Offseason Trade Prediction: We acquire Saquan

[Alphadawg7]

86 for and 84 against now in the poll as of now.  

34 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

Yes, Henry and Taylor are terrific players.  Both have, in fact, had games where they were held in check.

 

I suppose there is a running back somewhere who has succeeded behind an OL that can't block for him, but I'm struggling to think of him right now.

 

The Titans and Colts OLs say "Hi"

 

Having an RB who can make plays when you need them, generally depends upon having an OL who can spring that guy to the 2nd level when you need them to

Honestly Barry Sanders is the only RB I can think of that excelled to greatness behind a weak OL.  It’s pretty important to the success of a RB.

 

Priest Holmes for example was pedestrian in Baltimore and then was other worldly the moment he landed in KC.

 

That being said, if our OL performs next year the way he has the last 7 games (or even better) then Barkley could be a monster here IMHO.  It reminds me a LOT of the Priest Holmes move out Baltimore in fact.

 

Barkley has seen stacked boxes his whole career, he won’t get that here.  And if he does, Allen will eat them alive.

Edited January 30, 2022 by Alphadawg7

[BADOLBILZ]

41 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

Yes, Henry and Taylor are terrific players.  Both have, in fact, had games where they were held in check.

 

I suppose there is a running back somewhere who has succeeded behind an OL that can't block for him, but I'm struggling to think of him right now.

 

The Titans and Colts OLs say "Hi"

 

Having an RB who can make plays when you need them, generally depends upon having an OL who can spring that guy to the 2nd level when you need them to

 

 

Derrick Henry has actually been bad.......shut down......... in EACH of his last 3 playoff games.........all losses, or course.

 

They ran the ball just fine with a bunch of relative nobodies with him out..........and Foreman greatly outplayed him in their playoff game.........the Titans could save $9M on the cap if they cut Henry this offseason.    

 

Wouldn't rule it out.

Edited January 30, 2022 by BADOLBILZ

[JakeFrommStateFarm]

Not going to happen.

 

Daboll is going to keep Barkley. 

 

There's a new Sherriff in town

[ArtVandalay]

9 hours ago, Alphadawg7 said:

Why I think it makes more sense than ever, and why I would actually like to see this happen.  And I am a fan of Devin, not a knock on him at all, but Barkley just brings more to the table.

If you amputated one of Saquons legs he would still be bigger stronger faster than Dingleberry.

[JoshAllin]

Derrick Henry choked the last 2 playoffs, and a huge one on 4th and 1 their last game that would've sealed a W for them. I'm  on the boat of stop wasting or caring about overpaid RB's

[Nitro]

Bills do not need to trade away picks.  Barkley and his contract are not coming to Buffalo.  

Edited January 30, 2022 by Nitro

[JROC INTEL]

Barkley would be awesome. I think there is a difference between injury prone and unlucky. I would call his injuries very unlucky. But man was he amazing when healthy, I bet they would ask for a second rounder at the least. 

[Hebert19]

If I was trading for anyone it would be Kamara since that might be a tear down.  

 

But fourette on the cheap is a better idea. 

[MJS]

I'd rather trade for Kamara. Their team is in cap purgatory. Their head coach just resigned. They will be rebuilding and dumping some of their high cap players. Kamara is the best receiving back in the NFL. Barkley can't stay healthy, it seems.

[Alphadawg7]

4 minutes ago, MJS said:

I'd rather trade for Kamara. Their team is in cap purgatory. Their head coach just resigned. They will be rebuilding and dumping some of their high cap players. Kamara is the best receiving back in the NFL. Barkley can't stay healthy, it seems.

Way more expensive though

[MJS]

Just now, Alphadawg7 said:

Way more expensive though

Yeah, I haven't looked at their contracts, so I can't speak to that.

[LABILLBACKER]

All I know is we better start making some better FA splashes than we have recently. Take a page from the Rams and take advantage of Josh in his prime for the next 10 years. I don't care if it's Barkley,  Kamara or Fournette. 

[Alphadawg7]

2 hours ago, Hebert19 said:

If I was trading for anyone it would be Kamara since that might be a tear down.  

 

But fourette on the cheap is a better idea. 

Can’t afford Kamara, and why do you think Fournette is going to be cheap?  He was a beast this year 

[BullBuchanan]

The Giants aren't going to trade Barkley and they would be insane to do so for the awful compensation suggested. If they do take any of that, maybe we should get Jamarr Chase for a 5th and Pat Mahomes for Cole Beasley and a bag of footballs,

[2020 Our Year For Sure]

7 hours ago, ScottLaw said:

I I’d bet money he’s gone. 

I'll take that bet. How much? 

[longtimebillsfan]

On 1/29/2022 at 10:06 AM, Alphadawg7 said:

Why I think it makes more sense than ever, and why I would actually like to see this happen.  And I am a fan of Devin, not a knock on him at all, but Barkley just brings more to the table.  

 

Schoen just studied under Beane's masterclass on how to rebuild an organization.  Clear the cap first, asses what you have, and start rebuilding.  Giants have a terrible cap situation, first things first will be to start fixing that.  Barkley doesn't make them better, that OL is atrocious and the QB position isn't settled.  He IMHO is almost a lock to be traded somewhere, I really don't think he will be on the roster week 1 in NY.  Plus, Daboll just came from an offense where he didn't lean on the run game.

 

Bills are in a unique position to be able to offer the Giants something in return that can help them try and remain competitive (they want to instill a new culture from the get go) and pieces they are familiar with.  We could send them back a RB that could come in and immediately compete to start for them in Moss or even Devin that are cheap on the cap too.  And then we redo his contract like when we acquired Diggs.

 

Additionally, if we needed to, we could include Cole in a package as well which would be a great piece for the Giants to get because he comes off the books after this next season and he would be an immediate on field help to whoever is QB this year as a move the chains specialist.  

 

There are going to be a bunch of disagree emoticons and quick replies hating this idea because people think Saquan is done, especially with the injury history.  But I would not write him off so fast.  There have been a long list of guys where a change of scenery to a better situation allowed a player to flourish.  And the talent was there with him, but he has been saddled with an atrocious OL the whole time and even worse QB play.  

 

Plus, we have the most state of the art training facilities and team in the NFL, if there was ever a place for a guy to go and try and put the injuries behind them its here.  And its already proved to be effective as we have had some guys who cant shake the injury bug elsewhere come here and stay healthy at multiple positions.  

 

Additionally, we will still have either Devin or Moss at RB and Allen at QB...meaning we wont need to run Barkley into the ground like they kept trying to do with him in NY and EMC in Carolina.  This will help keep Barkley healthy as well, and a healthy Saquan in this offense could be explosive.  

 

Trade ideas:  Put these and more in the poll too

 

Package A - Moss and a 4th.

Package B - Cole, Moss, and a 6th.

Package C - Devin and a 5th.

Package D - Just draft picks...but I think both teams will be interested in one of our RB's being included.  

 

 

 

I would love to have Barkley in our backfield, but do we realistically have the cap space to take on such a large contract for a running back?

Edited January 30, 2022 by longtimebillsfan

[GunnerBill]

10 hours ago, ScottLaw said:

I I’d bet money he’s gone. 

 

Yep. Beane only said he expects him back after being really pressed and after originally saying "Cole can still play in this league" which tells you all you need to know. 

 

He's gone.

[Pbomb]

17 hours ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

Oh really?   What would that contract look like to you?

 

If Barkley were cut today.........he would clear waivers and become a free agent because of that $7M+ guaranteed contract.

 

He has ZERO trade value.

 

The only way he gets traded is if the Giants eat all but the league minimum portion of his contract.

 

Any new deal he gets from another team will START with $7M in guarantees.

 

The Bills are a bit tight for cap space...........they would likely have to spread a deal with him over 3 years or more to get him in for a $2M type cap hit..........which begs the question "why would Barkley accept two cheap years added to his contract?".

 

He would not.

 

His goal is to collect his $7M...........have a big year.........and hit free agency.

 

Trading him doesn't make sense for either the Giants or Barkley at this point..........they might as well roll with him.

Doubt he would clear waivers, some team would take on a 7m cap hit for one year and hope he could stay healthy

[Coach Tuesday]

4 hours ago, GunnerBill said:

 

Yep. Beane only said he expects him back after being really pressed and after originally saying "Cole can still play in this league" which tells you all you need to know. 

 

He's gone.

My takeaway from that PC was they’ll look for 1-2 more good TE options instead of Beas - can at least run or threaten to run out of their formations whereas with Beas in you’re basically announcing to the defense that it’s a pass.

[Alphadawg7]

7 hours ago, BullBuchanan said:

The Giants aren't going to trade Barkley and they would be insane to do so for the awful compensation suggested. If they do take any of that, maybe we should get Jamarr Chase for a 5th and Pat Mahomes for Cole Beasley and a bag of footballs,

What a ridiculous response.  Barkley has a low market value with the injury issues and lower production last couple years.  To compare trading for him to Chase or Mahomes just shows how out of touch with reality you are.

Barkley is gone after this year regardless when he would be a FA as they begin a long rebuilding process.  it’s not only in their best interest to trade him, it’s actually more likely he gets traded than this year than not.

Edited January 30, 2022 by Alphadawg7

[filthymcnasty08]

I would compare Barkley's first years against Fournette's

 

Fournette coming out of Jax - underachieved in people's eyes, injuries, questions about effort, etc.  At the same time, flashed enough for many to think he still had it but needed a change of scenery out of a losing situation where the system was always in flux.  Very similar to Saquan.

 

New environment, winning culture, 2nd chance....

 

I think the team that gets Saquan will get some very good years from him.

[TheyCallMeAndy]

Barkley would be on a 1 year, 7.2 million dollar contract if Buffalo traded for him. He’s only 25 and NYG is sitting at -10 in cap space.

 

McCaffrey and the Panthers have an opt out clause in his contract for this year, but his 2022 cap is nearly double SB and he still has some hefty dead cap. CM is really only an option if Panthers opt out of his contract, but they have 18 million currently and could easily keep him. 

 

[T master]

I think you keep Cole he is still a good player and i'm not sure of his cap hit but i believe especially with a new OC coming in you want guys that Josh has a good chemistry with during the transition into a new scheme .

 

I would rather see them package Moss & Cody Ford neither of them have proven IMO that they are anything but a depth player and with both of them knowing Dabol that may help NY sooner rather than later.

 

I don't see Beane keeping Ford around after his rookie deal runs out so get something for him while you can & i have never really been a fan of the Moss pick and moving forward we still have 2 players that yo know will contribute in this offense with who ever they bring in as the new OC ... 

[TheyCallMeAndy]

5 minutes ago, T master said:

I think you keep Cole he is still a good player and i'm not sure of his cap hit but i believe especially with a new OC coming in you want guys that Josh has a good chemistry with during the transition into a new scheme .

 

I would rather see them package Moss & Cody Ford neither of them have proven IMO that they are anything but a depth player and with both of them knowing Dabol that may help NY sooner rather than later.

 

I don't see Beane keeping Ford around after his rookie deal runs out so get something for him while you can & i have never really been a fan of the Moss pick and moving forward we still have 2 players that yo know will contribute in this offense with who ever they bring in as the new OC ... 

I too think they try to retain Cole, but I wouldn’t be shocked if it’s a restructure or release situation and he chooses the second option. 

[ThurmanThomasEnglishMuffin]

6 minutes ago, filthymcnasty08 said:

I would compare Barkley's first years against Fournette's

 

Fournette coming out of Jax - underachieved in people's eyes, injuries, questions about effort, etc.  At the same time, flashed enough for many to think he still had it but needed a change of scenery out of a losing situation where the system was always in flux.  Very similar to Saquan.

 

New environment, winning culture, 2nd chance....

 

I think the team that gets Saquan will get some very good years from him.

 

Good to look at Fournette and Barkley.

 

If a team was looking for a RB of this type, why not just go get Fournette? He is a FA, so no picks lost for compensation.

Fournette had a $3.5M cap hit last year. His $ should be similar this year. Barkley has a $7.2M hit in a trade.

 

Fournette was much more productive in every category in 2021 than Barkley.

 

Why not just go get Fournette? 1/2 the compensation, more productive and no picks lost.

 

I think Fournette would be a solid mid level FA addition for the Bills, and make much more sense than trading for Barkley.

[TheyCallMeAndy]

6 minutes ago, ThurmanThomasEnglishMuffin said:

 

Good to look at Fournette and Barkley.

 

If a team was looking for a RB of this type, why not just go get Fournette? He is a FA, so no picks lost for compensation.

Fournette had a $3.5M cap hit last year. His $ should be similar this year. Barkley has a $7.2M hit in a trade.

 

Fournette was much more productive in every category in 2021 than Barkley.

 

Why not just go get Fournette? 1/2 the compensation, more productive and no picks lost.

 

I think Fournette would be a solid mid level FA addition for the Bills, and make much more sense than trading for Barkley.

Honestly IMO Fournette will go back to the guy he was in Jacksonville now that Tampa is on the verge of blowing up worse the the Death Star

[newcam2012]

21 hours ago, LyndonvilleBill said:

This. I thought I was an outlier. 1 full season... I'd rather grab a rookie in the 3rd or 4th instead.

Not me. Barkley is a special talent. For me, the only question as mentioned is can he stay healthy? I'd be doing cartwheels in the snow if we could get hon for Moss and a 4th. He's worth the risk. A 4th round pick isn't much and Moss can easily be replaced. I do like Devin though. Not sure I would give him up ib the package. 

Alpha, I think your premise is incorrect that the Giants will unload Barkley. His trade value isn't much and his upside is too high for what they get in return. Restructure is more likely. 

[Sammy Watkins' Rib]

That's  a hard no from me on trading for Saquan. He is a JAG at this point. Moss doesn't appear to be good enough so I think we should look into probably cutting Moss and signing or drafting another back. I don't think Moss has much trade value. But whoever we bring in needs to be super cheap. 

[Ridgewaycynic2013]

OK, we consider Sasquan for RB.

 

How about a sasquatch for defense?  Maybe a samsquanch?  Edwards for a sasquatch, straight up?

[Alphadawg7]

14 minutes ago, ThurmanThomasEnglishMuffin said:

 

Good to look at Fournette and Barkley.

 

If a team was looking for a RB of this type, why not just go get Fournette? He is a FA, so no picks lost for compensation.

Fournette had a $3.5M cap hit last year. His $ should be similar this year. Barkley has a $7.2M hit in a trade.

 

Fournette was much more productive in every category in 2021 than Barkley.

 

Why not just go get Fournette? 1/2 the compensation, more productive and no picks lost.

 

I think Fournette would be a solid mid level FA addition for the Bills, and make much more sense than trading for Barkley.

I am not opposed to getting Fournette too, but I think Fournette is going to get more money than people think.  
 

And we can clear a little cap space if we were able to include a player or two in the trade to get Barkley.

 

But I think Fournette would also be a great get here.

[ThurmanThomasEnglishMuffin]

18 minutes ago, TheyCallMeAndy said:

Honestly IMO Fournette will go back to the guy he was in Jacksonville now that Tampa is on the verge of blowing up worse the the Death Star

 

Funny you bring that up. Fournette is a FA, so it's his choice to go back to TB or not. I suppose a lot will depend on who TB gets to play QB. TB also has a lot of valuable FAs this yer, so I can see him choosing where to play, and not be affected by what happens in TB.

 

In his 3 years in Jax, he put up 2 x 1000 rushing seasons. Averaged 4.0 YPC, often against 8 man fronts because Blake Bortles.

2632 yards rushing/ 17 Rush TDs in 36 Games (73 yards per game) 4.0 YPC.

134 Rec/ 1009 yards receiving/ 2 Rec Tds (28 Rec YDS/Game)

 

Hardly a bust, but not the production JAX wanted for his draft status

 

Fournette proved he can be a solid dual back with better QB play and not facing stacked fronts. His Rec numbers with Minshew and Brady are quite good for a big back. He has a career 78.4% catch percentage. Buffalo would be ideal for his running style and because he has a QB that should keep stacked boxes to a minimum.

 

I understand your POV but disagree with it. I only saw two Giants games this year, but Barkley looked slow and washed.

 

No need to send draft capital and spend to the cap with Barkley when a back with more production and the size this team is missing is a cheaper available FA.

[Bookie Man]

21 hours ago, Alphadawg7 said:

 

Because Josh cant keep this pace up and expect his body to hold up.  The guy leaves 110% of himself and his soul on that field every Sunday.  His body takes a pounding running the ball.  

 

Great he is 25...but at some point that beating is going to catch up with him, it always does.  We need to take some of that weight off him literally.

Good stuff here 😆.

[LyndonvilleBill]

32 minutes ago, newcam2012 said:

Not me. Barkley is a special talent. For me, the only question as mentioned is can he stay healthy? I'd be doing cartwheels in the snow if we could get hon for Moss and a 4th. He's worth the risk. A 4th round pick isn't much and Moss can easily be replaced. I do like Devin though. Not sure I would give him up ib the package. 

Alpha, I think your premise is incorrect that the Giants will unload Barkley. His trade value isn't much and his upside is too high for what they get in return. Restructure is more likely. 

He can only be special if he's on the field. He hasn't played a full season since his rookie year. What's the saying, best ability is availability? He hasn't been able to do it. Just my opinion. 

[newcam2012]

11 minutes ago, LyndonvilleBill said:

He can only be special if he's on the field. He hasn't played a full season since his rookie year. What's the saying, best ability is availability? He hasn't been able to do it. Just my opinion. 

No doubt about that. He comes with a big risk and that's exactly why his trade value is capped. Risk vs reward...

[BarleyNY]

So Schoen steps foot into the Giants building, shines up his new General Manager name plate and then ships off Saquon Barkley for Moss a bag of kicking tees?  Or something equally as worthless?  SMDH.  That’s just not happening.

[Ethan in Cleveland]

I said no for three reasons. I'm fine with Singletary.  The Moss and a fourth or any of the scenarios seems like something the Giants would not feel is adequate compensation.  Im not giving up draft picks for an injured RB. And ladt, I'm not spending limited cap on a RB. I would have last year with Harris in round 1. Not now.  They need several replacements on both lines and a CB#2.

[SoTier]

I would prefer to improve the  OL, especially the interior, through FA or the draft first, and then add a bigger RB who's a decent blocker through FA.  A lot of rookie RBs have to learn the blocking part of the game.  I don't like the idea of investing a lot of resources in a RB who hasn't been able to stay of the field consistently.

[gobills1212]

14 hours ago, whorlnut said:

This literally makes no sense, but thanks for playing…

How does that not make sense?! It makes perfect sense! You cant, to a man, discern the difference in giving up assets for a WRx and a RB (implying that they are the same thing) so that is a direct comparison as to how silly you saying that is. Please try and keep up.

[ThurmanThomasEnglishMuffin]

48 minutes ago, Ethan in Portland said:

I said no for three reasons. I'm fine with Singletary.  The Moss and a fourth or any of the scenarios seems like something the Giants would not feel is adequate compensation.  Im not giving up draft picks for an injured RB. And ladt, I'm not spending limited cap on a RB. I would have last year with Harris in round 1. Not now.  They need several replacements on both lines and a CB#2.

 

Agree with you on all points above. How would you feel about Fournette who is a FA?

 

Would rather sign Fournette as a FA. 6'0" 240 takes a lot of beating off of Allen. Fournette is only 27. a 2-3 yr contract leaves wiggle room.

Retain Ryan Bates as a OG on a starting OG salary

Let Wallace walk for big money, he earned it

Trade 1st and x pick for a starting calibre NFL CB (The Diggs method)

Draft IOL or 1TDT in the 2nd

BPA after with an eye on WR, DT/IOL, LB, TE ST

[whorlnut]

12 minutes ago, gobills1212 said:

How does that not make sense?! It makes perfect sense! You cant, to a man, discern the difference in giving up assets for a WRx and a RB (implying that they are the same thing) so that is a direct comparison as to how silly you saying that is. Please try and keep up.

Hahah…the classic “please try to keep up” line…funny stuff.