibles, I'll always appreciate that Mel Kiper was a Josh Allen Guy before almost anyone else. One of Mel's arguments in favor of Josh is that his (Allen's) stats in college are skewed (especially the completion percentage). He mentioned that (on the draft day when Allen was picked) Allen's completion % is lower because he was asked to throw less than 25 time. For rhythm passers, the 25 number is not sufficient., He says that if Allen had an opportunity to throw 30+ times in a real offense, his % would have automtaically increased with the extra check downs to RB/TEs and to slot receivers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
machine gun kelly Posted March 8, 2021 Share Posted March 8, 2021 6 hours ago, Rubes said: A little weird that Marino didn't make the list, but I have no sense of his college career. Marino like Sapp (dude is such a tool) dropped due to the wacky tabaccy. Even more than Kelly, Marino is the best QB I’ve ever seen. I loved Manning, but that release of Marino was something I’ve never seen. Him singlehandedly winning over the 85 Bears was incredible. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buffalo716 Posted March 8, 2021 Share Posted March 8, 2021 22 minutes ago, ganesh said: One of Mel's arguments in favor of Josh is that his (Allen's) stats in college are skewed (especially the completion percentage). He mentioned that (on the draft day when Allen was picked) Allen's completion % is lower because he was asked to throw less than 25 time. For rhythm passers, the 25 number is not sufficient., He says that if Allen had an opportunity to throw 30+ times in a real offense, his % would have automtaically increased with the extra check downs to RB/TEs and to slot receivers Yeah when you don't throw a lot every incomplete pass has more effect on your completion percentage If Allen had one more completion a game over his 11 game season, AKA 11 more completions... his last year at Wyoming he would have been over 60% Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
machine gun kelly Posted March 8, 2021 Share Posted March 8, 2021 I loved Kiper’s interview on Josh stating the number of players at Wyoming were drafted, and the lack of volume of throws. Kipper stated this before and after the draft. He was spot on with his evaluation. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Freddie's Dead Posted March 8, 2021 Share Posted March 8, 2021 Amazing that people were actually debating Peyton Manning vs. Cryan' Leaf. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alphadawg7 Posted March 8, 2021 Share Posted March 8, 2021 20 hours ago, Coach Tuesday said: Fun to wonder about what Andre Ware could do in the modern NFL. Dude I was just going to say the same thing. I will never understand why he didn’t get more of a chance either. I always said I feel like his career might have gone different had he not been drafted by the Lions and he was grossly mismanaged and never really given much chance to succeed or even play. 15 hours ago, Charles Romes said: they did also get to draft Jeff George #1 overall who was considered near generational - he would make many top 10 lists in terms of rating coming out. Honestly Jeff George was probably one of the 10 most talented QBs to ever play the game. He just had the personality, likability, and mental game of Jay Cutler. If he was less of a douche he would have probably had a HOF career. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chongli Posted March 8, 2021 Share Posted March 8, 2021 (edited) 23 hours ago, The Jokeman said: and the Bills drafted Tony Hunter before Kelly. Good point. The only thing I can say in Buffalo's defense is they had picks 12 and 14. They planned to take Jimbo at 14 and knew Detroit at 13 was all set at QB, with Eric Hipple leading them to the NFC North crown the previous year (although, technically, there were no divisions that strike-shortened season, only two conferences). I suppose Detroit could have traded with a team who needed a QB though, like New England, who took Tony Eason at 15. It was a risky move by the Bills, although they still had franchise QB Joe Ferguson. Edited March 8, 2021 by chongli Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelly the Dog Posted March 8, 2021 Share Posted March 8, 2021 1 hour ago, chongli said: Good point. The only thing I can say in Buffalo's defense is they had picks 12 and 14. They planned to take Jimbo at 14 and knew Detroit at 13 was all set at QB, with Eric Hipple leading them to the NFC North crown the previous year. I suppose Detroit could have traded with a team who needed a QB though, like New England, who took Tony Eason at 15. It was a risky move by the Bills, although they still had franchise QB Joe Ferguson. The Bills also had Kelly and Marino rated even. If one of them was gone they would have been just as happy with the other. But it wasn't like they thought Hunter was better. They wanted both Hunter and a QB so they took Hunter first. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chongli Posted March 8, 2021 Share Posted March 8, 2021 33 minutes ago, Kelly the Dog said: The Bills also had Kelly and Marino rated even. If one of them was gone they would have been just as happy with the other. But it wasn't like they thought Hunter was better. They wanted both Hunter and a QB so they took Hunter first. I did not know that. Great info you posted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrDawkinstein Posted March 8, 2021 Share Posted March 8, 2021 (edited) On 3/7/2021 at 3:48 PM, The Jokeman said: and the Bills drafted Tony Hunter before Kelly. Only because both Kelly and Marino were still available, and our next pick was only 2 picks away, so we were guaranteed one of them. Crazy to think about if KC drafted Kelly, which would have forced us to pick Marino with our first pick. Which then opens up a whole new history and timeline. How many Super Bowls does Marino lead us to? How many does he win? etc etc 37 minutes ago, chongli said: I did not know that. Great info you posted. Good info about it in the 30 For 30: Elway to Marino. They go through every pick of the 83 draft, with a focus on every QB pick. Lots of good behind the scenes stuff. Edited March 8, 2021 by DrDawkinstein 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Jokeman Posted March 8, 2021 Share Posted March 8, 2021 1 minute ago, DrDawkinstein said: Only because both Kelly and Marino were still available, and our next pick was only 2 picks away, so we were guaranteed one of them. Crazy to think about if KC drafted Kelly, which would have forced us to pick Marino with our first pick. Which then opens up a whole new history and timeline. How many Super Bowls does Marino lead us to? How many does he win? etc etc Yep I think we benefitted getting Kelly because him going off the USFL allowed us to be worse and then add guys like Bruce and Andre and Reich etc in later drafts. Yet to me Marino was a better QB then Jim by quite a bit. Yet Elway will be the best of that class. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bubba Gump Posted March 8, 2021 Share Posted March 8, 2021 Todd Marinovich and Jamarcuss Russell were both sposed to take the league over. These guys miss on their rankings more than they hit on them. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoHuddleKelly12 Posted March 8, 2021 Share Posted March 8, 2021 37 minutes ago, DrDawkinstein said: Only because both Kelly and Marino were still available, and our next pick was only 2 picks away, so we were guaranteed one of them. Crazy to think about if KC drafted Kelly, which would have forced us to pick Marino with our first pick. Which then opens up a whole new history and timeline. How many Super Bowls does Marino lead us to? How many does he win? etc etc Good info about it in the 30 For 30: Elway to Marino. They go through every pick of the 83 draft, with a focus on every QB pick. Lots of good behind the scenes stuff. 3 less than Kelly, and none. I do get your point though, and pound for pound we did have stronger rosters than the 'Phins in those years, but they certainly weren't exactly slouches either. Miami was always a consistent playoff team coached by a legendary HOFer, so it's not like he was never put in a position to win, imho. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsCuse Posted March 8, 2021 Share Posted March 8, 2021 On 3/7/2021 at 3:48 PM, The Jokeman said: and the Bills drafted Tony Hunter before Kelly. They did that intentionally, knew the team in between their 2 picks didn't need a QB, so made sure they got Hunter 1st Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrDawkinstein Posted March 8, 2021 Share Posted March 8, 2021 38 minutes ago, Bubba Gump said: Todd Marinovich and Jamarcuss Russell were both sposed to take the league over. These guys miss on their rankings more than they hit on them. Neither of which were or are on Kiper's list. 9 minutes ago, NoHuddleKelly12 said: 3 less than Kelly, and none. I do get your point though, and pound for pound we did have stronger rosters than the 'Phins in those years, but they certainly weren't exactly slouches either. Miami was always a consistent playoff team coached by a legendary HOFer, so it's not like he was never put in a position to win, imho. I dunno. It was a good point that not having a QB between 83-86 did help us build out the roster. We almost certainly dont get the #1 pick and Bruce with Marino playing QB. But... Marino never had help from the run game like Kelly did, and I'm not sure Marino parties like Kelly the week before which lead to some subpar SB performances. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eball Posted March 8, 2021 Share Posted March 8, 2021 On 3/7/2021 at 12:29 PM, Coach Tuesday said: Fun to wonder about what Andre Ware could do in the modern NFL. You and I have different definitions of the word “fun.” Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rico Posted March 8, 2021 Share Posted March 8, 2021 Drew Bledsoe in the modern NFL would be fun, good for lots of laughs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charles Romes Posted March 8, 2021 Share Posted March 8, 2021 9 hours ago, Alphadawg7 said: Dude I was just going to say the same thing. I will never understand why he didn’t get more of a chance either. I always said I feel like his career might have gone different had he not been drafted by the Lions and he was grossly mismanaged and never really given much chance to succeed or even play. Honestly Jeff George was probably one of the 10 most talented QBs to ever play the game. He just had the personality, likability, and mental game of Jay Cutler. If he was less of a douche he would have probably had a HOF career. Yes with all the Jeff George hype and the arm that spoke for itself I thought it was just a matter of time the colts would take over the division in the mid 90s 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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