QB Velocity Numbers for 2018 Draft Released

[GunnerBill]

29 minutes ago, FeelingOnYouboty said:

I remember arguing with people for a year that Mayfield has a great arm. 

 

People are so lazy with their analysis that you have a guy who is 6’0 they immediately question his arm strength but don’t watch tape. Ball explodes off his hand.

 

Yea there is plenty of arm on Mayfield. If anything it was under utilised in the Oklahoma offense. 

[Teddy KGB]

11 hours ago, 26CornerBlitz said:

 

 Watson has plenty to clean up in his game, but he makes plays. 

 

What does he need to clean up ? Besides Beane/phantom GM’s corpse in a few years for passing on him. 

 

19 tds In 7 games seems squeaky clean. 

 

If we don’t land Rosen, Mayfield or Darnold we failed.   

 

 

 

 

Edited March 8, 2018 by Teddy KGB

[Hapless Bills Fan]

7 hours ago, Reed83HOF said:

ok - Fake news

 

Benjamin Allbright‏Verified account @AllbrightNFL 13m13 minutes ago

Since apparently it wasn't clear to some, the combine velocity numbers released earlier are NOT the ones I use.

 

He tweeted that last year, the OurLads velocity numbers were quite different than the "official" velocity numbers.

[Gugny]

9 hours ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

Where did this conclusion that anyone throwing less than 55 mph has "no chance" come from?

 

2017

Trubisky 51/50

Watson 45/45

Peterman 49/49 - throw him out NOW! (jk)

2016

Dak Prescott 54

2013

EJ Manuel 54 -hey that explains a lot, why didn't we follow the rules *g*

 

And then how do you deal with the "did not throw" guys like Darnold, Derek Carr, Bridgewater, Andrew Luck, Bob Griffin, Tannehill etc?

 

I'm just commenting to show appreciation for writing, "Bob Griffin," instead of that stupid nickname everyone else calls him.  

[LeGOATski]

QBs named "Bob" don't succeed in the NFL.

[BuffaloHokie13]

It's nice and all that Allen broke the record, except if he can't throw with touch. Then it's a problem (and I believe it is).

[26CornerBlitz]

18 minutes ago, LeGOATski said:

QBs named "Bob" don't succeed in the NFL.

 

Mr. Griese says 

[Blokestradamus]

5 minutes ago, BuffaloHokie13 said:

It's nice and all that Allen broke the record, except if he can't throw with touch. Then it's a problem (and I believe it is).

 

Same issue as guys like Chad Kelly and Cody Fajardo. He throws so many bad passes so hard, they're impossible to pick off

[Bray Wyatt]

In regards to Tyrods numbers, I believe he had a sore/hurt arm when he did that hence the low number. I remember hearing that somewhere

[BillnutinHouston]

**  Nuanced point alert **

 

Looking at these numbers without any context can be misleading.  To explain:

 

To my knowledge the QBs weren't put through a drill where they were instructed to throw as hard as they can.  Rather, each made choices about how they wanted to pass to make the completions.  

 

Take Jackson for example.  I heard Mayock specifically say that Jackson wasn't really ripping it, he was playing it cautiously and aiming the ball to ensure completions.  If you accept Mayock's observation, you have to interpret Jackson's 49 as an aimed throw 49, not as his top speed nor necessarily reflective of his arm strength.  

Edited March 8, 2018 by BillnutinHouston

[Reed83HOF]

1 hour ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

He tweeted that last year, the OurLads velocity numbers were quite different than the "official" velocity numbers.

 

Correct - We should wait to get our hands on his data before we go too overboard with this. From what I recall this data is pretty useful in looking at prospects. If the ball takes too long to get where it needs to go, bad things can happen in the NFL...

[NewEra]

3 hours ago, Blokestradamus said:

 

Same issue as guys like Chad Kelly and Cody Fajardo. He throws so many bad passes so hard, they're impossible to pick off

 

I remember Jamarcus Russell play the saints.  It seemed as if the Raiders offense was built around Injuring the Saints defensive players......with Jamarcus bullet passes to the chest.   The passes were thrown THAT hard and directly at the saints players.  I don’t think the saints caught one pass and a couple had to leave the field after being drilled with such unexpected force.  

[Bleeding Bills Blue]

3 hours ago, BillnutinHouston said:

**  Nuanced point alert **

 

Looking at these numbers without any context can be misleading.  To explain:

 

To my knowledge the QBs weren't put through a drill where they were instructed to throw as hard as they can.  Rather, each made choices about how they wanted to pass to make the completions.  

 

Take Jackson for example.  I heard Mayock specifically say that Jackson wasn't really ripping it, he was playing it cautiously and aiming the ball to ensure completions.  If you accept Mayock's observation, you have to interpret Jackson's 49 as an aimed throw 49, not as his top speed nor necessarily reflective of his arm strength.  

 

I think they're out routes to the right and left, which is a very weak part in jacksons game as it stands right now.  

[Maynard]

6 hours ago, Commonsense said:

Mayfield just keeps warming my heart more and more each day.

I would do anything to get Mayfield if I’m Beane. 

[ndirish1978]

13 hours ago, Mij yllek said:

Here is a much more comprehensive assessment of the QB's:

 

 

https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/draft/news/2018-nfl-draft-rankings-accuracy-arm-strength-and-everything-to-know-about-qbs/

 

I'm not reading anything by Trespasso that deals with QBs. The guy wants to have Mason Rudolph's babies. 

[HiddenInLight]

The Jackson excuses have already started.  Is it too much to ask for us to actually go for a guy that we don't need to make excuses for?

[hondo in seattle]

3 hours ago, Bray Wyatt said:

In regards to Tyrods numbers, I believe he had a sore/hurt arm when he did that hence the low number. I remember hearing that somewhere

 

I remember more or less the same thing.  I thought it was a sore shoulder, though. 

 

He did have some kind of minor/recovering injury at the combine.  

[Over 29 years of fanhood]

14 hours ago, 26CornerBlitz said:

Combine Velocities from 2008-2017: http://blogs.ourlads.com/2017/03/16/quarterback-ball-velocity-at-nfl-combine-2008-2015/

 

Seems the guys who expect to get drafted early don’t risk this hurting their stock. 

 

 

Tanner Lee- haven’t discussed him much. He might be worth a 6 or 7 as the second or third qb? 

[BuffaloHokie13]

1 minute ago, Over 29 years of fanhood said:

Tanner Lee- haven’t discussed him much. He might be worth a 6 or 7 as the second or third qb? 

We do need someone to accidentally hit the hospitality tent in camp...

[26CornerBlitz]

6 minutes ago, Over 29 years of fanhood said:

Seems the guys who expect to get drafted early don’t risk this hurting their stock. 

 

Tanner Lee- haven’t discussed him much. He might be worth a 6 or 7 as the second or third qb? 

 

The Bills have no picks after the 5th round, but if they did I wouldn't waste one on Lee.

Edited March 8, 2018 by 26CornerBlitz

[Over 29 years of fanhood]

1 minute ago, BuffaloHokie13 said:

We do need someone to accidentally hit the hospitality tent in camp...

 

?. Poor EJ.  He really did try hard.  

2 minutes ago, 26CornerBlitz said:

 

The Bills' have no picks after the 5th round, but if they did I wouldn't waste one on Lee.

 

Good point.  No need to worry about it then. 

[Sweats]

Chances are, if there’s a scrub QB who can’t throw the ball, we’ll find him......and probably sign him to a monster deal.

[ColoradoBills]

3 minutes ago, Sweats said:

Chances are, if there’s a scrub QB who can’t throw the ball, we’ll find him......and probably sign him to a monster deal.

 

LOL.  I'm waiting for all of the "Bill's should of Drafted (insert name here)" threads.

[Alphadawg7]

14 hours ago, billspro said:

 

Very impressive for Rosen and Mayfield. 

 

I thought Jackson had a bigger arm than that. That is another red flag for him with the accuracy issues. The other guys didn't have great arms on tape so I am not surprised. There are not many pocket passers that make it with low velocity. I would be a little worried expecting Falk or Lauletta to be anything more than backups. I still think Rudolph has a chance though. 

 

Velocity is over rated.  It completely ignores touch, feel, and timing.  Yes you like to see your QB have some rocket fire arm, but honestly, too strong of an arm can also be a detriment and lead to deflected passes.  Its not very often when a QB needs to fire a laser shot that has a low, deflectable and interceptable, pass to a WR.  

 

And if you watch Lamar, he is capable of firing rockets down field.  The biggest difference is massive distance, but you are talking about a handful of passes each year at most where a QB needs to heave the ball 70 yards in the air, its a rare play.  And its mostly a Hail Mary type play because of the amount of time it takes for the play to develop as you need to the WR to make all its moves and get down field to catch it in the first place and takes too long to develop in the pocket.  

 

While you want zip to the outside routes, you dont need to be at 55 or above to have enough zip to make that pass.  Its once again rare that a guy is literally going to fire at full power on a laser rope to the outside.  Timing, accuracy, and touch will beat out zip and power 100% of the time.  The two greatest QBs of all time without debate are easily Montana and Brady, neither had big live arms.  

 

I do find it interesting people are crapping on Lamars 49 yet most of them are the same people who like Peterman (also a 49) and Watson, who is worse at a 45.  

 

I have all year wanted Baker, and still very much do.  He's my guy and has been the whole CFB season even when people kept telling me he was a 2nd round pick at best.  But I would also be quite happy with Lamar if we stay put and dont trade up.  I wont be upset about any QB we take, all the top 5 or 6 guys would be interesting or exciting to bring in.  I just think Baker is the best QB prospect and guy I prefer in a trade up, and Lamar is the best guy on the board likely if we stay put.

Edited March 8, 2018 by Alphadawg7

[cba fan]

16 hours ago, H2o said:

I will admit that Chad Pennington's was probably about 34, but he was a successful QB. 

lol...

 

Chad was so slow he was first QB ever to have his throws measured via "air speed" vs  "ground speed".

[Lurker]

Lamar Jackson - Louisville - 49 (left), 49 (right)   

 

Nathan Peterman, Pittsburgh, 49 (Left), 49 (Right)  

6 hours ago, 26CornerBlitz said:

 

Mr. Griese says 

 

Mr. Griese would be holding a clipboard in today's NFL...

Edited March 8, 2018 by Lurker

[26CornerBlitz]

12 minutes ago, Lurker said:

Lamar Jackson - Louisville - 49 (left), 49 (right)   

 

Nathan Peterman, Pittsburgh, 49 (Left), 49 (Right)  

 

Mr. Griese would be holding a clipboard in today's NFL...

 

[LABILLBACKER]

....but do any of these guys have late movement?

[cba fan]

3 hours ago, LABILLBACKER said:

....but do any of these guys have late movement?

lol.....

 

no but Johnny Football had a great slider.

[bills11]

theres something off about these qb velocity numbers..like theres abberations or such

Peterman has the weakest arm probably in the nfl yet he scored similar to tyrod and stronger

then deshaun watson who has show to have more than adequate velocity..and flacco having less 

velocity then andy dalton is bull ****

[Hapless Bills Fan]

9 hours ago, Reed83HOF said:

 

Correct - We should wait to get our hands on his data before we go too overboard with this. From what I recall this data is pretty useful in looking at prospects. If the ball takes too long to get where it needs to go, bad things can happen in the NFL...

 

Agreed.

7 hours ago, HiddenInLight said:

The Jackson excuses have already started.  Is it too much to ask for us to actually go for a guy that we don't need to make excuses for?

 

Who would that guy be?

[Luxy312]

The Jackson apologists are out in full force.
"Nevermind his accuracy percentage.  He's more accurate than what that says"
"Nevermind his arm strength.  That metric must have been measured wrong"

"Nevermind that 1/3 of his college offensive contribution was on running plays.  He can pass"
"Nevermind that his intelligence test has him grading out borderline illiterate.  He's smarter than what it says on paper"
"INSERT ADDITIONAL APOLOGIES HERE"

All of these quarterbacks have issues, but none stand out more than Jackson.  He's a multiple wart toad being compared to frogs.
 

[HappyDays]

31 minutes ago, Luxy312 said:

The Jackson apologists are out in full force.
"Nevermind his accuracy percentage.  He's more accurate than what that says"
"Nevermind his arm strength.  That metric must have been measured wrong"

"Nevermind that 1/3 of his college offensive contribution was on running plays.  He can pass"
"Nevermind that his intelligence test has him grading out borderline illiterate.  He's smarter than what it says on paper"
"INSERT ADDITIONAL APOLOGIES HERE"

All of these quarterbacks have issues, but none stand out more than Jackson.  He's a multiple wart toad being compared to frogs.
 

 

Good thing you resurrected a thread from over a month ago to offer your unrelated opinion on Lamar Jackson

[nbbillsfan]

pretty sure drew brees is like a 53 mph guy....

[Luxy312]

On 4/23/2018 at 1:57 PM, HappyDays said:

 

Good thing you resurrected a thread from over a month ago to offer your unrelated opinion on Lamar Jackson

 

Good thing Lamar Jackson was drafted exactly where he was expected to be drafted (late first, early second).  Backup.....

[T master]

On 3/7/2018 at 10:02 PM, BisonMan said:

Interesting Notables under 55:

 

Deshaun Watson - 45

Nate Peterman - 49

Dak Prescott- 54

Mitch Trubisky - 51

AJ McCarron - 53

 

It seems a bunch of starters are right around 55, including Wentz, Mahomes, Winston and Mariota. The number appears arbitrary to me and may not be applicable in game conditions. Peterman’s ball seems a lot slower to me in game situations than Watson’s but he was 4mph faster at the combine.

 

EdW

 

 

 

More from the "experts" side of things i wonder what Kelly, Marino, & Elways were back then that had nothing to do with nothing it's all about reading defenses & yes you need zip but if you can anticipate a WR coming open i would think that has a lot more to do with it !! 

 

Every body now is into the analytics of the game at any position !! 

[Buffalo716]

4 minutes ago, T master said:

 

 

More from the "experts" side of things i wonder what Kelly, Marino, & Elways were back then that had nothing to do with nothing it's all about reading defenses & yes you need zip but if you can anticipate a WR coming open i would think that has a lot more to do with it !! 

 

Every body now is into the analytics of the game at any position !! 

 

I’m sure Elway, Kelly and Marino were all above 55.

 

Elway was known for the “Elway cross” so he might of been 60*

[Fadingpain]

A stat like this is about as important to QB success as ability to cook a wonderful meal.

 

When Tom Brady reads a defense at the line, makes adjustments to take advantage of defensive scheme, and then throws a little 7 yard timing pass over the middle...where does ball speed enter the equation?

 

The mental component of the game is massively more important than arm strength.

 

 

[Beans Dream]

4 minutes ago, Fadingpain said:

A stat like this is about as important to QB success as ability to cook a wonderful meal.

 

When Tom Brady reads a defense at the line, makes adjustments to take advantage of defensive scheme, and then throws a little 7 yard timing pass over the middle...where does ball speed enter the equation?

 

The mental component of the game is massively more important than arm strength.

 

 

Good thing our QB topped the wonderlic test as well!

[Chicken Boo]

On 3/7/2018 at 10:34 PM, ILBillsfan said:

Lamar Jackson didn't even hit 50 wow

 

 

That's likely because he was focused more on being accurate.

 

I'm no Jackson fan, but his arm is ??

Edited May 5, 2018 by Chicken Boo