Harrison Phillips to Vikings, 3 year 19.5 million

[ArtVandalay]

2 hours ago, Sharky7337 said:

Glad we let him train here for a payday at minimal benefit to us!

Comp pick formula...

[YoloinOhio]

I love Harry as a person and he did play well at the end of the season but this is the type of player that you do not pay. He’s been average and injured over his time with the Bills. Great, great person, good draft pick, but not a player that good teams give big money to. Players come and go, it’s a business. He will always be remembered for being Pancho Billa’s draft pick. And he really embraced  that he was. 

Edited March 15, 2022 by YoloinOhio

[Hapless Bills Fan]

2 minutes ago, YoloinOhio said:

I love Harry as a person and he did play well at the end of the season but this is the type of player that you do not pay. He’s been average and injured over his time with the Bills. Great, great person, good draft pick, but not a player that good teams give big money to. Players come and go, it’s a business. He will always be remembered for being Pancho Billa’s draft pick. And he really embraced  that he was. 

 

I'm kind of there.  Maybe I just can't get over Kim Jones basically calling Harry out in an interview for not being nasty enough as a football player.  At the time, he was probably still struggling with his ACL rehab but he got benched shortly thereafter.  But I've pretty much wondered if he really does bring the "nasty" between whistles.

 

The bottom line is he's only played one full season since he's been drafted here.  He was inactive 4  games in 2020 and 3 games in 2021.  Now it was pretty much stated by Beane that this was because he was rehabbing his knee injuries and needed more time to "get right" but, that's the bottom line.  45/65 games, and a lot of those games he was only taking 25-35% of the snaps.

 

He seems like a great person, and I wish him well with the Vikings and the Vikings well with him.  It's possible he will have a great career with them and start 51 games in the next 3 years, but it's also possible his run of injuries will continue.  It's also possible he's getting injured because he has to push himself to his physical limits to play at a high level and when he does that, he risks injury.

[Shaw66]

2 hours ago, BillsFan692 said:

Sucks but it's a business yall

I thought Bean was a draft and retain kinda guy but I just don't think they liked phillips that much.

Draft and retain doesn't mean just draft them and keep them.   It means be good at drafting so that the players you draft are good enough to force you to retain them.   Allen, of course is the obvious example.  You want to draft guys who turn out to be so good that you say, "heck, yeah, we're keeping that guy!"

 

Obviously, Phillips wasn't the kind of player who made McBeane say "heck, yeah!"  And that's why we saw the two signings today.   McB already had decided they could get more in the market than Phillips was likely to give them, and Phillips knew it. 

 

And from Phillips' point of view, it makes perfectly good sense.  He thinks McBeane are wrong about him, and he thinks he'll prove that, but he also knows he needs a payday.   If he gets a nice offer in a place that makes sense for him, he's going to take it.  This is the contract that can make him able to take care of his family for life.  Pretty important to grab it when it's there.  

[Coach Tuesday]

18 minutes ago, YoloinOhio said:

I love Harry as a person and he did play well at the end of the season but this is the type of player that you do not pay. He’s been average and injured over his time with the Bills. Great, great person, good draft pick, but not a player that good teams give big money to. Players come and go, it’s a business. He will always be remembered for being Pancho Billa’s draft pick. And he really embraced  that he was. 

TBH in retrospect he maybe was not a good draft pick.  Using a third-rounder on a low-ceiling 1T leads to problems because those guys are easy to find and therefore difficult to justify paying.

[Shaw66]

1 minute ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

I'm kind of there.  Maybe I just can't get over Kim Jones basically calling Harry out in an interview for not being nasty enough as a football player.  At the time, he was probably still struggling with his ACL rehab but he got benched shortly thereafter.  But I've pretty much wondered if he really does bring the "nasty" between whistles.

 

The bottom line is he's only played one full season since he's been drafted here.  He was inactive 4  games in 2020 and 3 games in 2021.  Now it was pretty much stated by Beane that this was because he was rehabbing his knee injuries and needed more time to "get right" but, that's the bottom line.  45/65 games, and a lot of those games he was only taking 25-35% of the snaps.

 

He seems like a great person, and I wish him well with the Vikings and the Vikings well with him.  It's possible he will have a great career with them and start 51 games in the next 3 years, but it's also possible his run of injuries will continue.  It's also possible he's getting injured because he has to push himself to his physical limits to play at a high level and when he does that, he risks injury.

I agree with you and Yolo - both good takes.   He's a super guy, and an over-achiever.  McDermott loves those guys, because he sees himself in them.  But McDermott knows that his job requires him to be hard-nosed in the evaluation of his players.   And I would bet that there's enormous mutual respect between McDermott and Phillips for those reasons, so this is probably truly a no-hard-feelings-we're-happy-for-him situation.

1 minute ago, Coach Tuesday said:

TBH in retrospect he maybe was not a good draft pick.  Using a third-rounder on a low-ceiling 1T leads to problems because those guys are easy to find and therefore difficult to justify paying.

Well, you're right, certainly, that he wasn't a good pick because he didn't turn out to be as good as the Bills needed him to be.  But I get your point, that this was a talent-evaluation failure, to invest a third in a guy whose physical profile and talent level was limited enough that all you really were going on was his personal determination.   At some point, it doesn't matter how much want-it a guy has, the guy just can't get there.  I think you're right, that they should have seen that he was a low-probability pick.  

[transplantbillsfan]

Walter Payton nominee for Buffalo. Great person. That's just way too much for the player. Hope he earns it.

 

Good luck!

[YoloinOhio]

I wonder if the Bills offered him a contract 

[Hapless Bills Fan]

38 minutes ago, YoloinOhio said:

I wonder if the Bills offered him a contract 

 

I'm pretty sure Beane and Harry's agent talked and Beane outlined what the Bills thought was fair, while the agent told Beane that they could get more.

Whether they actually made him a formal contract offer, who knows?  If you say we can give you 3 years, $12M plus incentives and the response is "I'm worth $20M" not too much point, is there? 

 

Will be interested to see the details of Harry's contract, though. 

[John from Riverside]

1 hour ago, YoloinOhio said:

I love Harry as a person and he did play well at the end of the season but this is the type of player that you do not pay. He’s been average and injured over his time with the Bills. Great, great person, good draft pick, but not a player that good teams give big money to. Players come and go, it’s a business. He will always be remembered for being Pancho Billa’s draft pick. And he really embraced  that he was. 

I honestly saw this the same way I was hoping that the bills would not pay him huge money there was times when he sat the bench for an undrafted players Zimmer who is playing better than him and then he had that bad injury

[GreggTX]

Good luck Harry. Stay healthy and have a great career.

[Logic]

I liked Harry as a person and a player. According to Jeremy Fowler, the Bills wanted him back, but weren't willing to pay what he ultimately wound up getting from the Vikings.

 

While I wanted him back too, I'm not upset. I think Settle and Jones will more than make up for what we lost in Harry. I'm also leery of paying that much to a guy who only really played high level football for one half of one season while he was here.

 

I sincerely wish him all the best going forward, but I think the Bills upgraded the DT position and ultimately saved money doing it.

Edited March 15, 2022 by Logic

[JoPoy88]

He was never good. 

[ExWNYer]

5 minutes ago, JoPoy88 said:

He was never good. 

 

Some might even say he was...horrible.

[par73]

3 hours ago, The Wiz said:

Do we still not want Star?

 

just curious.

Star is a liability on the field. Wish there was a way to get rid of him. Vikings overpaid for Harry, so best of luck to him.

Edited March 15, 2022 by par73
add

[Milanos Milano]

4 hours ago, Mrbojanglezs said:

Draft and keep them they say. 

 

He wasn’t good enough to keep around. Glad we didn’t pay anywhere near that amount. 

[GunnerBill]

That is more than I'd have paid him. Good luck Harry. 

[Patrick Duffy]

12 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

That is more than I'd have paid him. Good luck Harry. 

Yeah really....he showed improvement and made some good plays as season went on, but not enough to pay that much

[Utah John]

Sorry to see him go, but the Bills couldn't match that offer.  

 

What kind of compensatory pick does this mean?

[eball]

9 hours ago, BADOLBILZ said:

if Phillips had been better and stayed healthier(remember he played injured all last season too)........then he would have gotten paid by the Bills.

 

This.  I jumped the gun late last season, proclaiming Phillips may have turned into “the guy” the Bills had hoped, but in reality I think that was a little bit of wishful thinking after a few solid games.  I am pleased with the two DL acquisitions yesterday and agree with those who say the Bills’ interior DL looks better this morning, on paper, than it did at the end of the season.

 

Phillips is indeed a great dude and I’m happy for him to get this payday.  Too bad for him he has to go in his new locker room and see Captain Kirk rather than Josh Allen.

 

[HOUSE]

I almost donated money to his charities once but the check got lost in the mail.

[ExWNYer]

4 hours ago, Utah John said:

Sorry to see him go, but the Bills couldn't match that offer.  

 

What kind of compensatory pick does this mean?

 

A compensatory pick is not automatically awarded to the team just because a UFA signed elsewhere. Comp picks are calculated based on a net loss formula. Players cut by a team who sign elsewhere do not count towards this formula:

 

"Clubs that lose to other Clubs a greater number of CFAs than they sign or acquire from other Clubs shall be eligible to receive a Compensatory Draft Selection in the College Draft to be held in the following League Year subject to the provisions set forth below."

 

https://overthecap.com/the-basics-and-methodology-of-projecting-the-nfls-compensatory-draft-picks/

[filthymcnasty08]

Good man, good player.  Best to him going fwd.

 

Minnesota looks like a team that's not sure if they're patching holes or staving off the full rebuild.

[Coach Tuesday]

Wow I just read that they’re moving to a 3-4… so are they expecting Harry to play a traditional nose tackle role anchoring the 3-4?  That is asking a lot IMO…

[MrEpsYtown]

4 minutes ago, Coach Tuesday said:

Wow I just read that they’re moving to a 3-4… so are they expecting Harry to play a traditional nose tackle role anchoring the 3-4?  That is asking a lot IMO…

 

Yeah he seems a little light for that. I guess he could play a 3-4 end, but those guys usually have more length. It is a weird fit, but nice for a new coach establishing culture. 

 

For me, he will not be missed, especially at that price. 

[FLFan]

12 minutes ago, Coach Tuesday said:

Wow I just read that they’re moving to a 3-4… so are they expecting Harry to play a traditional nose tackle role anchoring the 3-4?  That is asking a lot IMO…

I agree. I don’t see that with Harry.  Wish him well though. 

[buffaloboyinATL]

I remember reading an article during the season that said he was playing with a partially torn ligament in his knee and would not get it repaired until after the season.  I assume that he has gotten this surgery by now, even though I never heard anything else about it.  After reading the article, which was about halfway through the season, I worried every game that he would suffer a bigger injury.

 

https://buffalonews.com/sports/bills/bills-harrison-phillips-says-hell-work-through-playing-with-torn-knee-ligament/article_f6128bfe-4f0c-11ec-9d57-f76e6718387a.html

 

Edited March 15, 2022 by buffaloboyinATL

[DCofNC]

Stupid money for that production, good for him.

[nucci]

you guys calling him Harry...are you sure he doesn't go by Harold?

[dollars 2 donuts]

@Sherlock Holmes

 

I'm with you, Sherlock, I am.  

 

I also remember the lonely times when only a few of us were on the beach of "Keep Milano Island" until last season when you couldn't even find a place to sit in the sun anymore and the bar line went on forever. 

 

Yes, he is a great guy, but even forget about that because his metrics for what he meant to the defense were starting to get ridiculous and it showed.  His "high tide" was raising all ships upfront and in the middle of the Bills D and even outside of Buffalo it was getting noticed.

 

However, I do hope next season this leads them to resigning Oliver, but I really could have lived with those two being together for awhile here.

[JoPoy88]

Good for OP I guess. He was never very good anyways.

[jimmy10]

Sorry to see him go, but I get it. He was incredibly kind to my young boys on the autograph line at training camp several years ago. Rock solid dude, maybe the new environment will do him good. 

[Orlando Tim]

1 hour ago, Coach Tuesday said:

Wow I just read that they’re moving to a 3-4… so are they expecting Harry to play a traditional nose tackle role anchoring the 3-4?  That is asking a lot IMO…

If this is true they are dumb- though Jeff Wright made it work with Bruce Smith all those years 

[Maynard]

I’m sorry to see him go as well. Great dude but not worth that kind of dough….

[Warcodered]

 

[Not at the table Karlos]

5 hours ago, jimmy10 said:

Sorry to see him go, but I get it. He was incredibly kind to my young boys on the autograph line at training camp several years ago. Rock solid dude, maybe the new environment will do him good. 

He's an amazing person. Had the pleasure of meeting him a few times. The world needs more people like him. 

Edited March 15, 2022 by Not at the table Karlos

[YoloinOhio]

 

[Hapless Bills Fan]

 

What I notice from that picture:

1) wtf is it with OLmen and DLmen having teensy little dogs?

2) a typical labrador female is a solid, 60 lb dog.  Josh Allen is holding a squirming 60 lb dog that is trying to play with its neighbor, like she's a 5 lb bag of flour

3) Jerry Hughes wins "best trained pupper"

[Hapless Bills Fan]

On 3/15/2022 at 12:41 AM, Utah John said:

Sorry to see him go, but the Bills couldn't match that offer. 

 

Let's be real here.  Yeah, $19.5M sounds like a lot of money, but that's $6.5M/year (and with terms not know, could effectively be less)

 

The Bills are reported to have signed Phillips replacement, Daquon Jones, for 2 years, $14M with $10.6 guaranteed.  That's $7M a year.

 

The Bills could absolutely have matched that offer, cap-wise. 

 

They chose not to.  As Phillips said, "there were multiple teams that placed a higher value on who I am as a football player than Buffalo and that going back was not logical".

 

In the last 3 years, Phillips has played in 29 out of 49 games, or 59%.  In 7 of them he was a so-called "healthy scratch", and whether it was for performance reasons or (as Beane later implied) because he needed more time to recover from his knee injuries, is unclear.

 

In the last 3 years, Daquon Jones has played in 49 out of 49 games.

 

I don't think it's so personal as "who (Harry) is as a football player".  I think it's that "best ability is availability" thing.  He had an ACL tear in college Sophomore year.  He had an ACL tear his 2nd year in the league.  And this season he had a PCL injury. 

 

Maybe these are freak injuries and now that they're rehabbed, they won't recur and he'll have a long healthy career in the league.  Or maybe there's a systematic injury risk. based on either Phillips particular body geometry or some aspect of how he plays.

 

I wish him the best!

 

 

[ganesh]

3 hours ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

Let's be real here.  Yeah, $19.5M sounds like a lot of money, but that's $6.5M/year (and with terms not know, could effectively be less)

 

The Bills are reported to have signed Phillips replacement, Daquon Jones, for 2 years, $14M with $10.6 guaranteed.  That's $7M a year.

 

The Bills could absolutely have matched that offer, cap-wise. 

 

They chose not to.  As Phillips said, "there were multiple teams that placed a higher value on who I am as a football player than Buffalo and that going back was not logical".

 

In the last 3 years, Phillips has played in 29 out of 49 games, or 59%.  In 7 of them he was a so-called "healthy scratch", and whether it was for performance reasons or (as Beane later implied) because he needed more time to recover from his knee injuries, is unclear.

 

In the last 3 years, Daquon Jones has played in 49 out of 49 games.

 

I don't think it's so personal as "who (Harry) is as a football player".  I think it's that "best ability is availability" thing.  He had an ACL tear in college Sophomore year.  He had an ACL tear his 2nd year in the league.  And this season he had a PCL injury. 

 

Maybe these are freak injuries and now that they're rehabbed, they won't recur and he'll have a long healthy career in the league.  Or maybe there's a systematic injury risk. based on either Phillips particular body geometry or some aspect of how he plays.

 

I wish him the best!

 

 

most sane post !!!