newcam2012 Posted October 21, 2020 Share Posted October 21, 2020 9 hours ago, CincyBillsFan said: As others have noted we got smaller and less physical on the D-line compared to last year and it shows on the field. Oliver is the key. We talk about what a disaster missing on Allen would be and IMO we haven't as Allen is a franchise QB. But we used a #7 pick on Allen and we used I believe a #9 pick for Oliver in 2019. A top 10 pick has to produce or it's a real problem. So far Oliver has under performed and that has got to change. One other point, how much of the LB's problems are tied to a D-line that can't occupy the opponents O-line allowing them to release and blast our LB's? Oliver and Edmunds seem to be trending as busts. Still too early but both haven't lived up to expectations. We really needed them to step up. Oliver barely gets his name called in a game. Edmunds is constantly out of position or missing tackles. I'm no expert but I really don't think it's the coaches or the scheme. They have been successful with it for a few years now. The common denominator is the players. The offense is going to have to win us games. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LABILLBACKER Posted October 21, 2020 Share Posted October 21, 2020 1. White almost opts out and he's playing like he'd rather be home. 2. Obviously losing Star, Shaq & Jordan killed this D as their replacements are bad (except for maybe Addison) 3. As soon as Lorax retired, McB had no plan for who their 3rd LB would be? Now forced to "nickel" thru the rest of the year. 4. No improvement from Edmunds and Milano always hurt. 5. No pass rush No run stop 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
In Summary Posted October 21, 2020 Share Posted October 21, 2020 Bills often play only two LB's. One starter (Milano) is injured. The other (Edmunds) makes no impact. The backups are underwhelming. The D-line is (read above). The result is that the safeties are having to handle most of the run support (IMO) in addition to having to the whole D backfield having to cover longer. I really don't have too much to say that's negative about the defensive backfield given the injuries and the fact that many plays that should have been stopped at the line or 5 yards past it are now all falling to the safeties and DB's. The Bills were absolutely resolute about wanting to limit the Chief's big play pass offense at the cost of leaving the D on the field too long and getting slapped around on runs. Perhaps better personnel adjustments to the run could have been made if we had clear LB depth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BADOLBILZ Posted October 21, 2020 Share Posted October 21, 2020 38 minutes ago, Mr. WEO said: The "Star legend" grows by the week!! In 32 games, he has amassed 22 tackles--4 for a loss. SUPER-Star you mean. Getting him back next year will be like having another first round pick! 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rock-A-Bye Beasley Posted October 21, 2020 Share Posted October 21, 2020 (edited) Watch the Damien Williams TD. Edmunds does what he does on most plays. He hesitates, then goes to the Chiefs RG at the exact same time as a Williams goes to the left. is that him or the defense scheme? I’m not 100% sure but it keeps happening. edmunds also gets dragged for extra yards constantly on tackles. and if you think star will help that I’d like to hear why Edited October 21, 2020 by Chemical Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
simpleman Posted October 21, 2020 Share Posted October 21, 2020 18 hours ago, Southern Bills Fan said: How many times will they have to watch the film and see Hughes crash inside and the QB run outside where he should be and gain 20 yards before they sit him? Sadly I agree. I have always been a Hughes fan. He was a great player for us, but as in NFL football, sooner or later Father Time catches up with you. Father Time has caught up with Hughes. Hughes, it was a good run, thank you for all the effort and dedication, and thank you for the memories. But Father time has won. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
finn Posted October 21, 2020 Share Posted October 21, 2020 18 hours ago, turftoe said: Losing Lawson, Phillips, and Lotulelei has really hurt. Think of those three replaced by Klein, Zimmer, Epenesa and Cox. That's supposed to be a wakeup call to Murphy and Phillips. It's a wakeup call, all right, but to the fans and I hope Beane, who may be beginning to figure out that McDermott just may not know what he's doing after all. What a strategy. "I got it! Let's play the JV against the best team in the NFL on national TV! That'll light a fire under our D-line starters. And I'll inactivate those starters for good measure! My JV players are so good, no WAY will we need our best run stoppers in the game." 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
simpleman Posted October 21, 2020 Share Posted October 21, 2020 18 hours ago, turftoe said: Losing Lawson, Phillips, and Lotulelei has really hurt. People here always put down Lawson because they said he was very good at setting the edge, but it wasn't enough, it really was all about the sacks. And he did not get enough of them. Now see what happens in 2020 with the run when you don't have someone good at setting the edge. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoCal Deek Posted October 21, 2020 Share Posted October 21, 2020 Haven’t read through all the comments but the answer to what’s wrong with the defense should be obvious: EVERYTHING. They need major help at all three levels...line, linebackers, and secondary. The fact that the coaching staff seems utterly oblivious to this makes it all the more troubling. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jrb1979 Posted October 21, 2020 Share Posted October 21, 2020 There is nothing wrong with the defense. They are playing are harder schedule this season and it's showing. They couldn't stop the run last season either. Not getting turnovers isn't help either Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dopey Posted October 21, 2020 Share Posted October 21, 2020 One word: STAR Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dopey Posted October 21, 2020 Share Posted October 21, 2020 4 hours ago, Chemical said: Watch the Damien Williams TD. Edmunds does what he does on most plays. He hesitates, then goes to the Chiefs RG at the exact same time as a Williams goes to the left. is that him or the defense scheme? I’m not 100% sure but it keeps happening. edmunds also gets dragged for extra yards constantly on tackles. and if you think star will help that I’d like to hear why To your last question, just watch us on Def the two prior years compared to this year. It will make sense right away. If not, there's not enough explaining to help you with that question. Star is the difference, like it or not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rock-A-Bye Beasley Posted October 21, 2020 Share Posted October 21, 2020 (edited) 8 minutes ago, Dopey said: To your last question, just watch us on Def the two prior years compared to this year. It will make sense right away. If not, there's not enough explaining to help you with that question. Star is the difference, like it or not. I disagree. I could say it’s Shaq Lawson using your logic, but I don’t have any proof which apparently isn’t necessary. If that doesn’t make sense to you then no amount of explaining will help you. Edited October 21, 2020 by Chemical Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dopey Posted October 21, 2020 Share Posted October 21, 2020 2 minutes ago, Chemical said: I disagree. I could say it’s Shaq Lawson using your logic, but I don’t have any proof which apparently isn’t necessary. If that doesn’t make sense to you then no amount of explaining will help you. Your response shows you didn't pay attention the previous two seasons. Your Shaq logic is very flawed. Shows you don't get what I said or just want to be right. Again, it's easy to see STAR is the difference. If it doesn't make sense to you...you know the drill. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rock-A-Bye Beasley Posted October 21, 2020 Share Posted October 21, 2020 Just now, Dopey said: Your response shows you didn't pay attention the previous two seasons. Your Shaq logic is very flawed. Shows you don't get what I said or just want to be right. Again, it's easy to see STAR is the difference. If it doesn't make sense to you...you know the drill. Ok I say the same to you Dopey but with word Shaq replaces with Star. Ok Dopey thank you. Here is example for you: Your response shows you didn't pay attention the previous two seasons. Your Star logic is very flawed. Shows you don't get what I said or just want to be right. Again, it's easy to see SHAQ is the difference. If it doesn't make sense to you...you know the drill Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dopey Posted October 21, 2020 Share Posted October 21, 2020 (edited) 2 minutes ago, Chemical said: Ok I say the same to you Dopey but with word Shaq replaces with Star. Ok Dopey thank you. Here is example for you: Your response shows you didn't pay attention the previous two seasons. Your Star logic is very flawed. Shows you don't get what I said or just want to be right. Again, it's easy to see SHAQ is the difference. If it doesn't make sense to you...you know the drill I have a 3 year old grandson that sounds more mature than you. Sorry I wasted my time on you. Carry on. Edited October 21, 2020 by Dopey Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rock-A-Bye Beasley Posted October 21, 2020 Share Posted October 21, 2020 (edited) 11 minutes ago, Dopey said: I have a 3 year old grandson that sounds more mature than you. Sorry I wasted my time on you. Carry on. Personal attacks aren’t welcome here maybe you could try explaining why you think star is the difference? Edited October 21, 2020 by Chemical Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hapless Bills Fan Posted October 21, 2020 Share Posted October 21, 2020 23 hours ago, njbuff said: They suck. End thread. That @JGMcD2 guy had a point. And that point is that "They suck" posts are the Football Board version of breasts on a chicken - totally useless for the useful purposes of chickens. Why do they suck? What makes them suck? What could make them better? Agree or disagree, all of those foster discussion. Just "They Suck, End Thread" does not - I mean, congratulations Einstein, I guess we can turn out the lights, shut the board down, and go home now, You've spoken? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shortchaz Posted October 21, 2020 Share Posted October 21, 2020 have to find a way to get off the field on third down. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ALF Posted October 21, 2020 Share Posted October 21, 2020 The Bills went up against two playoff caliber teams , not ending well again, the weaknesses are now evident. When it's time for the real playoffs they need injured players back healthy . 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hapless Bills Fan Posted October 21, 2020 Share Posted October 21, 2020 12 hours ago, In Summary said: Bills often play only two LB's. One starter (Milano) is injured. The other (Edmunds) makes no impact. The backups are underwhelming. The D-line is (read above). The result is that the safeties are having to handle most of the run support (IMO) in addition to having to the whole D backfield having to cover longer. I really don't have too much to say that's negative about the defensive backfield given the injuries and the fact that many plays that should have been stopped at the line or 5 yards past it are now all falling to the safeties and DB's. The Bills were absolutely resolute about wanting to limit the Chief's big play pass offense at the cost of leaving the D on the field too long and getting slapped around on runs. Perhaps better personnel adjustments to the run could have been made if we had clear LB depth. Apparently per Frazier presser, one starter (Milano) is injured and out; the other starter (Edmunds) is injured and playing. Matt Fairburn had a take on the DL decisions: 2. The Bills’ defensive line may have had better luck if Harrison Phillips and Trent Murphy had been in the lineup. Sean McDermott said the two handled the situation like pros after being named healthy scratches.(....) McDermott decided Bryan Cox Jr., A.J. Epenesa and Darryl Johnson all gave the Bills a better chance to win than Murphy did. That has to be tough for Murphy to swallow. The Bills could have turned to Murphy and Phillips in this game when the Chiefs decided to go with a run-heavy approach. It felt like McDermott tried to get too clever with that lineup decision, and you wonder what impact it will have in a locker room that looks to Phillips and Murphy as leaders. I'd love to have been a fly on the wall in the room where that decision was made and when the aftermath was discussed. It seems contra-intuitive to have a game plan where the primary goal is to shut down the pass with the secondary goal to contain the QB limit the run, and healthy-scratch a guy who is one of the best run defenders and another guy who is a very gap-sound run defender, in favor of two practice squad guys who apparently were winning the walk-through or limited practice. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
njbuff Posted October 21, 2020 Share Posted October 21, 2020 2 hours ago, Hapless Bills Fan said: That @JGMcD2 guy had a point. And that point is that "They suck" posts are the Football Board version of breasts on a chicken - totally useless for the useful purposes of chickens. Why do they suck? What makes them suck? What could make them better? Agree or disagree, all of those foster discussion. Just "They Suck, End Thread" does not - I mean, congratulations Einstein, I guess we can turn out the lights, shut the board down, and go home now, You've spoken? Dandy Don would have song that to the Bills the last two weeks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Haze_21 Posted October 21, 2020 Share Posted October 21, 2020 Off season signings Vernon Butler - 2 yr(s) / $15,000,000 AJ Klein - 3 yr(s) / $18,000,000 Tyler Matakevich - 2 yr(s) / $7,150,000 Josh Norman - 1 yr(s) / $6,000,000 These guys vary between useless and detrimental to the current squad. No one liked these signings at the time, Jefferson and Addison haven't been great either but are less head scratching. We were willing to trust the process given Beane and McDermott being the best leadership in some time but this money could have been better spent. This carolina re-tread ***** needs to end. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
colin Posted October 21, 2020 Share Posted October 21, 2020 the klien contract is especially insane. like, we run this D which requires frankly too much from LBs, they have to read cover move and tackle, and a mistake in any of those hurts the d more than in many other d's, so we spend not big but not small money on a guy who really can't do any of that as well as the scheme requires. this team hit paydirt w cheaper free agents signing hyde and poyer, lorax, and jordan phillips. they did less well w star and murphy. combine that with drafting (solid on white, edmunds and milano, trash at CB since that and unless oliver just gets awesome when his knee heals, he and epenesa can be added to that list so far) and we just don't have the right amount of young playmakers offsetting underperforming over paid old guys given that we are putting straight UPS driver practice squad guys and benching starters vs the champs, we would be MUCH better off to have passed on some of these barely JAGS and brought in say clowney and a decent nickle cb 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Call_Of_Ktulu Posted October 21, 2020 Share Posted October 21, 2020 My guess is that the D-Line is slightly undersized. With the O-Line allowed to hold like they are now our guys are having trouble shedding blockers and getting to the QB. They seem to be having trouble with gap responsibility which is putting more pressure on our undersized LB’s who need to be kept clean to make plays. In turn our secondary is having to cover longer and are being burned. This is also not just happing to just the Bills but all defenses across the NFL. We have to figure out how to adapt or die. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ridgewaycynic2013 Posted October 21, 2020 Share Posted October 21, 2020 Defense eats their Snickers bars with knives and forks? 🤔 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ngbills Posted October 21, 2020 Share Posted October 21, 2020 2 hours ago, Haze_21 said: Off season signings Vernon Butler - 2 yr(s) / $15,000,000 AJ Klein - 3 yr(s) / $18,000,000 Tyler Matakevich - 2 yr(s) / $7,150,000 Josh Norman - 1 yr(s) / $6,000,000 These guys vary between useless and detrimental to the current squad. No one liked these signings at the time, Jefferson and Addison haven't been great either but are less head scratching. We were willing to trust the process given Beane and McDermott being the best leadership in some time but this money could have been better spent. This carolina re-tread ***** needs to end. Scary. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BADOLBILZ Posted October 22, 2020 Share Posted October 22, 2020 On 10/20/2020 at 12:54 PM, Southern Bills Fan said: How many times will they have to watch the film and see Hughes crash inside and the QB run outside where he should be and gain 20 yards before they sit him? It's a problem. And I think if you look back on the worst stretches of Bills defense in the past 4 seasons, unfortunately Jerry Hughes going off script is a common theme. Hughes is hurt by a lack of interior pass rush this year.........some of that was having Jordan Phillips just diving thru gaps like a massive Kyle Williams and some of it is the blitzing LB's not being able to do so this year.........but he's just playing way too out of control. They had a nice plan using Addison as a spy a few times and he did a good job of cutting off Mahomes scrambles........I think the near Josh Norman interception was one such play........but in general there have been way too many plays with lack of contain. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DuckyBoys Posted October 22, 2020 Share Posted October 22, 2020 2 minutes ago, BADOLBILZ said: It's a problem. And I think if you look back on the worst stretches of Bills defense in the past 4 seasons, unfortunately Jerry Hughes going off script is a common theme. Hughes is hurt by a lack of interior pass rush this year.........some of that was having Jordan Phillips just diving thru gaps like a massive Kyle Williams and some of it is the blitzing LB's not being able to do so this year.........but he's just playing way too out of control. They had a nice plan using Addison as a spy a few times and he did a good job of cutting off Mahomes scrambles........I think the near Josh Norman interception was one such play........but in general there have been way too many plays with lack of contain. Jerry's been awful. Spinning back inside just in time to give the edge to the qb on too many critical downs 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Blitz Posted October 22, 2020 Share Posted October 22, 2020 1 guy has more then one sack. Jefferson has 2. We have 10 total on pace for about 26 sacks. We have 2 interceptions. Turnovers change games. Sacks get guys fired up. We have done neither and its rippling through the whole team. Not being able to run the ball well hurts to that puts too much pressure on a passing attack now facing a defense that can just leave 6 in the box and take away all big plays and turn the d lineman loose. We've been figured out. The offense can adjust I believe we will fix the running game and Josh will be fine. The defense is done. Lost cause in 2020. Major overhaul get them to elite quick (you can do that with a defense) and with what we have now on O we're SB contenders next year. We need a little playoff run this year for confidence. Win a game hopefully. It will be a successful season if we can manage that from here. Win the division. Win at least one playoff game. That's gotta be worst case scenario for what we've been trying to build to this point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gordong Posted October 22, 2020 Share Posted October 22, 2020 first thing I see is we are playing WAY to soft in coverage its not hard to complete an 8 yard pass when you are 12 yards off to begin with. secound the DLine is getting no pressure... its actually worse than last year.. all off season we heard how the line was going to be so much better with the better players, I'm blaming the new D-Line coach. However the players need to start performing as well. and lastly the LB depth is non-existent when you have these three issue the defense is going to have issues... One trade for a real pass rusher would help this defense by leaps and bounds... if you have to give up a first round pick do it... but it would have to be for someone on the younger side. we are going to see a defensive heavy draft next year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Not at the table Karlos Posted October 22, 2020 Share Posted October 22, 2020 On 10/20/2020 at 10:49 PM, newcam2012 said: Oliver and Edmunds seem to be trending as busts. Still too early but both haven't lived up to expectations. We really needed them to step up. Oliver barely gets his name called in a game. Edmunds is constantly out of position or missing tackles. I'm no expert but I really don't think it's the coaches or the scheme. They have been successful with it for a few years now. The common denominator is the players. The offense is going to have to win us games. Coaches are playing Oliver out of position in the 1 tech a lot taking on blockers. A 280lb NT is going to struggle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hebert19 Posted October 22, 2020 Share Posted October 22, 2020 On 10/20/2020 at 10:57 AM, billsfan61184 said: To start how about the defense yielding 245 yards in the ground and 466 overall in which a team did what they wanted when they wanted. How about 15 percent or $30M of our entire cap tied up in 3 DEs in Hughes, Addison and Murphy and all we have is 4 sacks from these 3 guys. We have too many hard working, over paid defensive guys courtesy of coach. We made great strides with the passing offense. This league is now a year to year league because of qb contracts. In this day and age ..... with qbs on rookie contracts you can't afford to waste their early years. This putrid defense is on coach and GM. It's only going to get more difficult when 20 percent of cap is tied up in qb in a few years. Can't afford to keep a 29 yr old run stopper on edge for almost 9m in Murphy. Could have used that money this year to get a legitimate starting lb to go next to Edmunds and Milano and not have some washed up imposter playing the role of a starting lb in Klein. it's time for a change in philosophy with the d line. Hard working over achievers arent going to cut it..... it's time for a pure edge rusher with our top pick. If Oliver is going to make it in this league it's not between the "A" gap.... he's getting destroyed/ manhandled. It's time to adapt to your talent coach..... definition of insanity is doing same thing over and over and expecting different results. Quintin Jefferson is not a DT....he's a hybrid..... you don't think teams know we have an undersized DT in Oliver and a hybrid guy that should be more outside in a 3-4 defense in Jefferson. Put this with Edmunds not getting off blocks and ultimately you have holes the size of the Grand Canyon in the middle of our defense. It also has made our safeties reactive with absolutely no proactive ability to cause havoc with pre-snap looks or deceptions. They have become paralyzed tacklers on the back end because of having to make so many tackles and not being able to be aggressive at the line of scrimmage. 1. No identity. Are we a coverage team or a blitzing team. Are we stout again run or pass...no on knows. 2. System has been exposed. I have to believe there is more to this then just personnel. These are talented football players. Ed was great at the end of last year. Jefferson had a huge win rate last year. Addison has been a double digit sack guy. Jerry is Jerry. He beats his guy pretty regularly. There is something broken in the system. Teams have figured out our vanilla shell and get the ball out quickly. Or have blocking schemes based on how our front 4 rarely use stunts or anything outside just trying to push the pocket. Thats my take. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Straight Hucklebuck Posted October 22, 2020 Share Posted October 22, 2020 How long was Yannick Ngakoue our there? And to see Jordan Phillips not get a 3 year $50M deal, rather a 3 year $30M deal, it does make you wonder if the Bills gauged the market correctly. Our FO still values Panthers. We made our minds up that Butler and Addison had to be here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coach Tuesday Posted October 22, 2020 Share Posted October 22, 2020 (edited) 10 hours ago, BADOLBILZ said: It's a problem. And I think if you look back on the worst stretches of Bills defense in the past 4 seasons, unfortunately Jerry Hughes going off script is a common theme. Hughes is hurt by a lack of interior pass rush this year.........some of that was having Jordan Phillips just diving thru gaps like a massive Kyle Williams and some of it is the blitzing LB's not being able to do so this year.........but he's just playing way too out of control. They had a nice plan using Addison as a spy a few times and he did a good job of cutting off Mahomes scrambles........I think the near Josh Norman interception was one such play........but in general there have been way too many plays with lack of contain. There was a running play on Monday night that looked like it was schemed specifically by Reid with the expectation that Hughes would immediately vacate the edge and crash inside. Which he did, immediately at the snap, and the back ran right into the void for a huge gain. I wonder if it’s obvious on film that if if you block a certain way, Jerry will freelance because he can’t resist. PS - my wife is tired of me yelling at the TV, “Get back in your *#+$ lane Jerry!” She has no idea what it means other than she probably made a mistake in marrying me. Edited October 22, 2020 by Coach Tuesday 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
newcam2012 Posted October 22, 2020 Share Posted October 22, 2020 2 hours ago, Not at the table Karlos said: Coaches are playing Oliver out of position in the 1 tech a lot taking on blockers. A 280lb NT is going to struggle. I don't buy this notion. Frazier and McDermott know how to use the strengths of their players. Simply put, Oliver stinks right now. He has had little to no impact since being drafted. Maybe there is a reason why he dropped to us. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ethan in Cleveland Posted October 22, 2020 Share Posted October 22, 2020 They are soft, slow, and old. Without Star they don’t have the size to hold their spot and they don’t have the speed to create mismatches. It’s a total cluster and their is no quick fix. Beane and McD botched this horribly. The only hope is Phillips starts playing better, Epenesa develops into a pass rusher, and/or they make a trade. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoCal Deek Posted October 22, 2020 Share Posted October 22, 2020 (edited) The coaching staff is getting paid big bucks too...not just the players. It’s time for the coaches to make a strategic change. What they’ve been doing is clearly not working. If your D Line isn’t getting to the QB it’s time to start mixing in some blitzes. Sitting back and getting pounded into the ground is not the answer! Edited October 22, 2020 by SoCal Deek Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Not at the table Karlos Posted October 22, 2020 Share Posted October 22, 2020 (edited) 1 hour ago, newcam2012 said: I don't buy this notion. Frazier and McDermott know how to use the strengths of their players. Simply put, Oliver stinks right now. He has had little to no impact since being drafted. Maybe there is a reason why he dropped to us. Why are Frazier and McDermott playing Josh Norman in man if they know how to use the strengths of their players? Why are the blitzing players that suck at blitzing? If you just started watching oliver in the last few games I could see saying that he hasn’t been good but saying he’s had no impact since being drafted is flat out wrong. He was progressing towards the end of the year and had a huge impact in the Dallas game. Edited October 22, 2020 by Not at the table Karlos Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frostbitmic Posted October 22, 2020 Share Posted October 22, 2020 Can't pressure much less sack the QB Can't stop the run Receivers generally have 5-7 yard cushions Tackling could improve That's all, not much wrong with the D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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