Pats* WR Harry requesting a trade

[Rocky Landing]

3 minutes ago, Capco said:

 

Someone needs to throw New England a bone...

I'll bet in '21 even the refs have run out of bones for NE.

[CSBill]

4 hours ago, Royale with Cheese said:

He probably just doesn't want Cam or Jones throwing to him.

Well, what NFL caliber receiver would???

[Hapless Bills Fan]

31 minutes ago, Rocky Landing said:

I'll bet in '21 even the refs have run out of bones for NE.

 

All of our Bones Belong to Tampa Now

[Hapless Bills Fan]

3 hours ago, Ghost_002! said:

 

 

So these grown ass men  signed and NEVER got the 411 on BB? Ha ha  Nah why would they not do their homework on where they are signing first..ha ha

 

This a joke. Ha ha 

 

I mean, maybe they wanted to play for Brady and NE.  Or, maybe NE offered them the best deal by a bit and they figured "Money Changes Everything"

 

Jonnu Smith signed a $50M contract with $31.25M guaranteed (paid in 3 years)

Hunter Henry signed a $37.5M contract with $25M guaranteed (paid in the 1st 2 years)

They were by far the most expensive TE in FA, top-10 for guaranteed money (Smith top-5) and top-15 for FA AAV overall.

 

That's life-changing $$, and it's hardly the sort of deal NE used to get where guys would take a discount because they wanted a shot to be on that team.

 

I think that's kind of the point.

 

In addition, as I noted, signing up to be short passing game TE option on a run-heavy team figures to be a stat-building situation for a TE, but a stat-sapping situation for a deep threat WR

3 hours ago, HereComesTheReignAgain said:

Henry and Smith are "top end" TE's?  You could make the argument for Henry being top 10, but Smith has never averaged more than 30 yards per game in his career.  He averaged 5 yards per game more than Knox did in 2020.

 

Yeah, in terms of YPG for a TE I think Henry was #9 last season and Smith is #22 or something.  But unless I mistake, Smith's strong suit is his blocking abilities which are very solid, while his pass-catching is just good enough that you better pay attention to him or he'll burn ya.

[DCofNC]

Yeah.. they might give it to him, simply because it’s more than cutting him.

 

if take a flyer on him for the PS, not sold he’s any better than the guys at the bottom of this roster.  Would have to thinks he would be NO BETTER than #4 here, that’s assuming he made progress.

[White Linen]

I wanted him more than any WR coming out in that draft.  I'd still like to have him.  

[BobbyC81]

5 hours ago, RoyBatty is alive said:

He is requesting a trade because it is doubtful if he makes their 53 man roster this year, nothing to read into it about their QB situation.

New England did go for WRs in free agency, but if this guy is afraid to compete against Agholor and Bourne,  fogettaboutit.

[Putin]

5 hours ago, CommonCents said:

You’re doing it wrong Harry. You struggle getting off the LOS, ask for a free release not a trade. 

 

The Bills have 2 or 3 WRs that won’t make the 53 which are better options than Harry. 

Another Great pick by the great BB 

40 minutes ago, White Linen said:

I wanted him more than any WR coming out in that draft.  I'd still like to have him.  

Get him on your fantasy team you’ll make a killing 

[CommonCents]

32 minutes ago, Putin said:

Another Great pick by the great BB 

Get him on your fantasy team you’ll make a killing 

He is hard to explain. NFL’s version of the Brawny Man on a pack of 3 ply Angel Soft. 

[YoloinOhio]

5 minutes ago, CommonCents said:

He is hard to explain. NFL’s version of the Brawny Man on a pack of 3 ply Angel Soft. 

Looks like Tarzan, plays like Jane

[atlbillsfan1975]

3 hours ago, Ghost_002! said:

 

 

What sense are you making?

 

Where in this thread have I said anything about winning a championship? 

I am asking, when will you admit that Belichick is overrated? That without Brady the Pats would never have been what they were, and now they are nothing more than a mediocre team with a mediocre coach. Every year Bill’s legacy will grow worse. 

[ROCBillsBeliever]

7 hours ago, Albany,n.y. said:

That's what I thought so since you beat me to it, all I have left is the snark I was going to include in my post:

 

Next thing we'll hear about Harry is he running around naked threatening to jump out a window.  

 

 

Cyrus... Cyrus... The cows are calling for you 

[Jauronimo]

3 hours ago, atlbillsfan1975 said:

I am asking, when will you admit that Belichick is overrated? That without Brady the Pats would never have been what they were, and now they are nothing more than a mediocre team with a mediocre coach. Every year Bill’s legacy will grow worse. 

He's still a great coach.  His draft record isn't so hot and it seems that maybe teams finally stopped gifting them hall of fame talents for day 3 draft picks.

[LeGOATski]

This kid has the right attitude. He was a real stand-up guy at ASU. Maybe he does just need a change of scenery/culture. 

[machine gun kelly]

BB is an excellent coach, but you’re not going anywhere without a QB, and BB’s antics aren’t so tolerable when you’re not winning, and you don’t have a top flight QB.

 

Cam is washed up and AL QB’s  historically have not panned out in the NFL.  It’s funny their other skill players are the best in the NCAA let SEC, but QB, not so much.  Jones even if he works out will need a lot of time to develop.  BB did the best he could by bolstering and relying on short TE and tall WR passes and a running game.  That only allows you to beat average teams.  
 

I seriously doubt the Pats will have anything more than a 9-8 season which is perfect.  Picking

low enough in the draft to not get a superstar and missing another playoff run.

 

It is not a good sign when you’re 1st

round WR from last year wants out.

[GunnerBill]

14 hours ago, H2o said:

Just saw this. I mean his QB situation was meh last year, but I think the agent is making his client out to be more than he actually is. 

 

https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/31770745/agent-requests-wr-nkeal-harry-traded-new-england-patriots

 

Agree. I always thought it was a bizarre pick. Not because Harry doesn't have the talent to play in the NFL, he does, but he is a bad fit for an E-P spread style offense like the one New England have run in the Brady era and the one Daboll has now installed in Buffalo that really requires guys who can separate early in routes. There are still NFL schemes where the skillset of a Harry type can work. I think he could play in the Arthur Smith version of the stretch zone WCO and be reasonably successful, I actually think he could play as a big slot in the Greg Roman scheme too or possibly in the Scott Turner offense in Washington which traditionally from his dad has liked bigger bodies outside (and Fitz has had success with that type of player). I am not surprised it hasn't worked in New England. Just never felt like a scheme fit. 

[JMF2006]

The Patriot Way  

 

 

[Ridgewaycynic2013]

11 hours ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

All of our Bones Belong to Tampa Now

Awwwww...how could they say 'no' to the poor little guy?!

[Kwai San]

15 hours ago, TheFunPolice said:

2 things:

 

1. When it's all said and done, Andy Reid will have more career wins than Belichick

2. Harry is just upset because his rookie QB looks like a middle aged congressman smoking a cigar in a tweed jacket

 

 

I dunno about that....would be a nice thought but Andy (196) needs over 100 wins to catch BB (311) even if BB does nothing!!!

[atlbillsfan1975]

6 hours ago, Jauronimo said:

He's still a great coach.  His draft record isn't so hot and it seems that maybe teams finally stopped gifting them hall of fame talents for day 3 draft picks.

He has made a couple of great decisions like Brady over Bledsoe after Bledsoe healed. His best coaching might have been a season in Cleveland. Even then though, he was surrounded by people who would go on to show they are pretty darn good themselves at coaching and finding players.

[GunnerBill]

14 minutes ago, atlbillsfan1975 said:

He has made a couple of great decisions like Brady over Bledsoe after Bledsoe healed. His best coaching might have been a season in Cleveland. Even then though, he was surrounded by people who would go on to show they are pretty darn good themselves at coaching and finding players.

 

I think getting that Pats team to 7-9 last year was a darn fine coaching job. The now departed @Kirby Jackson said before the season the talent was 5 win talent at best. He was right. 

 

[Hapless Bills Fan]

10 hours ago, atlbillsfan1975 said:

I am asking, when will you admit that Belichick is overrated? That without Brady the Pats would never have been what they were, and now they are nothing more than a mediocre team with a mediocre coach. Every year Bill’s legacy will grow worse. 

 

Two things can be true at once:

1) without Brady, the Pats would never have become the dynasty they were

AND

2) Bill Belichick**** is a very very good football coach.

 

Take him and take the Pats**** lightly at your peril

 

What he may not be, is a capable GM/college scout/pro personnel evaluator AND coach.  Even if you're well above average at 3 jobs, by the time you're adding 3 jobs together you may not have the time to give it.

 

Then there's also the "ruthless in pursuit of a competitive advantage" thing

[Simon Says]

18 hours ago, Virgil said:

If we weren’t so crowded at WR, I’d love to acquire him and turn his career around.  Have him throw up a 10 reception, 150 yard game against the Hoodie 

NOT gonna happen. If Bills acquired him, Diggs would go on strike.  No way they could make both of these guys happy.

[Kwai San]

16 hours ago, Ghost_002! said:

https://www.pff.com/news/nfl-pff-tight-end-rankings-2021-nfl-season

 

They were 1st and 3rd respectively in this year free agent class. And

 

Has Hunter ranked 10th

And Smith ranked 12th Among tight ends...

 

Yer new here we get it.  PFF isn't the be all and end all of information in fact we laugh at it here.

 

10th and 12 are now TOP END TE's??!?!?!?!?  Did you get your 5th place trophy a lot growing up?  Shouldn't you be over on the ***Pats board whining about something or another?

 

SMFH....

[John from Riverside]

now that is an agent earning his money

[Mr. WEO]

Pats to agent:  your client has zero trade value.

[Mr. WEO]

11 hours ago, atlbillsfan1975 said:

I am asking, when will you admit that Belichick is overrated? That without Brady the Pats would never have been what they were, and now they are nothing more than a mediocre team with a mediocre coach. Every year Bill’s legacy will grow worse. 

 

This is a very good point.  Imagine how many SBs Bill Walsh would have won with a 2020 Cam Newton!

[Warcodered]

3 hours ago, machine gun kelly said:

BB is an excellent coach, but you’re not going anywhere without a QB, and BB’s antics aren’t so tolerable when you’re not winning, and you don’t have a top flight QB.

 

Cam is washed up and AL QB’s  historically have not panned out in the NFL.  It’s funny their other skill players are the best in the NCAA let SEC, but QB, not so much.  Jones even if he works out will need a lot of time to develop.  BB did the best he could by bolstering and relying on short TE and tall WR passes and a running game.  That only allows you to beat average teams.  
 

I seriously doubt the Pats will have anything more than a 9-8 season which is perfect.  Picking

low enough in the draft to not get a superstar and missing another playoff run.

 

It is not a good sign when you’re 1st

round WR from last year wants out.

The thing with Alabama QBs I think is that with the amount of talent they have around them if they're NFL level they shouldn't just be good they should be prolific.

[GunnerBill]

27 minutes ago, Mr. WEO said:

 

This is a very good point.  Imagine how many SBs Bill Walsh would have won with a 2020 Cam Newton!

 

35,004 posts in and I think this might be your best yet 😆. I actually spat out my tea when laughing. 

[Kwai San]

17 hours ago, Ghost_002! said:

 

And Allen was not lighting anything on fire going into this past season so that seemed to be a fair assessment of him. Th

 

ALL credibility thrown out the window right there with that big brain statement.....ALL.

[PatsFanNH]

19 hours ago, JimmyNoodles said:

Translation...QB's here suck.  

No, true translation “you can’t fire me I quit” this guy has been open 25% of the time he has been on the field which ranks 99th out of 100 . He is one of the worst receivers in the league in getting open and even worse he is never healthy.  
 

hell last year Newton called an audible and he was staring like a deer in the headlights till Edelman moved him off the line of scrimmage.. CAM KNEW THE PLAYBOOK BETTER THAN HIM! 🤦🏻‍♂️ 

2 hours ago, GunnerBill said:

 

I think getting that Pats team to 7-9 last year was a darn fine coaching job. The now departed @Kirby Jackson said before the season the talent was 5 win talent at best. He was right. 

 

I do believe the Pats roster was considered last year be ranked 29th or 30th? The talent level was horrid on the team but for the most part the competed almost every week. 

[GunnerBill]

3 minutes ago, PatsFanNH said:

No, true translation “you can’t fire me I quit” this guy has been open 25% of the time he has been on the field which ranks 99th out of 100 . He is one of the worst receivers in the league in getting open and even worse he is never healthy.  
 

hell last year Newton called an audible and he was staring like a deer in the headlights till Edelman moved him off the line of scrimmage.. CAM KNEW THE PLAYBOOK BETTER THAN HIM! 🤦🏻‍♂️ 

 

Yep, see my post above, I just never liked the fit of him into an E-P principles offense that runs a fair amount (or did before last year at least) of spread concepts. Do you have any insight as to what the thought process was behind drafting him? I always had AJ Brown down as the best WR in that class and he just seemed such a natural fit for what the Patriots do to pass on him in favour of Harry mystified me from day 1. There may be offenses in which Harry could be effective - but the Patriots offense never felt like it to me. Any views?

[PatsFanNH]

Just now, GunnerBill said:

 

Yep, see my post above, I just never liked the fit of him into an E-P principles offense that runs a fair amount (or did before last year at least) of spread concepts. Do you have any insight as to what the thought process was behind drafting him? I always had AJ Brown down as the best WR in that class and he just seemed such a natural fit for what the Patriots do to pass on him in favour of Harry mystified me from day 1. There may be offenses in which Harry could be effective - but the Patriots offense never felt like it to me. Any views?

The thought process is (per talking heads up here at the time) he was a big body who Brady could throw to in the red zone and he could go up and get the ball.  I myself didn’t know a lot about him at the time. I was so excited for that pick because I thought for sure they pick DK Metcalf since he was still there when they picked. 
 

I wasn’t happy with the pick but like any pats fan who is telling the truth, I trusted BB to know what he is doing.  

[machine gun kelly]

27 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

35,004 posts in and I think this might be your best yet 😆. I actually spat out my tea when laughing. 

We’ll, of course GB had to say tea.  Luv ya GB.  Pip pip.

[GunnerBill]

7 minutes ago, PatsFanNH said:

The thought process is (per talking heads up here at the time) he was a big body who Brady could throw to in the red zone and he could go up and get the ball.  I myself didn’t know a lot about him at the time. I was so excited for that pick because I thought for sure they pick DK Metcalf since he was still there when they picked. 
 

I wasn’t happy with the pick but like any pats fan who is telling the truth, I trusted BB to know what he is doing.  

 

I just think that view from the talking heads kind of ignores how the Pats had been doing it for years. Okay I know Gronk could jump ball anybody but when you actually look at a lot of his touchdowns over the years he wins with separation and body position giving Tom a window to fit it in. DK would have been a better pick than Harry, granted, but to me he wasn't a perfect scheme fit either and AJ Brown was the guy. Best receiver in that class in my view, best scheme fit for what the Pats run, I think I said that night when they went on the clock in our draft thread "Got to be a receiver, AJ Brown is still there, he is perfect for them."

[PatsFanNH]

6 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

I just think that view from the talking heads kind of ignores how the Pats had been doing it for years. Okay I know Gronk could jump ball anybody but when you actually look at a lot of his touchdowns over the years he wins with separation and body position giving Tom a window to fit it in. DK would have been a better pick than Harry, granted, but to me he wasn't a perfect scheme fit either and AJ Brown was the guy. Best receiver in that class in my view, best scheme fit for what the Pats run, I think I said that night when they went on the clock in our draft thread "Got to be a receiver, AJ Brown is still there, he is perfect for them."

True, but I never thought Harry be this brittle or bad when they picked him.  AJ Broen would been a hell of a pick too! As for being better I think any other WR been a better choice! Lol

 

 Hell I am high in Jacoby Meyers right now,a undrafted WR from the same class,  I expect he will be the breakout WR for them this year with over 1000 yards receiving and 5 TDs.  (He had over 700 yards and 3 TDs last year in 12 games.. so if healthy I don’t think my prediction is crazy)

[GunnerBill]

12 minutes ago, PatsFanNH said:

True, but I never thought Harry be this brittle or bad when they picked him.  AJ Broen would been a hell of a pick too! As for being better I think any other WR been a better choice! Lol

 

 Hell I am high in Jacoby Meyers right now,a undrafted WR from the same class,  I expect he will be the breakout WR for them this year with over 1000 yards receiving and 5 TDs.  (He had over 700 yards and 3 TDs last year in 12 games.. so if healthy I don’t think my prediction is crazy)

 

I like Jakobi - and he is a guy who is able to separate despite not really possessing anything approaching elite speed because he has good footwork and I love the way he breaks off his routes and explodes out of the break. He wins with precise feet. I am not sure I see a 1,000 yard receiver there I think he is more of a solid #2 type possession receiver (he has very good hands) who will put up 650-850 yards consistently but then a Robert Woods type who fits that description too and who we had here for a bit has had a couple of 1,000 yard seasons in the right scheme so it is not impossible. Jakobi is much more of a New England style receiver than Harry ever was to me. 

[dollars 2 donuts]

20 hours ago, Royale with Cheese said:

He probably just doesn't want Cam or Jones throwing to him.

 

20 hours ago, JimmyNoodles said:

Translation...QB's here suck.  

 

20 hours ago, Warcodered said:

Real hard to get players to put up with Belichick's hard ass ***** without a goat in lock step with him.

 

 

A weird segway and not necessarily tangential to the post, but I can't help thinking about this...regardless of Harry's skill, but just in general what WRs go through, without thinking, "Eric Mould had an exceptional career here in Buffalo considering who he had throwing to him for the greater part of his career."

 

In the last 8 years of his Buffalo career, 626 receptions (78.25 avg), 8,523 yards (1,065.38 avg), with 46 TDs (5.75 avg).

 

Honestly, still an underrated Bill, in my mind.

 

 

Honestly.

[DJB]

So good landing spots for Harry would be CFL, XFL or a team with a horrendous WR group would make sense. New England? 

[PatsFanNH]

27 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

I like Jakobi - and he is a guy who is able to separate despite not really possessing anything approaching elite speed because he has good footwork and I love the way he breaks off his routes and explodes out of the break. He wins with precise feet. I am not sure I see a 1,000 yard receiver there I think he is more of a solid #2 type possession receiver (he has very good hands) who will put up 650-850 yards consistently but then a Robert Woods type who fits that description too and who we had here for a bit has had a couple of 1,000 yard seasons in the right scheme so it is not impossible. Jakobi is much more of a New England style receiver than Harry ever was to me. 

I only figured he hit 1000 or more based offf of what he did last year with 5 more game averaging 60 yards a game was doable.  But hell I’ll be happy with 800 yards from him. Especially with the new TE in the mix.  
 

as far as Harry goes who would want him? Maybe trade with a team who has a badly underperforming first round pick?