Diggs traded to Texans for picks

[Governor]

Just now, Roundybout said:

 

 

Good point 

He’s creating drama for no reason.

[Pine Barrens Mafia]

Just now, GoBills808 said:

Five years cumulative I think would do it

 

stats/awards/whatevers relevant

I'm game, but I'm a broke ***** (thanks divorce court). So the stakes won't be high. DM me with ideas.

1 minute ago, Governor said:

He’s creating drama for no reason.

I think that may be Geary's best take in years 

[UKBillFan]

1 minute ago, Roundybout said:

 

 

Good point 

Possibly. Though we have seen in Green Bay that the wishes of a franchise QB can be ignored.

 

I suspect Josh had had enough of the underhand swipes from someone he had considered a brother, though.

[Roundybout]

1 minute ago, Pine Barrens Mafia said:

I'm game, but I'm a broke ***** (thanks divorce court). So the stakes won't be high. DM me with ideas.

I think that may be Geary's best take in years 

You don’t have to censor “cracker”

[Beck Water]

45 minutes ago, Lieutenant Aldo Raine said:

If the Bills held onto Diggs for another year, and he performed similarly like he did the last half of last year, would they still have been able to acquire a future 2nd Rnd Pick ????  Diggs value appears to be depreciating in value, and so maybe now was the time to sell as high as possible. 

 

Well, that's one of the unknowable questions, right?  
Diggs receiving performance with the Bills, while still strong, had fallen off overall last season.  He had a fall-off in 2021, then came back in 2022, then off again.

So is this something he'll rebound from, or the start of a downward trend?

 

It fell off to where it was his last year in Minn, where he was still at a performance point the Bills were willing to trade a 1st and a 4th for him.

So is getting a 2025 2nd reasonable comp, for the same level of performance the Bills were willing to fork over a 1st for but 30 instead of 26?

 

I'm still trying to get comfortable with LibreOffice, so I messed around with a couple of charts.

 

These are Diggs receiving yards per game for 2022 and 2023, including playoffs.  Obviously there's a lot of game to game variation and the regression line means nothing at all statistically, but it seems like the highs weren't as high and the fall off in the 2nd half was steeper.

 

One of the things that does happen to all NFL players as they get older, is that the toll on the body gets harder and harder to recover from between games and builds up faster and faster during the season.

[Pine Barrens Mafia]

1 minute ago, Roundybout said:

You don’t have to censor “cracker”

f*ck was the word choice lol

[thewookie1]

Diggs was a great player but was coming close to becoming a cap nightmare and had been slowly getting more troublesome with off the field drama
 

His happy go lucky response to his drop against KC this year versus he demonstrative anger he at Allen for missing him last year against Cinci always rubbed me the wrong way seeing as Allen just moved on to the next play both times. 

Edited April 3 by thewookie1

[Niagara Dude]

End of the day the talent level on this team is not great,  outside of Allen they have no true elite players.  Beane really started making mistakes after 13 secs and handing out big contracts to guys getting older.  That got us into this cap mess,  meanwhile the Chiefs were smart,  after losing to the Bengals they cut ties with Hill who is both younger and better then Diggs.  They never gave in to his contract demands and won 2 Super Bowls since.  I just hope McDermott does not convince Beane to spend high picks on defence and offence struggles for it.  

[ALLinALLEN]

The only feelings I have after processing this all day is that it just sucks. It sucks that we couldn’t get one damn championship let alone an appearance with a guy that will finish 4th in most Bills WR all time records. With an all star QB and an elite top 5 WR the closest we came (game wise) was a blowout AFCCG loss in KC. It just sucks. 

[Ya Digg?]

20 minutes ago, Mikie2times said:

100%- I will add, the dynamics with people can be extremely complicated. I think Steph and his personality made it harder for Josh to really take the leadership role by the horns. Allen came in the league and Steph was older, more experienced, more of a presence. The dynamic was fine for Steph at first, he was the alpha, the man. But I think as Allen grew into stardom Steph sort of wanted to maintain that pecking order. Josh isn't loud, he's excessively polite. He's just not the type to drop his Johnson on the ground and take charge. What part of that he did have in him, I think Stephs presence likely made him less likely to express it. But people like Josh can be that way in the right environment. It starts off by not being heavily challenged which was more likely to occur with Steph around. Over time confidence grows and you learn to express yourself as a vocal leader. Now all of our former captains gone this is Allens team. Nobody is left to challenge him. It's such a great opportunity for him to become more than a leader with how he plays. This just feels right to me in so many ways. Excited for the first time all offseason believe it or not. 

I don’t buy this at all. You are giving Diggs way too much credit over Josh’s leadership abilities. I don’t believe Diggs had that much influence on how Josh led the team. I also don’t get this obsession of needing to see Josh be “vocal” on the sidelines, as if that somehow makes him a better leader. Good leaders don’t need to scream at their teammates on the sidelines. We also have no idea what Josh does in terms of leadership the other 6 days a week. Players love playing for him, they all say he’s a great leader, and this has absolutely been Josh’s team the last several years. The “no one left to challenge him” line is just nonsense 

[Seventeen]

4 minutes ago, thewookie1 said:

Diggs was a great player but was coming close to becoming a cap nightmare and had been slowly getting more troublesome with off the field drama
 

His happy go lucky response to his drop against KC this year versus he demonstrative anger he at Allen for missing him last year against Cinci always rubbed me the wrong way seeing as Allen just moved on to the next play both times. 

 

Isn't 31 mil in dead cap a cap nightmare ? 

[Ethan in Cleveland]

27 minutes ago, Governor said:

I’m very proud of Beane today. That’s how you do it.  That’s how you stay good in this league.

Yes trade top 10 WR and keep busts like Epenesa. Take five years to finally put together an above average OL and then blow it up one year later.

Doesn't matter anyways, until McDermott is gone its all window dressing. 

[GaryPinC]

2 hours ago, Augie said:

 

It felt a bit like we lost our WR1 some time last Fall. 

 

Just a little more context. Part of me actually thought he was hurt.  🤷‍♂️

 

But he will come out fired up next year! I can guarantee you THAT!!!  😂 

Me also, I was convinced Diggs had to have an injury at first because the dynamic between him and Josh changed so abruptly. 

 

As games went on and things languished it seemed otherwise.  He definitely seemed nonchalant and not invested in the playoffs.  It all makes sense now and he's better gone.  It ran its course.  I wish him well and good luck Texans.  Diggs jumped to the up and coming team again.  Except he may be nearing the end of his usefulness. 

[Beck Water]

5 minutes ago, Roundybout said:

 

 

Good point 

 

I thought the Kyle Brandt take was interesting for a similar reason.  He said it's hard to imagine that Diggs relationship with Josh Allen or his relationship with the Bills "or both" had nothing to do with this, because both were "mercurial at best".  Kyle has been a Josh Allen fan-boy for a couple of years, and we can probably assume he has a bit of "tea" in the pot "off the record" there.
 

I agree with Nate that Josh's input was probably sought (not his vote as Geary implies, but his input), and that if Josh had said "He's My Guy" and went to the mat, it probably doesn't go down, at least not for a bag of peanuts and a case of that underwear Stef and his brother shill for.

[Gunsgoodtime]

1 minute ago, Seventeen said:

 

Isn't 31 mil in dead cap a cap nightmare ? 

6th highest in NFL history 

[GASabresIUFan]

FYI on DIggs last season

 

Games 1-6  49 catches on 66 targets for 620 yards and 5 TDs.  Catch % 74.24%; Yards/C 12.65

 

Games 7-19 68 catches on 111 targets for 636 yards and 3 TDS.  Catch % 61.26%; yards/c 9.35

 

 

[JGMcD2]

3 minutes ago, Ethan in Cleveland said:

Yes trade top 10 WR and keep busts like Epenesa. Take five years to finally put together an above average OL and then blow it up one year later.

Doesn't matter anyways, until McDermott is gone its all window dressing. 

Your schtick is boring 

[Niagara Dude]

2 minutes ago, Seventeen said:

 

Isn't 31 mil in dead cap a cap nightmare ? 

That is the worse part of this,  31 m dead cap and no picks for this season.  Someone said the pick was not available after June 1 and they don't know that because the pick is for next season not this season

[Beck Water]

26 minutes ago, BBFL said:

Dalton Shultz (who signed a 1 year deal before the 2023 draft) and Noah Brown were the only offensive signings so far this off season. Both resigns. 
 

Last year he was still an unknown at #2 when they drafted Juice Scruggs and Tank Dell. 
 

Aside those 4 players, only 2 of whom were added around Stroud, Joe Mixon is the only other addition. 
 

Their attention is on defense. They had the tackles in place and brought in Shaq Mason to fill one of the other guard spots. All three of those guys are on decent contracts. 
 

They gave Shultz a decent contract and resigned a guy who they like in Brown. 
 

To me, again, they’re building a team on both sides of the field. Defense needs more work than the offense hence the acquisitions so far this off season. 
 

Probably said this a couple of times in this thread but what bums me out the most in this trade is you sent a savvy vet to an easily top 8 AFC team. They needed help in working the underneath stuff for Stroud. 
 

Diggs, Shultz and a running back combo of Mixon/Pearce should fix that. 
 

 

 

I could be wrong, but while Diggs CAN run those underneath routes - I don't think he likes them. 

They often come with getting hit quickly and hard, or going down quickly to avoid hits (but fail to convert 1D)

Edited April 3 by Beck Water

[london_bills]

So much criticism of the bills, the guy was toxic 

[HalftimeAdjustment]

3 minutes ago, Beck Water said:

 

I thought the Kyle Brandt take was interesting for a similar reason.  He said it's hard to imagine that Diggs relationship with Josh Allen or his relationship with the Bills "or both" had nothing to do with this, because both were "mercurial at best".  Kyle has been a Josh Allen fan-boy for a couple of years, and we can probably assume he has a bit of "tea" in the pot "off the record" there.
 

I agree with Nate that Josh's input was probably sought (not his vote as Geary implies, but his input), and that if Josh had said "He's My Guy" and went to the mat, it probably doesn't go down, at least not for a bag of peanuts and a case of that underwear Stef and his brother shill for.

 

I think Diggs wanted out for a while. Given that there is no reason for Josh to push for Diggs to stay. That is true whether they have a positive or negative personal relationship. Once Diggs wanted out, it was just about finding a trade the team felt benefitted them more than hanging onto Diggs.

[All_Pro_Bills]

20 minutes ago, Pine Barrens Mafia said:

IDK about that

 

I think Stroud will likely be more successful than Allen long term.

 

 

It's going to be interesting for CJ.  He missed a couple games so his durability needs to be watched.  And everyone's assuming no sophomore jinx and 1 year of film for defensive coordinators to work with won't lead to figuring out his tendencies and possible weakneses.  But the set up for success looks to be in place

 

[PBF81]

18 minutes ago, ColoradoBills said:

 

That's the cost IF you want to use it this year.  Maybe Beane holds on to it.

 

The point is that it's a season gone by.  

 

Same as if I offered you a free meal somewhere next year.  It doesn't help you out now/this year.  

 

Beane keeps kicking the can down the road on certain things, but one thing he's never done is devoted even one offseaon, much less more, much less a string of them, into building around the one thing/player upon which our destiny hinges.  

 

 

[Roundybout]

Followed by a horrible take 

 

2 minutes ago, All_Pro_Bills said:

It's going to be interesting for CJ.  He missed a couple games so his durability needs to be watched.  And everyone's assuming no sophomore jinx and 1 year of film for defensive coordinators to work with won't lead to figuring out his tendencies and possible weakneses.  But the set up for success looks to be in place

 

Guys a baller. You can tell he has the confidence and the swagger to be a champion. 
 

Guys like Tua and Bryce Young don’t have this 

[zow2]

I owe Glab an apology.  Diggs is just one of those personality types who instigates all kinds of crap and then acts like the victim.

[MarkyMannn]

Could this be a TBD record for how quick a thread hit 100 pages? 8 hours!

[Herc11]

The more and more I've thought about this the more it makes sense. 

 

1: Diggs is 31 and prob only has a couple years left as #1. This draft is loaded and if you can get one of the top 3-4 WRs, you've effectively replaced him with a new #1 for the next 10 yrs. Trading him now, at least they got value to make the move to get one of those guys.

 

2: The trade clears his contract from the team going forward and gives them breathing room next year to move on from Miller if he doesn't produce this year.

 

3: dead cap is $31M. Diggs hit was $27M. So that's a $4M difference. Add on the rookie #1 WR cap hit, prob $2-4M and now that #1 cap hit is around $35M this year instead of $27M. They essentially are paying a slight premium to move on.

 

4: A rookie gives them, hopefully, a star WR on a rookie contract for the next 4 years or so, again, allowing money to be spent elsewhere. 

[Seventeen]

Trading Diggs just solidifies Beane taking WR in the 1st round and possibly moving up to do so - unless he's playing 4-D chess with a trade coming to replace Diggs.

[billsherd]

1 hour ago, UKBillFan said:

Just caught yesterday’s tweet. It is absolutely right that Diggs has never criticised the Bills or the Mafia. But he really seemed to have it in for Josh, and it gets to a point where you can’t have WR1 working against the QB in public to that extent.

What did he tweet?

[Slack_in_MA]

34 minutes ago, Mikie2times said:

100%- I will add, the dynamics with people can be extremely complicated. I think Steph and his personality made it harder for Josh to really take the leadership role by the horns. Allen came in the league and Steph was older, more experienced, more of a presence. The dynamic was fine for Steph at first, he was the alpha, the man. But I think as Allen grew into stardom Steph sort of wanted to maintain that pecking order. Josh isn't loud, he's excessively polite. He's just not the type to drop his Johnson on the ground and take charge. What part of that he did have in him, I think Stephs presence likely made him less likely to express it. But people like Josh can be that way in the right environment. It starts off by not being heavily challenged which was more likely to occur with Steph around. Over time confidence grows and you learn to express yourself as a vocal leader. Now all of our former captains gone this is Allens team. Nobody is left to challenge him. It's such a great opportunity for him to become more than a leader with how he plays. This just feels right to me in so many ways. Excited for the first time all offseason believe it or not. 

I'll play devil's advocate on the bolded. Why is that necessarily a great thing? Are you saying Josh's decision-making is infallible? We know that's not exactly true.

 

Who are the new leaders that Josh will look to for feedback on team-wide culture stuff? 

 

Don't discount the importance of a strong leadership team. 

[Augie]

12 minutes ago, GaryPinC said:

Me also, I was convinced Diggs had to have an injury at first because the dynamic between him and Josh changed so abruptly. 

 

As games went on and things languished it seemed otherwise.  He definitely seemed nonchalant and not invested in the playoffs.  It all makes sense now and he's better gone.  It ran its course.  I wish him well and good luck Texans.  Diggs jumped to the up and coming team again.  Except he may be nearing the end of his usefulness. 

 

May he have two tipped ball INT’s and a fumble against the Bills in the AFCCG next year!  

[UKBillFan]

Just now, billsherd said:

What did he tweet?

Someone posted that whilst Josh benefited from having a top receiver Diggs was not essential to Josh’s success. Diggs tweeted back “You sure?”

[CNYfan]

All this and "we need a dude, yo!".   Or whatever they say

[PBF81]

23 minutes ago, BBFL said:

Dalton Shultz (who signed a 1 year deal before the 2023 draft) and Noah Brown were the only offensive signings so far this off season. Both resigns. 
 

Last year he was still an unknown at #2 when they drafted Juice Scruggs and Tank Dell. 
 

Aside those 4 players, only 2 of whom were added around Stroud, Joe Mixon is the only other addition. 
 

Their attention is on defense. They had the tackles in place and brought in Shaq Mason to fill one of the other guard spots. All three of those guys are on decent contracts. 
 

They gave Shultz a decent contract and resigned a guy who they like in Brown. 
 

To me, again, they’re building a team on both sides of the field. Defense needs more work than the offense hence the acquisitions so far this off season. 
 

Probably said this a couple of times in this thread but what bums me out the most in this trade is you sent a savvy vet to an easily top 8 AFC team. They needed help in working the underneath stuff for Stroud. 
 

Diggs, Shultz and a running back combo of Mixon/Pearce should fix that. 
 

 

 

The point is that Stroud already has more talent at WR around him than Allen's ever had.  

 

Tank Dell had as good a rookie season as Samuel's ever had, slightly better.  Nico Collins is likely to be among the league's best next season.  Throw in Diggs, and when at 31 Robert Woods is your 4/5, you're lookin' pretty good.  

 

Stroud was incredibly impressive this past season.  It's early, and it's Ryan's second season as a HC, but it shouldn't be unrealistic to consider that Houston dominates that division for the foreseeable future.  And if all that Ryan does with that troop is see early exits from the playoffs for four or five seasons, I don't expect that he'll be kept on.  

 

 

[PauleeeWalnuts]

2 minutes ago, Seventeen said:

Trading Diggs just solidifies Beane taking WR in the 1st round and possibly moving up to do so - unless he's playing 4-D chess with a trade coming to replace Diggs.

I don’t think there is any money to trade for anyone else

[Governor]

After listening to Beane, production was definitely a key factor in the decision.

 

He said “The years Steph and Josh were clicking they were as good as anyone out there” which tells you that he felt there were also years where that DIDN’T happen.

Edited April 3 by Governor

[MAJBobby]

 

 

[PBF81]

16 minutes ago, london_bills said:

So much criticism of the bills, the guy was toxic 

 

Insofar as that criticism goes, Beane knew the risks as such when he traded for Diggs to begin with.  So this notion that this scenario has (more or less) now played out twice, if anything should add criticism to our originally having traded for him.  Again, not my criticism, but for those taking that angle.  

 

My thing is that we had to pay for Diggs because Beane and his staff, A, never even tried to draft a WR on days 1 or 2 in 6 drafts now, and B, with their later picks haven't been able to do much for WR otherwise, besides Shakir, who's good but hardly great.  

 

We'll see, there are a lot of roster & cap issues right now.  The one thing that's indisputable is that it's now fully McBeane's mess for them to clean up and deal with.  

 

At this point, and until we see our Draft in just over three weeks, I wouldn't bet that we win the division.  I hope we do, think that we likely will, but I wouldn't put any money on it.  

 

 

[dave mcbride]

Not sure this has been posted yet (I don’t have time to search), but it’s good: https://theathletic.com/5387835/2024/04/03/stefon-diggs-trade-bills-texans-attitude/

[boyst]

3 hours ago, Solomon Grundy said:

Isn't this the definition of a "hot mic"? 

 

Hot mic would be known and open mic is just left on.