mannc Posted June 22, 2022 Share Posted June 22, 2022 5 hours ago, Mr. WEO said: They would offer the least on the cases that could cost them the most? That’s not at all what I said. Just the opposite. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. WEO Posted June 22, 2022 Share Posted June 22, 2022 Just now, mannc said: That’s not at all what I said. Just the opposite. why do you think the ones who won't settle most likely have the weakest cases? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mannc Posted June 22, 2022 Share Posted June 22, 2022 5 hours ago, BarleyNY said: That's certainly possible. I do think that Buzbee would have led with one of the strongest cases though. The Solis case is the first and did not get settled. It is entirely possible that some of the four remaining are strong cases and some are weak; there are many reasons cases settle, or don’t. Each plaintiff has to make up her own mind… Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Augie Posted June 22, 2022 Share Posted June 22, 2022 (edited) 16 minutes ago, mannc said: It is entirely possible that some of the four remaining are strong cases and some are weak; there are many reasons cases settle, or don’t. Each plaintiff has to make up her own mind… Some of these ladies may be more interested in what they perceive as justice and accountability than money. It doesn’t have to be tied to the strength of the cases. EDIT: There were reports that they were close to settling a while back, but some ladies objected to the strict nature of the NDA. It’s not ONLY about money. . Edited June 22, 2022 by Augie 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mannc Posted June 22, 2022 Share Posted June 22, 2022 1 minute ago, Mr. WEO said: why do you think the ones who won't settle most likely have the weakest cases? I don’t necessarily think that. I said it’s possible. We don’t know one way or the other. There is probably a rough formula that the attorneys are using to settle out these cases. For some reason, these four plaintiffs have rejected what’s been offered. They might think they have such a great case that they want to go to trial, or their case might be so weak that Watson’s team has offered them substantially less than they offered the others and they don’t want to accept a lower offer. Or these plaintiffs might have some other reason not to settle…maybe they think the offer will go up if they hold out. 1 minute ago, Augie said: Some of these ladies may be more interested in what they perceive as justice and accountability than money. It doesn’t have to be tied to the strength of the cases. That’s possible too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mango Posted June 22, 2022 Share Posted June 22, 2022 21 hours ago, machine gun kelly said: I wouldn’t rule out a year as the stink on this issue is so red hot right now. The public especially some subgroups are so up on arms that 6 games like Big Ben wouldn’t fly today. They are the most vocal and the politicians and media will skewer the NFL, the owners, Goodell and just about anyone else to make an issue. The owners are Billionaires, some of the most powerful people in this country. Do you think they can’t read the room? They are also pissed at the Browns for making such a go awful contract with Watson that every other team is going to face the same problem when the Lamar’s of the world are up for their extensions. Ben only getting 6 games and not being booted from the league entirely still makes me feel dirty. What a terrible human. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BarleyNY Posted June 22, 2022 Share Posted June 22, 2022 41 minutes ago, Mango said: Ben only getting 6 games and not being booted from the league entirely still makes me feel dirty. What a terrible human. 6 games, quietly reduced to 4 games after appeal. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pine Barrens Mafia Posted June 22, 2022 Share Posted June 22, 2022 These clowns think it'll be 8 games or less. If that's the case, then we know the NFL has the fix in. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Punching Bag Posted June 22, 2022 Share Posted June 22, 2022 2 hours ago, Niagara Bill said: And now everyone will criticize Washington Football Team for paying out 1.6m for their owner. Browns likely paid out 10 times that much indirectly for Watson. Harvey Weinstein is in jail. It is hard to decide what to criticize $nyder with first since there are so many things to do so. It would be a PERFECT team for board members who all they have to say about Bills is criticism. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. WEO Posted June 22, 2022 Share Posted June 22, 2022 3 minutes ago, mannc said: I don’t necessarily think that. I said it’s possible. We don’t know one way or the other. There is probably a rough formula that the attorneys are using to settle out these cases. For some reason, these four plaintiffs have rejected what’s been offered. They might think they have such a great case that they want to go to trial, or their case might be so weak that Watson’s team has offered them substantially less than they offered the others and they don’t want to accept a lower offer. Or these plaintiffs might have some other reason not to settle…maybe they think the offer will go up if they hold out. That’s possible too. When you said that more likely than not, these were weaker than the settled cases, it raised my question. It also seems counterintuitive that the Asley Solis case in particular is more likely than not weaker than the settled cases. She was the one where he has admitted that she was crying after their encounter. Plus Watson's lawyer has implicated him publicly saying he was seeking "happy endings" and used so many therapists in the hopes of getting them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Blitz Posted June 22, 2022 Share Posted June 22, 2022 He's going to be suspended for the season. How the media and NFL promotes and treats him when all is said and done - he's going to be out of the league in 3 years. I do not see him playing well for the Browns anyway. And when he wasn't down by 30, I'm not sure he was any good with Houston in 2020. Had the Bills D not fallen apart and the refs not blow one of the worst calls I've ever seen, he doesn't even have a playoff victory yet. But sure.... he's "elite." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4merper4mer Posted June 22, 2022 Share Posted June 22, 2022 2 hours ago, mannc said: I don’t necessarily think that. I said it’s possible. We don’t know one way or the other. There is probably a rough formula that the attorneys are using to settle out these cases. For some reason, these four plaintiffs have rejected what’s been offered. They might think they have such a great case that they want to go to trial, or their case might be so weak that Watson’s team has offered them substantially less than they offered the others and they don’t want to accept a lower offer. Or these plaintiffs might have some other reason not to settle…maybe they think the offer will go up if they hold out. That’s possible too. It makes zeeeeeeeeeeeeeeero sense that Watson would be happy to settle 20 cases but let 4 linger due to weakness. If Walmart was trying to buy a city block to build a Superstore would they haggle with the last homeowner because they don’t like the flooring in his kitchen? Watson’s team would 100% want all 24 and never be the obstacle on a few cases while settling the others. If he got all 24 he’d have some plausible….if unlikely…deniability. Leaving 4….even if it goes to trial and he wins and the judge laughs all 4 out of court…..Watson has now admitted that the other 20 had a case at some level and he didn’t want to fight. Settling all 24 leaves no such admission, otherwise he would have fought them all. What is possible is that the 20 got let’s say 500k each and the remaining 4 are demanding 5M each. Nooooooooooooo way on Earth is Watson’s team saying well yeah the other 20 got 500 but our formula says you get 250. That’s as possible as the Easter Bunny being real and leading the Vancouver Canucks to a game seven World Series victory in a game played on Jupiter. 2 hours ago, Mango said: Ben only getting 6 games and not being booted from the league entirely still makes me feel dirty. What a terrible human. 💯 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Augie Posted June 22, 2022 Share Posted June 22, 2022 Let us not forget, even if he settles with the remaining 4, there is no guarantee that #25 and a next wave won’t appear tomorrow, next week or next month. I’m sure she’s out there somewhere. This guy was a serial predator. 3 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wjag Posted June 22, 2022 Share Posted June 22, 2022 When all is said and done from this sordid affair, only Buzbee will have won. And he will have won big. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WotAGuy Posted June 22, 2022 Share Posted June 22, 2022 38 minutes ago, 4merper4mer said: That’s as possible as the Easter Bunny being real and leading the Vancouver Canucks to a game seven World Series victory in a game played on Jupiter. 💯 So you’re saying there’s a chance? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Albany,n.y. Posted June 22, 2022 Share Posted June 22, 2022 1 hour ago, Big Blitz said: He's going to be suspended for the season. How the media and NFL promotes and treats him when all is said and done - he's going to be out of the league in 3 years. I do not see him playing well for the Browns anyway. And when he wasn't down by 30, I'm not sure he was any good with Houston in 2020. Had the Bills D not fallen apart and the refs not blow one of the worst calls I've ever seen, he doesn't even have a playoff victory yet. But sure.... he's "elite." Mike Vick came back from prison after being out 2 years. Watson is a lot better than Vick. I see no reason to believe Watson will be out of the league in 3 years. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Blitz Posted June 22, 2022 Share Posted June 22, 2022 14 minutes ago, Albany,n.y. said: Mike Vick came back from prison after being out 2 years. Watson is a lot better than Vick. I see no reason to believe Watson will be out of the league in 3 years. It's not 2007. If what Vick did happened in 2022, do you think he comes back - or with any significant success? I'm not so sure. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Albany,n.y. Posted June 22, 2022 Share Posted June 22, 2022 1 minute ago, Big Blitz said: It's not 2007. If what Vick did happened in 2022, do you think he comes back - or with any significant success? I'm not so sure. Absolutely Vick comes back just like 2009. Do you remember all the anti-Vick protests? When the Bills played the Eagles in 2011, Vick's 3rd season back, there were still protestors across the street near the Mobil station at the corner of Abbott & Southwestern. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Blitz Posted June 22, 2022 Share Posted June 22, 2022 25 minutes ago, Albany,n.y. said: Absolutely Vick comes back just like 2009. Do you remember all the anti-Vick protests? When the Bills played the Eagles in 2011, Vick's 3rd season back, there were still protestors across the street near the Mobil station at the corner of Abbott & Southwestern. The scrutiny that comes with playing professional sports in 2022 is significantly more challenging and difficult than it was in 2010. The things he's charged with mean more today then they did 11 years ago (guilty or not). Your toxic at this point. 11 years ago? You were definitely an issue - at best if exonerated. Today? You're toxic. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BarleyNY Posted June 22, 2022 Share Posted June 22, 2022 Regarding suspension, the reported taking point from the NFL is that they’ve looking for a year. At least! Unprecedented punishment! The NFLPA says 0 games or owners will be getting dragged. At least 3 of them. And court, if necessary. So that’s how the two sides are grandstanding. They’re probably good parameters: 0-17 games. That range shouldn’t be a surprise. My guess is that it’ll be about half a season along with a fine. Maybe less games if the fine is big. I think the fine will be important to the league so that they can throw around how unprecedented the penalty is. Plus they can point out that he hasn’t played in a year so they can say he was out a year and a half or something to that effect. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mannc Posted June 23, 2022 Share Posted June 23, 2022 17 hours ago, 4merper4mer said: It makes zeeeeeeeeeeeeeeero sense that Watson would be happy to settle 20 cases but let 4 linger due to weakness. If Walmart was trying to buy a city block to build a Superstore would they haggle with the last homeowner because they don’t like the flooring in his kitchen? Watson’s team would 100% want all 24 and never be the obstacle on a few cases while settling the others. If he got all 24 he’d have some plausible….if unlikely…deniability. Leaving 4….even if it goes to trial and he wins and the judge laughs all 4 out of court…..Watson has now admitted that the other 20 had a case at some level and he didn’t want to fight. Settling all 24 leaves no such admission, otherwise he would have fought them all. What is possible is that the 20 got let’s say 500k each and the remaining 4 are demanding 5M each. Nooooooooooooo way on Earth is Watson’s team saying well yeah the other 20 got 500 but our formula says you get 250. That’s as possible as the Easter Bunny being real and leading the Vancouver Canucks to a game seven World Series victory in a game played on Jupiter. 💯 It’s true that there would be a strong preference to resolve ALL the cases rather than let four linger, but we (including you) just have no idea why those four have not settled yet. There are dozens of possible reasons, and of course there is a good chance the last 4 will settle too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4merper4mer Posted June 23, 2022 Share Posted June 23, 2022 36 minutes ago, mannc said: It’s true that there would be a strong preference to resolve ALL the cases rather than let four linger, but we (including you) just have no idea why those four have not settled yet. There are dozens of possible reasons, and of course there is a good chance the last 4 will settle too. All of the above is true. I’d say “no idea” is a bit of a stretch because inferences can be drawn from things that have been said and similarities and differences with other proceedings in the past. I’d replace “no idea” with “don’t know”. What you said previously about Watson offering less money to these four being the likely reason they haven’t settled has a 0.0000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000010000000000000000004% chance of being the actual reason. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Albany,n.y. Posted June 23, 2022 Share Posted June 23, 2022 Maybe one or even all 4 don't care about the money and just want him exposed as the predator he appears to be. In that case they won't settle no matter what the offer is. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RoyBatty is alive Posted June 23, 2022 Share Posted June 23, 2022 25 minutes ago, Albany,n.y. said: Maybe one or even all 4 don't care about the money and just want him exposed as the predator he appears to be. In that case they won't settle no matter what the offer is. Ashley Solis has the best case (from what I can tell) was the first to file a lawsuit, has done TV interviews, is very compelling and sounds pissed. She isn't going away quietly sand good for her. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheWeatherMan Posted June 23, 2022 Share Posted June 23, 2022 26 minutes ago, Albany,n.y. said: Maybe one or even all 4 don't care about the money and just want him exposed as the predator he appears to be. In that case they won't settle no matter what the offer is. Fingers crossed that this is the case and he is exposed, found guilty, and jailed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
popcornpam Posted June 23, 2022 Share Posted June 23, 2022 Interesting! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YoloinOhio Posted June 23, 2022 Share Posted June 23, 2022 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buffalo_Stampede Posted June 23, 2022 Share Posted June 23, 2022 (edited) 15 minutes ago, YoloinOhio said: If they’re negotiating a suspension I can’t see a year. If it’s less than a year the NFL is afraid of what might come out about some of their owners. He’s going to get 8 games. Roethlisberger got 6 initially for settling his rape case, then it cut to 4. We live in different times with social media so strong though. I wonder if the NFL hits him with a year but then cuts it down after the NFLPA fights it. Makes the NFL look strong for the year but ultimately had to cut it down due to NFPA. So I bet the deal is 1 year but after appeal it’s cut to 8 or 12. Edited June 23, 2022 by Buffalo_Stampede Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Hindsight Posted June 23, 2022 Share Posted June 23, 2022 13 minutes ago, Buffalo_Stampede said: If they’re negotiating a suspension I can’t see a year. If it’s less than a year the NFL is afraid of what might come out about some of their owners. He’s going to get 8 games. Roethlisberger got 6 initially for settling his rape case, then it cut to 4. We live in different times with social media so strong though. I wonder if the NFL hits him with a year but then cuts it down after the NFLPA fights it. Makes the NFL look strong for the year but ultimately had to cut it down due to NFPA. So I bet the deal is 1 year but after appeal it’s cut to 8 or 12. I actually think the opposite. I bet the NFL is throwing the book at him and he is countering 4 games. I bet it’s at least a year Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul Costa Posted June 23, 2022 Share Posted June 23, 2022 9 hours ago, 4merper4mer said: All of the above is true. I’d say “no idea” is a bit of a stretch because inferences can be drawn from things that have been said and similarities and differences with other proceedings in the past. I’d replace “no idea” with “don’t know”. What you said previously about Watson offering less money to these four being the likely reason they haven’t settled has a 0.0000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000010000000000000000004% chance of being the actual reason. 💯 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Putin Posted June 23, 2022 Share Posted June 23, 2022 8 hours ago, Albany,n.y. said: Maybe one or even all 4 don't care about the money and just want him exposed as the predator he appears to be. In that case they won't settle no matter what the offer is. Hope that’s the case !!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoSaint Posted June 23, 2022 Share Posted June 23, 2022 (edited) 3 hours ago, Buffalo_Stampede said: If they’re negotiating a suspension I can’t see a year. If it’s less than a year the NFL is afraid of what might come out about some of their owners. He’s going to get 8 games. Roethlisberger got 6 initially for settling his rape case, then it cut to 4. We live in different times with social media so strong though. I wonder if the NFL hits him with a year but then cuts it down after the NFLPA fights it. Makes the NFL look strong for the year but ultimately had to cut it down due to NFPA. So I bet the deal is 1 year but after appeal it’s cut to 8 or 12. I think the biggest underlying issue on length is how do you count time served last year, right? the nfl wants to look strong but Watson has to be arguing he already sat quietly a full year getting cute with his contract only makes finding a middle ground harder. The nfl saying he’s out 8 games and $25m in salary satiates their need. Playing half the season with essentially full pay looks much weaker… so now the punishment needs to look strong in the number of games instead of dollars… but watsons camp can’t agree to a full year. Edited June 23, 2022 by NoSaint Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aristocrat Posted June 24, 2022 Share Posted June 24, 2022 10 minutes ago, NoSaint said: I think the biggest underlying issue on length is how do you count time served last year, right? the nfl wants to look strong but Watson has to be arguing he already sat quietly a full year getting cute with his contract only makes finding a middle ground harder. The nfl saying he’s out 8 games and $25m in salary satiates their need. Playing half the season with essentially full pay looks much weaker… so now the punishment needs to look strong in the number of games instead of dollars… but watsons camp can’t agree to a full year. the nfl has to be starting with two seasons. A guy gambling like 1000 bucks got a season. You can’t go light on this. Negotiate down to 24 or something. If not it’s a pr nightmare 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beast Posted June 24, 2022 Share Posted June 24, 2022 (edited) 28 minutes ago, NoSaint said: I think the biggest underlying issue on length is how do you count time served last year, right? the nfl wants to look strong but Watson has to be arguing he already sat quietly a full year getting cute with his contract only makes finding a middle ground harder. The nfl saying he’s out 8 games and $25m in salary satiates their need. Playing half the season with essentially full pay looks much weaker… so now the punishment needs to look strong in the number of games instead of dollars… but watsons camp can’t agree to a full year. Watson sat out on his own last season. That should have no influence on a suspension.....not to mention the Texans paid him the whole year. Edited June 24, 2022 by Beast 5 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Noggin Posted June 24, 2022 Share Posted June 24, 2022 13 hours ago, TheWeatherMan said: Fingers crossed that this is the case and he is exposed, found guilty, and jailed. The ship has sailed on the "jailed" part of this preferred consequence equation. All we can hope for now, if we care about consequences for heinous actions, is significant short term financial penalties, medium term professional punishments, and lasting personal stigma. It's not ideal, but when dealing with the ultra rich and famous, it's about as good as it's going to get. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Noggin Posted June 24, 2022 Share Posted June 24, 2022 4 hours ago, NoSaint said: I think the biggest underlying issue on length is how do you count time served last year, right? the nfl wants to look strong but Watson has to be arguing he already sat quietly a full year getting cute with his contract only makes finding a middle ground harder. The nfl saying he’s out 8 games and $25m in salary satiates their need. Playing half the season with essentially full pay looks much weaker… so now the punishment needs to look strong in the number of games instead of dollars… but watsons camp can’t agree to a full year. Admittedly I'm underinformed on the entirety of the Watson saga, but didn't the PLAYER refuse to play again for his team last year (like prior (just barely) to the emergence of these allegations and consequent lawsuits)? Didn't he essentially allow the NFL to NOT make any difficult decisions on his availability last season? I could be missing important info (often am). But under my recollection of events, there is ZERO case for any "time served" considerations. 4 hours ago, Beast said: Watson sat out on his own last season. That should have no influence on a suspension.....not to mention the Texans paid him the whole year. Only post I hadn't yet read when I replied. Also my understanding of how it played out last year, of course. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoPoy88 Posted June 24, 2022 Share Posted June 24, 2022 5 hours ago, aristocrat said: the nfl has to be starting with two seasons. A guy gambling like 1000 bucks got a season. You can’t go light on this. Negotiate down to 24 or something. If not it’s a pr nightmare Agreed. There’s been a lot of comparisons to the Big Ben case, for example, but that was years ago. The gambling suspension recently handed down is much more instructive - it should at least be 2 seasons (and then inevitably adjusted) given the comparative harm to both people (Ridley didn’t hurt anyone physically or emotionally games that he wasn’t a participant in) and reputation (the NFL has already full-throatedly endorsed gambling on sports, putting gambling parlors in their actual places of business. Same can’t be said for Watson’s (alleged) conduct.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheWeatherMan Posted June 24, 2022 Share Posted June 24, 2022 3 hours ago, Richard Noggin said: The ship has sailed on the "jailed" part of this preferred consequence equation. All we can hope for now, if we care about consequences for heinous actions, is significant short term financial penalties, medium term professional punishments, and lasting personal stigma. It's not ideal, but when dealing with the ultra rich and famous, it's about as good as it's going to get. He hasn’t been exonerated, the Houston DA’s office has decided not to take the cases to trial at this time. If more damaging evidence comes to light, I’m sure he will be charged. I think the statute of limitations. Is 7 years. Good article explaining this: https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2022/03/19/has-deshaun-watson-definitely-avoided-criminal-prosecution/amp/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GunnerBill Posted June 24, 2022 Share Posted June 24, 2022 1 hour ago, TheWeatherMan said: He hasn’t been exonerated, the Houston DA’s office has decided not to take the cases to trial at this time. If more damaging evidence comes to light, I’m sure he will be charged. I think the statute of limitations. Is 7 years. Good article explaining this: https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2022/03/19/has-deshaun-watson-definitely-avoided-criminal-prosecution/amp/ It is not the DA that has decided not to take to trial. Two Grand Juries refused to indict based on the evidence. It could go back to a grand jury, the article is right. But for the DA to push for another Grand Jury that would need to be a material difference in the evidence. Essentially it needs some physical evidence to be uncovered or third party witness testimony (i.e. someone other than one of the alleged victims witnessing the alleged abuse). And it is worth saying again he doesn't need to be "exonerated" that isn't the way the criminal law works. You are innocent in the eyes of the law until a criminal courts finds you guilty. You are not and never have been "found innocent." 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beerball Posted June 24, 2022 Share Posted June 24, 2022 14 hours ago, YoloinOhio said: Just get it over with. Announce the suspension, let the PA have their say, go to the panel and be done with it. https://www.cbsnews.com/htdocs/pdf/NFL_domestic_violence_policy.pdf Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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