Damar Hamlin - Now (1/11/2023) discharged from Buf Gen & “recovering at home”

[Seventeen]

 

[RiotAct]

1 minute ago, Roy Hobbs said:

 

awesome sign.  As others have mentioned, the fact that he’s a young professional athlete likely makes his road to recovery a lot easier than, say, a 70 year old’s (notwithstanding playing pro sports is why he’s in this situation in the first place…)

[Beck Water]

 

5 hours ago, Herc11 said:

 

A couple corrections here: 

 

1) you don't ease a patient back into normal brain activity. As long as the patient is able to protect their airway, you extubate. The longer someone is intubated the more chance of complications/mortality.

 

You reduce sedation at least once per day and test the pt's ability to respond. This is called a Spontaneous Awakening Trial, SAT. Are they able to follow commands? Does the patient get agitated and try to pull the ET tube out or other lines? How are their vitals when sedation is reduced? Does HR go too high? Respiratory rate? Oxygenation? There are many things a nurse is watching for during the SAT. If they fail, you resedate them.

 

If they pass the SAT, then a Spontaneous Breathing Trial is done, SBT. For this, all sedation meds need to be off, except for precedex which helps with anxiety. We then get the RT to change the vent settings and attempt to let the patient breath on their own. Again, watch heart rate, resp. rate oxygenation. If this is passed we inform the doctor. At this time the doctor usually talks with the RT and RN and asks if they recommend extubation. 

 

2) you don't gradually rewarm the patient. There is no time period for this. Once the hypothermia protocol is discontinued, you turn off and remove the cooling blankets and let the patient return to normal temperature prior to attempting the trials in my first point. You obviously want to do this well enough ahead of attempting to awake them for their comfort. It doesn't take a significant amount of time for temp to return to normal levels.

 

3) the NFL has no say in what treatment these players are getting. This is on the doctors and the protocols of the hospital he is at and where Everett and Shazier went. Hospitals have protocols that they follow that are based on "best practies." 24-48 hrs is standard for hypothermia protocol in a post-cardiac arrest/post code patient. We use 48 hours in the ICU I work at in Fresno, California. 

 

Hi Herc,

I had that phrase in quotes because it was used in the post to which I was responding to.  I think the person in question was thinking of weaning off the vent, but unsure what exactly they meant and probably should have asked not quoted.

 

IF (and we don't know this) Damar Hamlin has been placed in a post-cardiac arrest hypothermia protocol, information on the interwebs from two major medical centers seems to differ from your corrections in terms of the protocol they use.

 

Johns Hopkins has a writeup explaining the treatment for patients and family:

https://www.hopkinsmedicine.org/health/treatment-tests-and-therapies/therapeutic-hypothermia-after-cardiac-arrest  (which someone cited upthread) says the following:

Quote

The medical team will slowly rewarm you over several hours. They may set cooling blankets at gradually higher temperatures. In some cases, they may use rewarming devices as well.

 

University of Pennsylvania has a protocol online:

https://www.med.upenn.edu/resuscitation/hypothermia/assets/user-content/documents/TherapeuticHypothermiaProtocolforCardiacArrest.pdf

Quote

Phase 3-Rewarm
 Slow controlled re-warming to avoid hemodynamic fluctuations
 Goal rate for re-warming will be 0.2-0.33C per hour until patient reaches 36.5-37.5C (This
should occur over a 17-20 hour period

 

This protocol also mentions that the patient is maintained on sedation while being cooled, maintained in hypothermia, and rewarmed (Phase 1 2 and 3).  They use the term "sedation vacation" as you use "spontaneous awakening trial":

Quote

Patients will not have a Sedation Vacation while in Phase 1-2 and 3. Sedation Vacation’s will resume in phase 4 (normothermia).

 

Last, a study in the New England Journal of Medicine comparing hypothermia to normothermia calls into question whether hypothermia has a benefit and there are several similar studies:

Quote

In conclusion, this individual patient data analysis found no benefit of hypothermia compared with normothermia with respect to mortality for patients with out-of-hospital cardiac arrest.

(possible benefit for out of hospital arrest with no bystander CPR, but this doesn't apply to Hamlin) and reiterates that the protocol is not used if the patient was conscious and responding to commands after pulse was restored (which in one interview, Hamlin's friend and marketing manager said he was at one point, prior to sedation and intubation). 

 

Again, the hypothermia protocol may not have been used, but if it was, the protocols and patient reference from two major medical centers appear to differ from your information/the protocol with which you're familiar, to say that gradual rewarming IS part of the protocol, and sedation vacations/spontaneous breathing trials are not used during hypothermia treatment.

Edited January 4, 2023 by Beck Water

[stlbills13]

I would assume the Bills players are getting at least some more frequent/detailed updates than the rest of the public. It may not be much different but I would think it's helping them cope a little better. 

[The Wiz]

 

[CorkScrewHill]

55 minutes ago, BillsFanNC said:

 

He is just one of those guys you expect will be back on the Bills on a veteran minimum contract to end his career

[Big Turk]

Wow...did not know that in terms of how things worked after you retire...

 

 

[TheFunPolice]

It's truly incredible to see the outpouring of love and support for Hamlin and his family. 

 

It's also great to hear tidbits of promising news. Waiting is the hardest thing, but there's been really nothing to say since Monday night.

[muppy]

12 hours ago, arcane said:

Amazing. But go home and get some rest, Tee. 

he feels guilty and/or just wants to be there to show Support. HE DID NOTHING  WRONG

 

I feel like we al know it likely wont be for another day or so at least .until they are READY to submit an update: I hope as a fanbase we receive the best news ASAP

 

Im just gonna say it.  I have issues with depression and anxiety. I fear that an episode like what we are experiencing is damaging too our own mental health. 

The waiting isn't easy.  But clearly also we are seriously invested in football which is why we are al here to start with. Hang On Brethren

 

To talk about football seems SO secondary CONCUR. But it would be impossible for me to not think of #3 and football or even ourselves during this situation

I

Im surprised I haven't read More Anger in the thread. Isnt it normal for something like this to have that reaction as well

 

I am just trying to deal with al of this the best I can.

 

 

PS: never, and I mean Never ever in my life have I heard people referencing The Lord, Jesus, God, PRAYER in my life as a believer in sports media and mainstream media . I can totally understand why this could cause upset on a secular football message. i dont wish to disrespect any person who that makes feel any sorta way.

 

But as I was recently reminded 'its not about us" CORRECTAMUNDO  It is about Damar Hamlin. And if our faith seeps out as we indeed pray for #3 Sorry Not sorry just sayin'. PEACE.

m

 

 

 

 

[Simon]

I've spent entirely too much time cleaning up entirely too much political and religious garbage from entirely too many people who ought to know better.

You've been asked to keep it out of here and you've ignored it.

SDS has asked you not to respond to garbage posts and you've ignored it.

 

I am ***** pissed off and you can take this is an advisory that going forward anybody who continues to ignore it is going right out the ***** door.

If you have so little respect for Damar Hamilin's situation that your personal grievances are more important, then stay the ***** out of this thread.

 

[Royale with Cheese]

I can't stop thinking about Damar's parents.  Please pull through Damar.  

[Mr. WEO]

9 minutes ago, Big Turk said:

Wow...did not know that in terms of how things worked after you retire...

 

 

Very few jobs  have the majority of full time employees retire as millionaires and still provide them with long term free healthcare/insurance. 

[Big Turk]

2 minutes ago, Mr. WEO said:

Very few jobs  have the majority of full time employees retire as millionaires and still provide them with long term free healthcare/insurance. 

 

Very few jobs take the type of physical toll football does on their body.  

Edited January 4, 2023 by Big Turk

[Beck Water]

2 hours ago, BrainwashedBillsFan said:

Right that sounds reasonable. They use the local trauma team at the hospital. I was under the impression that someone was implying the NFL had their own trauma team, paid for by the NFL who do not work on other trauma cases and that they just wait around just in case there is an injury to a player. 

 

So per information posted above, the NFL DOES have a trauma team standing by, not at the hospital but actually on the field.

 

It consists of a physician trained in Emergency care, an airway specialist, 2 paramedics, plus the physicians and trainers who travel with the visiting team and the physicians and trainers of the home team.

 

They all get together 90 minutes or an hour before the game, and discuss roles and responsibilities in different emergencies including cardiac arrest - who will maintain the airway, who will perform chest compressions, who will set up and operate the defib, presumably who will remove the facemask and pads, how the ambulance will be brought onto the field, what hospital will be used etc.

 

Links posted upthread.

 

 

 

Edited January 4, 2023 by Beck Water

[Joe Ferguson forever]

2 hours ago, Beast said:

Good question. 

as was mentioned earlier, animal and autopsy studies of commotio cordis show normal heart muscle.  It would appear the second instance of cardiac arrest is different.  Perhaps due to ARDS that it appears he has or to a preexisting underlying heart or vascular problem.  There r other possibilities: sepsis, electrolyte abnormalities, renal failure etc. Prone positioning and ventilator support are 2 treatments for ARDS.

Edited January 4, 2023 by redtail hawk

[dorquemada]

10 minutes ago, muppy said:

he feels guilty and/or just wants to be there to show Support. HE DID NOTHING  WRONG

 

 

 

That thought struck me as well.  He is, through no real fault of his own, going to bear the burden of this the rest of his life.   I work with a woman who ran over and killed a guy like 30 years ago.  She wasn't charged because it was a dark rainy night, the guy was wearing all black, and basically jumped in front of her car, but its still with her

 

[Einstein]

1 minute ago, redtail hawk said:

as was mentioned earlier, animal and autopsy studies of commotio cordis show normal heart muscle.  It would appear the second instance of cardiac arrest is different.  Perhaps due to ARDS that it appears he has or to a preexisting underlying heart or vascular problem. Prone positioning and ventilator support are 2 treatments for ARDS.

 

I read this morning that the 2nd instance of cardiac arrest at the hospital never happened. It was a misunderstanding by his uncle.

[34-78-83]

1 minute ago, redtail hawk said:

as was mentioned earlier, animal and autopsy studies of commotio cordis show normal heart muscle.  It would appear the second instance of cardiac arrest is different.  Perhaps due to ARDS that it appears he has or to a preexisting underlying heart or vascular problem. Prone positioning and ventilator support are 2 treatments for ARDS.

 

[CorkScrewHill]

4 minutes ago, redtail hawk said:

as was mentioned earlier, animal and autopsy studies of commotio cordis show normal heart muscle.  It would appear the second instance of cardiac arrest is different.  Perhaps due to ARDS that it appears he has or to a preexisting underlying heart or vascular problem. Prone positioning and ventilator support are 2 treatments for ARDS.

They corrected that statement. He only had the cardiac arrest on the field. The uncle misspoke when he said there was a second instance at the hospital 

[Ray Stonada]

Knowing the 2nd cardiac arrest didn't happen gives me a great feeling. 

 

I am hoping they will deintubate him after 48 hours, and he wakes up!

 

COME ON DAMAR. STAY WITH US!

[Ethan in Cleveland]

30 minutes ago, RiotAct said:

awesome sign.  As others have mentioned, the fact that he’s a young professional athlete likely makes his road to recovery a lot easier than, say, a 70 year old’s (notwithstanding playing pro sports is why he’s in this situation in the first place…)

Not really. I know that is an easy assumption to make but brain reperfusion and recovery is mostly determined by total time of the arrest and the adequacy of the CPR, and sadly just luck.   

[GaryPinC]

2 hours ago, Kmart128 said:

My question is if it's true his heart stopped at hospital does that indicate that the hit to the chest didnt necessarily cause the heart issue. From my understanding based off what these doctors are saying is a hit to the chest causes the heart electrical sustem to get out of whack. But if its started again with CPR or AED then it should go back to normal and its just a case of how much damage is caused. If his heart stopped again does that mean there is something underlying or could the first cardiac arrest cause multiple?

I work in cardiac research where we study rearrest and also reperfusion injury primarily to the brain.  I am not a doctor or health professional, just a bench researcher.  But a big part of our work involves animal models with clinical electrophysiologists and ER docs.

I can offer some perspectives and hopefully will keep it from getting into the scientific weeds.

 

The short answer to your question is the first cardiac arrest could cause multiple arrests, but it's truly an individual response.  The second the heart stops, in some corners of the circulatory system blood begins to clot immediately raising the risk of stroke and a massive inflammatory reaction is initiated.  The body quickly becomes hypoxic with reactive oxygen species (ROS) which damage DNA, RNA, proteins and can cause cell death.

 

In Hamlin's case, one could easily surmise he quickly became hypoxic given the physical exertion of the game.  

 

Also keep in mind that just because you restore sinus (normal) rhythm doesn't mean the heart is beating normally.  What usually happens post-arrest is despite the normal rhythm, electrical contraction(depolarization/QRS complex) is incrementally slowed(widened QRS complex) and relaxation (repolarization/T-wave) is usually a mess (ST elevation, elongated/elevated T-wave).  At this point the patient can be very susceptible to rearrest.  And this period can be as short as a couple minutes to nearly an hour in my animal model experiences.

 

Anyways, from my perspective, putting an arrest survivor under therapeutic hypothermia is about mitigating and controlling the inflammatory damage while also slowing the metabolic processes and the heart to hopefully prevent more arrests.

 

In terms of the brain, the inflammatory reaction compromises the blood/brain barrier, allowing blood and inflammatory cells into the brain to kill brain cells.  The first 24 hours are critical as the damage and cell death will evolve over the next couple of subsequent days.  Again, therapeutic hypothermia is crucial in arresting and limiting this damage.

 

I was in disbelief that the ambulance waited even 1 minute to allow Damar's mother to ride along.  Getting him to the medical center and started cooling is critical.  I just thank God he didn't rearrest in that ambulance with his mom right there.

[Ethan in Cleveland]

30 minutes ago, Beck Water said:

 

 

Hi Herc,

I had that phrase in quotes because it was used in the post to which I was responding to.  I think the person in question was thinking of weaning off the vent, but unsure what exactly they meant and probably should have asked not quoted.

 

IF (and we don't know this) Damar Hamlin has been placed in a post-cardiac arrest hypothermia protocol, information on the interwebs from two major medical centers seems to differ from your corrections in terms of the protocol they use.

 

Johns Hopkins has a writeup explaining the treatment for patients and family:

https://www.hopkinsmedicine.org/health/treatment-tests-and-therapies/therapeutic-hypothermia-after-cardiac-arrest  (which someone cited upthread) says the following:

 

University of Pennsylvania has a protocol online:

https://www.med.upenn.edu/resuscitation/hypothermia/assets/user-content/documents/TherapeuticHypothermiaProtocolforCardiacArrest.pdf

 

This protocol also mentions that the patient is maintained on sedation while being cooled, maintained in hypothermia, and rewarmed (Phase 1 2 and 3).  They use the term "sedation vacation" as you use "spontaneous awakening trial":

 

Last, a study in the New England Journal of Medicine comparing hypothermia to normothermia calls into question whether hypothermia has a benefit and there are several similar studies:

(possible benefit for out of hospital arrest with no bystander CPR, but this doesn't apply to Hamlin) and reiterates that the protocol is not used if the patient was conscious and responding to commands after pulse was restored (which in one interview, Hamlin's friend and marketing manager said he was at one point, prior to sedation and intubation). 

 

Again, the hypothermia protocol may not have been used, but if it was, the protocols and patient reference from two major medical centers appear to differ from your information/the protocol with which you're familiar, to say that gradual rewarming IS part of the protocol, and sedation vacations/spontaneous breathing trials are not used during hypothermia treatment.

Good post. The hypothermia protocol has changed over the years and there is no standard protocol used.  It sometime depends on how long the cardiac arrest is and what if any activity the patient is showing immediately at ROSC.  

You are correct a weaning trial would not be tried until the patient is fully rewarmed.  And some centers do a gradual rewarming while others simply remove the cooling device and allow the patient's temperature to rise naturally.  The reality of it is the patients temp is hard to control unless you are using an IV cooling catheter which has mostly fallen out of favor as most institutions are using non-invasive cooling means (ice bags/cooling blankets) as they are cheaper and easier to administer.

[uticaclub]

20 minutes ago, Mr. WEO said:

Very few jobs  have the majority of full time employees retire as millionaires and still provide them with long term free healthcare/insurance. 

It's a Mina Kimes interview with Foxworthy, I hope you werent expecting exceptational journalism.

[SectionC3]

42 minutes ago, Mr. WEO said:

Very few jobs  have the majority of full time employees retire as millionaires and still provide them with long term free healthcare/insurance. 

The majority don’t retire as millionaires.  And, the majority don’t retire in a traditional sense.  They just stop playing football and move on to other vocations. 
 

Nobody has a problem asking these guys to take some Toradol on any given Sunday. So nobody should have an issue asking the league and its teams to buck up for medical care.   

42 minutes ago, Mr. WEO said:

Very few jobs  have the majority of full time employees retire as millionaires and still provide them with long term free healthcare/insurance. 

And, define free. In my view, guys like Darryl Talley, for example, earned that health insurance in the field.   The fact that the payments are made after their ability to compete has ended makes no difference to me. 

Edited January 4, 2023 by SectionC3

[Ethan in Cleveland]

3 hours ago, Kmart128 said:

 

Yeah i agree. I think NFL personnel and refs on field were starting standard procedures for injuries. And then i think the teams went to locker room waiting for the NFL league office to get all the information before making a decision.

 

Also think they could have just been trying to make it look like they were gonna play again so fans dont leave and the ambulance has trouble getting to hospital with all the traffic.

Agree. There probably is some standard procedure when a prolonged injury and ambulance is used.  They likely started that process on the field before common sense kicked in that this was beyond even a terrible neck injury that we have seen sadly many too times before.  I'm not going to bash the NFL as this was truly an unprecedented event and they did the best they could.  It will be interesting to see how quickly Goodell and Troy Vincent were made aware of the events and how quickly they intervened.  Maybe that is already known but I haven't seen it. 

[Beck Water]

11 hours ago, redtail hawk said:

I found an article this morning that actually estimated the forces necessary to provoke the arrhythmia (I'm retired now so lots of time and interest, especially in this young man).  They did work on animal models as well.  Other variables included hardness of the object, position of contact (over the left ventricle was worst), age and I forget the other.  But again, 69 is an extremely low number on which to draw conclusions.  One reason I'm skeptical of the diagnosis was that at autopsy, these patients had no or little damage to the heart muscle.  Why would Damar arrest again without another blow to the chest if that were the mechanism?  There are possible explanations but it begs the question.  Finally, it looks like newer studies show closer to a 60% survival but it's not as simple as averaging the various studies.

 

If the blow throws the heart into fibrullation is that due to muscle damage, or does the blow actually damage one of the nodes or bundles?  Because if the node itself is damaged in some way (bruised?) that might explain the repeated cardiac arrest?

 

I agree you don't average studies.  My feeling is a more recent study (assuming both solid work and some procedural or treatment-based explanation of differences), it supercedes the older study.  So if a newer study says hey, portable AEDs are much more common now and that plus bystander CPR make a huge difference to survival, I regard the more recent study as superceding the old.

 

11 hours ago, boyst said:

I wonder if all these cases how many had expert help to the degree he had in just 2 minutes? 

 

As someone said up-thread, outside of a hospital, there is likely no better place to receive care for a true medical emergency than on the field at an NFL game.  And it's possibly better than a hospital, because there's a dedicated team standing by (as opposed to everyone on shift already working like mad) and they have access to something like 90-95% of the initial equipment a trauma center ER would use.

 

10 hours ago, Shake_My_Head said:

Not sure of your point.   My doubt was that there were not NFL-level doctors, trainers and ADE equipment at the games where individuals in that study died.   Prompt CPR was vital to the 10% that did survive, but that figure would probably be higher if those kids had the same resources at hand that Hamlin did.   

 

It's a good question, but you're likely correct IMO.  Also, the older 10% survival abstract says that roughly half the cases occurred at homes, playgrounds, schools etc - outside organized sports.

[EasternOHBillsFan]

10 hours ago, Beck Water said:

I don't put this out here to be a smart ass, but to counter manufactured deadlines of concern like "people SHOULD be concerned if he's still under after over 24 hrs".  We aren't his medical professionals.  We aren't treating him.  Obviously it's optimal if he's conscious and waving as he gets loaded into the ambulance, but he wasn't.  That being the case, his medical team is probably concerned about minimizing brain injury. 

 

It follows that when to be concerned depends on the treatment being administered and the expected course of treatment.

 

I understand that you're not trying to be a smart ass, that's cool. However, the word was concerned.... not ANY speculation as to his condition or what it might be or anything like that based upon ANY sort of medical diagnosis.

 

It has been over 24 hours... so you are not concerned?

[stevestojan]

I am truly impressed with the number of medical professionals, those is the field of science, and other relevant experts we have on this board. Thank you all for your unique perspectives. 
 

(re-read this and it sounded sarcastic. It’s not, I really appreciate the knowledge sharing). 

Edited January 4, 2023 by stevestojan

[Punching Bag]

3 hours ago, Roy Hobbs said:

Not sure if this is behind a paywall but the BN had this story today. 

 

https://buffalonews.com/news/local/lewiston-natives-heart-stopped-while-playing-college-baseball-hes-making-a-full-recovery/article_f4bd5c12-8baf-11ed-b59c-7fb841b8ca04.html#tracking-source=mp-homepage

 

It is a pay gate not wall meaning there is a way around it but an excellent quote on issue.

 

Quote

Doctors say DiCarlo suffered from an injury called commotio cordis, similar to a hectic disruption of the heart rhythm, throwing the heartbeat off, Dr. Alon Gitig, director of cardiology at Mount Sinai Doctors-Westchester told Parent Heart Watch, which focuses on protecting youth from sudden cardiac arrest. If the heart doesn’t get back into rhythm, it can knock a person unconscious or can be deadly, Gitig said.

 

The injury is very rare, with only 200 documented cases in the U.S. since 1995. When the sudden trauma of getting hit hard in the chest happens at a very specific time in the heartbeat cycle – a 20-millisecond span – this cardiac event can occur.

 

[OrangeBills]

11 hours ago, EasternOHBillsFan said:

 

As soon as Damar's uncle said that they had to administer CPR AGAIN at the hospital, I think that people SHOULD be concerned if he's still under after over 24 hours. This is out of concern for Damar and medical experience probably has nothing so do with it IMHO

 

They just said this was not the case, he was resuscitated just the once on the field, at least that's the latest I've heard

[Joe Ferguson forever]

3 minutes ago, Beck Water said:

 

If the blow throws the heart into fibrullation is that due to muscle damage, or does the blow actually damage one of the nodes or bundles?  Because if the node itself is damaged in some way (bruised?) that might explain the repeated cardiac arrest?

 

I agree you don't average studies.  My feeling is a more recent study (assuming both solid work and some procedural or treatment-based explanation of differences), it supercedes the older study.  So if a newer study says hey, portable AEDs are much more common now and that plus bystander CPR make a huge difference to survival, I regard the more recent study as superceding the old.

 

 

As someone said up-thread, outside of a hospital, there is likely no better place to receive care for a true medical emergency than on the field at an NFL game.  And it's possibly better than a hospital, because there's a dedicated team standing by (as opposed to everyone on shift already working like mad) and they have access to something like 90-95% of the initial equipment a trauma center ER would use.

 

 

It's a good question, but you're likely correct IMO.  Also, the older 10% survival abstract says that roughly half the cases occurred at homes, playgrounds, schools etc - outside organized sports.

from the available studies, it seems there generally is no permanent damage to the myocardium.  The mechanism of inducing the arrhythmia is postulated to be unrelated to cardiac structural changes.  It would not be surprising to see short runs of arrhythmias due to irritability of the conduction system from his overall condition (and perhaps this was misinterpreted by his uncle as cardiac arrest)..  Kidney failure and electrolyte abnormalities are possibilities but there are many more.  Hypoxia involves multiple organ systems.  I think the best we can say is that he remains profoundly ill but hopefully improving.

[H2o]

More good news. 🙏

Quote

Doctors saw promising signs of progress overnight from Damar Hamlin, who remained hospitalized in critical condition as of Wednesday morning, according to a friend and business partner of the Buffalo Bills safety.

 

https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/35377747/damar-hamlin-showed-signs-overnight-progress-friend-says

[cgang]

8 minutes ago, stevestojan said:

I am truly impressed with the number of medical professionals, those is the field of science, and other relevant experts we have on this board. Thank you all for your unique perspectives. 
 

(re-read this and it sounded sarcastic. It’s not, I really appreciate the knowledge sharing). 

I completely agree.  I’ve learned more about cardiac arrest, emergency response, and other heart ailments and details around treatment protocols (and why) than I ever thought I would.  I really appreciate what folks are bringing to the board.  It helps me make sense of things and reduces my anxiety somewhat as we patiently wait and see how Damar responds.

[Punching Bag]

1 hour ago, CEN-CAL17 said:

I’m just surprised there has been zero info from the hospital. A statement, breakdown of events…. 
 

Not saying it’s bad, just nothing other than from his personal friends and family.

 

1 hour ago, BillsFanNC said:

 

Unless they get permission from the family I don't think the hospital can release any information other than to confirm that he's there and receiving care.

 

Unless of course it is a reporter releasing information from confidential source who is illegally giving info to reporter which has happened in past.

[Beck Water]

15 minutes ago, Ethan in Cleveland said:

Good post. The hypothermia protocol has changed over the years and there is no standard protocol used.  It sometime depends on how long the cardiac arrest is and what if any activity the patient is showing immediately at ROSC.

 

One of the experts interviewed in the Times article made a point that seems relevant - that the more concerned physicians are about neurological damage, the more aggressive (meaning likely to use/likely to extend duration) they may become with sedation and hypothermia.

 

15 minutes ago, Ethan in Cleveland said:

You are correct a weaning trial would not be tried until the patient is fully rewarmed.  And some centers do a gradual rewarming while others simply remove the cooling device and allow the patient's temperature to rise naturally.  The reality of it is the patients temp is hard to control unless you are using an IV cooling catheter which has mostly fallen out of favor as most institutions are using non-invasive cooling means (ice bags/cooling blankets) as they are cheaper and easier to administer.

 

Hmmm.  Speaking with my engineer hat, the protocols must then vary depending upon the cooling devices available.  Ice bags or cooling gel packs are hard to maintain at intermediate temperatures, but a blanket featuring flexible tubing through which a bath circulates water should be able to be controlled for gradual re-warming.

[Joe Ferguson forever]

3 minutes ago, Beck Water said:

 

One of the experts interviewed in the Times article made a point that seems relevant - that the more concerned physicians are about neurological damage, the more aggressive (meaning likely to use/likely to extend duration) they may become with sedation and hypothermia.

 

 

Hmmm.  Speaking with my engineer hat, the protocols must then vary depending upon the cooling devices available.  Ice bags or cooling gel packs are hard to maintain at intermediate temperatures, but a blanket featuring flexible tubing through which a bath circulates water should be able to be controlled for gradual re-warming.

yes.  It's called a cooling blanket, strangely enough!

[Process]

 

[SydneyBillsFan]

Lots of love for number 3, keep fighting buddy! 

[YoloinOhio]