Week 12 Post Game thread Bills vs Chargers

[BillsFan619]

3 minutes ago, chknwing334 said:

Their margin of victory against the Chargers was more than the Chiefs and Saints margins of victory combined.  Are they one and done too?  The Chargers are a good team and the Bills controlled the game from start to finish. 

Yup, from start to finish. Yes, there was some drama in between but that’s why they play the game.

 

This is the Chargers worst loss of the year by point total.

[YattaOkasan]

6 minutes ago, Ed_Formerly_of_Roch said:

 

Yes agree we've beaten some good teams and with one more win in the last five will tie last years record, two wins will exceed last years total wins which is good.  Agree too that after first round likely won't be favored against a few teams.  And agree we had control in so many games only to let it slip away in so many games too, that's the worrisome part.

 

But calling these garbage times scores is way under selling it. We were up 18 points, and let them get within one score and came close to having to again worry about recovering an onsides kick to seal the game.  Did it happen no but too often is coming down to that after letting good size leads slip away.  In 11 games only the 2nd Jets game and the NE game did we outscore the team in the 2nd half.   One of these days and maybe repeated days this will catch up to the team and with only a one game lead on Miami, could find ourselves losing the division and on the road for the wild card too.

I agree with the points you make. I am still ok with it because when we have 1st half leads (we do often) you can afford to do that. The part that really makes me feel ok with it is even when we let a good team do that (cards) we can respond.  Having to recover an onside kick to win the game is not a problem. It’s a 95% thing. Having to win games by FGs that’s a different story. That means you were down or tied. Onside kicks mean you were up by two possessions in the closing minutes. I see your concerns but I think with a rising defense and a franchise QB we might be on the precipice of a really fun run. 

Edited November 30, 2020 by YattaOkasan

[JaCrispy]

2 hours ago, Limeaid said:

 

He also could have no INTs.  Could is a fuzzy word which is used by people to change prospective to what they think rather than what happened.

No need to get defensive...I was just agreeing with the other poster that it seemed, lately, Josh has been making unwise decisions more than he usually does...just an observation...

[Figster]

1 minute ago, CaptnCoke11 said:

They play like that on offense in playoffs it’s over 

Run game showed improvents and we already know what the passing game is capable of IMO.  Playing like that  gave Buffalo an 8 - 3 record and one step closer to the playoffs IMO.  This was like a playoff game for Anthony Lynn and a games like today get coaches fired in this league IMO..

 

 

 

  

 

 

[Stank_Nasty]

17 minutes ago, newcam2012 said:

We can probably win the first playoff game vs a weaker opponent at home. This team is clearly not elite. Still young and developing. Pitt or KC will destroy us in the playoffs.

Coming into this week Pitt has statistically played the easiest schedule in the whole league. And KC couldn’t “destroy” us the first time we played. 
 

quit with this..... Sure they’re better teams right now but the bills have shown they can play with anyone on a given day. 

9 minutes ago, balln said:

so we keep saying bills won by two scores while no other team has done that as some sort of trophy. THey very well could have scored at the end. Then bills up by 3. Still not a defense. Bills O is inconsistent. Team overall isnt playoff ready

Coughed up 3 4th quarter to’s and STILL won by 10. 
 

defense just gave up 17 to top ten offense. You people suck today. 

Edited November 30, 2020 by Stank_Nasty

[BillzFreak]

7 minutes ago, balln said:

so we keep saying bills won by two scores while no other team has done that as some sort of trophy. THey very well could have scored at the end. Then bills up by 3. Still not a defense. Bills O is inconsistent. Team overall isnt playoff ready

But yet they didn't score and the Bills won by 10 and that's the chargers worst loss of the season. If we going on could of would of things now the Bill's could be 9-2 if the Arizona hail Mary never happens.

[Ed_Formerly_of_Roch]

6 minutes ago, YattaOkasan said:

K I can see your opponents. Slight rebuttal is that when we have 1st half leads (we do often) you can afford to do that. The part that really makes me feel great is even when we let a good team do that (cards) we can respond.  Having to recover an onside kick to win the game is not a problem. It’s a 95% thing. Having to win games by FGs that’s a different story. That means you were down or tied. Onside kicks mean you were up by two possessions in the closing minutes. I see your concerns but I think with a rising defense and a franchise QB we might be on the precipice of a really fun run. 

 

Agree but the concerning part is look at the scores of games of other 8-3 and even 7-4 teams.  They are winning some close games, but they are also winning some blowouts by 15 to 20 points.  We have not won a game by more than 10 points and five of our wins were by one score, likely should have been six as I have no idea what the Chargers were trying to do in the last 30 seconds today, maybe Herbert bet on the Bills with the points. 

 

Likely if you take the unsportsmanlike conduct and roughing the passer penalties away we would have won comfortably but we just keep making totally dumb plays to allow the other team to get back into the game.

[folz]

4 hours ago, Rocky Landing said:

Just my two cents, and change:

 

I guess I can't be too mad at this game. Offense looked so undisciplined in the second half, that it's hard to remember the good things from the first.

 

At one point in the first half, the ref announced #71 as an eligible receiver. I had forgotten who that was-- Ryan Bates. But, the rest of the O-line starters were out there. Were they playing him like a TE? Weird.

 

Knox blocks sucks. (And he used a lot more effort reeling in that TD than was necessary)

Lee's blocks are damn good.

 

What the hell? Klein is legit? What happened midseason to get him to flip that switch?

 

If we're going to be a base 4-2-5 defense, we need a better nickel than Taron Johnson.

 

Our run game seemed to emerge in the second half, in no small part to improved O-line play in that area. I can forgive Motor's fumble, but I don't feel like we have complimentary backs. I'll take Motor over Moss, although there are people on this board that disagree. And, I'm not saying Moss is terrible, but IMO he's not a good compliment. I'm not sure I wouldn't feel better with Yeldon out there. Moss has been a disappointment, if you ask me.

 

This offense really misses Smoke when he's not there. I think Allen/McD needed to spread the ball around more in the second half. The TEs were invisible, McKenzie was a non-factor, and with Diggs playing so many short routes, there was little speed on the field, and we weren't that hard to cover in the second. Poor offensive adjustments at the half.

 

Great defensive adjustments at the half, though. The Chargers O became demoralized.

 

 

Just a couple of points I disagree with.

 

Yes, we all expected more out of Knox this year, but that big missed tackle was a one-on-one block against Bosa. There aren't many TEs in the league that can take Bosa one-on-one. So, it's hard for me to fault him too much for that. Especially since it was sweep play. He wasn't lined up opposite Bosa, he had to try to slide over and catch Bosa before he got off the ball. Tough ask. Coaches didn't put him in a position to succeed. And I totally disagree with your take on the TD. That was a great catch by Knox. It was either a bad ball from Josh or he was putting it where the defender couldn't get to it, but either way, the ball was high and behind Knox. The fact that he caught that and was still able to get his feet down was an excellent play by him.

 

I think Taron played a very good game today for the most part and I think he is a player. I'm not sure why people have been calling for his head lately.

 

And due to injuries, game plans, etc. Moss has not had many opportunities overall. So, I'm also surprised how many fans are down on him too. He is a rookie who has had a total of 68 carries, is averaging 4.2 yards per rush, and has 4 TDs. 

 

[Houston's #1 Bills Fan]

1 hour ago, YoloinOhio said:

 

Yeah, but he missed that 61 yarder!  👎     I mean, COME ON, MAN!!!

[ColoradoBills]

Without the turnovers this game could of easily been 37-17.  I don't get the "terrible/bad" game comments.

Defense stepped up.  I read all week where the Chargers were going to put up 30+.

Newsflash they put 17 with 3 turnovers handed them.

[balln]

2 minutes ago, ColoradoBills said:

Without the turnovers this game could of easily been 37-17.  I don't get the "terrible/bad" game comments.

Defense stepped up.  I read all week where the Chargers were going to put up 30+.

Newsflash they put 17 with 3 turnovers handed them.

defense played way better than I thought

[eSJayDee]

I don't think this has been mentioned yet, but I'd like to point out - After we got the 5 yd penalty on the KO, Bass hit the cross bar & put it through the uprights.  From 80 yds out!!!

[Mojo44]

5 minutes ago, eSJayDee said:

I don't think this has been mentioned yet, but I'd like to point out - After we got the 5 yd penalty on the KO, Bass hit the cross bar & put it through the uprights.  From 80 yds out!!!

I noticed that too. Very cool!I noticed that too. Very cool!

[Johnnycage46]

30 minutes ago, balln said:

so we keep saying bills won by two scores while no other team has done that as some sort of trophy. THey very well could have scored at the end. Then bills up by 3. Still not a defense. Bills O is inconsistent. Team overall isnt playoff ready

How spoiled/entitled.  Be happy, we are 8-3.  It's a good thing!

[BillsFan619]

29 minutes ago, Ed_Formerly_of_Roch said:

 

Agree but the concerning part is look at the scores of games of other 8-3 and even 7-4 teams.  They are winning some close games, but they are also winning some blowouts by 15 to 20 points.  We have not won a game by more than 10 points and five of our wins were by one score, likely should have been six as I have no idea what the Chargers were trying to do in the last 30 seconds today, maybe Herbert bet on the Bills with the points. 

 

Likely if you take the unsportsmanlike conduct and roughing the passer penalties away we would have won comfortably but we just keep making totally dumb plays to allow the other team to get back into the game.

I get what you’re saying but could some of that be (us not blowing out teams) because of all the teams that we have played above .500.

 

I believe it was after the Cardinals game where I saw a stat of how many teams the bills have played that are above .500. The second closest team at the time played two less games than us when it comes to teams above .500. That was just the second closest team.

 

When you only play 16 games, that’s a big difference.

Edited November 30, 2020 by BillsFan619

[YattaOkasan]

26 minutes ago, Ed_Formerly_of_Roch said:

 

Agree but the concerning part is look at the scores of games of other 8-3 and even 7-4 teams.  They are winning some close games, but they are also winning some blowouts by 15 to 20 points.  We have not won a game by more than 10 points and five of our wins were by one score, likely should have been six as I have no idea what the Chargers were trying to do in the last 30 seconds today, maybe Herbert bet on the Bills with the points. 

 

Likely if you take the unsportsmanlike conduct and roughing the passer penalties away we would have won comfortably but we just keep making totally dumb plays to allow the other team to get back into the game.

I think I’m ok with it. Yeah we have not blown anyone out but I have felt really comfortable with our lead with 4 min to go in all but 2 of our wins (pats and rams).  Maybe it feels weird cause we did get blown out in two of our losses (though I think they were closer than the score) which wasn’t our MO last year. 

[Justin C]

1 hour ago, YoloinOhio said:

 

 I personally prefer this Wolfpac (though Sting should have NEVER joined anything nWo related).

[Best Williams Available]

1 hour ago, YoloinOhio said:

 

Was the solo left eye black the thing that turned him around? Must shift his center of balance oh so perfectly.

[Penfield45]

2 hours ago, YoloinOhio said:

 

 

Bills defensive backs should be thanking Bass for making his kicks otherwise its a 7 point game and likely heading to OT after they give up another hail mary 

 

Bass and Klein were our MVP's today 

[wvbillsfan]

52 minutes ago, balln said:

so we keep saying bills won by two scores while no other team has done that as some sort of trophy. THey very well could have scored at the end. Then bills up by 3. Still not a defense. Bills O is inconsistent. Team overall isnt playoff ready

Agree. And it’s mental mistakes that are costing us. Our ceiling is as high as any teams in the league. We just don’t play at that level consistently enough. It’s self inflicted wounds that keep us from getting there 

[disco]

Super random but on the broadcast they mentioned the first hail mary that drew OPI was actually dropped going to the ground. Anybody catch if it was complete or not? Clearly not important but just curious if they should have declined the penalty and gotten the ball on downs instead of giving up the next hail mary.

[YoloinOhio]

57 minutes ago, balln said:

so we keep saying bills won by two scores while no other team has done that as some sort of trophy. THey very well could have scored at the end. Then bills up by 3. Still not a defense. Bills O is inconsistent. Team overall isnt playoff ready

The Bills could have scored at the end too. Then Bills up by 17.

[Penfield45]

28 minutes ago, Johnnycage46 said:

How spoiled/entitled.  Be happy, we are 8-3.  It's a good thing!

 

I think most fans are concerned about what happened last season. We let teams stick around all season long and everyone said not to worry about it bc of our record...until it finally came back to bite us in the 1 game that mattered most in the playoffs. 

 

The teams inability to close out games is very concerning at the moment. that type of mentality drags into the playoffs just like it did last season. 

[Warcodered]

 

[Rock-A-Bye Beasley]

1 minute ago, Penfield45 said:

 

I think most fans are concerned about what happened last season. We let teams stick around all season long and everyone said not to worry about it bc of our record...until it finally came back to bite us in the 1 game that mattered most in the playoffs. 

 

The teams inability to close out games is very concerning at the moment. that type of mentality drags into the playoffs just like it did last season. 

im concerned like most should be. However, I’m very happy we are 8-3 and have a “signature win” over the Seahawks. 
 

at this point I’m hoping we stay relatively healthy for the playoffs and then anything can happen. 
 

I think the frustration with the Bills is that it seems like they can hang with any team but can also lose to almost anyone; which is not a great recipe for repeated long playoff runs. 

[Miyagi-Do Karate]

17 minutes ago, disco said:

Super random but on the broadcast they mentioned the first hail mary that drew OPI was actually dropped going to the ground. Anybody catch if it was complete or not? Clearly not important but just curious if they should have declined the penalty and gotten the ball on downs instead of giving up the next hail mary.

Gannon seemed pretty sure about it. I couldn’t tell, and the ref was literally right there, so not sure how he could miss it. 
 

I was hoping for a booth review of the play. If it was incomplete, then we decline the OPI

and the game is over. I just think the refs weren’t thinking about it. 

[sonyab1974]

5 hours ago, A Firm Tree Does Not Fear said:

 

Man! What happened to the Jets?!?!? 

Edited November 30, 2020 by sonyab1974

[folz]

Just for some perspective on how the defense played:

 

Herbert has been averaging 26 comps./game for a 67% avg. comp. rate. He is averaging 300 yards/gm, 2.4 TDs/gm, and 21 rushing yards/gm.

Today he had 31 comps. for a 60% comp. rate, 316 pass yards, 1 TD, -2 rushing yards. 

 

So, the Bills held him to 7 yards less than his average yards from scrimmage, 7% less than his average comp. %, and 1.4 TDs below his average. Not a huge drop off, but the D didn't let him hurt us. (Not to mention that 55 of his passing yards came on that prayer he threw up in the closing minute of the game on 4th down and 27.)

 

Keenan Allen is averaging 9 receptions for 93 yards and 1 TD

Today he was held to 4 receptions for 40 yards and a TD

 

The Chargers were averaging 143.2 rushing yards per game. The Bills held them to 76 rushing yards today (and that was with the return of Austin Ekeler, who has been out for the last 8 games. He is probably their best offensive weapon and the last eight teams that played the Chargers didn't have to face him---so that should be factored in as well. He had 129 all purpose yards today---how much better would the Chargers have been over the last eight games with him?).

 

 

The Bills were in command the entire way. If not for the turnovers, I don't think that anyone is upset with this game. Don't forget that one of the turnovers happened at the Chargers 22. That should have been 3 or 7 automatic points. And both of the other turnovers happened at mid-field, just after a big Bills play, as they were rolling. Take back one of those turnovers and its a 13 or 17 point victory. Take back two and it could have been a 20-24 point margin of victory. No question, the Bills need to hold onto the ball. But if not for those turnovers (which were out of character---at least that many in one game), this would have probably been a blow out. I'm not excusing the turnovers, just trying to give some perspective. No doubt they have to clean that up. But, the only other game they had 3 TOs this year was the Tennessee game. They are averaging 1.45 turnovers/game (as opposed to 3). It would be good to get that down to one or under though. 

 

And I'm not faulting them for the penalties, because I thought that the majority of them were BS. Josh deserved the taunting call, but most of the other big penalties were on the refs, not the Bills. I think there was only 1 pre-snap penalty (Feliciano got called for a false start), which is a huge improvement from the Arizona game.

 

 

And to those who feel they can not be critical without getting called out, it isn't that you can't be critical of the Bills or the game they played, what people are reacting to is the negative attitude (the Bills are never going to win a playoff game, we can't beat any good teams, we're not as good as KC, Pitt, Tenn, Balt, Cle, Mia). Most don't have a problem discussing what went wrong in the game, where the Bills need to improve, etc., but that's not what a lot of the negative posts are. The negative ones tend to come from a defeatist attitude that the Bills and Bills fans are trying to overcome. We're 8-3 (a lucky Hail Mary away from 9-2), leading the division, still getting healthier, still improving. Enjoy the ride and stop worrying about if our wins look pretty or not. It's a week to week league, do whatever you can to advance and move on. Worrying about KC in a divisional round playoff game right now doesn't help anything and you can't predict that future yet anyhow, so take one game at a time. Enjoy the positives, point out the negatives, and move on to the next one. But, have a little faith too.

 

Edited November 30, 2020 by folz

[EmotionallyUnstable]

You know what the other teams staff puts their players in a position to be successful, and exploit match-ups, and how we refer to this as “out-coached”? 
 

What is the appropriate terminology for the opposite, where as your coaches aren’t necessarily contributing to the aforementioned advantage, but the opposing coach is negatively hurting their chances? 
 

Under-coached? 

[Hapless Bills Fan]

1 hour ago, CincyBillsFan said:

 

I disagree on Allen.  He was having a brutally efficient game in piloting the Bills to a 24 - 6 lead half way through the 3rd quarter. He was completing 75% of his passes had one TD pass and one TD run.  And hadn't made a mistake.  On their first TD drive Allen's well placed deep ball drew a PI that set up the Bills at 1st & goal. 

 

At this point Allen was playing at an A level.  Then Singleterry loses that fumble and the bottom drops out on Allen for the next two series with a careless INT and fumble.  But for most of the game Allen played very well. The Bills approached this game differently and it was working until all the weird stuff happened in the 4th quarter.

 

Finished the game 18/24 which is 75% completion as well.

Morse took responsibility for the fumbled snap as well as for the Barkley sack.  I suppose we'll never know.

 

The play sequence leading to the INT  -  first of all, any plan which winds up with Knox blocking Bosa is a Plan where you Lose your Hat - a Bad Plan.  So much for that 2 yd loss to Moss.

 

I'm not good enough to figure out what's going on from broadcast film, but the protection was clearly AFU.  Singletary is there, Dawkins has a shot at a block, they look like they may interfere with each other.  It looks to me as though Allen's arm got hit as he threw.  I'm sure some of the guys who break down film will sort this.  If the ball went where Diggs was instead of wobbling off to his L, he arguably was open by Allen-to-Diggs standards.  I'm gonna wait to call that an awful decision by Allen.

 

 

 

[YattaOkasan]

35 minutes ago, Chemical said:

 

I think the frustration with the Bills is that it seems like they can hang with any team but can also lose to almost anyone; which is not a great recipe for repeated long playoff runs. 

Agree with most your points but we only lose to good teams. It looks like we could let any one back in but really the pats are the only bad team that even got close. I think not blowing out the Jets has left a mark on the fans.  as you said we can hang with anyone and have a signature win. I’m super excited to see the coming weeks. I think we are closer to having a special season than a loss in the first round of the playoffs. 

Edited November 30, 2020 by YattaOkasan

[Nineforty]

51 minutes ago, disco said:

Super random but on the broadcast they mentioned the first hail mary that drew OPI was actually dropped going to the ground. Anybody catch if it was complete or not? Clearly not important but just curious if they should have declined the penalty and gotten the ball on downs instead of giving up the next hail mary.

 

Replay definitely showed it moving 

[YoloinOhio]

👀when did this guy become a bills fan 

 

 

Edited November 30, 2020 by YoloinOhio

[ganesh]

1 hour ago, wvbillsfan said:

Agree. And it’s mental mistakes that are costing us. Our ceiling is as high as any teams in the league. We just don’t play at that level consistently enough. It’s self inflicted wounds that keep us from getting there 

Some of that might be due to lack of continuity

[Miyagi-Do Karate]

13 minutes ago, YoloinOhio said:

👀when did this guy become a bills fan 

 

 

I will take him Jumping on the bandwagon.  We are going to need Cuomo on our side to make sure no one pulls a stunt like they did in Santa Clara with the Niners. 

[YoloinOhio]

 

[jkeerie]

31 minutes ago, YoloinOhio said:

👀when did this guy become a bills fan 

 

 

Cuomo has always touted that the Bills are the only true NY football team.

[Penfield45]

We were actually playing decent up until the Singletary fumble that set off a chain of bad turnovers 

 

Singletary doesn’t fumble we score on that drive and game is over 

[MJS]

39 minutes ago, jkeerie said:

Cuomo has always touted that the Bills are the only true NY football team.

Because they are the only NY team that brings any tax revenue to the state.

21 minutes ago, Penfield45 said:

We were actually playing decent up until the Singletary fumble that set off a chain of bad turnovers 

 

Singletary doesn’t fumble we score on that drive and game is over 

I don't see how the turnovers are related, though. Allen was pressured all day and harassed continually by Bosa. And he had defenders on him again on that INT. So I think the pressure just got to him. And the other one was a mishandled snap, right?

[NewEra]

2 hours ago, Chemical said:

im concerned like most should be. However, I’m very happy we are 8-3 and have a “signature win” over the Seahawks. 
 

at this point I’m hoping we stay relatively healthy for the playoffs and then anything can happen. 
 

I think the frustration with the Bills is that it seems like they can hang with any team but can also lose to almost anyone; which is not a great recipe for repeated long playoff runs. 

But that hasn’t really been the case. For the most part, we beat the teams we’re supposed to beat and lose (sometimes big) to the teams that we aren’t supposed to beat. Underdogs to the chiefs and cards while losing @ the titans, who are returning the same team from the afccg.   The Seattle game, while it is a signature win, it was @home against an all time bad D traveling across the country to the east coast. 
 

I feel that we can hang with any team, no question.  I just don’t feel that we lose very many games that we are supposed win.  We might have to sweat them out though 

8 hours ago, RichRiderBills said:

The Singletary fumble, the Allen pick, and the Allen fumble so late in the game just cant let me feel great. Giving up that hail mary was surreal and weird. 

 

Week in and week out, so dissapointed with Hyde, and even Poyer. 

 

Great to be 8-3 ...should go 9-3 but who knows with this crew.

If you’re disappointed in Poyer week in and week out, you should stop smoking that particular kind of crack. It’s not helping