Josh Allen's 1st Int vs. Titans - How quickly the narrative changed

[Billsfan1972]

The first two years, it would have been:

 

"Allen threw behind the receiver & again shows he is just not that accurate a passer"

 

On Tuesday it was: 

 

"The pass was there and that is a catch an NFL receiver has to make"

 

I saw the Int & blamed the receiver.  The replay did show Allen was a little off.  Since day one 1 with Allen I blame the receiver & now it seems so does the media (and most on here).😜 

[SoCal Deek]

That was on Robert’s....all day.

[Big Turk]

3 minutes ago, Billsfan1972 said:

The first two years, it would have been:

 

"Allen threw behind the receiver & again shows he is just not that accurate a passer"

 

On Tuesday it was: 

 

"The pass was there and that is a catch an NFL receiver has to make"

 

I saw the Int & blamed the receiver.  The replay did show Allen was a little off.  Since day one 1 with Allen I blame the receiver & now it seems so does the media (and most on here).😜 

 

Wasn't a great throw but it was very catchable. Allen just seemed a little off most of the game.  Just one of those things he will hopefully have corrected by Monday. Far more worried about the defenses inability to get off the field and force punts.

[Bleeding Bills Blue]

1 minute ago, Billsfan1972 said:

The first two years, it would have been:

 

"Allen threw behind the receiver & again shows he is just not that accurate a passer"

 

On Tuesday it was: 

 

"The pass was there and that is a catch an NFL receiver has to make"

 

I saw the Int & blamed the receiver.  The replay did show Allen was a little off.  Since day one 1 with Allen I blame the receiver & now it seems so does the media (and most on here).😜 

 

I've played enough touch football to know - that was a very catchable ball.  Same with the knox one.  Same with the diggs one.  The roberts one seemed to go right through his hands and into his shoulder pad. 

[SCBills]

That might be one of the most infuriating “interceptions” I’ve ever witnessed.  
 

Time. Place. Player. Circumstance.   
 

Roberts, who is normally never even in that situation, could not have picked a worse moment to flub what should have been a 15 yard strike for a first down.  
 

Edited October 16, 2020 by SCBills

[Billsfan1972]

6 minutes ago, SoCal Deek said:

That was on Robert’s....all day.

And I still have debates here on the Week 1 2019 Pick 6 that was off Beasley, that the announcers & many here attributed to Allen.

Edited October 16, 2020 by Billsfan1972

[Penfield45]

3 minutes ago, SCBills said:

That might be one of the most infuriating “interceptions” I’ve ever witnessed.  
 

Time. Place. Player. Circumstance.   
 

Roberts, who is normally never even in that situation, could not have picked a worse moment to flub what should have been a 15 yard strike for a first down.  
 

my question is why wasn’t isaih Hodges elevated with Brown out as the 6th WR. 
 

reports from camp said he was one of the best performing wr’s 

Edited October 16, 2020 by Penfield45

[Royale with Cheese]

It is 100% on Roberts.  He didn't try to catch it with his hands and let it get to his pads, then bounced off.  If it hits him in the shoulder pads, its 100% catchable.  

At worst, it should have been a 10 yard catch and first down.  Then we can put blame on Allen for not leading him for a bigger gain.  

Edited October 16, 2020 by Royale with Cheese

[Bleeding Bills Blue]

11 minutes ago, Billsfan1972 said:

And I still have debates here on the Week 1 2019 Pick 6 that was off Beasley, that the announcers & many here attributed to Allen.

 

Also a very catchable pass.  Worst case you trap that thing in the ground.  Some how he found a worse worst case.

[DabillsDaBillsDaBills]

19 minutes ago, Billsfan1972 said:

The first two years, it would have been:

 

"Allen threw behind the receiver & again shows he is just not that accurate a passer"

 

On Tuesday it was: 

 

"The pass was there and that is a catch an NFL receiver has to make"

 

I saw the Int & blamed the receiver.  The replay did show Allen was a little off.  Since day one 1 with Allen I blame the receiver & now it seems so does the media (and most on here).😜 

 

The announcers for the game were absolute trash. They had the narrative that it was a bad throw by Josh, and that he was forcing throws all night.

 

The first INT wasn't a perfect throw, but it certainly wasn't a bad throw either. That's a catch 99% of the time in the NFL. 

 

Josh had a few bad throws (2nd INT being the worst), but Tannehill forced just as many throws. Josh had about 5 pretty routine NFL catches dropped whereas AJ Brown kept making contested catches for Tannehill.  

[All_Pro_Bills]

It was a catchable ball.  But what made matters worse were the circumstances.  If Brown wasn't hurt Roberts would not have been on the field for that play.  And it was the initial drive of the game.  It set the tone for the entire evening.  A short field against a defense that showed no resistance all night and the Titans were off to a fast 7-0 lead.  For me that play destroyed all the momentum and enthusiasm generated out of the Bills 4-0 start.  And a feeling of impending doom came over me as I watched.   

[No_Matter_What]

20 minutes ago, dneveu said:

 

I've played enough touch football to know - that was a very catchable ball.  Same with the knox one.  Same with the diggs one.  The roberts one seemed to go right through his hands and into his shoulder pad. 

 Agreed. Diggs had actually two clear drops - one in the first TD drive and one that ended FG drive.

 

I am not sure about both Davis incompletions in second half. I was studying all passes yesterday and was not sure about them, esp. that fastball on crossing route - was it out of reach or catchable?

[JerseyBills]

23 minutes ago, Penfield45 said:

my question is why wasn’t isaih Hodges elevated with Brown out as the 6th WR. 
 

reports from camp said he was one of the best performing wr’s 

Probably cause Robert's been great on ST but he had an awful game,  besidesvthat sideline catch . 

If Robert's catches that, Bills match down field,  it's likely a completely different game.  Can't dig a hole that early vs a quality opponent. 

 

I'm looking on the positive side tho. Maybe Bills were listening to the hype, not bringing it in practice,  I expect a rejuvenated team on Monday. 

[LABILLBACKER]

38 minutes ago, SCBills said:

That might be one of the most infuriating “interceptions” I’ve ever witnessed.  
 

Time. Place. Player. Circumstance.   
 

Roberts, who is normally never even in that situation, could not have picked a worse moment to flub what should have been a 15 yard strike for a first down.  
 

And that's why he's our last wr. Stick to returns (which he also fumbled). Aside from Beasley & Yeldon, the whole team was just not focused. Hopefully Brown is back Monday. How about calling  up Duke?

Edited October 16, 2020 by LABILLBACKER

[DrDawkinstein]

I count only the INT Allen threw later in the game as his first real and only interception of the season. That was the only one that was on him. The INT in the Rams game simply wasnt an INT, and the 1st of the Tenn game is all on Roberts.

 

I was happy to see Roberts come back and make that toe-drag catch along the sidelines. But then that fumble... Seems like the entire team were all trying to do too much instead of just doing their jobs.

[CincyBillsFan]

I also think that the reason the ball was slightly behind Roberts was that Allen expected him to sit in the open area of the zone.  Continuing towards the sideline in that coverage would have brought the WR AND ball back into coverage.  Brown sits on that pattern and catches a perfectly thrown pass in the gut for a 1st down.

 

But even with the miscommunication that was a very catchable ball.  To end up as an INT was just very bad luck and a weird bounce of the ball. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[2003Contenders]

Like much of the rest of the team, Josh definitely had an off night -- but he also made some plays. As for Roberts, it really was a nightmare of a game, starting with lousy returns, the interception that was 100% on him and ending with the fumble to hammer home what a mess the whole night was for the team.

 

With games like this (especially under the circumstances), you almost have to throw it out and move on.

[TBBills Fan]

40 minutes ago, dneveu said:

 

I've played enough touch football to know - that was a very catchable ball.  Same with the knox one.  Same with the diggs one.  The roberts one seemed to go right through his hands and into his shoulder pad. 

 

 

wayyyy to many drops Tuesday...all of them were catchable and on the WR  in my opinion. 

23 minutes ago, All_Pro_Bills said:

It was a catchable ball.  But what made matters worse were the circumstances.  If Brown wasn't hurt Roberts would not have been on the field for that play.  And it was the initial drive of the game.  It set the tone for the entire evening.  A short field against a defense that showed no resistance all night and the Titans were off to a fast 7-0 lead.  For me that play destroyed all the momentum and enthusiasm generated out of the Bills 4-0 start.  And a feeling of impending doom came over me as I watched.   

 

 

exactly how i felt

[Shaw66]

50 minutes ago, matter2003 said:

Wasn't a great throw but it was very catchable. Allen just seemed a little off most of the game. 

 

I agree.  Allen was off all day.  He didn't show the precision and command we had seen earlier.  

 

As for Roberts, it's constantly amazing to me that some guys just have it and others don't.  You'd think that after years of practice by a world-class athlete, that catch would be routine.  Even the best don't make that catch every time, but when that happens to the best, it's a surprise.  When it happens to Roberts, it's just another ball going off his hands.  

 

Brown would have made a difference throughout the game; he would have made a BIG difference on that play.  

[mannc]

58 minutes ago, matter2003 said:

 

Far more worried about the defenses inability to get off the field and force punts.

Hard to force punts when the other team starts its possession on your 30 yard line...

[thenorthremembers]

1 hour ago, SoCal Deek said:

That was on Robert’s....all day.

If you're paid to catch footballs, and you have your hands on it, you should catch it.   Completely agree, 100% on Roberts. 

[Hapless Bills Fan]

1 hour ago, Billsfan1972 said:

The first two years, it would have been:

 

"Allen threw behind the receiver & again shows he is just not that accurate a passer"

 

On Tuesday it was: 

 

"The pass was there and that is a catch an NFL receiver has to make"

 

I saw the Int & blamed the receiver.  The replay did show Allen was a little off.  Since day one 1 with Allen I blame the receiver & now it seems so does the media (and most on here).😜 

 

Well considering Allen had been slinging dimes all over the field the first 4 games, that "not that accurate a passer" thing is a bit hard to sustain.

 

I have noticed that the narrative is still a bit different for Allen vs. other QB.  Herbert, for example, was making inaccurate throws that were catchable but way harder than they needed to be and nothing was said about that.  It was all phrased on the receiver "couldn't haul it in".

 

Allen was a little off on his throw AND that's a catch an NFL receiver has to be able make.  Same with the one Knox got his hands on - it wasn't an easy catch, but it's one an NFL quality TE has to make.

 

1 hour ago, dneveu said:

I've played enough touch football to know - that was a very catchable ball.  Same with the knox one.  Same with the diggs one.  The roberts one seemed to go right through his hands and into his shoulder pad. 

 

Diggs said he dropped two passes.

[DCofNC]

18 minutes ago, Shaw66 said:

 

I agree.  Allen was off all day.  He didn't show the precision and command we had seen earlier.  

 

As for Roberts, it's constantly amazing to me that some guys just have it and others don't.  You'd think that after years of practice by a world-class athlete, that catch would be routine.  Even the best don't make that catch every time, but when that happens to the best, it's a surprise.  When it happens to Roberts, it's just another ball going off his hands.  

 

Brown would have made a difference throughout the game; he would have made a BIG difference on that play.  

I agree that Josh wasn’t as sharp, but he was still making enough throws to stay in the game.  The receivers were awful.  I have been very critical of JA, and he did throw the INT that pretty much sealed the game, but the number of drops was completely unacceptable.  
 

Obviously, the Roberts one turned into a tipped ball drill and worst case scenario comes of it, then Roberts with another turn over.  Horrible game for him and it shows exactly why he’s never caught on as more than a return guy.   He should never be more than a 5th wr, why on earth he was getting targets over Beasley is beyond me.

[Fred Slacks]

There’s the old saying if it touches your hands you should catch it. I’d one up that and say if it got to your pads you should have caught it. That pass was 100% accurate. It’s a throw into a window of a zone. It wasn’t a crossing route vs man coverage. That was a great throw. 
 

His second INT however was a completely different story. Bad throw. I’m guessing he got fooled by the coverage. 

[hondo in seattle]

10 hours ago, SCBills said:

That might be one of the most infuriating “interceptions” I’ve ever witnessed.  
 

Time. Place. Player. Circumstance.   
 

Roberts, who is normally never even in that situation, could not have picked a worse moment to flub what should have been a 15 yard strike for a first down.  
 

 

I think it was huge for the Titans.  They hadn't played in two weeks.  Hadn't practiced much.  There was a lot of talk, drama and concern about Covid rather than their next opponent.  And then they start the game with a bang.  I think the turnover and subsequent TD really energized them.  

 

The Josh Allen narrative was the only narrative that changed.  We'll never know but I think the game would have unfolded much differently without that pick. 

 

Edited October 16, 2020 by hondo in seattle

[Jauronimo]

1 hour ago, Penfield45 said:

my question is why wasn’t isaih Hodges elevated with Brown out as the 6th WR. 
 

reports from camp said he was one of the best performing wr’s 

Because he's on IR.

[Fred Slacks]

Who was saying Allen was off?  Need to take into account his receivers dropped at least 5 or more catchable passes. Diggs has 2-3 himself. Knox 1 that I remember. Roberts the tipped one for INT. Gabriel Davis u think had 2. 
 

When Allen is starting to force throws that get tipped later in the game you have to wonder how much lack of faith he has with his receivers at that point in the game.  He knows he needs to string a drive together and put some points on the board to stay in the game. 
 

I think people need to take the game in context. The defense had a bad night but I would t say it was worse than the Raiders or Rams effort. We just gave bad field position to the Titans too often. Things spiraled from there. If we were to play them again I feel confident this game would have been closer. Heck if Roberts doesn’t tip the ball up for an INT on the first drive most likely we score on the opening drive and are up 7-0. That alone could have changed the direction of the game. I think we have just as good of shot at the Chiefs this week as we did the week before against the Titans. 
 

we aren’t amazing at defense but we definitely aren’t as bad as the final score would indicate. Offense and special teams contributed heavily to that. 

[Bleeding Bills Blue]

37 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

Well considering Allen had been slinging dimes all over the field the first 4 games, that "not that accurate a passer" thing is a bit hard to sustain.

 

I have noticed that the narrative is still a bit different for Allen vs. other QB.  Herbert, for example, was making inaccurate throws that were catchable but way harder than they needed to be and nothing was said about that.  It was all phrased on the receiver "couldn't haul it in".

 

Allen was a little off on his throw AND that's a catch an NFL receiver has to be able make.  Same with the one Knox got his hands on - it wasn't an easy catch, but it's one an NFL quality TE has to make.

 

 

Diggs said he dropped two passes.

 

There was one that was low but i thought he shouldve had it, i know there was a 2nd but i cant remember what happened.  

[Thurman#1]

1 hour ago, Billsfan1972 said:

 

I saw the Int & blamed the receiver.  The replay did show Allen was a little off.  Since day one 1 with Allen I blame the receiver & now it seems so does the media (and most on here).😜 

 

 

 

I think it's right that some changed. People often go by preconceptions. 

 

But it shouldn't have changed.

 

Whenever that happened the response should have been the same ... "He should've caught it, but the throw was off. Both of them have a part of the responsibility."

[shoshin]

Karch Kiraly couldn't have set up Malcolm Butler any better. 

 

[Mark Vader]

1 hour ago, Shaw66 said:

 

I agree.  Allen was off all day.  He didn't show the precision and command we had seen earlier.  

 

As for Roberts, it's constantly amazing to me that some guys just have it and others don't.  You'd think that after years of practice by a world-class athlete, that catch would be routine.  Even the best don't make that catch every time, but when that happens to the best, it's a surprise.  When it happens to Roberts, it's just another ball going off his hands.  

 

Brown would have made a difference throughout the game; he would have made a BIG difference on that play.  

Disagree with you on the thought that Allen was off all day.

 

That touchdown pass to Gabriel Davis was on the money, it just got wiped out by a strange illegal shift penalty.

 

Allen did quite well, all things considered. Too many dropped passes by the receivers did not help.

 

It wasn't a good game for Allen, but he was not off all day.

[Big Turk]

1 hour ago, mannc said:

Hard to force punts when the other team starts its possession on your 30 yard line...

 

Against Tennessee that was the case, what has been their excuse in the other games?

[DabillsDaBillsDaBills]

1 hour ago, mannc said:

Hard to force punts when the other team starts its possession on your 30 yard line...

 

The only thing the short fields did was hurt the Titans total yards by the end of the game. 

 

Titans had 6 TDs on 9 possessions. 

 

At what point does "bend but don't break" turn into "bend over and take it" ?

 

[Shaw66]

2 minutes ago, Mark Vader said:

Disagree with you on the thought that Allen was off all day.

 

That touchdown pass to Gabriel Davis was on the money, it just got wiped out by a strange illegal shift penalty.

 

Allen did quite well, all things considered. Too many dropped passes by the receivers did not help.

 

It wasn't a good game for Allen, but he was not off all day.

Well, it's just semantics.   He wasn't "on" all day.  His throws weren't always as accurate as they've been.  Some of his throws simply had too much pace - one got to Diggs faster than Diggs expected, and the high ball to Knox also had some pace that may have surprised him.  

 

Yes, Allen made some good throws - a lot of them, actually, but when I say he was "off" all day, what I mean is that he wasn't sharp.  

[Putin]

1 hour ago, All_Pro_Bills said:

It was a catchable ball.  But what made matters worse were the circumstances.  If Brown wasn't hurt Roberts would not have been on the field for that play.  And it was the initial drive of the game.  It set the tone for the entire evening.  A short field against a defense that showed no resistance all night and the Titans were off to a fast 7-0 lead.  For me that play destroyed all the momentum and enthusiasm generated out of the Bills 4-0 start.  And a feeling of impending doom came over me as I watched.   

We scored a TD on the next possession the game was tied 7-7 

IMO what killed the momentum are the bad drops that would have kept the drives alive the defense couldn’t get off the field , special teams /field position 

Edited October 16, 2020 by Putin

[mannc]

26 minutes ago, DabillsDaBillsDaBills said:

 

The only thing the short fields did was hurt the Titans total yards by the end of the game. 

 

Probably true.

[BigPappy]

2 hours ago, dneveu said:

 

I've played enough touch football to know - that was a very catchable ball.  Same with the knox one.  Same with the diggs one.  The roberts one seemed to go right through his hands and into his shoulder pad. 

I don't know why but I just laughed uncontrollably when I read the beginning. I mean, you're not wrong that it was catchable, and I certainly played my fair share of touch and even tackle football in my youth, but I just found the context and the actual words typed hysterical. Probably because of the comparison of touch football to NFL football, but I know thats not what you were really conveying. Sorry.... i just found it funny and I'm still giggling at this very second as i finish typing this. 

[billybrew1]

3 hours ago, SCBills said:

That might be one of the most infuriating “interceptions” I’ve ever witnessed.  
 

Time. Place. Player. Circumstance.   
 

Roberts, who is normally never even in that situation, could not have picked a worse moment to flub what should have been a 15 yard strike for a first down.  
 

I saw it at a couple different angles and I thought it was a very hard to catch pass. The ball came in very fast and hard and kind of pinned him at a bad angle (behind him.) While he could have caught it, it was a very difficult catch, imho...

[Bleeding Bills Blue]

37 minutes ago, BigPappy said:

I don't know why but I just laughed uncontrollably when I read the beginning. I mean, you're not wrong that it was catchable, and I certainly played my fair share of touch and even tackle football in my youth, but I just found the context and the actual words typed hysterical. Probably because of the comparison of touch football to NFL football, but I know thats not what you were really conveying. Sorry.... i just found it funny and I'm still giggling at this very second as i finish typing this. 

 

I just meant it like... myself and the people that i play with - we are not good.  Even the guys who played in high school etc. 

 

And most probably would've caught that.  So I don't wanna hear about how it should've been over here instead - catch the friggin ball, its literally your job.

Edited October 16, 2020 by dneveu

[billykay]

2 hours ago, Fred Slacks said:

There’s the old saying if it touches your hands you should catch it. I’d one up that and say if it got to your pads you should have caught it. That pass was 100% accurate. It’s a throw into a window of a zone. It wasn’t a crossing route vs man coverage. That was a great throw. 
 

His second INT however was a completely different story. Bad throw. I’m guessing he got fooled by the coverage. 

On the second int, it looked like Josh was trying to feather it in over the defender but was just a little low with the pass. Tough throw. Didn't it seem that Josh was throwing it harder rather than with touch like he was doing in the first 4 games? He was really gunning the throws in there. The one drop by Diggs was below the waist and gunned. Has to be caught but I'm not sure if was necessary to gun it. I don't recall if Diggs was well covered & a hard throw was necessary.