What are we missing offensively?

[Ramza86]

We can get drives going...but it just looks like we cant get enough big plays down the field. Im not talking about just a streak down the field for 60 yards.

 

Is it lack of separation? Is it lack of play design?

 

I dont think we can use the excuse of there are 2 deep safeties so we can only take what they give. 

 

Every other NFL team doesnt seem to have that issue. And no team plays two deep the entire game. 

 

What is it and it this fixable?

If the offense doesnt shape up those tight ones will not always be winnable. 

 

[MAJBobby]

1 minute ago, Ramza86 said:

We can get drives going...but it just looks like we cant get enough big plays down the field. Im not talking about just a streak down the field for 60 yards.

 

Is it lack of separation? Is it lack of play design?

 

I dont think we can use the excuse of there are 2 deep safeties so we can only take what they give. 

 

Every other NFL team doesnt seem to have that issue. And no team plays two deep the entire game. 

 

What is it and it this fixable?

If the offense doesnt shape up those tight ones will not always be winnable. 

 

it’s the way Allen being coached and the way Defenses are currently playing Allen. 
 

defenses are playing to make Allen complete passes in areas he struggled last year and sustain the drives. Eventually Teams will allow the shots. Now when that happens Allen cannot miss the WR by 5 yards like he has been so far this season on those shots 

[Don Otreply]

I think that having Duke out there as an actual receiving threat will help open up opportunities for Brown in the deep throw game, that alone could loosen up coverages on the opposing Ds enough to prompt bigger chunk pass plays, and more scoring. Dukes being on the field and needing to be accounted for in a bigger way than ZJ was,  will also help Beasley’s game a lot. 

 

Go Bills!!!

Edited October 7, 2019 by Don Otreply

[Ramza86]

Just now, MAJBobby said:

it’s the way Allen being coached and the way Defenses are currently playing Allen. 
 

defenses are playing to make Allen complete passes in areas he struggled last year and sustain the drives. Eventually Teams will allow the shots. Now when that happens Allen cannot miss the WR by 5 yards like he has been so far this season on those shots 

 

Honestly I cant buy that anymore. 

 

We cannot be seeing the same defense from every team every game. If thats the case we should already know how to be successful against it.

[MAJBobby]

Just now, Ramza86 said:

 

Honestly I cant buy that anymore. 

 

We cannot be seeing the same defense from every team every game. If thats the case we should already know how to be successful against it.

these last two weeks we did see the exact same defense. Vrabel coaches the defense in Tenn the same way BB did. 
 

the shots have been there. Over these first 5 weeks just when Josh has taken them he missed 

[JoshAllenHasBigHands]

4 minutes ago, MAJBobby said:

these last two weeks we did see the exact same defense. Vrabel coaches the defense in Tenn the same way BB did. 
 

the shots have been there. Over these first 5 weeks just when Josh has taken them he missed 

 

Just about every pre-game analysis I read leading up to the game was analysis as to how Vrabel has not followed BB's footsteps and has instead adopted the Ravens model of defense.  

[Hebert19]

Deep shots.   That's it.  

[MAJBobby]

Just now, JoshAllenHasBigHands said:

 

Just about every pre-game analysis I read leading up to the game was analysis as to how Vrabel has not followed BB's footsteps and has instead adopted the Ravens model of defense.  

ok and yet against the Bills player under coverage. Rushed to contain Allen just as BB. Teams look at film and they all right now decide to defend Allen in this specific way

[CaptnCoke11]

i think a lot of it is the WRs struggling to get open against man to man.  Two weeks in a row now they’ve struggled.  Announcers pointed it out both weeks now.  

[PromoTheRobot]

>An answer at right tackle.

>Singletary.

>One more WR threat.

 

[Putin]

12 minutes ago, Ramza86 said:

 

Honestly I cant buy that anymore. 

 

We cannot be seeing the same defense from every team every game. If thats the case we should already know how to be successful against it.

Well when the defense is playing man and our receivers don’t get separation do you still want Allen to throw ? 

There were few opportunities when we had them beat but Allen did missed couple of throws , 

 

Edited October 7, 2019 by Putin

[JoshAllenHasBigHands]

1 minute ago, MAJBobby said:

ok and yet against the Bills player under coverage. Rushed to contain Allen just as BB. Teams look at film and they all right now decide to defend Allen in this specific way

 

That is such a generic interpretation of what happened the last two weeks. That is the equivalent of not understanding defense beyond teams play 3-4 v. 4-3 or zone v. man. There is just so much more that goes into it. 

[SCBills]

Three part answer:

 

1)  Mistakes on the plus side of the field.  Turnovers, not converting on crucial 3rd/4th downs, penalties, sacks and we've seen some drops by the tight ends in that area.

 

2)  The need for one more legit WR/TE target.   Kroft looks like he's 50/50 on ever suiting up this year and Foster has had nagging injuries all year.  We need that one more big target to threaten defenses.  Whether it's Kroft/Foster in-house or we make a move for someone. 

 

3)  Connecting on deep passes.   When we've had them, Josh has missed them. 

 

Duke and Singletary should also help.  We clearly had a need for a big WR and Duke showed out on all 4 targets this past game.   I think it's obvious our offense will have a much needed added dimension with Singletary back into the lineup with Gore.

 

Edited October 7, 2019 by SCBills

[Teddy KGB]

Just now, PromoTheRobot said:

>An answer at right tackle.

>Singletary.

>One more WR threat.

 

 

Complete list right here ✊?✊? 

 

 

[BuffaloHokie13]

We should take a page out of New England's playbook and take some shots on TE seams (preferably to Knox).

[Dkollidas]

I think a true #1 WR is the main thing missing. Getting Singeltary back will change the offense up a bit as well. 

 

Duke Williams looks like an improvement over Zay though, which gives us another decent option.

 

Main thing is Josh cutting down on errors and reckless plays. Yes he had the interception. But other than that play... 2 TD passes, no fumbles, no head first dives into traffic when running. He also tucked the ball a lot better when he was running. Not pulling that Shady move where he’s out there with it just in his hand waving around. 

[Lieutenant Aldo Raine]

Who's the current deep threat on this team outside of John Brown?  Defenses are putting a safety over the top on Brown.  In turn, Brown is doing a lot of his damage in the mid range game.  The one time Brown got open deep, Allen over threw him.  The other times that I can recollect, there has been a safety there for help resulting in an pass break-up or INT.  Perhaps with the addition of Duke, Allen can start to throw some back shoulder throws along the sideline.  And when Foster comes back, perhaps we can get some safety relief giving either him or Brown some one on one opportunities.  

[Antonio]

I think we are missing more consisten play. Sometimes we are stoping our own drives.

 

Opposite teams are dearing us to sustain long drives because last year we had a bunch of explosive plays. 

 

So we can´t afford to drop easy passes like Sweeny and Knox did yesterday. Those were drive killers. 

[Cripple Creek]

20 minutes ago, Ramza86 said:

We can get drives going...but it just looks like we cant get enough big plays down the field. Im not talking about just a streak down the field for 60 yards.

 

Is it lack of separation? Is it lack of play design?

 

I dont think we can use the excuse of there are 2 deep safeties so we can only take what they give. 

 

Every other NFL team doesnt seem to have that issue. And no team plays two deep the entire game. 

 

What is it and it this fixable?

If the offense doesnt shape up those tight ones will not always be winnable. 

 

Without Singletary we do not have a viable option running the ball outside of Gore. That hurts.  Defenses know what's coming when Yeldon is in the game. One dimensional is a tough way to play.  

 

Offensive line consistency...tough to begin with when the (virtually) entire line is new. Doubly so now with injuries.

 

Drops.

 

QB who just started his 16th game.  He's learning.

 

OC who sometimes seems lost.

[hondo in seattle]

*  Chunk plays.  

 

*  Open targets.  Either the WRs can't get separation or Daboll isn't designing/calling the right plays.

 

*  Ball security/decision making.  Too many dumb picks by Allen.

 

*  Passpro.  Not consistent enough.

 

*  Holes for backs.  Not consistent enough.

 

 

[Frez]

4 minutes ago, Teddy KGB said:

 

Complete list right here ✊?✊? 

 

 

A permanent solution tight end on top of those! 

[mjt328]

If you are referring specifically to deep shots, I think it's a mix of three things:

1.  Play Design

2.  Offensive Line

3.  Josh Allen

 

Outside of the New England game, the receivers are not running very many deep routes to begin with.  Most plays seem designed to get people open within 5-10 yards of the line of scrimmage.  The Bills offensive attack is a complete 180 from what we saw last year.  The few times we've called for deep shots, the offensive line hasn't held up long enough for the QB to get the pass off.... or Allen hasn't thrown an accurate pass where the WR can get to it.  It also doesn't help that Robert Foster has been dinged up.  With him out of the lineup, our only deep threat is John Brown.  Teams know that and are going to bring safety help to his side of the field.

 

Based on all the above factors, I think the Bills are doing the right thing by taking what the defense gives them.  Yardage-wise, we are playing very well and significantly out gaining our opponents.  By sustaining longer drives, we are helping keep the defense fresh.  The problem is that we keep making dumb mistakes at the wrong times (penalties, turnovers, dropped passes, missed blocks), which are killing productive drives and keeping points off the board.  

 

If the Bills can clean-up their sloppy mistakes, I think the points will come.

[golfball323]

This team was so close to an identity on offense in weeks 2 & 3. Our jet sweep usage and consequent play action of, had defenses on their heels and had to respect that on every play.

 

I don't think it's a coincidence that our biggest play came on jet sweep action (forward pass toss thing)yesterday. I would reintroduce that action back into the game plan after getting away from it the last two weeks. 

 

As a further bonus it gets McKenzie involved more, which is always a plus to me.

[CuseBill]

A couple of times yesterday they showed a replay of Bills receivers "being covered and not getting open" against man to man coverage.  It seemed to me that in those situations where Allen was scrambling out of the pocket and had to throw it away, the receivers were not either coming back to the ball or breaking off the pattern and going deep.  They just seemed to be kind of giving up.  Don't we practice a "scramble drill" for those situations?

[Antonio]

6 minutes ago, PromoTheRobot said:

>An answer at right tackle.

>Singletary.

>One more WR threat.

 

 

I agree!

 

Singletary would be a welcome addition as soon as he gets back.

 

I think Duke helps, but mainly in the red zone, hope I´m wrong and he keeps playing like he did yesterday.

 

I still think we could add a legit WR to help Brown out (Sanders). He has been our only real thret. Beasly is playing well, and helping the offense to move the chains, but thats all  underneath stuff and it is not enough.

[Juice_32]

10 minutes ago, PromoTheRobot said:

>An answer at right tackle.

>Singletary.

>One more WR threat.

 

 

And consistent hands out of our TE's. Sweeny and Knox both dropped balls yesterday that would have sustained drives and likely lead to points. 

[SCBills]

I think our OL is fine.  We played a really good defense yesterday and I only remember a few times where they had pressure.  I'm not counting pressure where Josh is holding onto the ball for 10 seconds and can't find anyone open. 

 

There's a reason teams, not named NE, don't regularly score on 10 play drives.  Lots of opportunities for a mistake, which we've seen.  Whether it's a turnover, a sack, a holding penalty etc..

 

Our biggest miss, outside of just playing cleaner football, is the deep ball.  We only have one deep threat right now and Josh has been missing guys when they are open on the long ball.  A healthy Foster with his head screwed on straight would be huge.

 

Edited October 7, 2019 by SCBills

[All_Pro_Bills]

Need more speed at WR and RB.  At this point more touches for Mckenzie and getting Singletary healthy.  Also, finally get Kroft on the field after the bye (I hope).   As defenses crowd the LOS more quick slants into areas vacated by blitzers.    

[Ray Finkel]

27 minutes ago, Ramza86 said:

 

Honestly I cant buy that anymore. 

 

We cannot be seeing the same defense from every team every game. If thats the case we should already know how to be successful against it.

I love Josh but he is not that good.  Barkley didn’t have trouble completing passes down field against the Jets last year.  We can’t keep saying it is the line or receivers.

[CEN-CAL17]

Nearly 85% of Pass plays are like 5 step drops.

 

Daboll needs to help get the ball out sooner. Shotgun, pivot, throw! Beasley is not a guy who gets open after time. He gets open right away. Quick outs, a quick crossing route, 3 yard curl,  more rub routes etc. John Brown needs a few of those as well.

 

Knox is athletic, get the ball in his hands quick. 

 

Singletary should help with some quick quick swing passes etc.

 

But having Josh sit in the pocket for 3-4 seconds, a lot of the times longer cause our WRs are running 10-15 sometimes 20 yard routes on 1st and 10 a majority of the time is not helping.

 

 

 

 

Edited October 7, 2019 by 1ZAYDAY1

[Jpsredemption]

Well the past two weeks we played 2 of the top defenses in the NFL so there’s that. 

[ProcessAccepted]

OMG!!! Why are people so negative. We are 4-1. Yes 4-1. Vegas had us winning 6.5 this year. 

 

Give the offense a little time. Right now they know we have the defense to support us, so they can take a little time and coach the hero ball out of Josh. He's learning how to play the QB role without relying on his arm. They'll open it up again for the kid and start throwing the long ball when his decision making is a little more mature.

[PromoTheRobot]

9 minutes ago, Antonio said:

 

I agree!

 

Singletary would be a welcome addition as soon as he gets back.

 

I think Duke helps, but mainly in the red zone, hope I´m wrong and he keeps playing like he did yesterday.

 

I still think we could add a legit WR to help Brown out (Sanders). He has been our only real thret. Beasly is playing well, and helping the offense to move the chains, but thats all  underneath stuff and it is not enough.

 

Maybe when Foster gets heathy he will fill that downfield threat role.

[Trogdor]

3 minutes ago, Ray Finkel said:

I love Josh but he is not that good.  Barkley didn’t have trouble completing passes down field against the Jets last year.  We can’t keep saying it is the line or receivers.

I feel like every week the All-22 comes out and proves that WRs were open. It's possible that he is just bad at deep throws. A strong arm isn't the only thing you need to be good at it.

[Royale with Cheese]

There’s just too many times where we are close to FG range and take a big sack or penalty...putting us now second and long and out of field goal range.  I don’t believe we converted many of those.

We need to stop shooting ourselves in the foot....

[Ramza86]

Just now, ProcessAccepted said:

OMG!!! Why are people so negative. We are 4-1. Yes 4-1. Vegas had us winning 6.5 this year. 

 

Give the offense a little time. Right now they know we have the defense to support us, so they can take a little time and coach the hero ball out of Josh. He's learning how to play the QB role without relying on his arm. They'll open it up again for the kid and start throwing the long ball when his decision making is a little more mature.

 

Actually this is more of a positive thread. I wouldnt be posting this if I were negative. This season has me with hope. 

 

Just want to get the ship righted if we are going to seriously make a run for the playoffs.

[Bleeding Bills Blue]

I feel we can occasionally get a little too pass heavy.  The empty sets on first downs etc.  It seems like it works - we get to the plus-40 and then we get sacked.  Then we're behind the sticks and end up punting.

[Antonio]

3 minutes ago, PromoTheRobot said:

 

Maybe when Foster gets heathy he will fill that downfield threat role.

 

I sure hope so.

 

Deep and intermediate crossing patterns like he did last year. 

[D. L. Hot-Flamethrower]

I think the short answer is more speed and playmakers. We may have some of these answers (Foster) already, but they need to develop and produce.

[atlbillsfan1975]

I think a lot ha to do with the type of offense they are trying to run. It appears a more rhythm offense. Quick throws are much more prevalent. I surmise one reason is to get Josh to play sound controlled football. I am sure we will see big plays not long from now.