Inigo Montoya Posted January 27, 2023 Share Posted January 27, 2023 (edited) Cook isn't going anywhere. He has looked better as the season progressed and still has three years left on his rookie contract and has a cap friendly hit of $1.3mm in 2023. I don't think Beane is going to keep both Singletary and Hines. It is going to be one or the other. Nyheim's contract is not cheap, his cap hit in 2023 is $4.79mm, and in 2024 it is $5.48 https://overthecap.com/player/nyheim-hines/6989 Singletary is an unrestricted free agent and according to Sportrac his projected free agent contract should be right around $5.5mm annually for three years. https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/buffalo-bills/devin-singletary-29110/market-value/ Hines is great in the return game and has stand alone value in that respect. He has more speed than Motor and is probably a better receiving back than Motor. We haven't seen him carry the ball much. In his five years in the league the most carries he's had in a season was 89 in 2020. That year he averaged 4.3 yds per carry. His career average is 3.9 yds per carry. The most receptions Hines had in a season was 63 in both '18 and '20. His career average yds per reception is 7.4 yds. Across his career, Hines catch percentage is 77%. https://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/H/HineNy00.htm Singletary had 177 carries this year and averaged 4.6 yds per carry. He had 38 receptions this year with an average of 7.4 yds per reception. The most receptions he's had was 40 in the '21 season. Across Motor's career, his catch percentage is 75%. https://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/S/SingDe00.htm The question is which back, Motor or Hines, compliments Cooks the best? In Cook we have a speedy / receiving back. That is the same skill set that Hines brings to the table, plus his return skills. Does it make sense for the offense to have their two primary RBs with essentially the same skill set? Also, are Cook and Hines able to soak up the 170 plus carries Singletary has a season? Cooks has looked good running the ball but has a smaller frame. Can we expect him to hold up carrying the ball 100+ times a year in the NFL? Singletary's projected free agent contract isn't much more than what Hines is under contract for now. What does Beane decide to do? The problem is I don't think Beane can afford both. Beane's last option is to release both of them and build around Cook with new faces. Edited January 27, 2023 by Inigo Montoya 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John from Riverside Posted January 27, 2023 Share Posted January 27, 2023 Heinz is also an excellent punt returner he gives more versatility I’m not down on Devon. I still think that the problem is who’s blocking in front of them But this is gonna come down to dollars 4 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boyst Posted January 27, 2023 Share Posted January 27, 2023 if mcdermott is true on the process garbage then Singleterry is retained. but he's not, so singleterry walks. 3 4 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
machine gun kelly Posted January 27, 2023 Share Posted January 27, 2023 John, the RN, not ketchup. Just kidding. Damn autocorrect. I see Beane letting Motor check the market and then give him a low offer. Having three RB’s is somewhat of a necessity given how often all RB’s get hurt. I think we have a good shot at keeping all of them. If you’re asking my six fingered friend of it’s an either or, I’d say motor would be gone. Hones has the speed Motor doesn’t, but Motor has skills. 1 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bmur66 Posted January 27, 2023 Share Posted January 27, 2023 Singletary is the workhorse. If not resigned, he will need replaced. Cook and Hines are complimentary to Singletary and I don't see either filling that role, but what do I know? 4 3 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dopey Posted January 27, 2023 Share Posted January 27, 2023 I don’t see Hines getting a ton of carries. I think he’ll be our primary kick returner. He’s really good at it. Singletary leaves for more money. We’ll draft a rb late and a fa. Just my thoughts. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CNYfan Posted January 27, 2023 Share Posted January 27, 2023 I think it will be Cook, Hynes and a late round or UFA back. And that is because of money/cap that Motor won't be back. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsCuse Posted January 27, 2023 Share Posted January 27, 2023 They are both gone. Need to cut Hines for cap relief - he has no dead $, so will save 4.5 million. 1 1 4 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John from Riverside Posted January 27, 2023 Share Posted January 27, 2023 I mean for chrissake, the Chiefs found the running back in the sixth round We need to be doing that ***** 1 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrEpsYtown Posted January 27, 2023 Share Posted January 27, 2023 Yeah don't pay either. Never pay a running back, draft them in the 3-6 range, use them for all they are worth, rinse and repeat. Restructure Hines and spread that money over two years as a change of pace guy and return guy. Say goodbye to Singletary and watch him toil in obscurity as a the #2 back in Jacksonville or something. 1 1 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SirAndrew Posted January 27, 2023 Share Posted January 27, 2023 None of our backs are irreplaceable. You should be able to find anyone in the draft who can play at the level of our starters. Ironically, we drafted Moss who made that statement seem untrue. Cook is just a pass catcher and situational guy so that’s a separate conversation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BarleyNY Posted January 27, 2023 Share Posted January 27, 2023 34 minutes ago, Inigo Montoya said: Cook isn't going anywhere. He has looked better as the season progressed and still has three years left on his rookie contract and has a cap friendly hit of $1.3mm in 2023. I don't think Beane is going to keep both Singletary and Hines. It is going to be one or the other. Nyheim's contract is not cheap, his cap hit in 2023 is $4.79mm, and in 2024 it is $5.48 https://overthecap.com/player/nyheim-hines/6989 Singletary is an unrestricted free agent and according to Sportrac his projected free agent contract should be right around $5.5mm annually for three years. https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/buffalo-bills/devin-singletary-29110/market-value/ Hines is great in the return game and has stand alone value in that respect. He has more speed than Motor and is probably a better receiving back than Motor. We haven't seen him carry the ball much. In his five years in the league the most carries he's had in a season was 89 in 2020. That year he averaged 4.3 yds per carry. His career average is 3.9 yds per carry. The most receptions Hines had in a season was 63 in both '18 and '20. His career average yds per reception is 7.4 yds. Across his career, Hines catch percentage is 77%. https://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/H/HineNy00.htm Singletary had 177 carries this year and averaged 4.6 yds per carry. He had 38 receptions this year with an average of 7.4 yds per reception. The most receptions he's had was 40 in the '21 season. Across Motor's career, his catch percentage is 75%. https://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/S/SingDe00.htm The question is which back, Motor or Hines, compliments Cooks the best? In Cook we have a speedy / receiving back. That is the same skill set that Hines brings to the table, plus his return skills. Does it make sense for the offense to have their two primary RBs with essentially the same skill set? Also, are Cook and Hines able to soak up the 170 plus carries Singletary has a season? Cooks has looked good running the ball but has a smaller frame. Can we expect him to hold up carrying the ball 100+ times a year in the NFL? Singletary's projected free agent contract isn't much more than what Hines is under contract for now. What does Beane decide to do? In a perfect world you keep Motor and Hines. The problem is I don't think Beane can afford both. Good topic. That they might let Hines go due to his contract is a real possibility. It is bothersome that he didn’t get more work in the backfield so we could have seen what he brought to the table there. Obviously he had great moments as a return man. I agree that money will have a lot to do with whom the Bills fill out their backfield, but the answer might be C. New Free Agent(s). The RB market looks like it will be depressed because is should have a lot of good backs on it. The Bills should have some choices for reasonable deals. I can see a new FA and a day 3 draft pick to go along with Cook. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SirAndrew Posted January 27, 2023 Share Posted January 27, 2023 5 minutes ago, MrEpsYtown said: Yeah don't pay either. Never pay a running back, draft them in the 3-6 range, use them for all they are worth, rinse and repeat. Restructure Hines and spread that money over two years as a change of pace guy and return guy. Say goodbye to Singletary and watch him toil in obscurity as a the #2 back in Jacksonville or something. A couple years ago I was on here defending Singletary, but I’ve given up on him. I’m not sure why he’s held in high regard. He’s slow, can’t break a big run, and doesn’t concern defenses. He’s our best guy, so he’s been given the most opportunity, but that doesn’t mean he’s good. Singletary picks up some yardage, but who shouldn’t with Allen as QB? He just doesn’t offer much imo. 1 1 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark92 Posted January 27, 2023 Share Posted January 27, 2023 If they would use Hines as a pass catcher out of the backfield like he was brought to Buffalo to be, then his cap hit would be justified. I think Singletary is probably gone. We could replace him pretty easily I believe either through FA or the Draft. Cooks will get his shot this coming season to see what he can do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
streetkings01 Posted January 27, 2023 Share Posted January 27, 2023 The question should be Motor vs Carry the load RB that doesn’t fumble a lot + Hines? 27 minutes ago, SirAndrew said: A couple years ago I was on here defending Singletary, but I’ve given up on him. I’m not sure why he’s held in high regard. He’s slow, can’t break a big run, and doesn’t concern defenses. He’s our best guy, so he’s been given the most opportunity, but that doesn’t mean he’s good. Singletary picks up some yardage, but who shouldn’t with Allen as QB? He just doesn’t offer much imo. He also fumbles too much! 1 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SirAndrew Posted January 27, 2023 Share Posted January 27, 2023 20 minutes ago, Bandito said: He offers more than you. lmao Thanks Mrs.Singletary. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
H2o Posted January 27, 2023 Share Posted January 27, 2023 Approach Hines about a restructure to lower the cap hit. If he refuses ✌️✌️. Another guy we could take a look at is D'Onta Foreman. An early achilles tear sort of derailed his career, but he has made a nice comeback the last two seasons at Tennessee and then Carolina. He only has a total of 450 carries in 5 years. The money for him and Singletary would probably be about the same. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
harmonkillebrew Posted January 27, 2023 Share Posted January 27, 2023 Neither. Hines' cap hit is too much. Singletary shouldn't be re-signed time to overhaul RB room 4 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rusty shackleford Posted January 27, 2023 Share Posted January 27, 2023 Trade Hines for Moss and a 5th. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffaloRebound Posted January 27, 2023 Share Posted January 27, 2023 8 minutes ago, harmonkillebrew said: Neither. Hines' cap hit is too much. Singletary shouldn't be re-signed time to overhaul RB room This. I like Singletary, but he’s too small and slow. Get a hammer back there. Damien Harris won’t be that expensive. That’s the type of guy we need. We need to get a more physical run game. Hynes is good in the return game but his number is too big for just that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. WEO Posted January 27, 2023 Share Posted January 27, 2023 The Bills never used Hines a a RB....now they should dump Singletary, a guy who produces, for a guy who returns kicks? This guy has 1200 career yards (5 years, 2 teams) rushing--under 4 YPC. He had -3 yards in 9 games with the Bills. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoCal Deek Posted January 27, 2023 Share Posted January 27, 2023 We’ve seen everything we are EVER going to see from Singletary. I’m ready to move on. Next! 1 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mango Posted January 27, 2023 Share Posted January 27, 2023 I would rather have Singlerary on Hines contract. I have no interest in paying Hines $4.7M and $5.4M to be a kick returner in our current cap situation. If you are going to be a $5M RB you better touch the ball more than 4 times per game. I think $5M is a fair AAV for Singletary. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
somnus00 Posted January 27, 2023 Share Posted January 27, 2023 Given the cap situation, it would be nice if we weren't paying people just for their special teams capabilities. Ideally your second string guys would be your primary special teams guys. But we're paying 3rd and 4th string guys like Matakevich, Taiwan, and Kumerow relatively big $ to be our ST aces. I like that Hines would be both someone who sees the field regularly on offense as well as teams. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Billz4ever Posted January 27, 2023 Share Posted January 27, 2023 (edited) 2 hours ago, Inigo Montoya said: Cook isn't going anywhere. He has looked better as the season progressed and still has three years left on his rookie contract and has a cap friendly hit of $1.3mm in 2023. I don't think Beane is going to keep both Singletary and Hines. It is going to be one or the other. Nyheim's contract is not cheap, his cap hit in 2023 is $4.79mm, and in 2024 it is $5.48 https://overthecap.com/player/nyheim-hines/6989 Singletary is an unrestricted free agent and according to Sportrac his projected free agent contract should be right around $5.5mm annually for three years. https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/buffalo-bills/devin-singletary-29110/market-value/ Hines is great in the return game and has stand alone value in that respect. He has more speed than Motor and is probably a better receiving back than Motor. We haven't seen him carry the ball much. In his five years in the league the most carries he's had in a season was 89 in 2020. That year he averaged 4.3 yds per carry. His career average is 3.9 yds per carry. The most receptions Hines had in a season was 63 in both '18 and '20. His career average yds per reception is 7.4 yds. Across his career, Hines catch percentage is 77%. https://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/H/HineNy00.htm Singletary had 177 carries this year and averaged 4.6 yds per carry. He had 38 receptions this year with an average of 7.4 yds per reception. The most receptions he's had was 40 in the '21 season. Across Motor's career, his catch percentage is 75%. https://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/S/SingDe00.htm The question is which back, Motor or Hines, compliments Cooks the best? In Cook we have a speedy / receiving back. That is the same skill set that Hines brings to the table, plus his return skills. Does it make sense for the offense to have their two primary RBs with essentially the same skill set? Also, are Cook and Hines able to soak up the 170 plus carries Singletary has a season? Cooks has looked good running the ball but has a smaller frame. Can we expect him to hold up carrying the ball 100+ times a year in the NFL? Singletary's projected free agent contract isn't much more than what Hines is under contract for now. What does Beane decide to do? The problem is I don't think Beane can afford both. Beane's last option is to release both of them and build around Cook with new faces. I think we will get more bang for the buck with Hines than Singletary given that Hines can return kicks. It would be nice to keep all 3, but don't know if that happens. The first question is what happens if we don't sign Motor and either Cook or Hines gets hurt. Are they going to sign a cheap FA? Draft a RB? The second is why did we bother to trade for Hines or draft a back like Cook if they are never going to get used in the offense like they should be? Earth to Dorsey. Edited January 27, 2023 by Billz4ever Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LABILLBACKER Posted January 27, 2023 Share Posted January 27, 2023 2 hours ago, John from Riverside said: Heinz is also an excellent punt returner he gives more versatility I’m not down on Devon. I still think that the problem is who’s blocking in front of them But this is gonna come down to dollars It's kind of pointless to even discuss RB's until we revamp our OL. I'd lean Hines because I think he'll come slightly cheaper and he's locked up the return position. We'll acquire another rookie contract rb or 2. Sean fix the damn OL. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
colin Posted January 27, 2023 Share Posted January 27, 2023 i'd walk away from both or keep hines on a cheaper contract. agree w the above, spend a late pick on a RB and have him be a body, put resources into the o line and pass catchers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffaloBillsGospel2014 Posted January 27, 2023 Share Posted January 27, 2023 2 hours ago, Inigo Montoya said: Cook isn't going anywhere. He has looked better as the season progressed and still has three years left on his rookie contract and has a cap friendly hit of $1.3mm in 2023. I don't think Beane is going to keep both Singletary and Hines. It is going to be one or the other. Nyheim's contract is not cheap, his cap hit in 2023 is $4.79mm, and in 2024 it is $5.48 https://overthecap.com/player/nyheim-hines/6989 Singletary is an unrestricted free agent and according to Sportrac his projected free agent contract should be right around $5.5mm annually for three years. https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/buffalo-bills/devin-singletary-29110/market-value/ Hines is great in the return game and has stand alone value in that respect. He has more speed than Motor and is probably a better receiving back than Motor. We haven't seen him carry the ball much. In his five years in the league the most carries he's had in a season was 89 in 2020. That year he averaged 4.3 yds per carry. His career average is 3.9 yds per carry. The most receptions Hines had in a season was 63 in both '18 and '20. His career average yds per reception is 7.4 yds. Across his career, Hines catch percentage is 77%. https://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/H/HineNy00.htm Singletary had 177 carries this year and averaged 4.6 yds per carry. He had 38 receptions this year with an average of 7.4 yds per reception. The most receptions he's had was 40 in the '21 season. Across Motor's career, his catch percentage is 75%. https://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/S/SingDe00.htm The question is which back, Motor or Hines, compliments Cooks the best? In Cook we have a speedy / receiving back. That is the same skill set that Hines brings to the table, plus his return skills. Does it make sense for the offense to have their two primary RBs with essentially the same skill set? Also, are Cook and Hines able to soak up the 170 plus carries Singletary has a season? Cooks has looked good running the ball but has a smaller frame. Can we expect him to hold up carrying the ball 100+ times a year in the NFL? Singletary's projected free agent contract isn't much more than what Hines is under contract for now. What does Beane decide to do? In a perfect world you keep Motor and Hines. The problem is I don't think Beane can afford both. I see us letting Singletary walk and drafting a 4th-5th round lead type back, a guy like Kendre Miller TCU or Sean Tucker of Syracuse. Drafting Cook in the 2nd round makes me believe he's going to be the man and Hines has years on his deal and will be cheaper than Singletary. Although I like Singletary he doesn't get the carries that would justify the contract he'll be getting/wanting imo but I really liked him when he was called upon. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Jokeman Posted January 27, 2023 Share Posted January 27, 2023 We traded for Hines and knowing his cap figure. That tells me he's here until the contract runs out. While Devin is our best back right now, James/Hines offer more when comes to game speed/overall talent so think Devin is good as gone and likely replaced with a low cost rookie. I've mentioned before and will keep saying it that feel a guy like Chris Rodriguez Jr would be a good compliment to James if we lose Devin. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DapperCam Posted January 27, 2023 Share Posted January 27, 2023 I think they bring back neither. The expectation is that Cook will carry the load and we’ll bring in a very cheap vet or late round pick to be the third down back. 2 minutes ago, The Jokeman said: We traded for Hines and knowing his cap figure. That tells me he's here until the contract runs out. While Devin is our best back right now, James/Hines offer more when comes to game speed/overall talent so think Devin is good as gone and likely replaced with a low cost rookie. I've mentioned before and will keep saying it that feel a guy like Chris Rodriguez Jr would be a good compliment to James if we lose Devin. Hines can be cut with no dead cap. He’s probably a goner. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Jokeman Posted January 27, 2023 Share Posted January 27, 2023 2 minutes ago, DapperCam said: I think they bring back neither. The expectation is that Cook will carry the load and we’ll bring in a very cheap vet or late round pick to be the third down back. Hines can be cut with no dead cap. He’s probably a goner. He's the best return man we've had since Roberts left, why cut him and leave a hole at depth RB and return man? I think we brought Hines in so Shakir and/or McKenzie can focus on WR and while he'll remain. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
khlax3 Posted January 27, 2023 Share Posted January 27, 2023 (edited) I think Hines will be back and his contract will be re-worked. They will add a year or 2 to the contract and give him some guaranteed money to reduce his cap hit. He provides value as a KR/PR/RB. If you let him and singletary go you need to go out and sign at least 2 running backs. I would expect to see a running back room of cook- cap hit 1.3 Hines - 3 million bigger back vet around 2 to 2.5 million cap space Edited January 27, 2023 by khlax3 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
H2o Posted January 27, 2023 Share Posted January 27, 2023 20 minutes ago, Mango said: I would rather have Singlerary on Hines contract. I have no interest in paying Hines $4.7M and $5.4M to be a kick returner in our current cap situation. If you are going to be a $5M RB you better touch the ball more than 4 times per game. I think $5M is a fair AAV for Singletary. I wouldn't give Singletary $5M per. Just wouldn't. He's too slow and kind of pigeon-holed into his role. Cook is the only one I keep if Hines doesn't agree to cut his $$$ in half. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Inigo Montoya Posted January 27, 2023 Author Share Posted January 27, 2023 1 minute ago, khlax3 said: I think Hines will be back and his contract will be re-worked. They will add a year or 2 to the contract and give him some guaranteed money to reduce his cap hit. He provides value as a KR/PR/RB. If you let him and singletary go you need to go out and sign at least 2 running backs. I would expect to see a running back room of cook- cap hit 1.3 Hines - 3 million bigger back vet around 2 to 2.5 million cap space Hey khlax I was with you until the very end, I think they rework Hines but go the rookie route with a solid RB in the middle rounds to round out the RB room. They should resign Duke to keep a veteran presence in the RB room. His cap hit was only $300K this year. If there is an injury mid-season there always seems to be middle of the road / serviceable veteran RBs out there waiting for a GM to call. That would keep the total cap hit for the RB position at around $5mm. That $3mm in cap savings can be spent on the O-line or elsewhere. 🍻 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffaloRebound Posted January 27, 2023 Share Posted January 27, 2023 In regards to Singletary, there’s so many free agent RB’s available that will be the same price or cheaper that would bring a much more physical presence to the running game and are also faster. https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/free-agents/all/running-back/all/ 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blitzboy54 Posted January 27, 2023 Share Posted January 27, 2023 I say neither because Singletary is nothing special and Hines is cap casualty. We need the space back. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CincyBillsFan Posted January 27, 2023 Share Posted January 27, 2023 I can't believe I'm saying this but IMO the Bills should try to cut CAP friendly deals with both Hines & Singleterry. I have become firmly convinced that the O line is the primary problem with this offense. And the 2nd biggest issue is finding a consistent #2 & slot WR. So if Hines & Motor won't cut a CAP friendly deal don't sign them. If they do keep them. RB is a lesser problem then O line and the WR's not named Diggs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
entropyrules Posted January 27, 2023 Share Posted January 27, 2023 just fix the O-line before they even think about adding any early round draftee or pricey free agent..without an Oline any back won't be worth the price 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NewEra Posted January 27, 2023 Share Posted January 27, 2023 Cut Hines. Hope that one of them will take a team friendly deal. If not, use that money on another position and bring back Duke and draft a RB mid-late. or Bijan 🤣 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
H2o Posted January 27, 2023 Share Posted January 27, 2023 Just now, NewEra said: Cut Hines. Hope that one of them will take a team friendly deal. If not, use that money on another position and bring back Duke and draft a RB mid-late. or Bijan 🤣 Bro, you're about to make some people spaz out on you. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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