Josh Allen will be the best QB in the league with a running game

[JerseyBills]

Mahomes played how Josh has to play every week.

0 TD 2 INT 9 points 49 pass attempts 270 yards

His RB got 69 yards on 11 carries

Defense could play pass , focus on Patty every play basically. Josh literally deals with this every game. 

Brady got 26 carries and 150 yds from his RBs. 

If Josh gets even a decent run game,  him and this already elite O will become unstoppable. 

He'll outplay Mahomes. He'll win Lombardis. 

The run game should be priority #1 going into next season,  I truly think Josh would be unstoppable.  

Edited February 8, 2021 by JerseyBills

[Bob in STL]

16 minutes ago, JerseyBills said:

Mahomes played how Josh has to play every week.

0 TD 2 INT 9 points 49 pass attempts 270 yards

His RB got 69 yards on 11 carries

Defense could play pass , focus on Patty every play basically. Josh literally deals with this every game. 

Brady got 26 carries and 150 yds from his RBs. 

If Josh gets even a decent run game,  him and this already elite O will become unstoppable. 

He'll outplay Mahomes. He'll win Lombardis. 

The run game should be priority #1 going into next season,  I truly think Josh would be unstoppable.  

If the Bills OL was even close to elite they would already have a running game.  More speed at RB will help but maybe the blocking could be better?  

[JerseyBills]

9 minutes ago, Bob in STL said:

If the Bills OL was even close to elite they would already have a running game.  More speed at RB will help but maybe the blocking could be better?  

Whatever the F.O determines it is , fix it. Make it priority 1. 

I think it'd make that much of a difference to an already elite offense 

Even if it means decent amount of cap space.. We'd have such an elite offense,  that we could afford to have the same defense. 

[Big Turk]

47 minutes ago, JerseyBills said:

Mahomes played how Josh has to play every week.

0 TD 2 INT 9 points 49 pass attempts 270 yards

His RB got 69 yards on 11 carries

Defense could play pass , focus on Patty every play basically. Josh literally deals with this every game. 

Brady got 26 carries and 150 yds from his RBs. 

If Josh gets even a decent run game,  him and this already elite O will become unstoppable. 

He'll outplay Mahomes. He'll win Lombardis. 

The run game should be priority #1 going into next season,  I truly think Josh would be unstoppable.  

 

Allen looked a whole lot better with no protection than Mahomes did.

[Generic_Bills_Fan]

1 hour ago, JerseyBills said:

Mahomes played how Josh has to play every week.

0 TD 2 INT 9 points 49 pass attempts 270 yards

His RB got 69 yards on 11 carries

Defense could play pass , focus on Patty every play basically. Josh literally deals with this every game. 

Brady got 26 carries and 150 yds from his RBs. 

If Josh gets even a decent run game,  him and this already elite O will become unstoppable. 

He'll outplay Mahomes. He'll win Lombardis. 

The run game should be priority #1 going into next season,  I truly think Josh would be unstoppable.  

Mahomes has a tight end that is literally impossible to cover i would argue he still had it easier than what josh has every week lol 90% of his passing yards pre garbage time were to a wide open Travis kelce 

39 minutes ago, JerseyBills said:

Whatever the F.O determines it is , fix it. Make it priority 1. 

I think it'd make that much of a difference to an already elite offense 

Even if it means decent amount of cap space.. We'd have such an elite offense,  that we could afford to have the same defense. 

That seems tough to make priority 1 as our defense was just straight up dreadful and none of our offensive linemen were particularly good at run blocking.  This should be an interesting offseason.  I dont think we could afford to have that same defense if we want to win a super bowl.  Your offense just isn't gonna carry you 3 - 4 times in a row against the best teams in the nfl.

[wagne591]

I agree we need a running game...and I don't think our backs we have on the roster will do anything even with a good O-Line. Where we are drafting in this draft I say get a running back. That is the only position we can attack where a quality player will be available in the upcoming draft that will help our O right away. Our O-line is good enough to run block we just don't run enough. They need to get in step with each other and we just don't run the ball enough for them to get in Sync. During the post season for a snap shot of our offense we threw the ball 68% (120 pass attempts) of the time and ran the ball 31% (55 carries). Even further (45% of our running plays were by the QB 25 carries). How many of those carries were pass plays that broke down I don't know. I think we need to mix it up a little more and when we call a run play give it to our backs. We need to draft a big back that can move the pile even if there is nothing there to get 2 yards. 

[SectionC3]

8 minutes ago, wagne591 said:

I agree we need a running game...and I don't think our backs we have on the roster will do anything even with a good O-Line. Where we are drafting in this draft I say get a running back. That is the only position we can attack where a quality player will be available in the upcoming draft that will help our O right away. Our O-line is good enough to run block we just don't run enough. They need to get in step with each other and we just don't run the ball enough for them to get in Sync. During the post season for a snap shot of our offense we threw the ball 68% (120 pass attempts) of the time and ran the ball 31% (55 carries). Even further (45% of our running plays were by the QB 25 carries). How many of those carries were pass plays that broke down I don't know. I think we need to mix it up a little more and when we call a run play give it to our backs. We need to draft a big back that can move the pile even if there is nothing there to get 2 yards. 

 

I'm with you.  I'd rather have an effective banger than a speed guy.  I'm not sold on Moss.  No pop.  Maybe it was the toe injury.  Hopefully he proves me wrong.  

[UKBillFan]

Mahomes is still better than Josh but, as indicated by many experts even after the Championship game the gap isn't nearly as large as some wanted to make out. A few of us, including me, had a slight wobble after that game even though Josh hardly disgraced himself - but yesterday showed what happens to a Quarterback when their OL disappears, and Mahomes didn't look any better than Josh. Indeed, thanks to experience, Josh seems far more comfortable behind a non-existent OL than Mahomes.

Edited February 8, 2021 by UKBillFan

[Call_Of_Ktulu]

I don’t even want to think about what Vea Vita would do to anyone of our interior OL. Add in that Dawkins struggles with speed rushers and you have some serious OL issues.

[thenorthremembers]

I said it in another post, but watching Mahomes last night made me realize what we have in Josh.  The guy carried our team to wins multiple times this year.  If you get him a little more help he is easily a Super Bowl QB and league MVP.

[Trogdor]

12 minutes ago, SectionC3 said:

 

I'm with you.  I'd rather have an effective banger than a speed guy.  I'm not sold on Moss.  No pop.  Maybe it was the toe injury.  Hopefully he proves me wrong.  

I agree with you on Moss and I think it's weird that they bill him as a short yardage guy. He was a shifty back in college and Singletary is a YAC runner, but they seem to think they both do the opposite. Williams looked way more impressive either way. Sometimes I think they try to strike non-power 5 conference gold too much. 

[Solomon Grundy]

5 hours ago, Generic_Bills_Fan said:

Mahomes has a tight end that is literally impossible to cover i would argue he still had it easier than what josh has every week lol 90% of his passing yards pre garbage time were to a wide open Travis kelce 

That seems tough to make priority 1 as our defense was just straight up dreadful and none of our offensive linemen were particularly good at run blocking.  This should be an interesting offseason.  I dont think we could afford to have that same defense if we want to win a super bowl.  Your offense just isn't gonna carry you 3 - 4 times in a row against the best teams in the nfl.

Awesome post!! Get Josh a capable TE and he’s at the top. The Bills simply did not have a consistent contributor at the TE position 

[All_Pro_Bills]

32 minutes ago, thenorthremembers said:

I said it in another post, but watching Mahomes last night made me realize what we have in Josh.  The guy carried our team to wins multiple times this year.  If you get him a little more help he is easily a Super Bowl QB and league MVP.

Great players have the ability to elevate the play of others.  For whatever reason, Mahomes didn't do that last night even though he benefits from being surrounded by highly skilled athletes at every skill position on the field.  With the exception of Diggs, Allen does not.  Josh just seemed to will his way to wins at times during the season.  And his leadership attributes are clear.  The team rallies around him and feeds off his energy.  The team has assumed his identity. 

While the QB is the de facto leader of the team I don't see Mahomes as having the same leadership qualities.  That's not to diminish his style, leadership, or play which is outstanding.  But if I had to choose one going into 2021 I'd pick Allen.     

[george c]

At the end of the day, defense wins championships..

[Royale with Cheese]

7 hours ago, Bob in STL said:

If the Bills OL was even close to elite they would already have a running game.  More speed at RB will help but maybe the blocking could be better?  

 

They need maulers at guard.  Beane basically said Ford will be a starter next year, have to assumer guard.  They like him.

I think Morse is a goner.  Feliciano moves to center and then get a guard in FA or a within a day 2 pick.  We got pushed around in the run game too much.

[LABILLBACKER]

7 hours ago, Bob in STL said:

If the Bills OL was even close to elite they would already have a running game.  More speed at RB will help but maybe the blocking could be better?  

Then we need to overhaul our OL.  You better be able to do both, pass protect and run block. 

[SectionC3]

1 hour ago, Trogdor said:

I agree with you on Moss and I think it's weird that they bill him as a short yardage guy. He was a shifty back in college and Singletary is a YAC runner, but they seem to think they both do the opposite. Williams looked way more impressive either way. Sometimes I think they try to strike non-power 5 conference gold too much. 

 

I’m not ready to put too much stock into Williams.  Want to see him in a different context (i.e., against a team that hadn’t been run over and quit).  But your point about non-power 5 gold is an excellent one and well taken.  

 

Back in the day I did some work with some MLB scouts in Buffalo.  They had a “rule of thumb” question about pitchers: what’s the pitch that’s going to get him to the big leagues?  The one really unique talent that either of our guys have is Singletary’s balance.  But otherwise these guys look like they have 91 mph FBs that can’t support a change with average control and a mediocre breaking ball.  Point being, they don’t have the qualities to be difference makers.  

[Hapless Bills Fan]

7 hours ago, Bob in STL said:

If the Bills OL was even close to elite they would already have a running game.  More speed at RB will help but maybe the blocking could be better?  

 

FWIW, the Cover1 "Glaring Run Game" podcast agrees with you.  Something along the lines of 60% blocking, 20% running backs, 20% scheme.

[Buffalo_Stampede]

I know Beane has done a great job adding to the interior OL but If Beane wants to win a super bowl we need to continue to upgrade the interior OL. Don't rely on Cody Ford. I know he loves him some Cody Ford. If Ford works out great, but we have to upgrade there. 

 

 

[Hapless Bills Fan]

1 minute ago, Buffalo_Stampede said:

I know Beane has done a great job adding to the interior OL but If Beane wants to win a super bowl we need to continue to upgrade the interior OL. Don't rely on Cody Ford. I know he loves him some Cody Ford. If Ford works out great, but we have to upgrade there.

 

I'm with you.  Cody Ford was not on the injury report for arm or shoulder injuries, but there were run blocks where he was easily shed or beaten where it looked like his hand placement sucked. 

 

Now perhaps injuries are to blame but when you have a 3rd year guy where the GM says "he's played more games injured than healthy", that's a durability concern IMO.

 

 

[Dr. K]

Offensive and defensive lines need to be better. 

 

Other stuff is gravy.

 

[BearNorth]

As I said Ali Marpet played D3 football in the finger lakes, and we drafted Ronald Darby who is just a guy.  Marpet will be an all-pro LG for the next 5 years, he stoned the KC rush.

 

[Royale with Cheese]

20 minutes ago, ScottLaw said:

When did Beane say this? 

 

 

[PrimeTime101]

8 minutes ago, Dr. K said:

Offensive and defensive lines need to be better. 

 

Other stuff is gravy.

 

I have been saying this right along.. the game was won in the trenches last night. 

We need a 1 Tech DT 

Drop some guys on O'Line that cant run block and I am sorry.. I have little faith in the RB's we have now. we need an upgrade there to.

[SCBills]

36 minutes ago, Buffalo_Stampede said:

I know Beane has done a great job adding to the interior OL but If Beane wants to win a super bowl we need to continue to upgrade the interior OL. Don't rely on Cody Ford. I know he loves him some Cody Ford. If Ford works out great, but we have to upgrade there. 

 

 

 

Cody Ford was an almost "can't miss" guard prospect coming out of college.  

 

We tried him at RT, then moved him back to G, and he promptly got hurt for half the season. 

 

I think we need to give him a shot and hope he is the guy everyone thought he was coming into the Draft.  

 

We have Dawkins, we can re-sign Williams, but we aren't going to have the resources and/or draft picks to replace both guard spots.   Ford, to me, is the penciled in starter and then I'd draft the best available interior lineman in Round 2.  

[Hapless Bills Fan]

31 minutes ago, ScottLaw said:

When did Beane say this? 

 

In his post-season presser.  He didn't say it in so many words but close enough.

(flip flip)

-like the versatility, not slotting him in at guard or tackle

-he'll have to compete, but he believes he'll be one of our best 5

 

[Buffalo_Stampede]

6 minutes ago, SCBills said:

 

Cody Ford was an almost "can't miss" guard prospect coming out of college.  

 

We tried him at RT, then moved him back to G, and he promptly got hurt for half the season. 

 

I think we need to give him a shot and hope he is the guy everyone thought he was coming into the Draft.  

 

We have Dawkins, we can re-sign Williams, but we aren't going to have the resources and/or draft picks to replace both guard spots.   Ford, to me, is the penciled in starter and then I'd draft the best available interior lineman in Round 2.  

You don't need to replace both OGs. Bring in at least 1 serious contender for OG/C. Going in with what we have now would be a failure IMO. 

 

I agree with your plan. What I mean when I say don't depend on Ford is don't believe Ford/Morse/Feliciano is good enough. 

 

Upgrade at least one of these players. 

[Buffalo_Stampede]

9 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

In his post-season presser.  He didn't say it in so many words but close enough.

(flip flip)

-like the versatility, not slotting him in at guard or tackle

-he'll have to compete, but he believes he'll be one of our best 5

 

Here's the dilemma for Beane heading into the offseason. We got zero snaps of the interior combination of Ford - Morse - Feliciano this season. They love Ford and they love Feliciano. Feliciano and Ford have a great relationship with each other and Allen. I almost 100% believe they will be penciled in as starters. 

 

I think the question for Beane is what to do at center. I think Feliciano is a real possibility depending how the offseason goes. They can also draft a center, I actually like that idea. We could draft the best center in the draft. Release Morse and give Feliciano a contract with the savings. 

 

They can also just say we believe Ford - Morse - Feliciano is a good group we believe in. Injuries didn't allow them to play together. 

 

What I think they will do is try to bring everyone back but also draft interior OL very high in this draft. 

[34-78-83]

Hoping for a healthy Ford at one of the guard spots and then Feliciano moving to Center full time next year. Hey really plays well there. Morse is super intelligent and a very good pass blocker but leaves a lot to be desired in the run game.

[Hapless Bills Fan]

8 minutes ago, Buffalo_Stampede said:

You don't need to replace both OGs. Bring in at least 1 serious contender for OG/C. Going in with what we have now would be a failure IMO. 

 

I agree with your plan. What I mean when I say don't depend on Ford is don't believe Ford/Morse/Feliciano is good enough. 

 

Upgrade at least one of these players. 

 

It's going to be very interesting to see what they do with Feliciano.  Evvybody loves him.  He's apparently buds with the QB and has a bromance going with half the OL.  I love me some Mongo too.

Technically, I'm wondering.  Several of his shotgun snaps in SEA and AZ were "good thing our QB is 6'5" with great reflexes" scary.  He got beat consistently in the AFC Championship game to the point that Marlon Humphrey tweeted "Y’all not ever trying to block for JA17".  There are a number of "run play fail" clips in Cover1's "Glaring Run Game Issues" video where Feliciano was the guy who whiffed (obviously, film clips not necessarily representative, and he was hardly the only problem).

 

To be fair, Mongo was coming back from injury and maybe "playing himself back into shape" this season so it doesn't reflect his best, and he said as much in one press conference "I'm not blocking well, I have to do better" IIRC after the Chargers game I think.

 

What he has brought to the Bills is good RG play who can step in almost seamlessly at C or LG - versatility, something Beane consistently praises about him.  WE got great value from him at $4M/year.  But if we slot him in as the starting C, we immediately lose that - you don't move your starting C to fill in at LG or RG.

 

Spotrac has hm getting paid like a starter: 4 year, $33M, $8.4M/yr.  I'm not sure he'll be resigned for that.  I see Beane re-signing Ike Boettger, trying to keep Williams at RT, and looking for an upgrade at C/G in the draft.  So the guard competition would be Ford, Boettger, and rookie with Ryan Bates as the backup C.

11 minutes ago, Buffalo_Stampede said:

I think the question for Beane is what to do at center. I think Feliciano is a real possibility depending how the offseason goes. They can also draft a center, I actually like that idea. We could draft the best center in the draft. Release Morse and give Feliciano a contract with the savings.

 

Savings from releasing Morse this year $4.8M

Feliciano current contract $4.4M last year

 

Feliciano was signed for that as a quality backup/competition for a starting spot.  Now he's made his case he's a starter.  I don't think he re-ups for $4.8M

 

Then there's the question of Daryl Williams, or who is the answer at RT?

[TheFunPolice]

Last night we saw what many commentators call "Sugar Rush Pat" where he just panics out there. 

 

This is Big Ben vs Peyton Manning all over again. 

 

Here's the biggest difference that I see: Mahomes plays a fancy game and things have mostly been easy for him. Take that away and get into a dogfight and it's panic time. Why aren't guys wide open by 10 yards?!

 

Allen plays a grittier game and has had to scratch, fight and claw early in his career. This year, he gets some help and look at the difference. 

 

When things get ugly with a fancy passer (Peyton Manning, Pat Mahomes) you have no chance. With a guy like Allen you still might lose, but he can play ugly. 

 

Even Tom Brady failed in NE (twice) when his team was all about offense and fireworks and became 1 dimensional. When NE went back to a balanced attack they won again. TB was the same way. 

 

With Mahomes contract kicking in they are going to lose some guys in KC. Same thing happened to another "next dynasty" in Seattle. they failed to go back to back SB wins and never really recovered. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[SCBills]

3 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

It's going to be very interesting to see what they do with Feliciano.  Evvybody loves him.  He's apparently buds with the QB and has a bromance going with half the OL.  I love me some Mongo too.

Technically, I'm wondering.  Several of his shotgun snaps in SEA and AZ were "good thing our QB is 6'5" with great reflexes" scary.  He got beat consistently in the AFC Championship game to the point that Marlon Humphrey tweeted "Y’all not ever trying to block for JA17".  There are a number of "run play fail" clips in Cover1's "Glaring Run Game Issues" video where Feliciano was the guy who whiffed (obviously, film clips not necessarily representative, and he was hardly the only problem).

 

To be fair, Mongo was coming back from injury and maybe "playing himself back into shape" this season so it doesn't reflect his best, and he said as much in one press conference "I'm not blocking well, I have to do better" IIRC after the Chargers game I think.

 

What he has brought to the Bills is good RG play who can step in almost seamlessly at C or LG - versatility, something Beane consistently praises about him.  WE got great value from him at $4M/year.  But if we slot him in as the starting C, we immediately lose that - you don't move your starting C to fill in at LG or RG.

 

Spotrac has hm getting paid like a starter: 4 year, $33M, $8.4M/yr.  I'm not sure he'll be resigned for that.  I see Beane re-signing Ike Boettger, trying to keep Williams at RT, and looking for an upgrade at C/G in the draft.  So the guard competition would be Ford, Boettger, and rookie with Ryan Bates as the backup C.

 

I'd let Feliciano walk.  

 

Re-sign Williams to go with Dawkins at LT and keep Morse at C.   Then do exactly as you said, draft a C/G in the 2nd or 3rd Round to play the G spot opposite Ford. 

 

I still think a healthy Ford can be a really good player.  His tape from college was fantastic.  

[Hapless Bills Fan]

4 minutes ago, SCBills said:

I'd let Feliciano walk.  

 

Re-sign Williams to go with Dawkins at LT and keep Morse at C.   Then do exactly as you said, draft a C/G in the 2nd or 3rd Round to play the G spot opposite Ford. 

 

I still think a healthy Ford can be a really good player.  His tape from college was fantastic.  

 

That's kind of where I see Beane going, but it really depends upon what kind of running game Daboll wants to run.  2019, we were successful with pin-and-pull blocking that Morse is quite good at.

 

Then there's the question what do they think of Morse physically with the concussion history?

 

I think a healthy Ford can be a really good player, but it begs the question why has he been injured so much?  Is it just freak stuff?  Or is he being injured because he's not really in the right position with the right technique but instead trying with all that's in him to make the play, leading to injury?

 

 

[Big Turk]

57 minutes ago, SCBills said:

 

Cody Ford was an almost "can't miss" guard prospect coming out of college.  

 

We tried him at RT, then moved him back to G, and he promptly got hurt for half the season. 

 

I think we need to give him a shot and hope he is the guy everyone thought he was coming into the Draft.  

 

We have Dawkins, we can re-sign Williams, but we aren't going to have the resources and/or draft picks to replace both guard spots.   Ford, to me, is the penciled in starter and then I'd draft the best available interior lineman in Round 2.  

 

Good guards can be found in the late rounds of the drafts...look at Teller as a 5th round pick.  Pats routinely find these guys and plug them in as well and they do great, sometimes even as UDFA's.  Lots of teams do.  Most guards that are very good players were not drafted in the top 2 rounds.

Edited February 8, 2021 by Big Turk

[SCBills]

1 minute ago, Big Turk said:

 

Good guards can be found in the late rounds of the drafts...look at Teller as a 5th round pick.  Pats routinely find these guys and plug them in as well and they do great, sometimes even as UDFA's.  Lots of teams do.  Most guards that are very good players were not drafted in the top 2 rounds.

 

Good point.. More of where I'm going is taking the best Center and maybe use them at G for a year or so and then take over for Morse down the line.  

[Hapless Bills Fan]

I think that Josh Allen can be the best QB in the league if he continues to work on areas where he's shown development, but needs more:

1) taking the open throw underneath instead of pressing to push the ball downfield.  he's gotten better since the Tenn. game, but it's still a flaw.

2) reading and reacting to disguised coverages

3) solidifying his mechanics - under pressure especially in big games, he can still miss a handful of throws that could turn the tide of the game.

 

I think having a run game will help the Bills be the best team in the league

[Over 29 years of fanhood]

2 hours ago, All_Pro_Bills said:

Great players have the ability to elevate the play of others.  For whatever reason, Mahomes didn't do that last night even though he benefits from being surrounded by highly skilled athletes at every skill position on the field.  With the exception of Diggs, Allen does not.  Josh just seemed to will his way to wins at times during the season.  And his leadership attributes are clear.  The team rallies around him and feeds off his energy.  The team has assumed his identity. 

While the QB is the de facto leader of the team I don't see Mahomes as having the same leadership qualities.  That's not to diminish his style, leadership, or play which is outstanding.  But if I had to choose one going into 2021 I'd pick Allen.     

Beasley is one on the best slots in the game. Gotta count him too. 

[BaaadThingsMan]

Allen is gonna go to work this off season. His idle just won another ring.

 

For all the hate I have for Brady, I think maybe he deserves a modicum of credit for Allen's work habits and thought process. He has studied Brady for years and knows what he needs to do to accomplish greatness. 

 

This, above all else will be why Allen is successful. 

 

Grab a speedy RB in the draft and maybe an o lineman also. 

[MJS]

He doesn't need to be the best QB in the league. That would be great, for sure, but if he can maintain top 5, that's good enough to win some Superbowls.

 

Aaron Rodgers has been one of the best, if not THE best, QB's in the league for much of his career. He almost never makes it to the Superbowl.

[jkeerie]

I was thinking last night after the game.  The Bills put up 24 points against the Chiefs...with their DBs holding all game and the refs letting KC get away with personal fouls, etc...unlike last night's Super Bowl.  They also put up 24 points with no running game and playing  one dimensionally.  Allen was pressured most of the game as Mahomes was last night.  Yet the Bills offense put up 24 points.  

 

The huge difference, of course, was on the opposite side of the ball.  Our defense got zero pressure on Mahomes and the game plan was to "limit" big plays versus playing aggressive and physical.  

 

Lots for Josh to learn in the off season, as well as our coaching staff.