GM Doug Whaley has been fired

[iinii]

Shitting Bison?

When the chips are down

[Rico]

Just not 100% true but reads good

#12 is dead-on.

[FireChan]

Now it's time to see if the people who believed Whaley was good at his job and would get picked up by another team to be GM actually comes true.

He's the best GM on the market, but he would also never be fired soo

[Buffalo86]

I look forward to Buffalo 86's diatribe next year about how McDermott should be fired for trading up for Jones and Dawkins when he could have had (insert name here) Oh and wait for the screed after Peterman misses a pass.

I was vocally against every one of the moves I listed at the time they happened. Don't know enough about Jones & White, but I like those picks. Love the Dawkins pick; I had posted several times about wanting him leading up to the draft. Can't believe Peterman was still available at that point in the draft. Overall, I think we had one of the better drafts in the league. Did I miss anything?

[bbb]

Chris Gragg‏Verified account @Gragg80

@buffalobills can your #2 TE from last year come back now? Just wondering.

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11:01 AM - 30 Apr 2017

34 replies 151 retweets 515 likes

[Buffalo Barbarian]

Bingo card

[MAJBobby]

#12 is dead-on.

#13 is complete lie

[BringBackFergy]

 

Yeah, cuz speaking skills are a crucial prerequisite in football.....

Leadership and being able to articulate a vision are...I think that's his point.

[Buffalo Barbarian]

Bingo card

Whaley should've been fired when:

 

• He traded a king's ransom for Watkins, then said there wasn't much of a gap between Sammy & the other top WRs in the class. It was clear that the importance of draft picks was completely lost on him
• He traded our 2014 5th round pick to the Bucs for a 7th and the next year's 5th. Horrible value, and the pick would've been better spent on McCarron, Murray, etc.
• He went into the 2014 pre-season with Thad Lewis and Jeff Tuel as our backups, having already seen what they were capable of the year before
• He traded for Bucs' WR Mike Williams, a guy with character issues & with whom Marrone had a bad history. This may have been the first of many moves aimed at undermining his HC
• He traded #2 QB Matt Cassel, possibly against his coaches' wishes, for some future late round picks, forcing EJ Manuel back up the depth chart
• He pushed for EJ Manuel to start in 2016 before the Bills were eliminated
• He said that if EJ didn't work out, Whaley himself would be looking for a job
• He gushed about what a perfect hire Rex was, while supposedly not meaning a word he said
• He traded multiple picks for a LB who fit Rex's scheme perfectly. You know, Rex: the guy Whaley supposedly didn't want
• He declared our first 3 picks of the 2016 draft to be off the bus starters. None of them were.
• He either lied about or was the only person who didn't know that Shaq Lawson would need surgery
• He forced his supporters to ignore the rest of the modern day NFL and hang on to the irrelevant claim that he was better than our last few GMs
• He re-signed Dareus to a huge deal without any clauses for personal conduct violations. This is low on the list, as I'm not exactly sure how common this is in the NFL. But if it is common practice to include such clauses, oh boy...

Most of the items listed above can be traced back to this: Whaley fell too hard for EJ, and he spent far too much trying to prove he was right.

 

Good riddance.

Excellent post !

[Sweats]

Whaley and the Ryan brother are probably all sitting around in a bar saying, "yep, i remember when i used to work for the Bills..........."

 

I'd like to say that this firing affects me, but it truly does not.

It's the same as any other job..........if you don't produce or succeed, then you're going home.

 

No love lost here.

[Bill_with_it]

I remember that thread. Didn't it use making the team as the benchmark for success? Or was it starting for the Bills? By either measure, Chris Kelsay was a resounding 10 year success!

 

Since we're taking this personal, let me know the first time you come up with any analysis of any sort, or for that matter, any original thought whatsoever. All you do is spout off of what others have written & recycle corny one-liners that you surely heard someone else say.

 

I was thinking the same thing. Wasn't it said that Whaley would be hired as another team's GM "in a second"? We're already running late.

What he isnt on the Patriots or Falcons running the show as promised?

[Dr. K]

Well, this makes the organization look even more like a complete cluster f*ck. I feel bad for Whaley. He has had 3 coaches to deal with in 4 years. Three scheme changes on both sides of the ball. He has still managed to assemble more talent on this team than we have seen in a decade. The coaching staffs failed him, mainly Rex failed him. Now he is getting the axe right after a highly rated draft by all who rate such things? Amazing. Only in Buffalo. You couldn't make this sh*t up if you tried.

This is my view. Some of the things he tried did not work out. He was saddled with coaches, notably Rex, that he did not want, but he kept his mouth shut for the most part and did his job. He made some smart trades, such as the one that brought Hughes here, and consistently picked up undrafted gems for the roster.

 

I hope McDermott will work out, but this move in and of itself does not inspire confidence in the Pegulas and the organization. And the Pegulas have already done a number of things, such as fall in love with Rex, that seriously call their judgment into question. Firing the scouts also strikes me as iffy. We'll see.

[Bill_with_it]

not a lot of openings right now

We were fed that Whaley was better than alot of the GMs in the league, those owners should fire the bad GMs and hire Whaley if hes as good as we were fed constantly.

[OldTimeAFLGuy]

This is my view. Some of the things he tried did not work out. He was saddled with coaches, notably Rex, that he did not want, but he kept his mouth shut for the most part and did his job. He made some smart trades, such as the one that brought Hughes here, and consistently picked up undrafted gems for the roster.

 

I hope McDermott will work out, but this move in and of itself does not inspire confidence in the Pegulas and the organization. And the Pegulas have already done a number of things, such as fall in love with Rex, that seriously call their judgment into question. Firing the scouts also strikes me as iffy. We'll see.

....the direction of his defense personnel wise over two years, equating to a top five unit was undone overnight by the bloviating Wrecks....nah, I wouldn't be pissed.....

[GunnerBill]

For those of you complaining about a possible inverted structure between the coach in the GM, you haven't been listening to Terry. Terry likes flat organizations built upon consensus. Whomever gets hired as GM will have to get along very well with Sean and they both will be tasked to work together, not in separate silos.

 

From what I understand Doug and Sean worked together, but perhaps Sean felt more comfortable with his own guy moving forward.

I am far from complaining about an inverted structure..... I would welcome that. It is a risk giving that much power to a rookie HC I agree but the alternative is the flat structure that has led to so many of the problems. If we are going to the Carroll / Schneider model or the Reid / Dorsey model I am fine with that... at least we would have a clear definition of whose say counts where.

 

I wasn't anti the flat structure 3 years ago and I think it can work if the two guys are tied at the hip. Where one came first and then the other followed I think you are just storing up all kinds of power struggle shaped trouble in future months and years.

He's the best GM on the market, but he would also never be fired soo

I don't know who ever said that on this board. If he wants to continue working in the NFL he will... but it will be as a Director of Pro Personnel because that is where he really excels. His record as a drafter was mixed at best.

[D521646]

 

I'm so f'ing disgusted with them right now I can barely type

 

 

Me either, I am really shocked by this. Whaley was NOT the problem here, if anything can be blamed on him, it might be that he allowed himself to be outplayed by pretty much everyone. Whaley is a talented evaluator, he'll land on his feet just fine. Well I hope the Pegulas are happy. If Brandon is advising them on this crap, they and we as fans are in for another decade of shitery... As for McD, well, it's all on him now, if he asked for this, well he got it!

 

 

Tim-

[Another Fan]

My lasting memory of him was at the press conference after Rex got fired saying he had no idea that was going down. At the time I thought he was either just blowing smoke up people's butt or was just totally naïve and or kept out of the loop Either way it didn't make management look too good.

 

I do think Whaley had the best interests for the team at heart though. Wish him well

[Cripple Creek]

We were fed that Whaley was better than alot of the GMs in the league, those owners should fire the bad GMs and hire Whaley if hes as good as we were fed constantly.

Do you think before you let your fingers do the walking or do you just fire these gems off? What a load of crap.

 

Whaley had warts and worked in a dysfunctional environment. He's good at obtaining talent, hope things work out for him down the road.

[YoloinOhio]

Whaley reminds me of Chris Polian. Much better behind the scenes with player evaluation than running the show and actually speaking to media. He was so bad that Bill was the "president" and only consulting on the FO side but he spoke for Chris on radio show, etc. He will likely end up in a similar role as Chris and that's the right fit imo.

Edited April 30, 2017 by YoloinOhio

[cba fan]

We were fed that Whaley was better than alot of the GMs in the league, those owners should fire the bad GMs and hire Whaley if hes as good as we were fed constantly.

It never works that way and you know it. Clever response though. I see your point.

 

I would hire Whaley tomorrow if I owned a team. I would put him in charge of scouting and very likely move him up when GM leaves or gets fired for CAUSE.

 

I liked him but it was just a personal opinion. He was never given the power to do his job as a GM. Classic Bills.

Edited April 30, 2017 by cba fan

[Bill_with_it]

Do you think before you let your fingers do the walking or do you just fire these gems off? What a load of crap.

 

Whaley had warts and worked in a dysfunctional environment. He's good at obtaining talent, hope things work out for him down the road.

Well its on these boards since I joined. Multiple people stating hea better than alot of other GMs. What owners wouldnt want a better GM?

[CanadianFan]

Pegula didn't explain the move very well at the press conference. I can't see this move being seen favourably in NFL circles. This is a brand problem of a different sort. Whaley had some credibility in NFL. He has relationships in the league. This is going to have an impact on attracting the best talent out there due to optics involved.

[Bangarang]

He was never given the power to do his job as a GM. Classic Bills.

How so?

[Sweats]

Pegula didn't explain the move very well at the press conference. I can't see this move being seen favourably in NFL circles. This is a brand problem of a different sort. Whaley had some credibility in NFL. He has relationships in the league. This is going to have an impact on attracting the best talent out there due to optics involved.

 

 

So, it was the Whaley firing that turned this franchise into an unprecedented fiasco?

 

I suppose a dysfunctional franchise with 17+ years of fail has nothing to do with attracting the markets best talent.

[Bangarang]

Pegula didn't explain the move very well at the press conference. I can't see this move being seen favourably in NFL circles. This is a brand problem of a different sort. Whaley had some credibility in NFL. He has relationships in the league. This is going to have an impact on attracting the best talent out there due to optics involved.

I often think listening to Pegula give an interview or press conference is painful but I didn't have much of an issue with him today. The media was fishing for a story they can run with and I like that he held his ground and refused to go into detail regarding why Whaley was fired. He kept things general and didn't give the media more fuel for their fires. We're not stupid. We know this decision was made well before the draft. Just like we know it was McD running things this weekend. All that matters is that Whaley was not good at his job and Pegula was wise enough to see that and let him go so he can try and find someone who is.

[jrober38]

Doug Whaley was a horrible GM. His drafting was abysmal and his management of the salary cap was terrible.

 

Now if we could fire Russ Brandon this franchise would finally have hope of being successful one day.

[BringBackFergy]

Pegula didn't explain the move very well at the press conference. I can't see this move being seen favourably in NFL circles. This is a brand problem of a different sort. Whaley had some credibility in NFL. He has relationships in the league. This is going to have an impact on attracting the best talent out there due to optics involved.

 

"Optics"?? I've heard more and more sports analysts use this term. What does it mean?

[BADOLBILZ]

I am far from complaining about an inverted structure..... I would welcome that. It is a risk giving that much power to a rookie HC I agree but the alternative is the flat structure that has led to so many of the problems. If we are going to the Carroll / Schneider model or the Reid / Dorsey model I am fine with that... at least we would have a clear definition of whose say counts where.

 

I wasn't anti the flat structure 3 years ago and I think it can work if the two guys are tied at the hip. Where one came first and then the other followed I think you are just storing up all kinds of power struggle shaped trouble in future months and years.

 

I don't know who ever said that on this board. If he wants to continue working in the NFL he will... but it will be as a Director of Pro Personnel because that is where he really excels. His record as a drafter was mixed at best.

 

 

Exactly.

 

Since Donahoe was fired there has been no organizational accountability in the front office.

 

Whitey went out in a blaze but he owned the moves and that's the way it should be.

 

The constant "wondering" if Jauron or Gailey or Marrone or Rex were imposing moves on the GM here has been about f*cking ridiculous and it's been used as a way of deflecting blame by the organization.

 

Enough with the "Jauron picked Maybin no Brandon picked Maybin no Modrak picked Maybin" nonsense.

 

The "safety in numbers" approach by the FO employees of OBD was at best impeding progress.

[Buffalo86]

I think it's a reasonable assumption that the Bills won't be picking up Sammy's option, which was probably another source of friction with Whaley.

[GunnerBill]

 

Exactly.

 

Since Donahoe was fired there has been no organizational accountability in the front office.

 

Whitey went out in a blaze but he owned the moves and that's the way it should be.

 

The constant "wondering" if Jauron or Gailey or Marrone or Rex were imposing moves on the GM here has been about f*cking ridiculous and it's been used as a way of deflecting blame by the organization.

 

Enough with the "Jauron picked Maybin no Brandon picked Maybin no Modrak picked Maybin" nonsense.

 

The "safety in numbers" approach by the FO employees of OBD was at best impeding progress.

This. 100% this.

 

In a properly functioning organisation a flat all report to uncle Terry might work. But until the Bills can prove that they are that let's have some clear structure and accountability. If McDermott is the guy let's have him be the guy... if he fails in 3 or 4 years we fire him and his handpicked General Manager.

[eball]

 

 

Exactly.

 

Since Donahoe was fired there has been no organizational accountability in the front office.

 

Whitey went out in a blaze but he owned the moves and that's the way it should be.

 

The constant "wondering" if Jauron or Gailey or Marrone or Rex were imposing moves on the GM here has been about f*cking ridiculous and it's been used as a way of deflecting blame by the organization.

 

Enough with the "Jauron picked Maybin no Brandon picked Maybin no Modrak picked Maybin" nonsense.

 

The "safety in numbers" approach by the FO employees of OBD was at best impeding progress.

Can't disagree with any of this.

[billspro]

I'm fine with the move. Whaley was given a fair amount of time to create a playoff roster and didn't get it done. I would love to see some stability with this organization, hopefully the new GM along with coach McDermott provide that.

[DrDawkinstein]

This. 100% this.

 

In a properly functioning organisation a flat all report to uncle Terry might work. But until the Bills can prove that they are that let's have some clear structure and accountability. If McDermott is the guy let's have him be the guy... if he fails in 3 or 4 years we fire him and his handpicked General Manager.

 

Right in line with you and Badol.

 

BUT, for the flat structure to work, the person at the top needs to be "the decider" and give direction and settle beefs before they even get that far. If Pegula wants to be the top and the leader, then he needs to be present and lead. He's not only not doing that, but I'm not sure we want him doing that.

 

He needs to put someone in charge, get out of the way and go back to Florida (since he's going there any way).

 

If that's McD, fine. I'm not thrilled, but at least there's some accountability.

Edited April 30, 2017 by DrDareustein

[NoSaint]

 

 

So, it was the Whaley firing that turned this franchise into an unprecedented fiasco?

 

I suppose a dysfunctional franchise with 17+ years of fail has nothing to do with attracting the markets best talent.

I think there are a lot of people that were hoping the rumors weren't true and the firing confirmed a lot of worries.

 

Hopefully McD works out though. This could all be part of a grand awakening to how things should be... or spastic flailing

[row_33]

Pegula didn't explain the move very well at the press conference. I can't see this move being seen favourably in NFL circles. This is a brand problem of a different sort. Whaley had some credibility in NFL. He has relationships in the league. This is going to have an impact on attracting the best talent out there due to optics involved.

 

This could be dismissed readily, but everything the owner does in private and public reflects on the team and The Shield.

[NoSaint]

 

Right in line with you and Badol.

 

BUT, for the flat structure to work, the person at the top needs to be "the decider" and give direction and settle beefs before they even get that far. If Pegula wants to be the top and the leader, then he needs to be present and lead. He's not only not doing that, but I'm not sure we want him doing that.

 

He needs to put someone in charge, get out of the way and go back to Florida (since he's going there any way).

 

If that's McD, fine. I'm not thrilled, but at least there's some accountability.

I'll agree with this sentiment.

 

I wouldve made it DW either at the initial purchase or this coaching search and committed to the structure, but if he wants it to be McD hopefully we found a gem that can handle it. Would make me nervous based on many failing and odds of us discovering a guy that does both is lower than just finding a coach but... well... let's commit to a structure and have everyone actually step into real roles.

[JohnC]

This. 100% this.

 

In a properly functioning organisation a flat all report to uncle Terry might work. But until the Bills can prove that they are that let's have some clear structure and accountability. If McDermott is the guy let's have him be the guy... if he fails in 3 or 4 years we fire him and his handpicked General Manager.

There are a variety organizational structures that have proved to be successful and there are the same organizational structures that have proved to be failures. Regardless what the structure is what is guaranteed to fail is a system where accountability and responsibility are defused. That dynamic applies to all types of enterprises that have nothing to do with sports.

 

It has been apparent that once McDermott was brought on board Whaley's history with the organization was clearly written. There has never been an occasion that I can remember where the GM was completely silenced and the coach's voice was prominently elevated over the GM's. I have no problem with having a primary voice but when the GM is publicly told to not say anything on behalf of the organization that was more than a public demotion, it was a public castrating.

 

The irony is that it seems that in this draft Whaley did a good job of providing a list of the type of prospects that McDermott would be comfortable with. There is no question that McDermott is driving the bus. However, I get queasy when the role of HC and GM are wrapped into one. In that type of all encompassing setup there is not a counterbalance between the short and long term interests of the franchise. I find that worrisome.

[Reed83HOF]

 

Right in line with you and Badol.

 

BUT, for the flat structure to work, the person at the top needs to be "the decider" and give direction and settle beefs before they even get that far. If Pegula wants to be the top and the leader, then he needs to be present and lead. He's not only not doing that, but I'm not sure we want him doing that.

 

He needs to put someone in charge, get out of the way and go back to Florida (since he's going there any way).

 

 

Well said!

Edited April 30, 2017 by Reed83HOF

[Buffalo86]

I think there are a lot of people that were hoping the rumors weren't true and the firing confirmed a lot of worries.

 

Hopefully McD works out though. This could all be part of a grand awakening to how things should be... or spastic flailing

I bet the other teams in our division were hoping it wasn't true. Even Belichick is probably bummed; I hear he had grown quite fond of his annual RFA poker games with Doug.

[Reed83HOF]

In that type of all encompassing setup there is not a counterbalance between the short and long term interests of the franchise. I find that worrisome.

 

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