McDermott Weds Presser: Sullivan asks whether Allen is an improvement over Tyrod

[DaBillsFanSince1973]

15 minutes ago, Mat68 said:

If Taylor at any point led the league in 4th quarter game winning drives, Redzone efficiency, or 4th quarter Qb rating he very well could still be the QB.

this right here should shut down the taylor homers.

 

something tells me if JA and the bills make the postseason they'll be able to score more the 3 points.

Edited November 14, 2019 by DaBillsFanSince1973

[SlimShady'sSpaceForce]

Tyrod Taylor was SOOOOOOO bad he was benched for Nate Peterman.  

[Hapless Bills Fan]

11 hours ago, The Bills Blog said:

This question was strange.

 

But, in general, I support "tough" questions. McDermott, while not outwardly reacting too much, has shown some signs of having thin skin with respect to media relations. Whether it's his rescheduling of his weekly WGR appearance to (seemingly) avoid Schopp after some of their encounters last year, the attempt to avoid issuing a press pass to Sullivan at his new outfit (who knows if McD was involved in this or not), or McD's subtle frustration that you pick up on when Sully asks questions.

 

No.  The question was not strange.  It was specifically designed to *****-stir

 

[vincec]

Allen plays nothing like Tyrod and is running an offense that has a completely different focus with totally different personnel. Otherwise the QBs and their situations are very similar.

[mjt328]

I don't understand why it's SO DIFFICULT for people to have patience with a young QB.

 

 

I've been following this team for 30 years.  These exact same reporters (Sullivan) crucify the Bills front office every single time they pass on a QB in the draft, and instead choose to roll with a veteran like Drew Bledsoe, Ryan Fitzpatrick, Kyle Orton or Tyrod Taylor.  They complain incessantly about our GM wasting salary cap dollars paying for an average/below average passer.  They write their little op-ed pieces about how the Bills need to draft and develop a guy out of college, like all the other successful NFL franchises.

 

But when the Bills actually draft a young QB, they CANNOT WAIT to rip the guy to shreds.  Their hands are shaking at the keyboards, eagerly anticipating the day they can definitively call our young passer a bust.  It's amazing how quiet Sullivan has been this season, up until this week.  Now he is what?... suggesting the Bills shouldn't have drafted Allen and instead stuck with Taylor?  What a ridiculous load of nonsense.

 

When it comes to developing a QB, it's not about how you start.  It's about how you finish.  And even Josh Allen's biggest believers ALWAYS KNEW he was starting behind most 1st-Round level QBs.  He was coming from a small college, against very low-caliber competition.  His mechanics were poor.  His field vision and decision-making needed work.  He was a Number One Overall physical talent, with a mid-late round on-field production.  Even the draft critics who absolutely loved Allen, quantified their love by saying he needed LOTS of development and would take longer than other guys in the class like Baker Mayfield, Sam Darnold or Josh Rosen.

 

I would say that comparing Allen's stats in the middle of his second season, to a veteran like Taylor who was in his seventh season is totally sad and pathetic.  Except, it's actually a huge positive.  If he's already playing at a similar level to Taylor, it tells me Allen is progressing quicker than most of his critics expected.  There is no doubt that Bills coaches expect Allen to be better than Taylor eventually.  Same with the fans.  But it's going to take time and patience.

 

[BillsFanSD]

2 minutes ago, mjt328 said:

But when the Bills actually draft a young QB, they CANNOT WAIT to rip the guy to shreds.  Their hands are shaking at the keyboards, eagerly anticipating the day they can definitively call our young passer a bust.  It's amazing how quiet Sullivan has been this season, up until this week. 

Fortunately, Vic Carucci stepped up to carry on this proud tradition.

[JoshAllenHasBigHands]

27 minutes ago, vincec said:

Allen plays nothing like Tyrod and is running an offense that has a completely different focus with totally different personnel. Otherwise the QBs and their situations are very similar.

Nice...

[HamSandwhich]

It’s a valid point though they are in two different places in their careers when they compare these numbers. It seems that the coaching staff have handcuffed Allen like Tyrod seemed to be when he was playing. I hope the McDermott was serious about playing fearless and they let Josh take the reigns. Gotta take the good with the bad if you’re going to let Josh ball. In my opinion, it’s better than the Tyrod play not to lose scenario. 

[Hapless Bills Fan]

11 hours ago, Maine-iac said:

Whether he cares about Taylor or not he should care about the fact that he took a team that lead the NFL in rushing for 2 straight seasons and scored 23/24 ppg during that stretch and turned it into a team that scores under 20 for two straight going on 3 straight seasons and that's after investing the 7th pick in the draft to replace a two time pro bowl QB.  No matter who's asking it seems like a valid question.  I am on the side of people who think a little more time and probably one more draft and offseason to hopefully get the O-line right and we might turn a corner but I can't blame people for asking the question.

 

I agree it would be a valid question to ask McDermott about the offensive devolution under his watch.  But there's a reasonable and an unreasonable way to ask it.

Bringing up numbers that wrap an injury and season for a rookie QB known to be a project, noting that they're the same as the last 20 starts of a QB one moved on from, and framing it as "is that enough improvement for you or will it take another 20 starts" in a pointed way, is not a reasonable way to ask it.

 

I am not a fan of every move McDermott and Beane have made nor do I think they were necessitated by the cap situation they inherited.  They deserve some questions, especially if things don't turn around.  The question Sullivan asked in the way he asked it was not one of those questions.

[Z-Mann]

20 hours ago, GoBills808 said:

Unreliable. Much like the other takes on Allen recently.  

 

What was the criticism of Allen in the offseason? Needs to up his completion % and clean up the short/underneath stuff. Worked on it in the offseason and did it. 

 

Then through first 4 games it was: stop throwing INTs. Worked on it. Done. 

 

Now it's 'he can't hit a deep ball'...all you want to do is complain about what isn't working without looking at what is. It's beyond repetitive, it's just lazy at this point.

 

Just my opinion of course, but I'm not sure if it's "progress" if he gets better in some areas and worse in others.  He's cleaned up his short game, but gotten worse with the deep ball.  He's increased his completion percentage, but he's gotten more careless with the ball (8 fumbles all of last year, 11 already this year).  

 

Again, just expecting more in his second year - and I don't feel it's acceptable that for everything that he gets better at, there is something he has gotten worse at.  Not a great trade-off.

[Cugalabanza]

Just my take, but the significant difference between Josh and Tyrod becomes clear in the 4th quarter when you need a drive to win or tie.  I liked Tyrod very much as a reliable, protect-the-ball type of game mgmt. QB, but I think we all knew that the 2 minute drill was going to end in frustration every time.

 

Josh has shown that he can lead that winning drive.  Even when everyone knows he has to throw it, he can still make it happen.  He tends to be good in the clutch and is the better passer when you need it.

 

[Gugny]

16 minutes ago, Cugalabanza said:

Just my take, but the significant difference between Josh and Tyrod becomes clear in the 4th quarter when you need a drive to win or tie.  I liked Tyrod very much as a reliable, protect-the-ball type of game mgmt. QB, but I think we all knew that the 2 minute drill was going to end in frustration every time.

 

Josh has shown that he can lead that winning drive.  Even when everyone knows he has to throw it, he can still make it happen.  He tends to be good in the clutch and is the better passer when you need it.

 

 

Gringo!!!!!  Good to see you, brutha.

 

I agree 100% with your sentiment.

[Cugalabanza]

7 minutes ago, Gugny said:

 

Gringo!!!!!  Good to see you, brutha.

 

I agree 100% with your sentiment.

 

What's up, Gugs?

 

Life is good.  Bills are 6-3 and about to destroy the dolphins on Sunday.

[Sundancer]

1 hour ago, Z-Mann said:

 

Just my opinion of course, but I'm not sure if it's "progress" if he gets better in some areas and worse in others.  

 

He's cleaned up his short game, but gotten worse with the deep ball.  

 

Not excusing his misses, but his hits last year were mostly jump balls and underthrows where bigger WRs and jumpers get them (which is how a lot of QBs hit their deep WRs)...but also where they got INTed. This year, Josh has been trying to hit his 2019 smurf WRs in stride at 50+ yards, which is really hard. A bigger target would help him feel like he can take more of a chance on those throws. 

 

Quote

He's increased his completion percentage, but he's gotten more careless with the ball (8 fumbles all of last year, 11 already this year).  

 

 

The fumbling is making me nuts too. That's just focus when he's scrambling. Once he runs, he needs to lock that ball in. He must correct that. 

 

My guess is what's happening with Josh is as a project QB, he had 6 things to work on. Focusing all the energy on one thing like increasing short percentage passing may have caused a drop in other things. He will get more mental muscle memory on those things and hopefully can move on to others. If he can't, that's a problem, but so far, I see a coachable guy who can correct his flaws and that's encouraging. That doesn't mean he won't have another 3 INT game or a 50% completion game or bail on the pocket early too often, but when he focuses on stuff, it seems to get better.  

 

We can be patient as fans or give up. I'm happy giving his growth a few more years. First, what choice do we have? Does someone want to make a run at Josh Rosen, next year's top trade contender? Or Andy Dalton? Second, patience is something this franchise never has with its coaches and culture, and that's not worked out well. Third, Josh has some things that we can all see are worth building on: confidence, well-liked teammate, leadership, arm strength, clutch, good in community, toughness. 

 

He may not work out but he's the most promising QB they've had since...Bledsoe? Let's let it ride a bit. Anyone who didn't expect it to be bumpy has a short memory from what we all knew we were getting on draft day. I expected a lot of 140 yard passing games this year and I'm not seeing those. Now in fairness, I also expected some 300 yard games and I'm not seeing those. But I'm a long ways from bailing or calling him the second coming of friggin' Tyrod. 

Edited November 14, 2019 by Sundancer

[Bleeding Bills Blue]

4 hours ago, ColeB said:

 

And there are several QBs who were thought to be the answer for their teams who have since regressed: Mariota, Goff, Trubisky, Mayfield, Wentz

 

And Goff got PAID.  And it seems like he also got figured out right around the time he got paid.  They need a powerhouse Oline to dominate the LOS for that O to work... and now they have no cap room since they paid - Donald, Cooks, Goff, Gurley, Woods, Higbee, Havenstein... even Hekker.  They also will have to negotiate with or trade ramsey this offseason - and they carry about 25 mil in cap space including what they carry over. 

 

They can't really extend anyone, and there aren't cap savings to cut anyone from that group.  They have no first round pick in the next 2 drafts... and their oline (which isn't very good right now) will probably get worse.  I still can't believe they extended gurley, huge mistake looking back.  Oh - and their best offensive player becomes a free agent in 2021.  Yikes...

 

Wentz is in need of like - 1 more target i think.  Sanders does look legit though - so that helps.  Jeffery is good but he doesn't scream like top dog #1 WR, I guess he's better than John Brown but i think he's just bigger.  Ertz is awesome... but agholor has hands of stone and desean jackson is always hurt (and old).  Arcega-Whiteside should be able to eventually fill that like #2 do-all guy (your robert woods type), but they could use someone in the slot with a bit more talent. 

 

2 young players, an all-pro TE, and a former 1000 yard receiver/RZ threat - just missing another chain mover.  If Emmanuel sanders has any tread left I think he'd fit nicely in there, allowing them to use the draft to focus on defense.

[Shaw66]

10 hours ago, reddogblitz said:

 

You get what you pay for

No, the whole point of the post was even if Tyrod=Josh, the Bills are paying a lot less for Josh than they would have paid Tyrod.  

[Punching Bag]

12 hours ago, Reed83HOF said:

What did @DC Tom (or @Alaska Darin) do to you that they remind you of Jerry Sullivan?

 

It is NOT DC Tom who reminds me of Jerry Sullivan - DC Tom is obviously too bright.

It is the Muppets' character who criticized everything and had a head full of felt.

[GunnerBill]

27 minutes ago, dneveu said:

 

And Goff got PAID.  And it seems like he also got figured out right around the time he got paid.  They need a powerhouse Oline to dominate the LOS for that O to work... and now they have no cap room since they paid - Donald, Cooks, Goff, Gurley, Woods, Higbee, Havenstein... even Hekker.  They also will have to negotiate with or trade ramsey this offseason - and they carry about 25 mil in cap space including what they carry over. 

 

They can't really extend anyone, and there aren't cap savings to cut anyone from that group.  They have no first round pick in the next 2 drafts... and their oline (which isn't very good right now) will probably get worse.  I still can't believe they extended gurley, huge mistake looking back.  Oh - and their best offensive player becomes a free agent in 2021.  Yikes...

 

Wentz is in need of like - 1 more target i think.  Sanders does look legit though - so that helps.  Jeffery is good but he doesn't scream like top dog #1 WR, I guess he's better than John Brown but i think he's just bigger.  Ertz is awesome... but agholor has hands of stone and desean jackson is always hurt (and old).  Arcega-Whiteside should be able to eventually fill that like #2 do-all guy (your robert woods type), but they could use someone in the slot with a bit more talent. 

 

2 young players, an all-pro TE, and a former 1000 yard receiver/RZ threat - just missing another chain mover.  If Emmanuel sanders has any tread left I think he'd fit nicely in there, allowing them to use the draft to focus on defense.

 

Goff has not been worked out so much as McVay's offense has been worked out. You are right they have lost talent on the OL - Whitworth's performance has finally dipped, Sullivan was done and released and Saffold went to Tennessee. You are also right that Gurley is not the player he was and paying him long term has proven a mistake. But fundamentally the issue is the offense has been figured out. Teams are ignoring all the motion and ignoring all the jet sweep action and playing McVay's offense the same way they are playing Denver's offense which is, substantially, the same stretch zone scheme. Now admittedly Goff hasn't yet demonstrated he can overcome.... but I think OLine and scheme predictability are higher on the list of problems the Rams have than Jared Goff.

[Dopey]

I can picture jerry pondering all night long " how can I get coach to fumble an answer and make myself look smart". Comparing a player's first 20 games of his career to a 7 year vet and his last 20 games is the best he could do?!?! He just made a fool/ass of himself and didn't even realize it. He was dumb enough to tweet it out, like he accomplished his goal. Idiot. Stuff like that usually comes from the cesspool called New York City media. I was going to say " jerry, you're better than this. Then I thought more about it and...no he's not.

Edited November 14, 2019 by Dopey

[Maine-iac]

9 hours ago, MJS said:

He wasn't asked about the change in points per game. He was asked about Allen vs Tyrod.

If the offense wasn't doing worse than it was with Taylor they wouldn't be asking dumb questions.  I agree with everyone that it's kind of a confrontational question but it's getting asked because the offense after 2 1/2 years is scoring less than 19 ppg.  The truth is easily that Roman's offense with Taylor was better than what we have now but we don't have Taylor and we don't have Roman.  I think Allen and Daboll will be fine but that's just my opinion and up to this point Daboll has not shown an ability to score more than 20ppg in any stop he's been at and Allen is still getting past some young QB turnover problems and a missing longball. 

[Billl]

3 hours ago, mjt328 said:

I don't understand why it's SO DIFFICULT for people to have patience with a young QB.

 

 

I've been following this team for 30 years.  These exact same reporters (Sullivan) crucify the Bills front office every single time they pass on a QB in the draft, and instead choose to roll with a veteran like Drew Bledsoe, Ryan Fitzpatrick, Kyle Orton or Tyrod Taylor.  They complain incessantly about our GM wasting salary cap dollars paying for an average/below average passer.  They write their little op-ed pieces about how the Bills need to draft and develop a guy out of college, like all the other successful NFL franchises.

 

But when the Bills actually draft a young QB, they CANNOT WAIT to rip the guy to shreds.  Their hands are shaking at the keyboards, eagerly anticipating the day they can definitively call our young passer a bust.  It's amazing how quiet Sullivan has been this season, up until this week.  Now he is what?... suggesting the Bills shouldn't have drafted Allen and instead stuck with Taylor?  What a ridiculous load of nonsense.

 

When it comes to developing a QB, it's not about how you start.  It's about how you finish.  And even Josh Allen's biggest believers ALWAYS KNEW he was starting behind most 1st-Round level QBs.  He was coming from a small college, against very low-caliber competition.  His mechanics were poor.  His field vision and decision-making needed work.  He was a Number One Overall physical talent, with a mid-late round on-field production.  Even the draft critics who absolutely loved Allen, quantified their love by saying he needed LOTS of development and would take longer than other guys in the class like Baker Mayfield, Sam Darnold or Josh Rosen.

 

I would say that comparing Allen's stats in the middle of his second season, to a veteran like Taylor who was in his seventh season is totally sad and pathetic.  Except, it's actually a huge positive.  If he's already playing at a similar level to Taylor, it tells me Allen is progressing quicker than most of his critics expected.  There is no doubt that Bills coaches expect Allen to be better than Taylor eventually.  Same with the fans.  But it's going to take time and patience.

 

You're basically saying that the media will criticize bad QBs regardless of whether they are signed in FA, traded for, or drafted.  What do you expect them to say?  "Buffalo's got the 31st rated passer in the league, but good news...at least they spent a ton of draft capital on him."

 

I don't think anyone would have criticized the team if the FA they signed was Peyton Manning or if the QB they drafted was Pat Mahomes.

[IDBillzFan]

3 hours ago, mjt328 said:

I don't understand why it's SO DIFFICULT for people to have patience with a young QB.

 

It's not difficult for people who understand the game of football. It's mostly difficult for people who try to justify their deep football knowledge by first suggesting that (fill in the blank) will fail in the NFL and then return to message boards when the player isn't an immediate success to remind everyone how smart they were to see (fill in the blank) was going to be a failure.

 

It's lazy work because predicting failure in the NFL is THE single easiest thing to do. And I don't put a lot of stock in fans who wake up each day looking foward to seeing how many times they can post "I told you so."

[GoBills808]

Just now, IDBillzFan said:

 

It's not difficult for people who understand the game of football. It's mostly difficult for people who try to justify their deep football knowledge by first suggesting that (fill in the blank) will fail in the NFL and then return to message boards when the player isn't an immediate success to remind everyone how smart they were to see (fill in the blank) was going to be a failure.

 

It's lazy work because predicting failure in the NFL is THE single easiest thing to do. And I don't put a lot of stock in fans who wake up each day looking foward to seeing how many times they can post "I told you so."

Well put. Predicting a young player washes out of the league has zero to do with anything except playing the odds. It doesn't make you smart, or insightful, or knowledgeable about what you're talking about. It just makes you lazy.

 

And predicting that a young player ON YOUR TEAM washes out is the height of ***** miserable stupidity and I don't know why anyone would waste time out of their day doing it.

[Dr.Sack]

Tyrod kept Baker on the bench for 1.5 games right? At this point I’d think if you put Mayfield on this Bills team and Allen on Cleveland we’d be looking at a 3-6 Bills team and 6-3 Browns.

[Tenhigh]

Someone should ask Jerry if his first 20 columns at the Niagara Gazette were as predictable as his last 20 columns at the Buffalo News. 

[reddogblitz]

4 hours ago, mjt328 said:

I don't understand why it's SO DIFFICULT for people to have patience with a young QB.

 

Should we have been this patient with EJ?

Edited November 14, 2019 by reddogblitz

[Nextmanup]

4 hours ago, mjt328 said:

I don't understand why it's SO DIFFICULT for people to have patience with a young QB.

 

 

I've been following this team for 30 years.  These exact same reporters (Sullivan) crucify the Bills front office every single time they pass on a QB in the draft, and instead choose to roll with a veteran like Drew Bledsoe, Ryan Fitzpatrick, Kyle Orton or Tyrod Taylor.  They complain incessantly about our GM wasting salary cap dollars paying for an average/below average passer.  They write their little op-ed pieces about how the Bills need to draft and develop a guy out of college, like all the other successful NFL franchises.

 

But when the Bills actually draft a young QB, they CANNOT WAIT to rip the guy to shreds.  Their hands are shaking at the keyboards, eagerly anticipating the day they can definitively call our young passer a bust.  It's amazing how quiet Sullivan has been this season, up until this week.  Now he is what?... suggesting the Bills shouldn't have drafted Allen and instead stuck with Taylor?  What a ridiculous load of nonsense.

 

When it comes to developing a QB, it's not about how you start.  It's about how you finish.  And even Josh Allen's biggest believers ALWAYS KNEW he was starting behind most 1st-Round level QBs.  He was coming from a small college, against very low-caliber competition.  His mechanics were poor.  His field vision and decision-making needed work.  He was a Number One Overall physical talent, with a mid-late round on-field production.  Even the draft critics who absolutely loved Allen, quantified their love by saying he needed LOTS of development and would take longer than other guys in the class like Baker Mayfield, Sam Darnold or Josh Rosen.

 

I would say that comparing Allen's stats in the middle of his second season, to a veteran like Taylor who was in his seventh season is totally sad and pathetic.  Except, it's actually a huge positive.  If he's already playing at a similar level to Taylor, it tells me Allen is progressing quicker than most of his critics expected.  There is no doubt that Bills coaches expect Allen to be better than Taylor eventually.  Same with the fans.  But it's going to take time and patience.

 

Have a look around the league.

These guys don't get forever.

 

As I mention every day around here, EJ Manuel was sized up, analyzed, and spit out in FOURTEEN GAMES.

 

That was it.

 

 

 

[ngbills]

22 minutes ago, Dr.Sack said:

Tyrod kept Baker on the bench for 1.5 games right? At this point I’d think if you put Mayfield on this Bills team and Allen on Cleveland we’d be looking at a 3-6 Bills team and 6-3 Browns.

No way no how. We won games despite Allen not because of him this year. We would at least be 6-3 with almost anyone at QB. 

Edited November 14, 2019 by ngbills

[syhuang]

 

[IDBillzFan]

59 minutes ago, GoBills808 said:

I don't know why anyone would waste time out of their day doing it.

 

Because to these people, the desire to say "I told you so" is greater than the desire to be a fan.

[BarleyNY]

2 hours ago, Shaw66 said:

No, the whole point of the post was even if Tyrod=Josh, the Bills are paying a lot less for Josh than they would have paid Tyrod.  

The Bills paid picks 12, 53 and 56 for Allen. Plus a fully guaranteed $21M contract over 4 years.  That’s a lot.  I am absolutely not saying that Tyrod should’ve been the answer, but don’t act like Allen didn’t cost a lot. 

[ngbills]

39 minutes ago, syhuang said:

 

Lets pick Tyrod in a playoff game that he didnt play well with Allen against a 2-6 team. Yeah that makes sense. Pointless.

 

I am not care about any Tyrod vs Allen or want Tyrod back. Point in my mind is simply this offense is not good enough. The Bills chose to move on from Tyrod or whoever and it has not equaled that level of production yet after 2.5+ years. That is a concern. 

[Kirby Jackson]

I’ve purposely avoided this topic because I like Josh and liked Tyrod. I only came here because it was chat Bills here or talk about whether Chris Brown should move over from lead journalist to college scout. This just felt like a more intelligent conversation.

 

With that being said there are some similarities between the 2 both good and bad. They are both quality game managers and have winning records because of it. That’s not a bad thing. It was time for the Bills to move on from Tyrod. He was a guy that could win by game managing. In order to take the next step the Bills needed a QB that would occasionally take over a game and win it on his own. Josh has the ability to do it but hasn’t quite done it. He was raw coming out and has needed time to develop. He is getting better but still leaving too many plays on the field. 
 

At this point their production is similar and the hope is that Josh will continue to progress. Hopefully, he hasn’t reached his ceiling. As I said with Tyrod, the grass isn’t always greener. Josh is better than a bunch of guys playing. It’s just a matter of him elevating his game from serviceable to good to great, etc...

Edited November 14, 2019 by Kirby Jackson

[ngbills]

52 minutes ago, syhuang said:

 

 

 

 

2016 Tyrod

Edited November 14, 2019 by ngbills

[syhuang]

while we are on Tyrod Taylor train......

 

 

 

------------------------------------

 

https://www.barstoolsports.com/chicago/mind-blown-tyrod-taylor-and-lamar-jackson-are-practically-identical-through-their-first-16-starts#scrollToComments

 

Tyrod:

 

 

Lamar:

 

 

Obviously more yards and tuddies from Lamar but over double the attempts. Y/A is within a 2% margin and objectively Lamar has much, MUCH more talent around him on the ground which makes it even more preposterous. Really think about how much Lamar ball washing is going on right now vs. how fast Tyrod gets run out of places vs. how ***** impossible it would be to lump these two together through their first 16 starts. 

 

------------------------------------

[BarleyNY]

30 minutes ago, ngbills said:

 

 

 

2016 Tyrod

Thank you.  Tyrod was significantly better than Allen during his time here (passer rating, QBR, DYAR) and I would not argue that he was good enough.  

[ngbills]

13 minutes ago, syhuang said:

while we are on Tyrod Taylor train......

 

 

 

------------------------------------

 

https://www.barstoolsports.com/chicago/mind-blown-tyrod-taylor-and-lamar-jackson-are-practically-identical-through-their-first-16-starts#scrollToComments

 

Tyrod:

 

 

Lamar:

 

 

Obviously more yards and tuddies from Lamar but over double the attempts. Y/A is within a 2% margin and objectively Lamar has much, MUCH more talent around him on the ground which makes it even more preposterous. Really think about how much Lamar ball washing is going on right now vs. how fast Tyrod gets run out of places vs. how ***** impossible it would be to lump these two together through their first 16 starts. 

 

------------------------------------

Tyrod in the right system isnt a horrible option. Problem is you put yourself in a box that most teams would not want to be in. 

[ngbills]

1 minute ago, BarleyNY said:

Thank you.  Tyrod was significantly better than Allen during his time here (passer rating, QBR, DYAR) and I would not argue that he was good enough.  

Exactly. Tyrod was not good enough and Allen is not get enough (yet). Clearly Allen is greener and there is a chance, but not a guarantee, that he gets better. Mostly everyone here wants to see that happen. I think frustration comes from what we are seeing on the field being reminiscent of failed QB's of the past and hearing the familiar excuses about more time, changing systems, supporting cast, etc. 

[C.Biscuit97]

2 hours ago, Dr.Sack said:

Tyrod kept Baker on the bench for 1.5 games right? At this point I’d think if you put Mayfield on this Bills team and Allen on Cleveland we’d be looking at a 3-6 Bills team and 6-3 Browns.

Huh? You think Mayfield would be worse with on a team with the #3 ranked defense than Allen would be on a team with the #17 ranked one (which we helped their ranking going up)?  I don’t know about that chief.  
 

that’s the whole thing with Allen. We aren’t winning because of him. I believe a bunch of qbs could be subbed in and we’d have just as many, if not more wins.  This is the most functional situation a young Bills qb has had in a long time. I wasn’t a fan of Tyrod because I thought he was a game manager. He won’t lose game singlehandedly but he won’t win you them either. I wanted more.  Now, I want more from the highest drafted qb in Bills history.  All I heard about how great the 2018 class was.  Why is the 2017 and 2019 ones looking so much better?  Why do we always have to be the team that wants 3 years for our guy to be good when undrafted rookie qbs can have huge games.  I love Allen as a person but let’s show something that looks elite.

Edited November 14, 2019 by C.Biscuit97

[Reed83HOF]

3 hours ago, Limeaid said:

 

It is NOT DC Tom who reminds me of Jerry Sullivan - DC Tom is obviously too bright.

It is the Muppets' character who criticized everything and had a head full of felt.

LOL simply a joke based on avatars....