Meanwhile, over at FinHeaven....

[UKBillFan]

7 minutes ago, KDIGGZ said:

Fields is Tyrod Taylor? Fields is a blue chip prospect on a terrible team. I don't know if he would be much of an improvement over Tua but I think he could do what Tua does, 1 read throws. Tua led the NFL in passing this season so that's saying something, plus Fields would add the extra dimension of being able to run if the play is not there. Everyone knows if you get Tua off his first read he has absolutely no solution. It's not as crazy as it sounds if they decide to go in another direction rather than make Tua the highest paid player in NFL history!

 

Yeah, I'd definitely prefer the Fins keeping Tua than somehow trading for Fields.

[Prospector]

8 hours ago, Buffalo716 said:

Yea but fields is TT on steroids

 

He's bigger faster and stronger... And has a bigger arm...

 

It's like the Justin Herbert to Josh Allen comparison... Sure they might be physically the same stature on the field or close to it

 

But one place like he's Superman and one plays like he's not...

 

I don't think Fields is amazing... But he's definitely got more talent than tyrod Taylor.. who is a good journeyman

Tyrod in his prime may have been faster

[Irv]

Urgent Care of South Florida overwhelmed with broken ankle injuries from all the band wagon jumpers.   

[TheFunPolice]

I hope Tua holds out this offseason for a contract. 

 

How come everyone else has a new deal but he is expected/ok with playing for relative peanuts? 

 

Time to PAY THE MAN who led the Dolphins to the playoffs 2 years in a row, QB'ed the league's top offense, and was in the running for M V P!!

 

I say give him Burrow's deal, plus 10%

 

I can't wait until the Dolphins have to pay the piper. Having a QB on a rookie deal and surrounding him with a Pro Bowl roster only lasts so long, and if it didn't work by now what is it going to look like when they have to let guys go to get under the cap?

 

Hill is getting older and is beat up near the end of every season. They will need to pay Waddle too. 

Edited January 8 by TheFunPolice

[Over 29 years of fanhood]

8 hours ago, Ethan in Cleveland said:

Fields has had one of the worst supporting players can have. About as bad as 2018 Bills oline nad WR group. He needs a new team.

I’d take DJ Moore in Buffalo in a second

[WhoTom]

4 minutes ago, Irv said:

Urgent Care of South Florida overwhelmed with broken ankle injuries from all the band wagon jumpers.   

 

Judging by the crowd, I'd guess a lot of them jumped off last week.

 

[Rock'em Sock'em]

Fields could be amazing with this current Dolphins team.  Compared to Tua, he has a better arm, ability to run, ability to bye time, and better ability to throw on the run. Tua's thing is that he hits on those 2.2s throws that go 15 yards down the hash marks to Hill.  But that seems like an overall play design thing, not skillset that is specific to Tua.  Tua has also been very accurate on the deep throws to a wide open Hill.  Apparently, that's a skillset that not every QB has.  eh-hmmm.

[Unforgiven]

Ending up in a WC game…in 0° weather on Pea****…pretty much sums up the last month.

 

God wanted the weather to be similar to the percentage chance of us winning... How cute.

 

What is worse that it will be zero degrees or that the game is on Pea****.

 

A couple of frozen Samoan picks ought to wrap it up

 

One team on life support and they win the division and one team starts like a rocket then fizzles to the 6th seed

 

leave him alone. tuanons are gonna tuanons. they treat him like he's their child

 

My neighbor is a Bills fan is in the fcking street with goddamn fireworks. I’m going to jail tonight. Going to beat the fat off his face!!!

 

Jesus christ, if you lived closer i would help but since you don't please film it for me...

 

These guys are hilarious.

[Neo]

Clean up, aisle five.   Clean up, aisle five, please.

[jdonley1180]

[finn]

3 hours ago, Bogie_Klinkhammer said:

It's not fun to lose the AFC East on the final week. 

Especially after leading it for most of the season. Demoralizing. 

 

(Good!)

[BullBuchanan]

8 hours ago, Ethan in Cleveland said:

Fields has had one of the worst supporting players can have. About as bad as 2018 Bills oline nad WR group. He needs a new team.

DJ Moore, Darnell Mooney and Cole Cmet are a bad group of pass catchers?

[UKBillFan]

12 minutes ago, Neo said:

Clean up, aisle five.   Clean up, aisle five, please.

 

Should be six, really... 😉

[Generic_Bills_Fan]

39 minutes ago, Bruffalo said:

Tua is a fantastic QB for McDaniels' system, which is to make one read and throw the ball very quickly. He's also decent to great at presnap reads.

 

But he's a horrific improviser and can't go through progressions at an elite level. Once you take away the designed first option his efficiency plummets. 

I really don’t even think he’s a good qb for the mcdaniel/shanahan system either.  Tua is holding the system back imo.  Bills blitzed one time and gave tua plenty of time and he looked even more uncomfortable than usual which just can’t happen at an nfl level. Purdy runs it much better…he will at least hold the ball and attempt to make all the throws/give wrs a chance to adjust their routes.  McDaniel seems like he has training wheels on the Shanahan system to baby tua along

Edited January 8 by Generic_Bills_Fan

[KDIGGZ]

5 minutes ago, jdonley1180 said:

I don't know if this one is ignorance or stupidity or both

[SoTier]

8 hours ago, Buffalo716 said:

                                                                                                       before

Yes . The bears literally haven't developed a quarterback since ^ world war II

 

Any quarterback going there , is basically the end of your career historically

 

Fixed that for you.  😁

 

8 hours ago, JayBaller10 said:

Coming into the game, Miami was 11-0 when leading at halftime, the only team in the NFL that could boast an undefeated record in that circumstance. Feels good to end that for them. Their fans must be livid their vaunted offense did nothing the entire 2nd half.

 

I think that until the late third quarter -- or maybe even early in the fourth quarter -- the Fins only managed 1 first down in the second half.

 

3 hours ago, Bogie_Klinkhammer said:

It's not fun to lose the AFC East on the final week. 

 

Especially when your team has been the division leader since September and was 3 games ahead of the Bills with 5 games left in the regular season.

 

1 hour ago, May Day 10 said:

A team built 100% on speed is doomed to fail.

 

 

Itll look great on paper and in September and October, but the NFL season is a war of attrition.  Eventually, speed gets slowed down.  

 

Totally agree.   Winning in the playoffs usually depends upon a stout defense and a decent running game when all the opponents are good and playing conditions are frequently poor.

Edited January 8 by SoTier

[Wraith]

42 minutes ago, Bruffalo said:

Tua is a fantastic QB for McDaniels' system, which is to make one read and throw the ball very quickly. He's also decent to great at presnap reads.

 

But he's a horrific improviser and can't go through progressions at an elite level. Once you take away the designed first option his efficiency plummets. 

It truly is amazing how little production that offense gets once the initial play breaks down. We are spoiled watching Allen regularly rescuing plays he has no business rescuing.

[Beck Water]

3 hours ago, Blackbeard said:

I give you this thread on Allen. 
 

https://finheaven.com/threads/allen-vs-tua.382031/

 

We have the best offensive weapon in the league in Josh.  
 

But WE all knew that.. 

 

"Unfortunately, he only gets to play us twice a year. Vs the rest of the league, he was not good this year. Outside of 1 really exciting playoff game in which he lost wtf has Allen done?"

to which a saner head responds:

"I don't know he couldnt have been that bad. He had 30 TD's and 15 rushing TD's and over 4500 yards. When game is on the line he responds"

 

[TheFunPolice]

1 hour ago, May Day 10 said:

A team built 100% on speed is doomed to fail.

 

 

Itll look great on paper and in September and October, but the NFL season is a war of attrition.  Eventually, speed gets slowed down.  

 

You saw it last night...

 

Hill's ankle is busted up and Waddle couldn't even play. With Waddle out Miami is a dangerous offense, but not impossible to defend or anything. With Waddle out and Hill not 100% they are just another team.

 

When Tua takes the snap and throws within 2 seconds down the seam it doesn't work without both of them in there near full strength. 

 

With both 100% and on a nice warm, clean field with a healthy supporting cast and little to no film on their offense they are close to impossible to stop, but that doesn't last long. 

 

Take snap, close eyes, throw to predetermined spot to a track star who is wide open by 5 yards and then does a RAC for an extra 10-30 yards. run a few plays then float a moonball to a wide open WR who has his defender beat by 10 yards. That all depends on speed being there in multiple places. 

Edited January 8 by TheFunPolice

[Iiiiiiiiive Got a Feeeelin]

Finheaven is hilarious not only are the dolphins the weakest fan base theyre also completely clueless about, ya know, how football works and all that

[Beck Water]

Just now, TheFunPolice said:

 

You saw it last night...

 

Hill's ankle is busted up and Waddle couldn't even play. With Waddle out Miami is a dangerous offense, but not impossible to defend or anything. With Waddle out and Hill not 100% they are just another team.

 

With both 100% and on a nice warm, clean field with a healthy supporting cast and little to no film on their offense they are close to impossible to stop, but that doesn't last long. 

 

They seemed to be moving the ball quite nicely with Achane, Wilson, Cracraft, and a hampered Hill. 

 

TBH when we lost Douglas and Dodson I was concerned.

 

And kudos to McDermott for what adjustments he made defensively.

 

 

[Big Turk]

8 hours ago, Generic_Bills_Fan said:

Allen is like unquantifiable at this point lol. Everyone’s like well if he didn’t turn it over as much we’d be winning then he makes a handful of impossible plays and ends up more than redeeming himself  seemingly every game 😂. That INT in ot of the Vikings game last season is really the only time I can remember him blowing a game late or even not leading the bills on a game tying/leading drive when there was an opportunity 

 

There is a reason why the Bills have not lost a regular season game by more than 6 points in over 2 years going back to November 2021 against Indy and that is Josh Allen.  That is an absurdly long time to maintain that streak. No other team is even close.

Edited January 8 by Big Turk

[Punching Bag]

2 hours ago, May Day 10 said:

Really though, this has to be borderline traumatizing for Dolphins fans.

 

 

I cant imagine what it would have been like to have a season like this in the drought and have New England just ***** it up in Buffalo the last week of the season in front of a stadium full of their own fans. 

 

Correction: half-full

[YattaOkasan]

8 hours ago, Generic_Bills_Fan said:

Miamis gotta be headed for total rebuild in a couple years imo…that Shanahan system is high floor but pretty low ceiling and it just isn’t fooling the better defensive coaches in the league. They’re gonna lose some pieces if they decide to resign tua and really need a way to come up with elite defensive play but Howard is on the downswing and they got von millered with that Bradley Chubb knee injury. 

McD is super good against shanahan tree.  i forget his record what it was before the season but there were not that many losses.  hes 3-1 already this year with wins over miami and NYJ.  I dont think anyone in the NFC East or AFC west run shanahans offense (every copies a bit though) and TB, CIN, Jax dont run it so 3-1 this season is pretty good.

[TheFunPolice]

4 minutes ago, Beck Water said:

 

They seemed to be moving the ball quite nicely with Achane, Wilson, Cracraft, and a hampered Hill. 

 

TBH when we lost Douglas and Dodson I was concerned.

 

And kudos to McDermott for what adjustments he made defensively.

 

 

 

McDaniel had a really nice plan on offense to run the ball with those wide runs to keep the defense off balance. McDermott must have made some sort of adjustment that took that away and that was essentially their run game so they became one dimensional. 

 

The Shanahan tree/system is impressive and wins a lot of games, but from what I've read there are relatively few plays in the game plan, so if you can catch on before they get up multiple scores on you it's also quite stop able. 

 

The Shanahan plan is get up multiple scores and then just lean on you. It also cost him twice in the Super Bowl (Atlanta/NE and SF/KC) when the other teams caught on early enough and they didn't have the talent advantage to just win anyway. 

 

Also, I think Hill's ankle got worse and worse as the game went on.

 

Dolphins are a lot like the 49ers in that they had a Pro Bowl roster and were just too fast to cover. But then guys start getting hurt and the delta between them and every other offense gets smaller. Tua is still Tua, but he doesn't add much, just like Purdy. Then DC's catch onto some of what you're doing and adjust. 

 

IMO, that's why "injuries cost us a Super Bowl" is the mantra of a Shanahan system 

Edited January 8 by TheFunPolice

[Jerome007]

3 hours ago, UKBillFan said:

It’s why the Pro Bowl vote is so utterly stupid, and even Fins fans are seeing it now. Take Davis (which he was for some of the game) and Cook out of the Bills offense - does Josh struggle to the same extent as Tua did last night? No. Nine times out of 10 he finds a way to at least put the Bills in a winning position late on.

I have, or had, a very dim view of Tua. And was glad Miami built around him. But he does throw some amazingly great passes once in a while. Sure, these plays are schemed, but still, he places them perfectly. He simply has no grit and dog in him. 

[Mango]

Another apology from me, I said Miami fans would show up to this one. Super happy to be wrong about that one. 

 

A couple of favorites from me:
 

Quote

Last night was a disgrace. Not even a real home game.

Watching Josh Allen walk around waving thanks to his fans.... in Miami.


Every single person who sold their tickets to bills fans, should be banned for no less than 5 years from the stadium.

 

Quote

That was very disappointing.

It felt like a Bills home game.

 

Edited January 8 by Mango

[Cray51]

Just now, TheFunPolice said:

 

McDaniel had a really nice plan on offense to run the ball with those wide runs to keep the defense off balance. McDermott must have made some sort of adjustment that took that away and that was essentially their run game so they became one dimensional. 

 

The Shanahan tree/system is impressive and wins a lot of games, but from what I've read there are relatively few plays in the game plan, so if you can catch on before they get up multiple scores on you it's also quite stop able. 

 

Also, I think Hill's ankle got worse and worse as the game went on 

I believe Poyer mentioned they moved from two high to single high after the first half in an effort to stop the run.  McDaniel has great ability to scheme a gameplan on offense, but I dont think he adjusts well.  In the second half, we saw the exact same concepts and formations from the first half, and then once it was stopped a few times he just abandoned it entirely.

 

There have also been metrics that show the Dolphins get worse and worse in efficiency as games go on.  It's exactly what you said, if you stop them early, your chances of winning go up and up as the game goes on.

 

McD gets flak, but he did a great job handling Miami's offense.  It reminded me of his ability to stop the Ravens as well.  He really forces teams to win in secondary manners.  He wont let you run your offense over and over again.

[Captain Hindsight]

10 minutes ago, Beck Water said:

 

They seemed to be moving the ball quite nicely with Achane, Wilson, Cracraft, and a hampered Hill. 

 

TBH when we lost Douglas and Dodson I was concerned.

 

And kudos to McDermott for what adjustments he made defensively.

 

 

The Dolphins ran 17 plays after halftime. It was a team effort, really really impressive win 

[UKBillFan]

3 minutes ago, Jerome007 said:

I have, or had, a very dim view of Tua. And was glad Miami built around him. But he does throw some amazingly great passes once in a while. Sure, these plays are schemed, but still, he places them perfectly. He simply has no grit and dog in him. 

 

Throwing amazingly good passes once in a while shouldn't be a good enough reason to vote someone onto the Pro-Bowl roster, though. It's not just Josh who should feel hard done by; CJ Stroud could as well.

 

It is a bit daft to have the vote open so early though - think people can make their choices from week ten, when there's still a large portion of the season left.

[KingBoots8]

8 minutes ago, TheFunPolice said:

 

McDaniel had a really nice plan on offense to run the ball with those wide runs to keep the defense off balance. McDermott must have made some sort of adjustment that took that away and that was essentially their run game so they became one dimensional. 

 

The Shanahan tree/system is impressive and wins a lot of games, but from what I've read there are relatively few plays in the game plan, so if you can catch on before they get up multiple scores on you it's also quite stop able. 

 

The Shanahan plan is get up multiple scores and then just lean on you. It also cost him twice in the Super Bowl (Atlanta/NE and SF/KC) when the other teams caught on early enough and they didn't have the talent advantage to just win anyway. 

 

Also, I think Hill's ankle got worse and worse as the game went on.

 

Dolphins are a lot like the 49ers in that they had a Pro Bowl roster and were just too fast to cover. But then guys start getting hurt and the delta between them and every other offense gets smaller. Tua is still Tua, but he doesn't add much, just like Purdy. Then DC's catch onto some of what you're doing and adjust. 

 

IMO, that's why "injuries cost us a Super Bowl" is the mantra of a Shanahan system 

I wonder if his little backflip TD celebration was a great idea… 🤔

[Jerome007]

Just now, UKBillFan said:

 

Throwing amazingly good passes once in a while shouldn't be a good enough reason to vote someone onto the Pro-Bowl roster, though. It's not just Josh who should feel hard done by; CJ Stroud could as well.

 

It is a bit daft to have the vote open so early though - think people can make their choices from week ten, when there's still a large portion of the season left.

For sure. I don't think he should go to the ProBowl.  But hey, let Josh get a compensation prize: the SuperBowl

[Bruffalo]

23 minutes ago, Generic_Bills_Fan said:

I really don’t even think he’s a good qb for the mcdaniel/shanahan system either.  Tua is holding the system back imo.  Bills blitzed one time and gave tua plenty of time and he looked even more uncomfortable than usual which just can’t happen at an nfl level. Purdy runs it much better…he will at least hold the ball and attempt to make all the throws/give wrs a chance to adjust their routes.  McDaniel seems like he has training wheels on the Shanahan system to baby tua along

I don't think I would go as far as to say he's holding it back, but I'll agree he isn't doing anything to elevate it. 

[Don Otreply]

26 minutes ago, KDIGGZ said:

I don't know if this one is ignorance or stupidity or both

Both,

[NoSaint]

6 minutes ago, Cray51 said:

I believe Poyer mentioned they moved from two high to single high after the first half in an effort to stop the run.  McDaniel has great ability to scheme a gameplan on offense, but I dont think he adjusts well.  In the second half, we saw the exact same concepts and formations from the first half, and then once it was stopped a few times he just abandoned it entirely.

 

There have also been metrics that show the Dolphins get worse and worse in efficiency as games go on.  It's exactly what you said, if you stop them early, your chances of winning go up and up as the game goes on.

 

McD gets flak, but he did a great job handling Miami's offense.  It reminded me of his ability to stop the Ravens as well.  He really forces teams to win in secondary manners.  He wont let you run your offense over and over again.

I think a healthy tyreek/waddle makes that adjustment much harder but you play the hand you are dealt and it’s not like we were without injuries…. But we might’ve been blessed that their outside speed was so diminished 

[Generic_Bills_Fan]

6 minutes ago, Bruffalo said:

I don't think I would go as far as to say he's holding it back, but I'll agree he isn't doing anything to elevate it. 

It could be McDaniel just not running it as well it’s tough for me to say without being in the organization haha but it’s so odd to me that it’s like the same two-three route combinations all day that tua is throwing in the same amount of time at the same location on the field.  They’re never gonna consistently beat good teams this way it just isn’t possible.  My suspicion based on seeing tua pre McDaniel is tua is the issue but there’s no way to know for sure.  
 

seeing McDaniel praised as some offensive guru kind of makes me chuckle honestly lol. They disguise it pretty well presnap and it will fool the bad teams but it’s just too predictable for the better DCs 

Edited January 8 by Generic_Bills_Fan

[Cheektowaga Chad]

6 minutes ago, Cray51 said:

I believe Poyer mentioned they moved from two high to single high after the first half in an effort to stop the run.  McDaniel has great ability to scheme a gameplan on offense, but I dont think he adjusts well.  In the second half, we saw the exact same concepts and formations from the first half, and then once it was stopped a few times he just abandoned it entirely.

 

There have also been metrics that show the Dolphins get worse and worse in efficiency as games go on.  It's exactly what you said, if you stop them early, your chances of winning go up and up as the game goes on.

 

McD gets flak, but he did a great job handling Miami's offense.  It reminded me of his ability to stop the Ravens as well.  He really forces teams to win in secondary manners.  He wont let you run your offense over and over again.

The dolphins goal was to run the bills (or other teams) out of two high looks. The problem was they didn't have a healthy hill or waddle to take advantage

 

The dolphins offense is all timing based

 

Once teams get a feel for the timing of the offense they can stop them. Everything is speed and mis direction based so if a defense can start feeling and reading where either the rb is going to go or the floating pass tua puts to an open space. It's game over for the phins offense 

[DJB]

9 hours ago, KingBoots8 said:

In the Allen vs Tua thread:

 

”I’d take Allen 10 times a week over Tua…”

Earlier this week on Twitter Fish fans were trying to argue that Tua was better than Josh 😂

[stevewin]

2 minutes ago, Generic_Bills_Fan said:

It could be McDaniel just not running it as well it’s tough for me to say without being in the organization haha but it’s so odd to me that it’s like the same two-three route combinations all day that tua is throwing in the same amount of time at the same location on the field.  They’re never gonna consistently beat good teams this way it just isn’t possible.  My suspicion based on seeing tua pre McDaniel is tua is the issue but there’s no way to know for sure.  
 

seeing McDaniel praised as some offensive guru kind of makes me chuckle honestly lol. 

But he puts people in motion 

 

Wonder if all the media who've been bowing to the quirky greasy innovative genius are going to start to change their takes

[NoSaint]

12 minutes ago, KingBoots8 said:

I wonder if his little backflip TD celebration was a great idea… 🤔

Who knows if it hurt at all but we surely know it was a dumb risk