Free agent QBS who could back up Allen next year in case Barkley doesn’t come back

[Mr. WEO]

27 minutes ago, C.Biscuit97 said:

With all due respect, I hate this point. Obviously, any qb on the market would be a huge drop off. But:

 

Tom Brady (maybe The elite white is the next Brady)

 

Kurt Warner 

 

Doug Williams

 

nick Foles

 

trent dilfer 

 

jeff Hostetler

 

roger Staubach

 

jim pluckett 

 

earl morrall

 

all guys who started the season as backups who won SBs (Kaepernick lost as a backup).  I just can’t believe how many people are cool with whatever at backup. This is a SB contender that could win games if they had a decent backup. The Pats drafted Jimmy G in the 2nd and crackhead Mallett in the 3rd with Brady. The Saints signed Winston.  The Colts paid Brissett a good amount of money. 
 

I just think kee coldly do so much better than Barkley (nice guy, good teammate), Fromm, & Davis. I know people hate him but Newton could win games on this team if god forbid Allen got hurt. 

Fitz gets better every year. Dude is a baller who just didn’t have the physical tools. Miami makes the playoffs if they didn’t start Tua. 

 

Dilfer, a Pro Bowler in Tampa, replaced Tony Banks (because he sucked) after 4 weeks with no Offensive TDs.

 

Before the playoffs, Gibbs benched Jay Schroeder (because he sucked) and won out with Williams.

 

Staubach replaced a crappy Morton (because he sucked) and won a SB.

 

Plunkett was a #1 draft pick and a day 1 starter for the Patriots.  He was traded to SF and started both seasons.  But he did win a SB as a backup for the Raiders.

 

Morrall never started in a SB winning game.  He did come in for Johnny U in the 3rd Q.  

 

So:

 

A) good thing Josh doesn't suck

 

B) if Josh went down at ANY time in the season, there is not one guy on you mentioned that takes this team to the SB (OK, maybe my man Fitz--just because it would be awesome...).

 

But yeah, Barkley sucks.   The other 2 are zeros at this point.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Miyagi-Do Karate]

20 minutes ago, Giuseppe Tognarelli said:

Why did they draft Fromm in the 5th round? I think it's reasonable to expect him to be the backup in year 2, unless you drafted him for no reason.

 

I don't know-- his rookie year was a waste due to COVID. So, I would view Fromm as basically a rookie this year. I doubt they bank on him as the number 2 as essentially a rookie.

 

At least Webb has been around the NFL for a bit, and I think has had some live snaps.  Webb was a 3rd round pick, FWIW. 

[msw2112]

I'm all over the board on this one.

 

Fitz:  played great football last year for Miami.  Flores screwed him and the team going with the overrated Tua.  Cost his team a playoff spot.  He'd be a fantastic backup and can certainly win games if Josh went down for a period of time.  I don't see this happening due to 1) Fitz may want to go somewhere that he can start and/or play a lot.  2) he may command more than the Bills can afford under their cap constraints.

 

Barkley: has played OK in limited action, particularly in weeks when he got starter reps in practice.  If the defense and running game improve, Barkley could keep the ship afloat for a few weeks.  He can read a defense and run and NFL offense.  His arm strength and mobility aren't great, which is why he's a career backup.  He's not going to take the team on his back and win one and I don't think he's going to take a team deep into the playoffs unless the Bills return to having a top-3 defense.  May be the best option due to his "off the field" attributes and chemistry with the team - great teammate, supportive of Allen, not looking to be a starter, knows the playbook.

 

Fromm:  I have no idea.  Perhaps the Bills coaches do.  If they think he is ready, I'm OK with going with him.  He had a great career in college, taking and keeping the starting job over guys that were more highly recruited and highly rated than him.  Got GA to OT of the Championship game.  Seems to be a competitive guy with some football ability.  Maybe not the best athletic skills.  He certainly got himself in some twitter trouble in the past.

 

Webb:  I have no idea.  The fact that the Jests and Giants both moved on from him and that he was basically the 4th stringer for the Bills doesn't give me a lot of hope for his playing talent.  I think he's going to be a good coach someday.

 

Kyle Allen:  had not thought of him before seeing this thread today.  He's played some decent football in the NFL, but not enough to be a consistent starter.  He'd be fine as a backup, but I don't know that he'd be a big upgrade over what we already have.  He's probably more physically talented than Barkley, but I don't know much about his personality, mental makeup, etc.

 

The rest of the field:  I don't think there are any better options than what is listed above for the type of money the Bills have to spend.

 

 

[Seoulofstone]

1 hour ago, Mr. WEO said:

 

They isolated Love form the rest of the team for the season?  I couldn't find anything on that.   In fact there's an Pat McAfee interview with Rodgers in October describing Love's progress in practice, in the locker room after games, etc.

 

  I thought I had read something to that effect. But I can't recollect where, so I'm sure you're right.

1 hour ago, Mr. WEO said:

 

 

Edited February 26, 2021 by Seoulofstone
Fixed my gibberish double posted sentence.

[Doc]

2 hours ago, Seoulofstone said:

The Packers did it with their first round pick. Although, the media narrative in GB is that Love "couldn't win the backup role".

 

Why would there have to be a narrative?  

[Mr. WEO]

8 minutes ago, Seoulofstone said:

 

  I thought I had read something to that effect. But If I can't recollect where, so I'm sure you're right.

 

  I thought I had read something to that effect. But If I can't recollect where, so I'm sure you're right.

 

[Seoulofstone]

17 minutes ago, Doc said:

 

Why would there have to be a narrative?  

 

  This is just my reading of it and I must confess that I feel some sympathy for Love which may affect my bias. He got picked by a team that had an HOF QB, had no training camp and is being labelled in some places and by some media reports as a bust which I find extremely unfair in this context.

 

8 minutes ago, Mr. WEO said:

 

Goodness. I picked a bad day to quit sniffing glue.

18 minutes ago, Seoulofstone said:

 

  

 

Edited February 26, 2021 by Seoulofstone

[Freddie's Dead]

Fitzmagic is the correct answer.  Hopefully we don't see Fitztragic.

[chongli]

For all those who want Fitz, do we really want a 38 year-old QB who will be turning 39 mid-season? Father time may catch up to him, his performance last year notwithstanding.

[Jobot]

Too bad Fitz never went to Chicago the past several years.. I think they'd have at minimum made it to a conference championship and possible had a shot at a superbowl with that defense.

[Punching Bag]

6 hours ago, Don Otreply said:

Webb has the play book knowledge that’s needed, and a better arm than Barkley, and will be inexpensive to to promote to Bu QB,  in a season with financial constraints Webb is a likely selection if they don’t stick with Barkley.  Fromm?, Fromm is the C-19 back up for the foreseeable future. 

 

Fromm is the welfare QB - gets paid and does not need to work.

[Nextmanup]

11 hours ago, davefan66 said:

I expect Barkley back at a a decent cost.  Good veteran leadership.

 

Barkley and Allen have a great relationship, on and off the field.  Not sure beans would want to disrupt it. 

I think they do have a good relationship, but I don't think it counts for much in the broader conversation of what to do at backup QB.

 

I think Fitz would come back to Buffalo, guaranteed, if we made the offer and he didn't have something better going on from anyone else.

 

I think Fitz generally thinks very positively of his time in Buffalo, the community, the fans, and so on.

 

 

[Victory Formation]

Fromm.

[Pokebball]

7 minutes ago, Victory Formation said:

Fromm.

This is where I'm at.  I think we use cap space at positions we know we have a need.  

[BringMetheHeadofLeonLett]

6 hours ago, Mr. WEO said:

 

Dilfer, a Pro Bowler in Tampa, replaced Tony Banks (because he sucked) after 4 weeks with no Offensive TDs.

 

Before the playoffs, Gibbs benched Jay Schroeder (because he sucked) and won out with Williams.

 

Staubach replaced a crappy Morton (because he sucked) and won a SB.

 

Plunkett was a #1 draft pick and a day 1 starter for the Patriots.  He was traded to SF and started both seasons.  But he did win a SB as a backup for the Raiders.

 

Morrall never started in a SB winning game.  He did come in for Johnny U in the 3rd Q.  

 

So:

 

A) good thing Josh doesn't suck

 

B) if Josh went down at ANY time in the season, there is not one guy on you mentioned that takes this team to the SB (OK, maybe my man Fitz--just because it would be awesome...).

 

But yeah, Barkley sucks.   The other 2 are zeros at this point.

 

 

 

 

 

 

* Plunkett was the Raiders' starter

[Rico]

1 hour ago, BringMetheHeadofLeonLett said:

* Plunkett was the Raiders' starter

Yep. 2 rings as a starter for the Raiders & MVP in one of them.

[wagne591]

20 hours ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

This

 

 

But also this.

 

I think we don't keep Davis Webb around AND draft Fromm if we don't feel they could compete for the backup job

 

A QB I think we should keep our eye on is Kyle Allen.  He's currently an unsigned ERFA with Washington but they have Alex Smith on the roster getting the Big Bucks and they just signed Taylor Heinicke to a $4M contract so are they really gonna keep Kyle as well?   He and Josh train together in the off season.  He's played enough in the league that you have more confidence he can do it than you do with Webb or Fromm.

Who has more confidence in him? I like to think i can trust the front office now to make the right decision unlike past regimes. Even the D-Line and O-Line hasn't been the best since they took over and it was a weakness and the O-line is very good now and you can't say they aren't trying everything they can with the D-line. We haven't even seen Fromm play in an NFL game yet. He was very good in college this is what some of the scouts said before last years draft:

 

“I think he’s going to win a lot of games at that level. I think the league likes him a lot more than the media does. People talk themselves out of him because he doesn’t have the greatest physical tools in the world, but he’s just a dang good quarterback. He’s great from the neck up and he’s got the best eyes in this class. His arm strength is very underrated. He’s accurate. He’s tough. He’s won a ton of games. He’s durable. There’s so much to like. I think he could be a really good pro.”

 

“Assuming his accuracy comes back—and there’s no reason to believe it won’t – Fromm should develop into a low-end NFL starter or high-end NFL backup, a guy who is between the 24th and 40th-best quarterback in the league for a long time.” – Thor Nystrom, Rotoworld

 

“He's an intelligent game-manager whose range is good backup to middling starter, but he will be scheme and skill-position-needy at the next level.” – Lance Zierlein, NFL.com

 

So I say we give Fromm a shot if we need him (hopefully we wont) He sounds to me like a Frank kind of back up. 

 

 

 

[Punching Bag]

11 hours ago, Seoulofstone said:

 

I don't think you bring in Allen as a mentor. He is a good friend of Josh, is cheap, and has won NFL games (I think with KA as starter the Panthers were 5-2 at one point in 2019).

 

Coach McD could have some fun with reporters like Abbott and Costello:

Reporter: Josh Allen was injured in game last week and is limited in practice so who is starting this weekend.

Coach McD: Allen

Reporter: Do you Josh will start?

Coach: I meant what I said - Allen will start

Reporter: Let me put it another way.  The Bills were behind last week and Kyle Allen came in, made many impressive plays including 2 TDs he ran in and won the game.  Who is starter now?

Coach McD: Allen

[Hapless Bills Fan]

13 hours ago, wagne591 said:

Who has more confidence in him? I like to think i can trust the front office now to make the right decision unlike past regimes.

 

So we're talking about Kyle Allen vs Fromm here, right?

 

Our current front office has done a lot of good things, no doubt.  They also took us into the 2018 season with Nathan Peterman as the starting QB based upon camp and preseason results, which lasted less than half a game.

 

I don't know what lesson you take from this.  The lessons I take from this is:

1) while good, our FO is not infallible and when they make a mistake, it can be a big one.  And they made a mistake at QB not too long ago!

2) a QB can look good in camp and in pre-season, but a regular season NFL game is a different level. 

 

For this reason, I think most people around the league would agree that a backup QB who has started in the league and played capably, gives a higher degree of confidence than a QB who has never yet seen a regular season snap.

 

For all I know, Fromm (or Davis Webb!) may be better QBs than Kyle Allen - but he hasn't even taken a pre-season snap yet!

 

13 hours ago, wagne591 said:

“I think he’s going to win a lot of games at that level. I think the league likes him a lot more than the media does. People talk themselves out of him because he doesn’t have the greatest physical tools in the world, but he’s just a dang good quarterback. He’s great from the neck up and he’s got the best eyes in this class. His arm strength is very underrated. He’s accurate. He’s tough. He’s won a ton of games. He’s durable. There’s so much to like. I think he could be a really good pro.”

 

Who said this?  You give sources for the other two.  I found this......if correct, it's a pre-draft scouting evaluation by an "off the record" unidentified scout. 

 

Seems said scout was mistaken and the league didn't like him that well after all since 32 teams passed on him 166 times! 

 

I don't want to diss on Jake Fromm, he's a Bill now and I hope he succeeds if he plays, but that's actually a scary evaluation.  You know who was said to be great from the neck up with not the greatest physical tools in the world?    Yeah....

 

13 hours ago, wagne591 said:

“Assuming his accuracy comes back—and there’s no reason to believe it won’t – Fromm should develop into a low-end NFL starter or high-end NFL backup, a guy who is between the 24th and 40th-best quarterback in the league for a long time.” – Thor Nystrom, Rotoworld

 

What is this bit about Fromm's "accuracy" needing to come back?

 

[dave mcbride]

On 2/26/2021 at 7:52 AM, GunnerBill said:

 

Agreed on the bolded - but the question of a backup QB doesn't only arise in a situation where Allen is out for the year. If that happens the season is dead finish with a top 5 pick and hope there is a true difference maker there for you. But what if Allen misses 4 weeks? Say you go 9-3 in 12 games with Josh Allen. If you go 0-4 in the ones he misses you have blown a post season shot. So while I don't want to spend more than the $2m per year that Barkley made to chase one of those bigger name backups - Fitz, Dalton etc - Mike Glennon played for less in 2020 than Barkley and he is a better player. I'd personally still be interested in Blake Bortles. I know there are questions about how hard he works etc and maybe the Bills don't think he is a character fit, but playing style he is very similar to Josh Allen (not nearly as good but stylistically similar) and I don't think there is any question he is more talented than Matt Barkley. 

As I have been saying for years, you want your back up to be a guy who can get you 2-2 over a four game stretch. If Allen is out for the year, it’s basically over. 

[C.Biscuit97]

On 2/26/2021 at 1:11 PM, chongli said:

For all those who want Fitz, do we really want a 38 year-old QB who will be turning 39 mid-season? Father time may catch up to him, his performance last year notwithstanding.

It’s weird but Fitz is aging like wine. He’s getting better. Might be Time to give him another long term deal and he can win is the Super Bowl at 43. That would be a Disney movie.

[BADOLBILZ]

4 hours ago, C.Biscuit97 said:

It’s weird but Fitz is aging like wine. He’s getting better. Might be Time to give him another long term deal and he can win is the Super Bowl at 43. That would be a Disney movie.

 

Athletes who get physically better in their 30's usually do so because they get better informed on substances that will help them improve performance.    I suspect that is part of the deal with Fitz but the thing he really lacked in Buffalo was power in his core and subsequently his throwing arm and that kind of power is something that can improve with age from mid-30's to mid-40's.    That's why it has always been fairly common to see heavyweights box effectively for so long.   Fitz arm got miraculously stronger about the time he was in Houston.  Maybe JJ gave him a good connect down there or maybe Fitz just put on some good weight in the core.   When that happened he ceased to have to throw his whole body into every pass that traveled over 20 yards in the air and that improved his downfield accuracy immensely.   Agree that he should be able to play for several more years.  

[GreggTX]

I believe Fitz still wants to start. He played very well last year, but I doubt he'll get starter money. I'd very much like him at OBD as a QB coach. He certainly fits the culture and he's smarter than most NFL HC's.

[Punching Bag]

When Fitzpatrick retires I doubt he will become a coach with his brood and degree.  A better position would be for him would be a front office.

 

https://dolphinswire.usatoday.com/2021/02/27/a-clue-emerges-on-ryan-fitzpatricks-next-possible-move/

Quote

Perhaps his next move is easy enough to predict in that he’ll have the chance to provide more of the same to someone else. And one team who has reportedly reached out, the Denver Broncos, need exactly that. Woody Paige of the Denver Gazette has reported that the Broncos team has “spoken” to the veteran quarterback.

Quote

I recently tweeted that I believe Lock would be back with a veteran free agent signed. My choices were Tyrod Taylor and Ryan Fitzpatrick. They have spoken to Fitzpatrick.

Quote

How this is possible to have done without breaking league policies about the “legal tampering” window versus extracurricular activity is unclear — but Denver would certainly be a great destination for Fitzpatrick’s experienced hand to make an impact. The Broncos have plenty of talent but young quarterback Drew Lock appears to be a potential stumbling block to the team’s long-term outlook. And while Fitzpatrick wouldn’t fix the team’s long-term issue, he would provide a potential boost in play for a Broncos team that needs a “spark”.

 

 

[machine gun kelly]

I just heard the other day on NFLR Fitz camp is still looking for an opportunity to compete for a starting job.  That doesn’t surprise me as there are some teams like the Pats that don’t draft high enough to get a solid prospect out of the draft unless he is a development guy.  I can see him being a placeholder for a team while they develop a guy.  It’s too bad as my fandom would hope his love of Buffalo would be enough to accept the backup role.  With his size of a family, and the amount of $ he’s made for all of these years, I don’t see coaching in his future.  Very few players do it.

 

if they don’t retain Barkley, it’s a matter of whether McD thinks Davis Webb or Fromm are good enough to win a couple of games.  If not, maybe Tyrod, but I would think he and Dalton would want too much.  This isn’t the year for us to invest $7 mil. In a backup QB.

[davefan66]

On 2/26/2021 at 4:25 PM, Nextmanup said:

I think they do have a good relationship, but I don't think it counts for much in the broader conversation of what to do at backup QB.

 

I think Fitz would come back to Buffalo, guaranteed, if we made the offer and he didn't have something better going on from anyone else.

 

I think Fitz generally thinks very positively of his time in Buffalo, the community, the fans, and so on.

 

 

I believe Fitz would come back.  As long as he’s exhausted all avenues for a starting position.

 

As far as Barkley, the coaching staff knows the chemistry in the QB room.  Do they value it enough to keep it going?  I still think Josh needs a vet presence.  Is it his friend or can it be anyone?  Honestly, don’t think Barkley will get any nibbles, would come back on a cap friendly deal.

Edited February 28, 2021 by davefan66

[Doc]

It will be Fromm.  He wasn't ready to be the primary backup last season being that he was just a rookie who didn't get a pre-season, but they obviously liked what they saw enough to keep him on the active roster all season long and didn't want to chance him being signed if they cut him in an attempt to stash him on the PS. 

 

I doubt they keep 3 QBs on the active roster this year and continue with Webb on the PS +/- in isolation. 

[Punching Bag]

1 hour ago, davefan66 said:

I believe Fitz would come back.  As long as he’s exhausted all avenues for a starting position.

 

As far as Barkley, the coaching staff knows the chemistry in the QB room.  Do they value it enough to keep it going?  I still think Josh needs a vet presence.  Is it his friend or can it be anyone?  Honestly, don’t think Barkley will get any nibbles, would come back on a cap friendly deal.

 

I do not think that Barkley will get an offer if let go and Bills should consider putting him on practice squad and try Webb as backup.  

I think Webb is more athletically gifted which is shown by him doing multiple roles in practice preparing for games.

[Frat-Train]

Fitzy!!!  Bring back the magic!

[blacklabel]

Fitz still wants a chance to start somewhere so I don't think he'd end up here. Last I saw, Denver had interest in bringing him in as the starter. 

[JakeFrommStateFarm]

1 hour ago, Doc said:

It will be Fromm.  He wasn't ready to be the primary backup last season being that he was just a rookie who didn't get a pre-season, but they obviously liked what they saw enough to keep him on the active roster all season long and didn't want to chance him being signed if they cut him in an attempt to stash him on the PS. 

 

I doubt they keep 3 QBs on the active roster this year and continue with Webb on the PS +/- in isolation. 

Yes it will be Fromm.

 

Hopefully we have preseason games and the fans will see how great Fromm can be

[Doc]

8 minutes ago, JakeFrommStateFarm said:

Yes it will be Fromm.

 

Hopefully we have preseason games and the fans will see how great Fromm can be

 

I'll settle for him being a good backup QB.  Anything else is gravy.

[davefan66]

6 hours ago, Limeaid said:

 

I do not think that Barkley will get an offer if let go and Bills should consider putting him on practice squad and try Webb as backup.  

I think Webb is more athletically gifted which is shown by him doing multiple roles in practice preparing for games.

I like Barkley in the QB room from his relationship with Allen.  As the backup QB?  Had that great game when we first got him and hasn’t done much since when pressed into duty.

 

I guess the question is, are Covid practice squad rules going to stay?  If not, Barkley wouldn’t be eligible.

[Bing Bong]

On 2/25/2021 at 11:33 PM, Buffalo Junction said:

IDK. It’s not like he’s replaced elite QBs, but there’s a bit of merit to the cycle when you actually look at the entirety of his career. Fitzpatrick definitely gets a starting opportunity on every team. A large part of that is due to him being a low end starting talent. 

His career is fascinating. A career backup who has started the vast majority of games.

 

With his luck, JA starts 0-3 goes down injured through no fault of his own, Fitz wins the next 5 games, winning the job only to fizzle out spectacularly and go on the replace Pat Mahomes in KC.

 

I'm a superstitous man, I do not want to bet against Fitz winning a starting job anywhere he goes.

[Hapless Bills Fan]

On 2/28/2021 at 7:21 AM, Doc said:

It will be Fromm.  He wasn't ready to be the primary backup last season being that he was just a rookie who didn't get a pre-season, but they obviously liked what they saw enough to keep him on the active roster all season long and didn't want to chance him being signed if they cut him in an attempt to stash him on the PS. 

 

That's one interpretation, and it's the one I favor, but there are others (that he would have been cut except for the Covid situation and the need to have a "break glass in emergency" guy.

 

I personally think Fromm got a raw deal as a rookie being asked to go through that, and the team should give him every chance to prove he can earn the primary backup role.

 

But there also is this lingering fear that until you actually see a guy take live-action snaps in the season, there's doubt as to whether or not he can.  So if the Bills team says "once Peterman'd twice shy babe" they may want to bring in a vet who actually has started so they feel more WYSIWYG.  I don't see us paying much though.

 

 

 

[Hapless Bills Fan]

On 2/28/2021 at 9:04 AM, JakeFrommStateFarm said:

Yes it will be Fromm.

Hopefully we have preseason games and the fans will see how great Fromm can be

 

At this point in Bills history, Fromm could light up the scoreboard like a pinball machine during preseason and Bills fans be like "that's nice Son, let's see what ya really got when it counts on Sunday" 

 

Why?  See Peterman, Nathan

 

 

[C.Biscuit97]

1 minute ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

At this point in Bills history, Fromm could light up the scoreboard like a pinball machine during preseason and Bills fans be like "that's nice Son, let's see what ya really got when it counts on Sunday" 

 

Why?  See Peterman, Nathan

 

 

Or they will think he is the next Jim Kelly.

 

I don’t think Fromm is good. We’ll see though. 

[Hapless Bills Fan]

23 hours ago, davefan66 said:

I like Barkley in the QB room from his relationship with Allen.  As the backup QB?  Had that great game when we first got him and hasn’t done much since when pressed into duty.

 

I guess the question is, are Covid practice squad rules going to stay?  If not, Barkley wouldn’t be eligible.

 

It is my understanding Yes they are, based on something one of the NFL-following guys tweeted at one point.

 

[Ethan in Cleveland]

Can't spend money on a backup QB this year.  They need all the cap space they can get. If Allen gets hurt for a prolonged period of time the season is lost anyways.  Go with Fromm for 2021.  

[without a drought]

On 2/26/2021 at 1:11 PM, chongli said:

For all those who want Fitz, do we really want a 38 year-old QB who will be turning 39 mid-season? Father time may catch up to him, his performance last year notwithstanding.

Fitz was ok at times last season, nothing more.