JA and company are locking in on Diggs to a fault and here is the proof watch the whole thing

[Coldfronts]

 

Edited October 16, 2023 by Coldfronts

[Warcodered]

at 6:45 isn't the first read Gabe and the second one Diggs then the pressure gets there before he gets to Shakir?

 

at least he clearly looked like he was looking more at Davis at first.

Edited October 16, 2023 by Warcodered

[Draconator]

DIGGS

DIGGS

DIGGS

[Chaos]

9 minutes ago, Coldfronts said:

 

so this single play constitutes "proof".  hmm.

[Coldfronts]

1 minute ago, Chaos said:

so this single play constitutes "proof".  hmm.

you did not watch the whole thing did you?

[Bruffalo]

It's a problem, but we don't really know the root of it. 

 

Is it because Diggs is read 1 on practically every play and Allen trusts his arm to just gun it to him? If so, Dorsey needs to diversify the playbook to get more pieces involved.

 

Is it because Allen doesn't trust the other guys? Then they need to find whatever they can to establish that trust.

 

Is it because the other guys just don't get open? Well I don't know how you fix that, better schemes I guess.

 

I think it's a scheme issue and a read issue, honestly. 

[Big Turk]

6:54 he means I think

[Coldfronts]

almost 56% team target was diggs and 78% in the 1st quarter alone

[Straight Hucklebuck]

Don’t blame him at all.

 

In fact I’d push 20 targets per game to him.

 

Does anyone play with Diggs competitiveness or fire?

6 minutes ago, Bruffalo said:

It's a problem, but we don't really know the root of it. 

 

Is it because Diggs is read 1 on practically every play and Allen trusts his arm to just gun it to him? If so, Dorsey needs to diversify the playbook to get more pieces involved.

 

Is it because Allen doesn't trust the other guys? Then they need to find whatever they can to establish that trust.

 

Is it because the other guys just don't get open? Well I don't know how you fix that, better schemes I guess.

 

I think it's a scheme issue and a read issue, honestly. 

We are getting what we pay for on offensive skill position. 
 

Who is their right mind thinks 5’6” Deonte Harty is a consistent playmaker?

 

Who in their right mind is like we gotta get Trent Sherfield some more snaps out wide?

 

Our talent is average.

 

Thats why on all the pre season lists the Bills are mid pack when their weapons are rated. 

[Warcodered]

10 minutes ago, Big Turk said:

6:54 he means I think

Yeah that play looked like it was Gabe then Diggs.

[Coldfronts]

kiss about 60% of your offense away if Diggs goes down.  Over reliance on Diggs is just not going to be a successful strategy moving forward 

[Reed83HOF]

If you want to someone to catch to the ball, look for Diggs. Knox and Gabe are iffy pass catchers. I wouldn't trust them either...

 

This has been a known issue and I do wish Beane pushes harder during the offseason for WR2. Kincaid is nice, but he isn't WR2 and neither is Davis....

[dpberr]

The 2023 Bills are setting themselves up for more Cincy-Buffalo Divisional game disappointment because they *still* haven't developed any reliable plan to get the hard yards outside of Stefon Diggs.  There's no built in balance, and seemingly little interest to create any.  

 

It is concerning that through 6 games, Diggs has 66 targets and Davis is a distant 2nd with 30.   Knox 25.   

 

I'd rather have Diggs as my closer with more targets in the 2nd half of games, and let my first half be targets to someone else and get them into a rhythm.

 

 

Edited October 16, 2023 by dpberr

[Scott7975]

Diggs is the first read in most of their passing concepts.  Josh said so in the presser.  If Josh thinks Diggs is open or is going to be then that is where Josh is going with the ball by design of the offense.

[WotAGuy]

2 minutes ago, dpberr said:

   

 

I'd rather have Diggs as my closer with more targets in the 2nd half of games, and let my first half be targets to someone else and get them into a rhythm.

 

 

It seemed like Josh would go to Kincaid early in games to get the defense focused on covering the whole formation. For whatever reason, Josh seemed to be hyper focused on Diggs last night. Maybe he’s not in agreement with certain offensive approaches and is trying to send a message to the coaches?  Just like with his running - the coaches have been trying to reel him in for a couple years now.  It’s now to the point where Josh refuses to take the easy run yards available to him. Maybe he’s sending a message to the coaches that he’s not happy not being able to play more free?  

[eball]

Diggs is open all the time.  You'd prefer we look elsewhere first?

 

[Miyagi-Do Karate]

1 minute ago, eball said:

Diggs is open all the time.  You'd prefer we look elsewhere first?

 

I sort of see both sides on this. I think it would help the rhythm of the offense to get some more guys involved earlier.
 

People gripe about Gabe and Knox dropping balls. It’s tougher to get into a rhythm when you only get like 2 targets. 
 

I really liked that little out to Shakir yesterday and the goal line pass to Harty. Keep feeding Diggs— but mix some more of that in so guys can get a feel for the game. I think it will up the level of play across the board.

[PayDaBill$]

Not rocket science I said it earlier today it’s too one dimensional and easy for the opposition to scout & defend.  You need to keep everyone honest.  We’re basically a one trick pony.
 

Our OC & JA are SD infatuated at the expense of our TE’s, other WR’s etc….  It’s a limited scheme. If SD is doubled or taken out of the game by the opposing D we flounder.  JA forcing it to SD is no bueno…. 14 against that crappy a$$ D last was absurd.

 

 

Edited October 17, 2023 by PayDaBill$

[Big Blitz]

I’m not sure the throws to Diggs are as much the OC as it is Allen. 
 

Who may not trust anyone else on O at all.  Davis a little bit more.  
 

But all the other pieces are new.  
 

 

I think it’s obvious what Diggs was mad about this summer.  
 

“Why are we switching to 12?  Who is Dalton Kincaid?  Why are we changing what was working - just get a competent slot or another legit WR to spell and take over for Gabe after this season.”
 

 

The personnel decisions and the direction of the O are on Beane and McD.  But looking back this spring it’s like they let Dorsey and his preferred scheme win out but does that suit Allen?   

[pigpen65]

Did anybody notice Tirico point out how Tyrod was targeting Elam? Conversely, did anybody notice Allen targeting any specific defender on the Giants? Or a specific part of the field? Or a specific weakness of the Giants defense? I sure as ***** never noticed the Bills offense targeting anything in particular. I can't remember the last time I do remember Dorsey game planning to go after the other team's Elam. That's the difference. That's why the Dorsey's offense is becoming so easy to game plan for. All the other team has to do is concentrate on is defending a couple particular plays in running situations and then Diggs in obvious passing situations and you have cracked the Bills code.

[BananaB]

Just listened to Dorsey’s press conference and someone asked about getting another player involved besides just Diggs and Gabe. His answer was we got so many solid players it’s changes each week which guys they gameplan to get involved. I guess I don’t see that when I watch the games, maybe Hardy the first few games but not much. You’d think it would be more beneficial for the O if they just focus on one guy week in week out, that way the chemistry between Josh and the player gets stronger over the season. Jmo

[The Firebaugh Kid]

Most of the time there’s only two or maybe three options for him. This offense seems very conservative. I understand brown needs help and we are trying to develop the run game but I miss the 11 personnel badly.

[BananaB]

2 minutes ago, The Firebaugh Kid said:

Most of the time there’s only two or maybe three options for him. This offense seems very conservative. I understand brown needs help and we are trying to develop the run game but I miss the 11 personnel badly.

If Brown can’t do his job they gotta start exploring other options. I like the 12 personnel but we gotta do more with it then help out the RT. We have a  highly paid TE and a 1st round Te hardly being used in the passing game. 

[Alphadawg7]

Dorsey is the issue.  He is stubborn and despite the fact there are things where we are more effective, he goes away from them.  Under center Allen and the offense has been much better...yet Dorsey is obsessed with the stupid Shotgun for everything, even a goal and inches call like an idiot.  

 

Its Dorsey.  

[Xwnyer]

46 minutes ago, pigpen65 said:

Did anybody notice Tirico point out how Tyrod was targeting Elam? Conversely, did anybody notice Allen targeting any specific defender on the Giants? Or a specific part of the field? Or a specific weakness of the Giants defense? I sure as ***** never noticed the Bills offense targeting anything in particular. I can't remember the last time I do remember Dorsey game planning to go after the other team's Elam. That's the difference. That's why the Dorsey's offense is becoming so easy to game plan for. All the other team has to do is concentrate on is defending a couple particular plays in running situations and then Diggs in obvious passing situations and you have cracked the Bills code.

Dorsey can’t game plan for a specific team.  He has no idea what balance looks like etc.  sorry he is a midget league OC at best

[K-9]

I’m as concerned about such a Diggs dependent passing game as anyone, but Josh explained in his post game presser that Diggs is the first read in most of their concepts and he’s usually open so I can see the logic in going to him so often. 

[Mango]

33 minutes ago, BananaB said:

Just listened to Dorsey’s press conference and someone asked about getting another player involved besides just Diggs and Gabe. His answer was we got so many solid players it’s changes each week which guys they gameplan to get involved. I guess I don’t see that when I watch the games, maybe Hardy the first few games but not much. You’d think it would be more beneficial for the O if they just focus on one guy week in week out, that way the chemistry between Josh and the player gets stronger over the season. Jmo

My take is we don’t see it because we don’t execute it.

[Augie]

I had to respect Brady opening with 12 receptions by 7 different guys. 

[Marcus Aurelius]

1 hour ago, eball said:

Diggs is open all the time.  You'd prefer we look elsewhere first?

 

You did not watch the video  

[HappyDays]

From Matt Parrino at McDermott's presser today:

 

Quote

I asked Sean why they've struggled to find a consistent third option in the offense. Stefon Diggs is on pace for a career-high 187 targets. Here's McDermott's response:
"I think that's really some of the deep dive we're digging through now is where's the second target, where's the third targeted player and who is it and how can we get them more touches or how can we get them open more? Stef is off to a good start. I think the rapport with Josh has been certainly obvious and noticeable by all. Now it's, Hey, who's resource two, and who's resource three? And we've got to continue to evolve offensively with that."

 

So we are 7 weeks into the season and the coaches don't know who our #2 pass catcher is. Crazy.

[Warcodered]

1 minute ago, HappyDays said:

From Matt Parrino at McDermott's presser today:

 

 

So we are 7 weeks into the season and the coaches don't know who our #2 pass catcher is. Crazy.

I don't know I'm vaguely hopeful the way things did seem to get spread around a bit more in the 2nd half that McDermott saw the same problem and said something to Dorsey and hopefully it will actually lead somewhere.

[Coldfronts]

1 hour ago, Big Blitz said:

I’m not sure the throws to Diggs are as much the OC as it is Allen. 
 

Who may not trust anyone else on O at all.  Davis a little bit more.  
 

But all the other pieces are new.  
 

 

I think it’s obvious what Diggs was mad about this summer.  
 

“Why are we switching to 12?  Who is Dalton Kincaid?  Why are we changing what was working - just get a competent slot or another legit WR to spell and take over for Gabe after this season.”
 

 

The personnel decisions and the direction of the O are on Beane and McD.  But looking back this spring it’s like they let Dorsey and his preferred scheme win out but does that suit Allen?   

Dorsey is not scheming any others except for diggs so it's mainly the oc

[Bob Jones]

Really enjoyed watching this. IMHO, the guy does a great job explaining how & why the Bills offense is so inept.

 

And yes, it is also noted that the Giants defense did a really good job, but I think the schemes, and subsequently, the plays, by the Bills are garbage. They definitely need to bring in an offensive guru who won't put 3 receivers in a 10 yard circle, for one. 

Edited October 16, 2023 by Bob Jones

[dpberr]

3 hours ago, BananaB said:

Just listened to Dorsey’s press conference and someone asked about getting another player involved besides just Diggs and Gabe. His answer was we got so many solid players it’s changes each week which guys they gameplan to get involved. I guess I don’t see that when I watch the games, maybe Hardy the first few games but not much. You’d think it would be more beneficial for the O if they just focus on one guy week in week out, that way the chemistry between Josh and the player gets stronger over the season. Jmo

That's simply not a factual statement by Dorsey and the Bills.  Your eyes aren't betraying you.

 

Percent of targets through 6 games with leading receiver (by targets)

 

Cincy has a sneakily similar problem to the Bills - it's Chase and barely anyone else.    KC, San Fran and Detroit are superior distributors of the ball - and that matters because when those other players are called upon, they are used to performing.  The distribution of the ball is the flow and rhythm that you want.  

 

Buffalo:  Diggs 33.5%

Cincy:  Chase 33%

Philly: Brown (AJ) 30.3%

KC:  Kelce 20.8%

SF: Aiyuk 23.7%

Detroit:  Brown 26%

[BananaB]

22 minutes ago, dpberr said:

That's simply not a factual statement by Dorsey and the Bills.  Your eyes aren't betraying you.

 

Percent of targets through 6 games with leading receiver (by targets)

 

Cincy has a sneakily similar problem to the Bills - it's Chase and barely anyone else.    KC, San Fran and Detroit are superior distributors of the ball - and that matters because when those other players are called upon, they are used to performing.  The distribution of the ball is the flow and rhythm that you want.  

 

Buffalo:  Diggs 33.5%

Cincy:  Chase 33%

Philly: Brown (AJ) 30.3%

KC:  Kelce 20.8%

SF: Aiyuk 23.7%

Detroit:  Brown 26%

Not in those words. Basically said they are rotating guys and some more than others each week. Feels they are all really good players and wants to keep them all involved. That’s talking about a third target.
 

I’m not complaining about targets to Diggs, so I don’t have a clue why you did all that research….  I said I think it’s more beneficial for the O if we focus on one guy as third target on a week to week basis so him and Josh gain more chemistry. Cut down the rotation  and let one guy do the job

[Coldfronts]

4 hours ago, eball said:

Diggs is open all the time.  You'd prefer we look elsewhere first?

 

no, not all the time  but, he is and will be double and triple teamed like Sunday night all the time

Edited October 17, 2023 by Coldfronts

[BillsFan130]

3 hours ago, Alphadawg7 said:

Dorsey is the issue.  He is stubborn and despite the fact there are things where we are more effective, he goes away from them.  Under center Allen and the offense has been much better...yet Dorsey is obsessed with the stupid Shotgun for everything, even a goal and inches call like an idiot.  

 

Its Dorsey.  

I agree Dorsey is the main problem.

 

But the bills really don’t good players on O outside of diggs.

 
It’s Dorsey, combined with lack of playmakers outside of 14

[Thrivefourfive]

Diggs’s catch rate is still pretty high. I’ll take that from a high volume clear cut WR1. So when JA17 throws to Diggs, it’s fine. He just needs to throw to Harty a few more times, take what you can get from Davis, sprinkle the other guys with 3 targets a game, JC4 should get 5, the TE are not being used in any sort of creative way so who knows.. I want to see games where Diggs gets five targets, and Kincaid gets 11, but DK86 isn’t ready yet and DK88 never will be,…,or are they?….but coach doesn’t know how to show it??

 

The uncreative entire offensive passing games this season are disappointing. It’s like they have ten passing plays and they just run through them in mixed up order, never really having an entire series planned out effectively. 
 

I like the run game plans, especially compared to awful last year. I still think there’s too many nothing draws, but when a lot of guys up front are on the move, and holes open up outside the guards, I like that. Cook is handling the load pretty well for being a second year RB who was drafted as a third down back. 

[Dukestreetking]

Btw, my favorite play schematically was Gilliam running a "deep" out from the slot (2nd play/2nd series).

 

Obviously, the primary target was Diggs on the quick slant but...the DB handed 41 off to the LB, who broke on it for two steps, then focused back to middle coverage.

 

My point: kinda, sorta looked like 41 was going to be wide open (see around 3:30+ in vid). Would have loved to see the big man lumber down the field after catch, with lots of open grass in front of him.

[Beck Water]

6 hours ago, Warcodered said:

at 6:45 isn't the first read Gabe and the second one Diggs then the pressure gets there before he gets to Shakir?

 

at least he clearly looked like he was looking more at Davis at first.

 

When Erik shows the EZ view there's a clear window and throwing lane to Shakir.

 

The RPO at 10:00 where Josh pulls it and throws to Diggs when there's a light box and Cook could get some yards has me SMH