akm0404 Posted October 1, 2019 Share Posted October 1, 2019 Welcome to the new NFL, where a culture of inflicting damage has led to pre-game banter shifting from “X-s and O-s” to medical information on the effects of trauma on brain tissue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoSaint Posted October 1, 2019 Share Posted October 1, 2019 31 minutes ago, akm0404 said: Welcome to the new NFL, where a culture of inflicting damage has led to pre-game banter shifting from “X-s and O-s” to medical information on the effects of trauma on brain tissue. To be fair, that culture of inflicting damage has been much worse than it is today.... that we care is the major change. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoCal Deek Posted October 1, 2019 Share Posted October 1, 2019 I’m frankly amazed at the protocol. I would’ve sworn Allen was coming back in on Sunday after they showed him running, by himself, into the tunnel, waving at the crowd. I’ve never had a concussion but that sure didn’t look like a guy who had one. I assume the symptoms can come on the next day, like whiplash tends to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buffaloed in Pa Posted October 1, 2019 Share Posted October 1, 2019 What goes around Comes around. Cant believe we dont whack Tomasina Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YoloinOhio Posted October 1, 2019 Author Share Posted October 1, 2019 6 minutes ago, SoCal Deek said: I’m frankly amazed at the protocol. I would’ve sworn Allen was coming back in on Sunday after they showed him running, by himself, into the tunnel, waving at the crowd. I’ve never had a concussion but that sure didn’t look like a guy who had one. I assume the symptoms can come on the next day, like whiplash tends to. He must have displayed the symptoms of a concussion so they wouldn’t let him go back in the game. That’s part of the rules. In fact he was likely diagnosed with a concussion that afternoon. Many times guys are cleared and can return but he wasn’t. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoCal Deek Posted October 1, 2019 Share Posted October 1, 2019 2 minutes ago, YoloinOhio said: He must have displayed the symptoms of a concussion so they wouldn’t let him go back in the game. That’s part of the rules. In fact he was likely diagnosed with a concussion that afternoon. Many times guys are cleared and can return but he wasn’t. No doubt but wasn’t it odd seeing him running all alone into the tunnel? Where was the training staff? Heck, they put you in a wheelchair if you leave a hospital with a hangnail! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rocky Landing Posted October 1, 2019 Share Posted October 1, 2019 7 minutes ago, SoCal Deek said: No doubt but wasn’t it odd seeing him running all alone into the tunnel? Where was the training staff? Heck, they put you in a wheelchair if you leave a hospital with a hangnail! Not as odd as seeing lying unconscious on the field. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rew Posted October 1, 2019 Share Posted October 1, 2019 21 minutes ago, YoloinOhio said: He must have displayed the symptoms of a concussion so they wouldn’t let him go back in the game. That’s part of the rules. In fact he was likely diagnosed with a concussion that afternoon. Many times guys are cleared and can return but he wasn’t. He doesn't have to show any symptoms of a concussion to be in the protocol. A player can be placed into the protocol solely based on video evidence (this was changed in last few years after the Savage hit). After watching the hit in slow motion and Allen's reaction after the hit, the independent observers would have decided that taking a day or two for observation was the right plan regardless of reported symptoms. If Allen has no symptoms he'll progress through and play. If he had any symptoms yesterday, it is exceedingly unlikely that he plays against TEN. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaattMaann Posted October 1, 2019 Share Posted October 1, 2019 20 minutes ago, Rew said: He doesn't have to show any symptoms of a concussion to be in the protocol. A player can be placed into the protocol solely based on video evidence (this was changed in last few years after the Savage hit). After watching the hit in slow motion and Allen's reaction after the hit, the independent observers would have decided that taking a day or two for observation was the right plan regardless of reported symptoms. If Allen has no symptoms he'll progress through and play. If he had any symptoms yesterday, it is exceedingly unlikely that he plays against TEN. yes, this, this is exactly why he was in placed in the protocol regardless of his answers to questions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mojo44 Posted October 1, 2019 Share Posted October 1, 2019 8 minutes ago, Rew said: He doesn't have to show any symptoms of a concussion to be in the protocol. A player can be placed into the protocol solely based on video evidence (this was changed in last few years after the Savage hit). After watching the hit in slow motion and Allen's reaction after the hit, the independent observers would have decided that taking a day or two for observation was the right plan regardless of reported symptoms. If Allen has no symptoms he'll progress through and play. If he had any symptoms yesterday, it is exceedingly unlikely that he plays against TEN. As the other doc (s) on this thread have noted, this is the case. It’s hard to say how long it will take but Josh should be fine. I can’t remember if this is his first concussion or not but that is now my big worry for him given the way he plays. Typically when an individual suffers a single concussion, and it is their first one, with time they recover fully. The problem, as we have all come to find out, is repeated concussions. I have a valuated many combat veterans who have had multiple TBI’s and their symptoms can become chronic. What is interesting is that there does not even have to be a direct head trauma in that something hit somebody in the head. Getting exposed to explosions such as mortar attacks or IED hits cause a concussive effect, also. Thus, the well understood cumulative effect. The hit on Josh was clearly targeting and the guy should’ve been ejected. But Josh does need to learn how to protect himself in these situations a lot better. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ytownblofan Posted October 1, 2019 Share Posted October 1, 2019 10 hours ago, CincyBillsFan said: Question for the docs posting, and thanks for sharing your expertise it's much appreciated. What should we conclude, if anything, by Allen running off the field to the locker room? I would have thought if he was still "loopy" they would have had a trainer escort him rather then let him go on his own. Should we be more or less hopeful that this was a minor concussion? Hey, not a Doc, but have had several concussions myself. For one of them I got my bell rung running through 1st base. Was a little dazed, but felt good enough to go pitch the next 3 innings. Come the 4th inning, everything went blank and they had to basically carry me off the mound and the next 2 days were miserable. So, while you could be right, in the fact that it could be minor and they were being precautionary by making him go to the locker room, but it is also entirely possible that 2 hours after the game the symptoms hit him like a ton of bricks. Fingers crossed it's the former and we will see 17 lead us to victory this week! 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bleeding Bills Blue Posted October 1, 2019 Share Posted October 1, 2019 1 hour ago, SoCal Deek said: I’m frankly amazed at the protocol. I would’ve sworn Allen was coming back in on Sunday after they showed him running, by himself, into the tunnel, waving at the crowd. I’ve never had a concussion but that sure didn’t look like a guy who had one. I assume the symptoms can come on the next day, like whiplash tends to. I kept saying "THATS JOSH ALLENS MUSIC!!" and hoping he would come out for the final drive to lead us to victory Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoHuddleKelly12 Posted October 1, 2019 Share Posted October 1, 2019 Not sure if already posted somewhere upthread, but I found this interesting from Peter King's column yesterday, discussing advances in concussion/head related trauma prevention that's coming to market soon--wish the Bills already had this! Excerpt below: https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2019/09/30/nfl-power-rankings-week-4-fmia-peter-king/ "4. I think this is the most interesting thing I learned this week: There’s a doctor in Florida who is working to develop a topical cream for football players to use pre-game to reduce the effects of head trauma during the game, and also a nasal spray to be used after a concussive blow, to lessen the length of time for recovery from a concussion. The doctor, Jake VanLandingham of Florida State, is in the trial phase with these medications. These medications wouldn’t be solely for football either—the military, with its history of concussive incidents in combat, is interested as well. “It would be good for football, and good for the military,” VanLandingham said. “But it’d also be good for the U.S. health-care industry. We could save billions in health-care costs.” The savings could come, VanLandingham thinks, if the recovery time for a concussion went from 10 or 12 days to five, which is his forecast with the nasal spray after a concussion is suffered … and, if the brain had been pre-treated with the trans-dermal cream on the side of the neck before a concussive blow, the effect of the hit would be lessened because a neurological anti-inflammatory had been used. “It’s like a brain shield,” VanLandingham said of the pre-game trans-dermal cream. He expects a couple of college football programs to be using some of the medication by 2020. This is one of the most hopeful things I’ve heard about concussion treatment in years." 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mojo44 Posted October 1, 2019 Share Posted October 1, 2019 Interesting. Potentially game changing if it actually works. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dean Posted October 1, 2019 Share Posted October 1, 2019 36 minutes ago, NoHuddleKelly12 said: Not sure if already posted somewhere upthread, but I found this interesting from Peter King's column yesterday, discussing advances in concussion/head related trauma prevention that's coming to market soon--wish the Bills already had this! Excerpt below: https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2019/09/30/nfl-power-rankings-week-4-fmia-peter-king/ "4. I think this is the most interesting thing I learned this week: There’s a doctor in Florida who is working to develop a topical cream for football players to use pre-game to reduce the effects of head trauma during the game, and also a nasal spray to be used after a concussive blow, to lessen the length of time for recovery from a concussion. I saw that as well. Sounds like a late night TV pitch: Miracle cream helps prevent concussions! OTOH, the post hit nasal spray sounds a bit more realistic, at least to me. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John from Riverside Posted October 1, 2019 Share Posted October 1, 2019 Just sit him out this week and protect the franchise. THis is why you get the veteran QB who can come in and win 3 games a year for you but is not a starter. I believe Matt Barkely is that guy. 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DasNootz Posted October 1, 2019 Share Posted October 1, 2019 8 minutes ago, John from Riverside said: Just sit him out this week and protect the franchise. THis is why you get the veteran QB who can come in and win 3 games a year for you but is not a starter. I believe Matt Barkely is that guy. exactly - sit this week and the bye. Learn from your mistakes and move forward. The Bills are very capable of winning with Barkley under center. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Patrick Duffy Posted October 1, 2019 Share Posted October 1, 2019 17 minutes ago, John from Riverside said: Just sit him out this week and protect the franchise. THis is why you get the veteran QB who can come in and win 3 games a year for you but is not a starter. I believe Matt Barkely is that guy. I agree.If he has to sit this one out then so be it. Then the bye will come and that should give him plenty of time to be ready to go. I believe Barkley can pull out a W but the Oline will have to do a better job and not allow free runners to hit the QB like they did when Barkley came in against the Pats. Barkley may get the ball off a little bit sooner but they cannot allow defenders to go unblocked. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boatdrinks Posted October 1, 2019 Share Posted October 1, 2019 27 minutes ago, John from Riverside said: Just sit him out this week and protect the franchise. THis is why you get the veteran QB who can come in and win 3 games a year for you but is not a starter. I believe Matt Barkely is that guy. I think he’s that guy, but not so sure this is the game he can win. Especially with all that Pats film fresh in the TEN coaches mind. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John from Riverside Posted October 1, 2019 Share Posted October 1, 2019 Just now, Boatdrinks said: I think he’s that guy, but not so sure this is the game he can win. Especially with all that Pats film fresh in the TEN coaches mind. ? Matt didnt start against the pats? To me its about Motor being ready.....we dont even lose that game if Devin plays imo 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boatdrinks Posted October 1, 2019 Share Posted October 1, 2019 3 minutes ago, John from Riverside said: ? Matt didnt start against the pats? To me its about Motor being ready.....we dont even lose that game if Devin plays imo No, he didn’t but there were major OL issues . I don’t think Vrabel will be concerned about Barkley destroying him in the air when he’s rushed. I fully expect him to show a lot of the same things that were effective vs the Bills offense. I like Singletary, but I’m not ready to call him a difference maker just yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaattMaann Posted October 1, 2019 Share Posted October 1, 2019 17 minutes ago, John from Riverside said: ? Matt didnt start against the pats? To me its about Motor being ready.....we dont even lose that game if Devin plays imo What makes you think that? Gore ran really well. Yeldon caught the ball well out of the backfield. I think the turnovers by Josh and then Josh exiting the game led to the loss. Just curious why you think Devin makes the difference in that game Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PromoTheRobot Posted October 1, 2019 Share Posted October 1, 2019 (edited) 1 hour ago, The Dean said: I saw that as well. Sounds like a late night TV pitch: Miracle cream helps prevent concussions! OTOH, the post hit nasal spray sounds a bit more realistic, at least to me. Gronk brand CBD oil rub. "I'm not just the owner. I'm a client!" Edited October 1, 2019 by PromoTheRobot 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John from Riverside Posted October 1, 2019 Share Posted October 1, 2019 1 minute ago, PaattMaann said: What makes you think that? Gore ran really well. Yeldon caught the ball well out of the backfield. I think the turnovers by Josh and then Josh exiting the game led to the loss. Just curious why you think Devin makes the difference in that game I went back and looked at something I picked up on during the game to reaffirm. Gore had excellent runs but he tired....and when he did they dint trot Yeldon out there....they ran Josh on designed runs....I FIRMLY believe that they dont do those runs if they had a fresh back that they felt could make plays......keeping Gore fresh....when Josh started throwing picks I firmly beleve Debol brings it back to the vest because our D was holding Brady and company in check. This is not a knock on Gore...he simply is not a 25 carry back any more AND Its Motor.....every time he touches the ball something good happens. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaattMaann Posted October 1, 2019 Share Posted October 1, 2019 7 minutes ago, John from Riverside said: I went back and looked at something I picked up on during the game to reaffirm. Gore had excellent runs but he tired....and when he did they dint trot Yeldon out there....they ran Josh on designed runs....I FIRMLY believe that they dont do those runs if they had a fresh back that they felt could make plays......keeping Gore fresh....when Josh started throwing picks I firmly beleve Debol brings it back to the vest because our D was holding Brady and company in check. This is not a knock on Gore...he simply is not a 25 carry back any more AND Its Motor.....every time he touches the ball something good happens. hmmmmm interesting. Def could be something to that. Good take. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blank Stare Posted October 1, 2019 Share Posted October 1, 2019 51 minutes ago, John from Riverside said: Just sit him out this week and protect the franchise. THis is why you get the veteran QB who can come in and win 3 games a year for you but is not a starter. I believe Matt Barkely is that guy. I don’t get this at all. If they clear him, why sit him? It’s an independent neurologist if I recall correctly. If he’s clear, you put your best guys on the field. We need him. Even with all the bone headed hero ball plays, he’s our best shot. We go as far as he takes us, same as it’s always been. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John from Riverside Posted October 1, 2019 Share Posted October 1, 2019 2 minutes ago, TheProcess said: I don’t get this at all. If they clear him, why sit him? It’s an independent neurologist if I recall correctly. If he’s clear, you put your best guys on the field. We need him. Even with all the bone headed hero ball plays, he’s our best shot. We go as far as he takes us, same as it’s always been. If its iffy or there is a question i would rather he sits because he gets the benefit of 2 weeks off with the bye. I dont like Josh not playing any more then anyone else.....Josh is my guy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YoloinOhio Posted October 1, 2019 Author Share Posted October 1, 2019 1 minute ago, John from Riverside said: If its iffy or there is a question i would rather he sits because he gets the benefit of 2 weeks off with the bye. I dont like Josh not playing any more then anyone else.....Josh is my guy I don’t think it will be an “iffy” decision because the protocol and it steps are very clear cut. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
klos63 Posted October 1, 2019 Share Posted October 1, 2019 58 minutes ago, John from Riverside said: Just sit him out this week and protect the franchise. THis is why you get the veteran QB who can come in and win 3 games a year for you but is not a starter. I believe Matt Barkely is that guy. Sit him out even if he is healthy? Why? Barkely has been in the league since 2013 and hasn't won 3 games in his career, what makes you think he can win 3 in one season? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ColoradoBills Posted October 1, 2019 Share Posted October 1, 2019 If Allen is still in protocol do they bring Davis Webb up to backup Barkley? Who gets cut/waived? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Philo Posted October 1, 2019 Share Posted October 1, 2019 4 minutes ago, ColoradoBills said: If Allen is still in protocol do they bring Davis Webb up to backup Barkley? Who gets cut/waived? Connor McDermott? Second best guess would be Marlowe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boatdrinks Posted October 1, 2019 Share Posted October 1, 2019 3 minutes ago, ColoradoBills said: If Allen is still in protocol do they bring Davis Webb up to backup Barkley? Who gets cut/waived? I’d say yes, they would bring him up. Someone could go back to PS or the last guy on the roster gets waived, possibly to return later. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blank Stare Posted October 1, 2019 Share Posted October 1, 2019 18 minutes ago, John from Riverside said: If its iffy or there is a question i would rather he sits because he gets the benefit of 2 weeks off with the bye. I dont like Josh not playing any more then anyone else.....Josh is my guy I get that, and I also don’t want anything bad or long term to happen to Josh either. I’m with you there. However, I don’t think he clears protocol unless he’s actually cleared from all symptoms. So he would be healthy. If he doesn’t clear, he doesn’t play. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buddo Posted October 1, 2019 Share Posted October 1, 2019 Thing is, even clearing the protocols means limited reps. Barkley will get his reps, within the gameplan and Josh will probably not be allowed to do stuff while still in it. ’Good to go’ doesn’t necessarily mean the best option. If he’ s ok, then it might be best for him to be the backup for the next game. If need be, he can always be brought on, as it wouldn’t really be being benched. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ColoradoBills Posted October 1, 2019 Share Posted October 1, 2019 4 minutes ago, Buddo said: Thing is, even clearing the protocols means limited reps. Barkley will get his reps, within the gameplan and Josh will probably not be allowed to do stuff while still in it. ’Good to go’ doesn’t necessarily mean the best option. If he’ s ok, then it might be best for him to be the backup for the next game. If need be, he can always be brought on, as it wouldn’t really be being benched. Your point could come into play depending on when he would be cleared. If it's not until Friday they may sit him as a backup. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gobills1212 Posted October 1, 2019 Share Posted October 1, 2019 46 minutes ago, John from Riverside said: I went back and looked at something I picked up on during the game to reaffirm. Gore had excellent runs but he tired....and when he did they dint trot Yeldon out there....they ran Josh on designed runs....I FIRMLY believe that they dont do those runs if they had a fresh back that they felt could make plays......keeping Gore fresh....when Josh started throwing picks I firmly beleve Debol brings it back to the vest because our D was holding Brady and company in check. This is not a knock on Gore...he simply is not a 25 carry back any more AND Its Motor.....every time he touches the ball something good happens. I thought the same thing but then caught myself bc Allen has been pretty fumble prone this year as well. With all this concussed talk, im surprised no one brought up the time (against the Steelers maybe?) That Kelly had sustained a concussion and as he was calling his own plays proceeded to to call the same play 3x in a row. The players thought it a bit odd, but it was a different time. He probably shouldnt have been in the game at that point. Kelly has actually had a few good stories of being knocked silly over the years. He told them in a way that was funny, but now that its such a sensitive issue its prob poor taste. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lurker Posted October 1, 2019 Share Posted October 1, 2019 27 minutes ago, ColoradoBills said: Your point could come into play depending on when he would be cleared. If it's not until Friday they may sit him as a backup. Yep. If Josh doesn't practice Thursday, he'll sit on Sunday... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keepthefaith Posted October 1, 2019 Share Posted October 1, 2019 9 minutes ago, Lurker said: Yep. If Josh doesn't practice Thursday, he'll sit on Sunday... Let him sit. If ever there was a week when he needs a full week of practice it's this week. He's got a lot of work to do and a few extra days of no contact from that injury isn't a bad thing. Barkley can run the offense. Hopefully they get a healthy Singletary back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott7975 Posted October 1, 2019 Share Posted October 1, 2019 1 hour ago, John from Riverside said: If its iffy or there is a question i would rather he sits because he gets the benefit of 2 weeks off with the bye. I dont like Josh not playing any more then anyone else.....Josh is my guy I don’t think there will be anything iffy in this protocol. They don’t mess around with head trauma anymore. He will either be cleared to play or he won’t. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SlimShady'sSpaceForce Posted October 1, 2019 Share Posted October 1, 2019 Wasn't Tyrod concussed and he played the following Sunday?? (I'm sure "the competitor" even played while concussed) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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