DCofNC Posted April 12, 2022 Share Posted April 12, 2022 Isn’t it nice to not be debating if Tyrod is a top 15 guy? There’s going to be somebody who likes somebody better than somebody else, no matter what. I don’t think there’s a sane person in the world that wouldn’t agree, when you talk about the best QBs in the league, Allen is in the conversation. When you are talking about a guy to build your team around, Allen might be the favorite. To me, Herbert is a better version of year 2 JA, a lesser version of year 3 JA, but the guy looks to be on the trajectory to be a great. Maholmes has had amazing success, Burrow looks damn good, Aaaaaaaaaron is always an MVP candidate, Brady is the Goat, Wilson has been a great when healthy (last year was not the norm) and Watson was a stat machine, albeit on a team that was getting blown out often, so idk what to make of him. So pick the flavor you like. JA is one of the very best in the business and still has room to grow and the attitude to want to, that’s awesome. To me, you have to look at the “would you trade them straight up for the other guy?” My answer is, I think most GMs would say there is nobody they would trade straight up for Allen or Maholmes, to me, all the others fall under, the “damn right I’d make that deal” category. So in terms of most valuable, it’s those 2, followed closely by Herbert, and Burrow. I’d bet you would find at least 50% of GMs that would swap Herbert or Burrow for Allen or Maholmes. The others are all trade-able. Age plays a part, stupid contract plays a part, injuries play a part, but when you look at it, nobody would consider trading Allen or Maholmes, unless they just preferred the other for some reason and would swap only for the other guy. They are both dynamic playmakers with enough body of success to prove they are great. Herbert has to step up and do it at a truly high level all year, Burrow though really good, not nearly as scary as the others and the others have either been traded or dangled for trade, or are 40+, that’s all you need to know. I’ll say this, there’s nobody I’d trade Allen for. He’s just as good as Maholmes and has done it with less weapons. Side note, way less drama, that’s my guy. I’m sure there are fan boys of the other guys that think their guy is better, but objectively, nah. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Wiz Posted April 12, 2022 Share Posted April 12, 2022 (edited) 7 minutes ago, Nextmanup said: Watson gets no respect at this board; I think he's quite a good QB. He's in no way better than Josh Allen though! Nor is Burrow or Herbert, at least yet. Brady has done enough to be ranked No. 1, almost as an honorary title, until he retires. Rodgers is 2 (or vice versa). But no, you wouldn't trade Allen for either of them NOW, when you consider the age differential! It's not really about not respecting Watson, he is definitely a very good QB. The question that was asked to the cast was "who are the top 5 QBs right now?" Watson hasn't played in 18 months. Could very well be out another season depending on what happens with his legal issues and is also going to a new team that doesn't play in a dome for 50% of their games. So, he's a question mark as a top 5 "right now", JMO. Edited April 12, 2022 by The Wiz 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greg S Posted April 12, 2022 Share Posted April 12, 2022 Just now, The Wiz said: It's not really about not respecting Watson, he is definitely a very good QB. The question that was asked to the cast was "who are the top 5 QBs right now?" Watson hasn't played in 18 months. Could very well be out another season depending on what happens with his legal issues and is also going to a new team that doesn't play in a dome for 50% of their games. So right now, he's a question mark as a top 5 "right now", JMO. The Texans don't play in a dome. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeGOATski Posted April 12, 2022 Share Posted April 12, 2022 ....and we're 5 pages in already. Thanks Keyshawn! 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jamiezzz Posted April 12, 2022 Share Posted April 12, 2022 I can care 2 craps about what these washed up players have to say. Whether it's opinion or not, facts or no facts. We have our Franchise QB that works for Buffalo. F them all. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billybrew1 Posted April 12, 2022 Share Posted April 12, 2022 1 hour ago, Success said: Did anyone see that heated debate on First Take just now? They were debating if Allen is a top 5 QB in the league. Keyshawn had him behind Brady, Rogers, Mahomes, Burrow, Herbert & Watson. I actually have issues w/ all of those names being ranked ahead of Allen. I get the deference for Brady, but would anyone really want him over Allen RIGHT NOW? Rogers I can understand more. Herbert has done nothing in the league. Burrow looks to be very good, but hasn't shown nearly the versatility & clutch play that Allen has (imo). But Watson? I don't really get it - not just Keyshawn's take, but a still fairly large group of pundits who can't seem to break away from what they thought of Allen in the draft, or his rookie season. I get that it's not that important, and in general, prefer it when the Bills are disrespected, but it just seems like I'm living on a different planet than some of these guys. EDIT: he also had Mahomes ahead of Allen (which is one I completely get, though I think is closer than most) Allen is easily the best QB in the league right now. If it wasn’t for our knuckle-headed coaches he would have one notch on the belt already. What a gyp! I kind of hope we get Jameson or Watson in round one and let our OCs (we have four former or current OCs) tear defenses apart…. Could you imagine, Watson then Walker? That’s some cereal speed! LOL, I hope we do it. Sign Gilmore draft a good corner in the third…. If there’s a corner in fourth take him too… Now that’s an offense designed to win Super Bowls without the need of a great defense (which is rare). 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Patrick Duffy Posted April 12, 2022 Share Posted April 12, 2022 1 minute ago, Greg S said: The Texans don't play in a dome. Well they can close the roof making it a dome lol. I don't know how many times they have done that though if any Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Wiz Posted April 12, 2022 Share Posted April 12, 2022 3 minutes ago, Greg S said: The Texans don't play in a dome. Just now, Sheneneh Jenkins said: Well they can close the roof making it a dome lol. I don't know how many times they have done that though if any Retractable roof, dome. Either way, compared to open air in Cleveland I'm sure it is a big difference (especially late in the season). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
78thealltimegreat Posted April 12, 2022 Share Posted April 12, 2022 (edited) 1 hour ago, DrDawkinstein said: Its all so subjective, but outside of my fandom, I'd try to put together an objective list that looks like: Brady Rodgers Mahomes Allen Burrow The first 3 all have SB victories, so they have an advantage. I've seen lists that have Allen #3 behind Brady and Rodgers. Allen #1 after this season tho. Seriously you have Rogers? He sees a 49ers jersey and turns into a pumpkin Edited April 12, 2022 by 78thealltimegreat 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Man with No Name Posted April 12, 2022 Share Posted April 12, 2022 3 minutes ago, Greg S said: The Texans don't play in a dome. They do play in a dome, and they very rarely open it. they went 6 years without opening it at one point. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greg S Posted April 12, 2022 Share Posted April 12, 2022 1 minute ago, Sheneneh Jenkins said: Well they can close the roof making it a dome lol. I don't know how many times they have done that though if any I didn't even know they had a roof to close. Every Texans home game I have seen was open air. Of course the weather doesn't get all that bad in Houston either. Maybe hot but that's about it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
78thealltimegreat Posted April 12, 2022 Share Posted April 12, 2022 People need to remember Johnson was a Jet he absolutely despises the Bills I’m surprised he didn’t have Zach Wilson Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Patrick Duffy Posted April 12, 2022 Share Posted April 12, 2022 1 minute ago, Greg S said: I didn't even know they had a roof to close. Every Texans home game I have seen was open air. Of course the weather doesn't get all that bad in Houston either. Maybe hot but that's about it. Yeah I always knew they had the retractable roof, but just didn't pay enough attention to them to be sure how often they closed it. But yeah, kinda weird teams in places with mostly nice weather play in domes Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shaw66 Posted April 12, 2022 Share Posted April 12, 2022 28 minutes ago, Sheneneh Jenkins said: What makes you believe this?? I see nothing that makes one come to that conclusion. Looking back when Watson did take off with the ball and comparing to what we have seen Allen do running, there's absolutely nothing there to come to this conclusion. If anything Allen has all the "jaw dropping, amazing" plays making one question if he's human or not. I'm not saying Watson isn't a good runner, just have no idea where you believe he is better than Allen. I don't know how old this video - it doesn't have his great scramble that won the playoff game against the Bills - but it's tough to deny how well he runs the ball. https://www.facebook.com/watch/?v=529136024701547 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billybrew1 Posted April 12, 2022 Share Posted April 12, 2022 12 minutes ago, DCofNC said: Isn’t it nice to not be debating if Tyrod is a top 15 guy? There’s going to be somebody who likes somebody better than somebody else, no matter what. I don’t think there’s a sane person in the world that wouldn’t agree, when you talk about the best QBs in the league, Allen is in the conversation. When you are talking about a guy to build your team around, Allen might be the favorite. To me, Herbert is a better version of year 2 JA, a lesser version of year 3 JA, but the guy looks to be on the trajectory to be a great. Maholmes has had amazing success, Burrow looks damn good, Aaaaaaaaaron is always an MVP candidate, Brady is the Goat, Wilson has been a great when healthy (last year was not the norm) and Watson was a stat machine, albeit on a team that was getting blown out often, so idk what to make of him. So pick the flavor you like. JA is one of the very best in the business and still has room to grow and the attitude to want to, that’s awesome. To me, you have to look at the “would you trade them straight up for the other guy?” My answer is, I think most GMs would say there is nobody they would trade straight up for Allen or Maholmes, to me, all the others fall under, the “damn right I’d make that deal” category. So in terms of most valuable, it’s those 2, followed closely by Herbert, and Burrow. I’d bet you would find at least 50% of GMs that would swap Herbert or Burrow for Allen or Maholmes. The others are all trade-able. Age plays a part, stupid contract plays a part, injuries play a part, but when you look at it, nobody would consider trading Allen or Maholmes, unless they just preferred the other for some reason and would swap only for the other guy. They are both dynamic playmakers with enough body of success to prove they are great. Herbert has to step up and do it at a truly high level all year, Burrow though really good, not nearly as scary as the others and the others have either been traded or dangled for trade, or are 40+, that’s all you need to know. I’ll say this, there’s nobody I’d trade Allen for. He’s just as good as Maholmes and has done it with less weapons. Side note, way less drama, that’s my guy. I’m sure there are fan boys of the other guys that think their guy is better, but objectively, nah. Herbert hasn’t shown the ability yet to make something out of nothing. He is not athletic enough nor powerful enough to extend plays like Allen does. Just wait if our line is better from week one on, what Allen will do…there will be no more jax games. He will be unstoppable. Just wanted to add that no QB is nfl history has had protection like Tom Brady. It was ridiculous how well he was protected. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clearwater cadet Posted April 12, 2022 Share Posted April 12, 2022 Ranking are like #######, everyone got one, and most are full of crap. I'm happy with Josh, and would not trade him for anyone on that list. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Patrick Duffy Posted April 12, 2022 Share Posted April 12, 2022 1 minute ago, Shaw66 said: I don't know how old this video - it doesn't have his great scramble that won the playoff game against the Bills - but it's tough to deny how well he runs the ball. https://www.facebook.com/watch/?v=529136024701547 I didn't deny he runs the ball well. I specifically referred to your statement that he ran the ball better than Allen. That, I did deny. There's nothing at all that suggest he is and simply have no idea what makes you think he is. If anything, comparing the 2 as runners, everything points to Allen being better running the ball... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shaw66 Posted April 12, 2022 Share Posted April 12, 2022 3 minutes ago, Sheneneh Jenkins said: I didn't deny he runs the ball well. I specifically referred to your statement that he ran the ball better than Allen. That, I did deny. There's nothing at all that suggest he is and simply have no idea what makes you think he is. If anything, comparing the 2 as runners, everything points to Allen being better running the ball... Your opinion and mine. I'm okay with it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Success Posted April 12, 2022 Author Share Posted April 12, 2022 1 hour ago, JaCrispy said: I don’t understand the obsession with Burrow...I get that he is good and was taken #1... but people just act like he is the ‘second coming’...I don’t see it... 100% agree on this. He's a nice QB, but he hasn't shown anything near what Mahomes & Allen have shown so far. I don't see how anyone objectively could put Burrow ahead of either of those guys. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shaw66 Posted April 12, 2022 Share Posted April 12, 2022 7 minutes ago, clearwater cadet said: I'm happy with Josh, and would not trade him for anyone on that list. And that is the only point worth talking about. Frankly, I think ten or fifteen years from now, people won't be debating whether he's in the top 5 in the league. They'll be debating whether he's in the top 5 all time. The experts always said he had a high ceiling; they just debated whether he ever could overcome all the flaws they thought they saw. Now it's only question of how hard he's going to hit his head on the ceiling. 2 1 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dopey Posted April 12, 2022 Share Posted April 12, 2022 I remember Watson being really damn good his last 2 years. Doing some incredible things on the field. He has taken some time off. Will that affect him? Maybe, but it's not like they're saying Tua or Sam Darnold is better. Watson was really, really good before his issues. Like top 5 good, if not higher. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Success Posted April 12, 2022 Author Share Posted April 12, 2022 6 minutes ago, Dopey said: I remember Watson being really damn good his last 2 years. Doing some incredible things on the field. He has taken some time off. Will that affect him? Maybe, but it's not like they're saying Tua or Sam Darnold is better. Watson was really, really good before his issues. Like top 5 good, if not higher. I guess my memory isn't that good - others on the thread have said the same. I have never been all that impressed w/ him. He has a lot of skills, but I just don't put him on the level of an Allen or Mahomes, and I'd even say Herbert & Burrow are better (among the younger QB's). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Patrick Duffy Posted April 12, 2022 Share Posted April 12, 2022 14 minutes ago, Shaw66 said: Your opinion and mine. I'm okay with it. Yes, I respect that. I'm just curious what you see to think that because I can't find anything at all. Or maybe you're yanking my chain? Lol...there isn't any QB I can think off top of my head other than Lamar running the ball that can top those amazing plays we have seen Allen from his rookie year til most recent season. Did you confuse Watson with Lamar maybe? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dopey Posted April 12, 2022 Share Posted April 12, 2022 (edited) 8 minutes ago, Success said: I guess my memory isn't that good - others on the thread have said the same. I have never been all that impressed w/ him. He has a lot of skills, but I just don't put him on the level of an Allen or Mahomes, and I'd even say Herbert & Burrow are better (among the younger QB's). WARNING: Don't watch the play at the 1 minute mark. It's a magical play...vs us in the playoffs. Edited April 12, 2022 by Dopey 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RoyBatty is alive Posted April 12, 2022 Share Posted April 12, 2022 2 hours ago, Success said: Did anyone see that heated debate on First Take just now? They were debating if Allen is a top 5 QB in the league. Keyshawn had him behind Brady, Rogers, Mahomes, Burrow, Herbert & Watson. I actually have issues w/ all of those names being ranked ahead of Allen. I get the deference for Brady, but would anyone really want him over Allen RIGHT NOW? Rogers I can understand more. Herbert has done nothing in the league. Burrow looks to be very good, but hasn't shown nearly the versatility & clutch play that Allen has (imo). But Watson? I don't really get it - not just Keyshawn's take, but a still fairly large group of pundits who can't seem to break away from what they thought of Allen in the draft, or his rookie season. I get that it's not that important, and in general, prefer it when the Bills are disrespected, but it just seems like I'm living on a different planet than some of these guys. EDIT: he also had Mahomes ahead of Allen (which is one I completely get, though I think is closer than most) Give Credit to Watson, imo, he had one of the great NFL playoff comebacks of all time versus the Bills and Josh Allen. I would say it was 90% Watson taking the team on his back and willing the Texans to win. Down 16 point middle of Q3 he wins. No that was spectacular, the one play where Watson escaped two would be tacklers was a hard to believe play. And I am big a fan as anyone of Allen but you have to give Watson credit. I would rather have Perfect fit for Buffalo, great guy...can anyone say the same thing about watson? Plus Watson is off now for a year. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Augie Posted April 12, 2022 Share Posted April 12, 2022 2 hours ago, Royale with Cheese said: He's the betting favorite to win the MVP. That means more than Keyshawn "Throw me the damn ball" Johnson says. If Keyshawn or Booger are talking, I try to be listening to something else. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NewEra Posted April 12, 2022 Share Posted April 12, 2022 Keyshawn….nuff said. He’ll be fired and looking for work within the year imo. Not made for tv….or radio….No one wants to hear his ignant takes. If you know nba basketball well and you want to have some laughs, listen to any Keyshawn take on the nba. Dude is so far off I can’t comprehend how he gets paid for his takes. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John from Riverside Posted April 12, 2022 Share Posted April 12, 2022 Availability is the best ability Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nedboy7 Posted April 12, 2022 Share Posted April 12, 2022 At what? Creeping out their massage therapists? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
H2o Posted April 12, 2022 Share Posted April 12, 2022 #1. Brady is still Brady, even at 45 until we see him fall off #2. Rodgers still does everything he did 10 years ago #3. Mahomes I give the slightest of edges to over Allen. That's likely to be a different view after the upcoming season with no Tyreek Hill. #4. Allen, who is still climbing this list and hasn't even reached his full potential yet. #5. Burrow is exactly who they drafted him to be and will continue to grow. #6. Herbert is well on his way also. #7. Lamar Jackson. Despite his inconsistencies, he's still a bigger threat than anyone else below him. #8. Matt Stafford. LA traded for him and they win the SB. His numbers speak for themselves. #9. Deshaun Watson belongs here. 4 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Utah John Posted April 12, 2022 Share Posted April 12, 2022 There are at least 12 QBs that you could reasonably put on a Top 5 list. It's a silly argument. God I hate the offseason. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsFanForever19 Posted April 12, 2022 Share Posted April 12, 2022 Keyshawn is a Josh hater. He's always slighting him. I think at this point it's an attention seeking gimmick. Not quite the level of Nick Wright, but in the same vein. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ALLEN1QB Posted April 12, 2022 Share Posted April 12, 2022 (edited) Keyshawn is a big dope. I refuse to listen to his show. I still can't believe they fired MG for him. Edited April 12, 2022 by ALLEN1QB Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warcodered Posted April 12, 2022 Share Posted April 12, 2022 13 minutes ago, H2o said: #1. Brady is still Brady, even at 45 until we see him fall off #2. Rodgers still does everything he did 10 years ago #3. Mahomes I give the slightest of edges to over Allen. That's likely to be a different view after the upcoming season with no Tyreek Hill. #4. Allen, who is still climbing this list and hasn't even reached his full potential yet. #5. Burrow is exactly who they drafted him to be and will continue to grow. #6. Herbert is well on his way also. #7. Lamar Jackson. Despite his inconsistencies, he's still a bigger threat than anyone else below him. #8. Matt Stafford. LA traded for him and they win the SB. His numbers speak for themselves. #9. Deshaun Watson belongs here. This seems like a pretty fair list, I think there is a lot of hype on Watson right now because he's essentially a confirmed franchise QB that the only thing missing is getting to the big game and winning it, that's a big deal so for the last couple years there's been all this talk about teams mortgaging their futures in order to get him. This has made people think he's at the top of the pile which just isn't true yet, he's definitely a guy a franchise player but so are the rest of them on this list and he hasn't done enough to prove he's above them yet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheFunPolice Posted April 12, 2022 Share Posted April 12, 2022 Watson is good, but I never saw him as a top 5 QB. I would take Allen, Jackson, Burrow, Mahomes and Herbert over him, with Russell Wilson being a 50/50 call and that's just the AFC. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Firebaugh Kid Posted April 12, 2022 Share Posted April 12, 2022 Keyshawn is a ******* douche. Always hates on Buffalo. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wppete Posted April 12, 2022 Share Posted April 12, 2022 Cmon. Anyone with half a brain understands what’s happening here. 3 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Logic Posted April 12, 2022 Share Posted April 12, 2022 Aside from throwing a football well, the thing I really like about Josh is that he doesn’t sexually assault massage therapists. 1 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Man with No Name Posted April 12, 2022 Share Posted April 12, 2022 2 hours ago, Sheneneh Jenkins said: Yeah I always knew they had the retractable roof, but just didn't pay enough attention to them to be sure how often they closed it. But yeah, kinda weird teams in places with mostly nice weather play in domes it is interesting that every professional stadium in houston has a dome. astrodome, minute maid and reliant. never paid much attention to reliant, but looked it up and it is a fabric retractable roof. saw an article from 2019 or 2020 saying they were opening it up for first time in 6 years. opens in 6 minutes! i guess they like to keep it shut for crowd noise, not weather. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CSBill Posted April 12, 2022 Share Posted April 12, 2022 3 hours ago, Warcodered said: So he had Watson, Herbert and Burrow ahead of Josh and Mahomes...that's just stupid. That’s just being stupid for stupid’s sake. Further evidence of why I do not watch or listen to anything he is on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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