Ravens trade for Yannick

[Ethan in Cleveland]

Wasted opportunity.  Hopefully Beane has something in the works

[Niagara Dude]

2 hours ago, YoloinOhio said:

 

Better off closing the comments on this because people are just going to get mad,  i mean a 3rd and 5th and Beanne watches as our defense is just full of scrubs.

[NoSaint]

2 hours ago, YoloinOhio said:

 

and if he walks, can angle at getting back a 3 in 2022 via comp picks 

[JGMcD2]

13 minutes ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

 

They have 7 picks and a conditional.   That conditional 7th round pick and 4 of the others are 5th round or later.

 

Again.........other teams didn't have the need the Bills had.   Remember John Brown had a career year.........this year is more consistent with Brown's career, good one year, hurt the next.............he and Beasley aren't and weren't long time studs  with just a few seasons over 700 yards combined out of 12 in the league.   A player like Metcalf was a HUGE need for the Bills.  Can't be understated.

 

Arizona addressed WR early in the draft.........the Bills did not.    Arizona also fleeced Houston for Hopkins..........dumping the Johnson salary on the Texans to boot.   That was an epic steal.  So while they may have failed passing on Metcalf they made up for it elsewhere.  

 

That's the kind of thing Beane isn't doing.   He's making mistakes and then paying full price in real time to fix them.

Sure. Either way they’re not lacking draft capital. They have 7 picks. 3 in the first 3 rounds. It’s not like they’re in a dire position. They’re able to move picks if they want to. Every team starts with 7 picks. 

 

What do you mean other teams didn’t have the need the Bills had? I literally just told you DK Metcalf was the 9th receiver taken in that draft and you completely ignored it. Those teams undoubtedly had a need based on the fact that they drafted a receiver and in drafting a receiver they opted to not take Metcalf. 

 

That was a great deal for Arizona, but they were able to take advantage of O’Brien. I’m sure AFC teams weren’t even given that opportunity. The whole league knows the deal was a joke. There’s a very high chance most teams didn’t even know Hopkins was on the market, and O’Brien was just going rogue. It was an unprecedented deal, and one that other NFL teams didn’t have an opportunity to make. 

“No, we had no sense he was on the market,” Rivera told Washington reporters Wednesday. 

Asked if he was surprised that the Texans, led by coach and executive Bill O’Brien, traded Hopkins to the Arizona Cardinals, Rivera responded with the affirmative. “Yeah, just like everybody else,” he said. “We were all surprised. Here’s a talented player playing for a team he had played very well for and they traded him. It was a decision that was made on another team.”

 

“It is amazing in the NFL that some trades are so lopsided still,” said an NFL executive, according to Mike Sando of The Athletic. “The Hopkins thing was a joke. How the David Johnson contract was included in the deal just astounds me.”

 

 “The ability to get out from Johnson, I can’t recall if another one like that exists, where a team acquired a high-level player and also was able to divest itself of a negative contract.”

[H2o]

For everyone incessantly whining about Beane, McDermott, and us not making a deal for Ngakoue have you actually looked at the broader spectrum of this? First off, we have less than $5,000,000 in cap space at this point and can't fit Ngakoue in for the rest of the season without cutting a couple of other guys. Could we cut people? Sure, but what if he gets hurt and you just cut your depth at the position? Then you're really screwed. Second, we have other guys with contracts coming up after this season. The salary cap is coming down, we just don't completely know by how much yet. The talk is about a $20,000,000 drop due to the circumstances faced this year though. Do you think we are going to re-sign him at $20,000,000 per season next year in light of that? No, we wouldn't. Third, is Ngakoue the missing link for this team to win a SB? Sorry, no he is not Bills fans. This would be a remainder of a season rental trying to put a Band-Aid on something that needs stitches. Yes, he has 5 sacks this year. He averages about 9 a season for his career. He also only averages about 30 tackles per season, which means outside of his 9 takedowns of the QB he is making 21 other stops over 16 full games. He's solid, but not elite. He's also lightweight for a 4-3 DE at under 250lbs. The Ravens are in a place, with the defense they already have, that he just makes sense there and scheme wise as well. He will get to be a stand up edge rusher now and I always thought that was his best fit.  

[dorquemada]

22 minutes ago, Saint Doug said:

We don’t need a player with that many sacks on our line. Would disrupt the current chemistry. 

 

yeah its hard to let the other team sustain 15 play 9 minute drives when you go sacking the quarterback, very unsporting approach really

[BADOLBILZ]

3 minutes ago, JGMcD2 said:

Sure. Either way they’re not lacking draft capital. They have 7 picks. 3 in the first 3 rounds. It’s not like they’re in a dire position. They’re able to move picks if they want to. Every team starts with 7 picks. 

 

What do you mean other teams didn’t have the need the Bills had? I literally just told you DK Metcalf was the 9th receiver taken in that draft and you completely ignored it. Those teams undoubtedly had a need based on the fact that they drafted a receiver and in drafting a receiver they opted to not take Metcalf. 

 

That was a great deal for Arizona, but they were able to take advantage of O’Brien. I’m sure AFC teams weren’t even given that opportunity. The whole league knows the deal was a joke. There’s a very high chance most teams didn’t even know Hopkins was on the market, and O’Brien was just going rogue. It was an unprecedented deal, and one that other NFL teams didn’t have an opportunity to make. 

“No, we had no sense he was on the market,” Rivera told Washington reporters Wednesday. 

Asked if he was surprised that the Texans, led by coach and executive Bill O’Brien, traded Hopkins to the Arizona Cardinals, Rivera responded with the affirmative. “Yeah, just like everybody else,” he said. “We were all surprised. Here’s a talented player playing for a team he had played very well for and they traded him. It was a decision that was made on another team.”

 

“It is amazing in the NFL that some trades are so lopsided still,” said an NFL executive, according to Mike Sando of The Athletic. “The Hopkins thing was a joke. How the David Johnson contract was included in the deal just astounds me.”

 

 “The ability to get out from Johnson, I can’t recall if another one like that exists, where a team acquired a high-level player and also was able to divest itself of a negative contract.”

 

 

I never said they were in dire need of draft picks.    They just don't have a good enough or young enough roster to part with much.   The Ravens do.   They do more with less and make moves that work.......which gives them flexibility to do things like trade draft picks to enhance their roster.

 

One can always defend Beane by pointing out that some other teams make bad decisions............I don't contest that.........but the point isn't what the bottom of the league or even what the more efficient teams have or haven't done.........it's that Beane is making too many of his own mistakes.

 

 He's gotta' do better or the Bills will have to be an overachieving roster to remain a fringe contender.

[NewEra]

I really hope we don’t face them this year.  Last year, they brought the house all game.  Now they’re in a spot where they could rush 3 or 4, still get good pressure and sit in a frustrating zone

[Dablitzkrieg]

I'm reading through this thread and I am coming to the realization that there are a ***** ton of crazy Bills fans here 😂

[ColoradoBills]

7 minutes ago, H2o said:

For everyone incessantly whining about Beane, McDermott, and us not making a deal for Ngakoue have you actually looked at the broader spectrum of this? First off, we have less than $5,000,000 in cap space at this point and can't fit Ngakoue in for the rest of the season without cutting a couple of other guys. Could we cut people? Sure, but what if he gets hurt and you just cut your depth at the position? Then you're really screwed. Second, we have other guys with contracts coming up after this season. The salary cap is coming down, we just don't completely know by how much yet. The talk is about a $20,000,000 drop due to the circumstances faced this year though. Do you think we are going to re-sign him at $20,000,000 per season next year in light of that? No, we wouldn't. Third, is Ngakoue the missing link for this team to win a SB? Sorry, no he is not Bills fans. This would be a remainder of a season rental trying to put a Band-Aid on something that needs stitches. Yes, he has 5 sacks this year. He averages about 9 a season for his career. He also only averages about 30 tackles per season, which means outside of his 9 takedowns of the QB he is making 21 other stops over 16 full games. He's solid, but not elite. He's also lightweight for a 4-3 DE at under 250lbs. The Ravens are in a place, with the defense they already have, that he just makes sense there and scheme wise as well. He will get to be a stand up edge rusher now and I always thought that was his best fit.  

 

I'm not banging the table that Beane should of signed Yannick (although it would be nice to have him on the team right now) but I do want to address the cap stuff.

1st off, as it is now the Ravens are 6.5 million OVER the cap per Spotrac. They signed Yannick with much less than the Bills 4 million in space.

Yannick cost 5.1 million for the rest of the year.

 

https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/baltimore-ravens/cap/

 

The Bills could of restructured to open up a few million if they wanted to.  It's probably what the Ravens are doing right now.

Cutting vets doesn't free up money and cutting rookies/UDFAs doesn't get you a lot of free cash.

The only other option for the Ravens is they may have another trade (vet player of theirs) in the works.

 

Just saying that the Bills COULD of signed him without cutting players.  

[JGMcD2]

2 minutes ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

 

I never said they were in dire need of draft picks.    They just don't have a good enough or young enough roster to part with much.   The Ravens do.   They do more with less and make moves that work.......which gives them flexibility to do things like trade draft picks to enhance their roster.

 

One can always defend Beane by pointing out that some other teams make bad decisions............I don't contest that.........but the point isn't what the bottom of the league or even what the more efficient teams have or haven't done.........it's that Beane is making too many of his own mistakes.

 

 He's gotta' do better or the Bills will have to be an overachieving roster to remain a fringe contender.

 

 

Well no, you are stating that the trade for Diggs was an overpay and that a deal like the Hopkins deal should have occurred. Primarily because the Bills didn't address the WR position the year before. I was also showing that even though teams addressed the WR position the year before they STILL gave up assets to acquire Hopkins... so your point just doesn't hold up. DK was a mystery... he wasn't a can't miss stud... or else he wouldn't have fallen to the last pick in RD2.

 

I was showing you there that it wasn't possible. Teams didn't even know Hopkins was being moved... it's hard for someone to acquire Hopkins when they don't have a chance to acquire him. 

 

Back to your dead cap qualms. We can release Lee Smith, Vernon Butler, Quentin Jefferson and Tyler Matakevich to save $17.5mm with only $2.8mm dead. 

[Hapless Bills Fan]

3 hours ago, Not at the table Karlos said:

3rd and 5th I would have done that all day long

 

Worse than that, 2022 5th.

So like a 2021 3rd and 6th

🤐

 

1 season rental for $8M

[H2o]

2 minutes ago, ColoradoBills said:

 

I'm not banging the table that Beane should of signed Yannick (although it would be nice to have him on the team right now) but I do want to address the cap stuff.

1st off, as it is now the Ravens are 6.5 million OVER the cap per Spotrac. They signed Yannick with much less than the Bills 4 million in space.

Yannick cost 5.1 million for the rest of the year.

 

https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/baltimore-ravens/cap/

 

The Bills could of restructured to open up a few million if they wanted to.  It's probably what the Ravens are doing right now.

Cutting vets doesn't free up money and cutting rookies/UDFAs doesn't get you a lot of free cash.

The only other option for the Ravens is they may have another trade (vet player of theirs) in the works.

 

Just saying that the Bills COULD of signed him without cutting players.  

I understand what you're getting at. But whose money gets pushed down the line and how does that affect us moving forward after this year? Yannick's contract was $12,000,000. We're through week 6. That seems closer to $8,000,000 for the rest of the year. We have less than $5,000,000. Even if they could have maneuvered the cap to scrape under, everything else I stated still remains. He'd be nice to have, agreed, but it would be a 10 game regular season rental and whatever else we accomplished in the playoffs. With our performances against the Titans and Chiefs, as well as the way the defense has looked as a whole this entire year thus far, I just don't see him as our missing link to a Lombardi. 

[ColoradoBills]

2 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

Worse than that, 2022 5th.

So like a 2021 3rd and 6th

🤐

 

1 season rental for $8M

 

I'm just trying to keep the facts straight.  Yannick is 5.1 million.

https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/baltimore-ravens/yannick-ngakoue-19018/

[Hapless Bills Fan]

7 minutes ago, ColoradoBills said:

 

I'm just trying to keep the facts straight.  Yannick is 5.1 million.

https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/baltimore-ravens/yannick-ngakoue-19018/

 

My facts are straight - I said "ONE SEASON rental and quoted his 2020 salary.

 

You're correct for his remaining salary to be paid by the Ravens as 10 games remain, $0.5M/game = $5M 10 games

 

8 minutes ago, H2o said:

I understand what you're getting at. But whose money gets pushed down the line and how does that affect us moving forward after this year? Yannick's contract was $12,000,000. We're through week 6. That seems closer to $8,000,000 for the rest of the year. We have less than $5,000,000. Even if they could have maneuvered the cap to scrape under, everything else I stated still remains. He'd be nice to have, agreed, but it would be a 10 game regular season rental and whatever else we accomplished in the playoffs. With our performances against the Titans and Chiefs, as well as the way the defense has looked as a whole this entire year thus far, I just don't see him as our missing link to a Lombardi. 

 

Contract was $4M signing bonus (stays with original team), $8M annual salary.  10 remaining games $5M

https://overthecap.com/player/yannick-ngakoue/4782/

[ColoradoBills]

3 minutes ago, H2o said:

I understand what you're getting at. But whose money gets pushed down the line and how does that affect us moving forward after this year? Yannick's contract was $12,000,000. We're through week 6. That seems closer to $8,000,000 for the rest of the year. We have less than $5,000,000. Even if they could have maneuvered the cap to scrape under, everything else I stated still remains. He'd be nice to have, agreed, but it would be a 10 game regular season rental and whatever else we accomplished in the playoffs. With our performances against the Titans and Chiefs, as well as the way the defense has looked as a whole this entire year thus far, I just don't see him as our missing link to a Lombardi. 

 

The Jags AND Vikes ate dead cap on the trades.  Yannick costs 5.1 for the Ravens.

I agree "restructuring" is always a risk.  You are trading guaranteed money for cap space today but a couple of million could of been done with

Diggs and/or Morse among others.

 

I'm more just giving the numbers and option.  I like the money side of football, it's interesting to me.

[HurlyBurly51]

3 hours ago, Not at the table Karlos said:

3rd and 5th I would have done that all day long

Totally!

[ColoradoBills]

5 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

My facts are straight - I said "ONE SEASON rental and quoted his 2020 salary.

 

You're correct for his remaining salary to be paid by the Ravens as 10 games remain, $0.5M/game = $5M 10 games

 

 

Contract was $4M signing bonus (stays with original team), $8M annual salary.  10 remaining games $5M

https://overthecap.com/player/yannick-ngakoue/4782/

 

I stand corrected.  I thought you were quoting what the cost of todays trade would be.

[Hapless Bills Fan]

1 minute ago, ColoradoBills said:

 

I stand corrected.  I thought you were quoting what the cost of todays trade would be.

 

Eh, no worries, it's confusing for many of us!  And it makes sense to look at the cap liability the Ravens are taking on.

[Rc2catch]

I think it’s also fair to say maybe Beane did call, and Minnesota doesn’t want a second trade with buffalo. Clearly the Diggs trade has worked out really good for both teams but this Yannick one surely faces some backlash from their fans yes? 

[Billznut]

1 hour ago, Ethan in Portland said:

Wasted opportunity.  Hopefully Beane has something in the works

Don’t hold your breath 

[Ethan in Cleveland]

1 minute ago, Billznut said:

Don’t hold your breath 

Beane has made othe moves. I still think he will make a move

[ExWNYer]

4 minutes ago, Rc2catch said:

I think it’s also fair to say maybe Beane did call, and Minnesota doesn’t want a second trade with buffalo. Clearly the Diggs trade has worked out really good for both teams but this Yannick one surely faces some backlash from their fans yes? 

 

It should. Minnesota traded a 2nd and a 5th to Jacksonville and got back a 3rd and a 5th from Baltimore. Unless the Vikes turn things around drastically (and this trade does not indicate that they think they will), they have, in effect, traded an early 2nd Round pick for a late 3rd Round pick in order to get Ngakoue for the sum total of six games. Yikes. That is bad business.

[Rc2catch]

11 minutes ago, ExWNYer said:

 

It should. Minnesota traded a 2nd and a 5th to Jacksonville and got back a 3rd and a 5th from Baltimore. Unless the Vikes turn things around drastically (and this trade does not indicate that they think they will), they have, in effect, traded an early 2nd Round pick for a late 3rd Round pick in order to get Ngakoue for the sum total of six games. Yikes. That is bad business.

On top of the fact he’s probably their best player on defense this season. And hunter is out for the year now. No Barr. Guess they want to embrace the tank in some form 

[BuffBillsForLife]

6 minutes ago, High Football IQ said:

I'll never understand why NFL teams insist on making these type of ridiculous lopsided trades with teams like the Pats and Ravens year after year. I get that the Vikings realize they probably need to shift focus to 2021 and beyond but they are almost guaranteeing a spot for the Ravens in the AFC Championship game at worst.

 

And why this move was probably never realistic for this team, if for some reason the Bills do win the division they will likely be the 4th seed and given how strong the AFCN is there's a high probability they will face the top wildcard team which is obviously going to be the Ravens or Steelers and another quick playoff exit.

 

 

Teams almost never care about making seemingly bad trades with the other conference.  They aren't competing for playoff spots with them, and they only play that team once every four years unless both make the superbowl.  And if they're meeting in the superbowl obviously the trade worked out for both sides.  

[Buffalo716]

I honestly don't think he's a great fit for the 3-4

 

He's way too small to be 34 end and I don't think he'll be good dropping into coverage from the outside linebacker spot

[Ethan in Cleveland]

4 minutes ago, High Football IQ said:

 

He's likely trying but outside of the draft day trades to move up for Allen and Edmonds and sending a 1st for Diggs, I don't see him willing to give up anything higher than a 5th round pick because it was be a direct indictment for his previous failed moves and against the 'process' nonsense.

 

But if you think of some of the players we've wasted 3rd round picks on recent years (Knox, Singletary, Phillips, etc) what armchair GM would honestly be wrong saying we should have made this same move or give up a 3rd in a heartbeat for a proven veteran DT/DE/LB that can make a massive impact in the front seven even for just the rest of this season without guarantee they'd be back in 2021.

He traded a 3rd for KB. He cut Spain after signing him to an extension. It doesn't appear he is worried about an indictment of his choices. 

Let's see how it goes the next ten days or so. Then if he doesn't do anything to upgrade we can crucify him. I've been calling for an upgrade at DE since training camp. 

[PetermansRedemption]

Given what they traded FOR Yannick, I would have been happier as a Vikings fan if they just let him walk at the end of the season rather than trade him for nothing. Couldn’t they have even received a comp pick by letting him walk? So the downside of keeping him would be limited. 

[John from Riverside]

So....if this guy was available.....and we didnt outbid the ravens to get him....I am dissapointed in this

[RyanC883]

4 hours ago, Royale with Cheese said:

I just found out on Joe B's podcast that the Bills have the most expensive DL in the league.  22% of our cap goes to the DL.  

We're going to be releasing a lot players in the offseason.

 

terrible DL management both in FA and the draft.  

I would have traded a 2nd and 5th.   

[Justin C]

In addition to the Bills being tight up against the cap, people also need to realize Yannick is from Maryland, went to the University of Maryland and always wanted to play for the Ravens. It very well could have been a situation where he only would have accepted a trade to the Ravens. 

[Coach Tuesday]

Yannick also doesn't tackle running backs - he just refuses to do it.

[Bronxbomber21]

Buffalo should've gave a 3rd a 5th and Murphy 

[BuffaloRebound]

Instead of chasing more shiny objects, Bills gotta get their own house in order first.  Too many guys not playing to their potential.  

[dpberr]

Hot take today but perhaps not tomorrow (next year):  He's a player that needs to be actively chasing a contract to reach the greatness level.

 

 

 

 

    

[Ya Digg?]

2 hours ago, ColoradoBills said:

 

I'm not banging the table that Beane should of signed Yannick (although it would be nice to have him on the team right now) but I do want to address the cap stuff.

1st off, as it is now the Ravens are 6.5 million OVER the cap per Spotrac. They signed Yannick with much less than the Bills 4 million in space.

Yannick cost 5.1 million for the rest of the year.

 

https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/baltimore-ravens/cap/

 

The Bills could of restructured to open up a few million if they wanted to.  It's probably what the Ravens are doing right now.

Cutting vets doesn't free up money and cutting rookies/UDFAs doesn't get you a lot of free cash.

The only other option for the Ravens is they may have another trade (vet player of theirs) in the works.

 

Just saying that the Bills COULD of signed him without cutting players.  

How are so many people skipping over this??? The Ravens are over the cap and were able to make the trade, people need to stop saying the Bills couldn’t have made this trade. There are so many ways for teams to work around the cap to make something like this work. Also, how did the narrative change so fast in so many peoples eyes-somehow Beane went from being amazing with the cap and the draft to Beane needs to be fired! I think i got whiplash from watching so many people flip to that!

[Mr. K]

Ravens getting ready for the Chiefs I guess...

[billsfan89]

2 hours ago, ExWNYer said:

 

It should. Minnesota traded a 2nd and a 5th to Jacksonville and got back a 3rd and a 5th from Baltimore. Unless the Vikes turn things around drastically (and this trade does not indicate that they think they will), they have, in effect, traded an early 2nd Round pick for a late 3rd Round pick in order to get Ngakoue for the sum total of six games. Yikes. That is bad business.

 

I guess they looked at the 2nd and 5th as a sunk cost and Yannick probably wanted out. So get back something other than a comp pick in 2022. 

[DeltaDigital]

awesome. remind me again, how we have a ship full of J.A.Gs and 3m left in cap space? I mean, wtf are we doin here? 

[brianthomas]

6 hours ago, whatdrought said:

In all seriousness, what about either Eric Kendricks or Anthony Barr? Help our LB crew. 

Anthony Barr is out for the season, Kendricks or a sack of potatoes would help our LB crew tho