NFL Execs on what each team should worry about (Athletic: paywall)

[TroutDog]

Quote:

 

Buffalo Bills

The worry: Buffalo might not have the explosive playmakers to take the next step.

“People talk about Josh Allen’s accuracy and that will be the top concern if he winds up being Blake Bortles as a passer on third down. I wonder if they have the horses overall. You root for them because they do it the right way, but where is the big-play flair, the explosive, big-play home-run guy both offensively and defensively? They have a lot of lunch-pail-type guys who work hard, are smart, but might not get you over the hump to, say, 10-plus wins.”

 

https://theathletic.com/1180817/2019/09/03/nfl-execs-on-what-all-32-teams-should-worry-about-entering-the-season/

 

This falls in line with the ‘not having big names’ argument. I don’t buy it. 

 

The biggest concern to me this year is Josh’s continued improvement. 

Edited September 3, 2019 by TroutDog

[BuffaloBill]

Cart and horse issue in Buffalo.  It all depends upon Allen.  If he can win and produce then the guys around him will look better.  The D would have bigger names if they were a part of a winning playoff team.

[DJB]

Im cool with it. Continue to doubt the Bills and hopefully we turn dome heads and earn some damn respect 

[jletha]

That seems very reasonable. Especially since they reference 10+ wins. I think 9 wins is a major improvement and we can get the "explosive" player next year if its a huge need. Also nice to see that we did it right, according to this person. I kinda think the home-run player is overrated and often overpaid.

 

Honestly, Im personally more worried about many other things haha.

[RoyBatty is alive]

Very accurate comments on offensive but we have potential superstars on D, Tremaine Edmunds,  Tre White , Ed Oliver. Guy that arent as potentially splashy but able to put up big plays include Poyer, hyde, milano, J Hughes,  Lorax.

[StHustle]

2 minutes ago, RoyBatty is alive said:

Very accurate comments on offensive but we have potential superstars on D, Tremaine Edmunds,  Tre White , Ed Oliver. Guy that arent as potentially splashy but able to put up big plays include Poyer, hyde, milano, J Hughes,  Lorax.

 

Reading all those names in the same sentence sends a chill down my spine. I believe we have the best defense in football until proven otherwise.

[Big C]

4 minutes ago, RoyBatty is alive said:

Very accurate comments on offensive but we have potential superstars on D, Tremaine Edmunds,  Tre White , Ed Oliver. Guy that arent as potentially splashy but able to put up big plays include Poyer, hyde, milano, J Hughes,  Lorax.

 

Certainly the defense has some potential star power, but none of these guys are household names yet. I agree they are lunch pail type guys. That's fine. They play well as a team but we don't have the flashy sack and INT numbers. 

[hondo in seattle]

On paper, it doesn't look like we have a lot of big play guys on offense.  There are question marks around our wideouts.  None of our TEs is a proven big play guy.  Our RBs include an old man, a perennial back up, and a small, slow rook.  And our QB's accuracy is a works-in-progress.  Our  OL consists entirely of "lunch pail" guys.

 

This doesn't look like the roster of a high-flying offense.  

 

But it doesn't have to be.  If our D is as good as we think it is, we'll be in good shape if our O can just average something like 24 points/game.  If Allen steps up this year, that's do-able.  The big plays will come off his arm.  

[dave mcbride]

32 minutes ago, TroutDog said:

Quote:

 

Buffalo Bills

The worry: Buffalo might not have the explosive playmakers to take the next step.

“People talk about Josh Allen’s accuracy and that will be the top concern if he winds up being Blake Bortles as a passer on third down. I wonder if they have the horses overall. You root for them because they do it the right way, but where is the big-play flair, the explosive, big-play home-run guy both offensively and defensively? They have a lot of lunch-pail-type guys who work hard, are smart, but might not get you over the hump to, say, 10-plus wins.”

 

https://theathletic.com/1180817/2019/09/03/nfl-execs-on-what-all-32-teams-should-worry-about-entering-the-season/

 

This falls in line with the ‘not having big names’ argument. I don’t buy it. 

 

The biggest concern to me this year is Josh’s continued improvement. 

THis is actually my thinking. Outside of perhaps Morse, who on offense is a top-15-at-his-position player? I can't think of anyone.

[WhoTom]

With a solid defense - especially with good depth/rotation on the line - we don't need an explosive offense. We need a "move the chains" offense. That's exactly what we have.

 

 

 

[Mrbojanglezs]

Its true we don't have many "National big names", but to say we lack explosive playmakers is a stretch

[eball]

This is the sort of comment I'd expect to hear from Doug Whaley.  That's all he wanted to do -- add splash.

 

The defense is full of "explosive, game-changing" players.  Hughes, Oliver, Edmunds, Milano, White, Hyde, Poyer.  Sure, the offense doesn't have big names but that doesn't mean they aren't potentially explosive.  Brown makes explosive plays.  Singletary's explosiveness jumps off his tape.  Beasley is "explosive" in the slot.  And let's not forget the most important piece -- Josh Allen.  He has already shown explosiveness and the ability to take a game over.  If he takes the next step comments like this will disappear.

 

If the biggest thing Bills fans need to worry about is that nobody knows the names of their players (yet), we're not in bad shape.

[JoeF]

The Bills don't have anyone with the reputation of an explosive playmaker on O.  No recent draft pick or free agent has that.  However, the Bills have a lot of guys who can stretch the field:  Brown, Foster, Roberts, McKenzie; who can get tough yards-Gore, Singletary; who can move the sticks-Beasley -- and a lot of potential at TE with Sweeney, Knox and Kroft.  The Bills have built of deep Offense from the line to the skill positions.  I believe the Bills also have an Offensive Coaching staff who can use these parts to their max potential. 

 

I think the Offense has great potential to go from an offense that averaged under 300 yards a game last year to an offense that averages over 370 or so yards a game -- so move from 30th to 15th or so with Josh just playing at a level where he played the last 5 games of last year.  The Bills have improved that much.

 

The problem with having one or two key playmakers is that injuries wreak havoc with a season...I think building the kind of depth the Bills have started to build on O and then adding a playmaker or two through the draft makes more sense.

 

Edited September 3, 2019 by JoeF

[Malazan]

I guess our D players need to say more stupid sh*t so they get media coverage and can be "big" names like Ramsey

[dave mcbride]

2 minutes ago, JoeF said:

The Bills don't have anyone with the reputation of an explosive playmaker on O.  No recent draft pick or free agent has that.  However, the Bills have a lot of guys who can stretch the field:  Brown, Foster, Roberts, McKenzie; who can get tough yards-Gore, Singletary; who can move the sticks-Beasley -- and a lot of potential at TE with Sweeney, Knox and Kroft.  The Bills have built of deep Offense from the line to the skill positions.  I believe the Bills also have an Offensive Coaching staff who can use these parts to their max potential. 

 

I think the Offense has great potential to go from an offense that averaged under 300 yards a game last year to an offense that averages over 370 or so yards a game -- so move from 30th to 15th or so with Josh just playing at a level where he played the last 5 games of last year.  The Bills have improved that much.

 

 

I think this is a fair assessment. 

[MJS]

I agree completely with the premise of the article. I do think we can win with this team, but we need more elite talent to become a consistent contender.

 

Luckily I think we have a few guys on the roster that could develop into those kinds of players.

[DC Tom]

People worry too much about "superstars."  You need some...but on a successful team most of your team is going to be workman-like guys developed, coached, and playing to ten-tenths their ability.  At most, these days, only 5 of your roster is going to be regular all-pros.  

 

Get that foundation established first, then go after those 5 all-pros, if you haven't drafted them already (e.g. Tre White.)

[Buffalo716]

So John Brown and Robert "led the league in YPC" Foster aren't explosive?

 

What about McKenzie

[GG]

Sounds like the annual description of the Pats* for the last 20 years (except the QB)

[Don Otreply]

I’m thinking Allen to Foster was some seriously big splash play last season, and the team is in better shape this season, maybe it’s just me...

 

Go Bills!!!

[gjv001]

The Athletic has a very valid point. I believe Allen will be our offensive explosive playmaker this season and beyond. That being said, the Bills need a few more explosive playmakers on offense in order to elevate to the next tier in the NFL.

[ndirish1978]

The playmaker label is assigned by the media and is based on popularity. John Brown, Robert Foster are both deep-threats, is that not playmaking? Beasley is a great security blanket with excellent hands, is that not a playmaker?

[mjt328]

It's amazing.  

15-20 years of watching the New England Patriots stomp their @$$e$, and most NFL executives STILL don't get it.

 

You don't need big play makers.  You don't need Fantasy Football superstars.  You don't need a team full of Pro-Bowlers.

In fact, many of those guys become locker room distractions and drains to the salary cap.  

 

What you need is a top QB.  What you need is strong depth, and solid guys across the board who do their job.  What you need is a smart game plan, and the ability to be flexible depending on opponent.  Many of the league's strongest backfields use a committee-approach.  The most efficient passing games are often those who spread the ball around.

 

 

[BillsVet]

Going after Antonio Brown was an acknowledgement they didn't have the play-makers at the skill positions.  This attempt signaled they'd go outside the process to give Allen a real vertical weapon. 

 

Gore and Singletary aren't burner types at RB.  The TE position is a huge question mark with one guy not having practiced since May and another a 3rd round rookie. 

 

The WR who'll get down field is Brown and after him no one is proven at that role.  Foster is a nice story, but not proven by a long shot. 

 

Speed is going to be an issue for this offense. 

[billsfan89]

The Bills don't have a dynamic pass catcher. Their O-line is better, Beasley and Brown are solid to good complementary WR's, and Gore/Singletary is a decent RB tandem (and Yeldon provides decent depth) but there isn't a dynamic playmaking WR and the Tightend position seems bare. So while the offense is much better than last season there still needs to be an addition of a reliable tight end and a dynamic WR who captures the attention of the players on the defense. 

 

I suspect that the offense will be improved but it will have periods of frustration and the inability to move the chains against better more consistent defenses. 

[whatdrought]

We are very much a “pieces of the whole” type team, so I don’t find this problematic. My answer is simply that the best team in football the past 20 years has rarely had “names” with the exception of the QB. 

[dave mcbride]

1 hour ago, Buffalo716 said:

So John Brown and Robert "led the league in YPC" Foster aren't explosive?

 

What about McKenzie

They're fast and can make big plays, but they're definitely not elite - the sort of player like AJ Green, OBJ, or Julio Jones who are both fast and regularly win contested catches.  The Bills haven't had player like that since Eric Moulds in his prime from 1998-2002. Watkins had that potential (and, frankly, still does), and while he flashed it, he was hurt too much and the organization didn't keep him around.

Edited September 3, 2019 by dave mcbride

[OldTimeAFLGuy]

2 hours ago, BuffaloBill said:

Cart and horse issue in Buffalo.  It all depends upon Allen.  If he can win and produce then the guys around him will look better.  The D would have bigger names if they were a part of a winning playoff team.

 

know what you're saying but hope he does not think it is "solely dependent on Allen"......he now has the makings of an OL in front and talent around him......prefer to see him as the long term solution at QB versus a short term exit on a gurney.....he cannot be this club's leading rusher period.....

Edited September 3, 2019 by OldTimeAFLGuy

[Buffalo716]

7 minutes ago, dave mcbride said:

They're fast and can make big plays, but they're definitely not elite - the sort of player like AJ Green, OBJ, or Julio Jones who are both fast and regularly win contested catches.  The Bills haven't had player like that since Eric Moulds in his prime from 1998-2002. Watkins had that potential (and, frankly, still does), and while he flashed it, he was hurt too much and the organization didn't keep him around.

I didn't read the full article because I don't pay for the athletic but I'm pretty sure it said explosive playmaker not elite player, completely different things

 

There are only 6-8 elite receivers in the NFL who consistently play at an all pro level. But there are dozens and dozens of explosive playmakers who can make things happen in the right situation

[dave mcbride]

Just now, Buffalo716 said:

I didn't read the full article because I don't pay for the athletic but I'm pretty sure it said explosive playmaker not elite player, completely different things

 

There are only 6-8 elite receivers in the NFL who consistently play at an all pro level. But there are dozens and dozens of explosive playmakers who can make things happen in the right situation

Yeah, I'm not saying they're bad players or anything like that. They're just not elite. The Bills don't have any top-15 level talents on offense (except for maybe Morse, but I worry about his injuries), which is why people are downgrading their offense. Maybe a couple of players break out this season (Singletary, Allen, maybe even Beasley), but based on past performance, the offense looks average at best. 

[Buffalo716]

5 minutes ago, dave mcbride said:

Yeah, I'm not saying they're bad players or anything like that. They're just not elite. The Bills don't have any top-15 level talents on offense (except for maybe Morse, but I worry about his injuries), which is why people are downgrading their offense. Maybe a couple of players break out this season (Singletary, Allen, maybe even Beasley), but based on past performance, the offense looks average at best. 

I think Receivers need to be separated as outside or slot guys

 

Cole Beasley may not be a superstar or All Pro on the outside but he is one of the best slot receivers in the world, that's valuable

 

Mitch Morse is EASILY a top 10 center. Line play is atrocious around the league and we improved 10 fold

 

Josh Allen can be on the verge of breaking out and if he does all the WRs and TEs  will look good

 

We have a no name offense to the league, doesn't mean the potential isn't there.. Seattle played with a bunch of undrafted WRs for a long time

Edited September 3, 2019 by Buffalo716

[dave mcbride]

4 minutes ago, Buffalo716 said:

I think Receivers need to be separated as outside or slot guys

 

Cole Beasley may not be a superstar or All Pro on the outside but he is one of the best slot receivers in the world, that's valuable

 

Mitch Morse is EASILY a top 10 center. Line play is atrocious around the league and we improved 10 fold

 

Josh Allen can be on the verge of breaking out and if he does all the WRs and TEs  will look good

I disagree about Beasley being an elite slot guy based on his production in Dallas (he was pretty mediocre there - a JAG starter, basically, with one good season (2016) in seven years there), but I do agree that he has the potential to become an elite player at the position given that Daboll knows how to maximize the production from that position. 

 

Re Morse, he has played in 18 games over the past two seasons. Availability is huge when assessing player performance. The fact that he got a concussion early on in camp is not a promising sign. I'd say he's pretty good (not elite), but I also think he was a good person for the Bills to gamble on. 

Edited September 3, 2019 by dave mcbride

[Buffalo716]

3 minutes ago, dave mcbride said:

I disagree about Beasley being an elite slot guy based on his production in Dallas (he was pretty mediocre there - a JAG starter, basically, with one good season (2016) in seven years there), but I do agree that he has the potential to become an elite player at the position given that Daboll knows how to maximize the production from that position. 

 

Re Morse, he has played in 18 games over the past two seasons. Availability is huge when assessing player performance. The fact that he got a concussion early on in camp is not a promising sign. I'd say he's pretty good (not elite), but I also think he was a good person for the Bills to gamble on. 

He hasn't allowed a sack in 4 years I believe. That's elite

 

And the Bills said he was kneed in the head on a freak play which was described as "once in a lifetime play"

[formerlyofCtown]

38 minutes ago, BillsVet said:

Going after Antonio Brown was an acknowledgement they didn't have the play-makers at the skill positions.  This attempt signaled they'd go outside the process to give Allen a real vertical weapon. 

 

Gore and Singletary aren't burner types at RB.  The TE position is a huge question mark with one guy not having practiced since May and another a 3rd round rookie. 

 

The WR who'll get down field is Brown and after him no one is proven at that role.  Foster is a nice story, but not proven by a long shot. 

 

Speed is going to be an issue for this offense. 

No it isnt.

[dave mcbride]

Just now, Buffalo716 said:

He hasn't allowed a sack in 4 years I believe. That's elite

 

And the Bills said he was kneed in the head on a freak play which was described as "once in a lifetime play"

I think he's good - don't get me wrong. There's a reason he was drafted in the second round. But he has missed a LOT of time in the last two seasons. As for it being a "freak play," it still happened regardless of the team's excuses - and it's his fourth concussion. I'm concerned. 

[C.Biscuit97]

2 hours ago, eball said:

This is the sort of comment I'd expect to hear from Doug Whaley.  That's all he wanted to do -- add splash.

 

The defense is full of "explosive, game-changing" players.  Hughes, Oliver, Edmunds, Milano, White, Hyde, Poyer.  Sure, the offense doesn't have big names but that doesn't mean they aren't potentially explosive.  Brown makes explosive plays.  Singletary's explosiveness jumps off his tape.  Beasley is "explosive" in the slot.  And let's not forget the most important piece -- Josh Allen.  He has already shown explosiveness and the ability to take a game over.  If he takes the next step comments like this will disappear.

 

If the biggest thing Bills fans need to worry about is that nobody knows the names of their players (yet), we're not in bad shape.

Whaley’s team were loaded minus QB, and even as flawed he was, Tyrod did “make” a pro bowl.  The Whaley hate is so misplaced (not saying you’re hating on him but those were some talented teams).

[OldTimeAFLGuy]

5 minutes ago, Buffalo716 said:

I think Receivers need to be separated as outside or slot guys

 

Cole Beasley may not be a superstar or All Pro on the outside but he is one of the best slot receivers in the world, that's valuable

 

Mitch Morse is EASILY a top 10 center. Line play is atrocious around the league and we improved 10 fold

 

Josh Allen can be on the verge of breaking out and if he does all the WRs and TEs  will look good

 

We have a no name offense to the league, doesn't mean the potential isn't there.. Seattle played with a bunch of undrafted WRs for a long time

 

....have to agree 716......and like the Fins of the 70's had the "No Name Defense", perhaps, PERHAPS we can have the "No Name Offense"....offense is the Achilles's heel of the prognosticating urinalists (YAWN) leading to a 20 something power ranking..."under the radar" works just fine....stay tuned......

[Big Turk]

3 hours ago, hondo in seattle said:

On paper, it doesn't look like we have a lot of big play guys on offense.  There are question marks around our wideouts.  None of our TEs is a proven big play guy.  Our RBs include an old man, a perennial back up, and a small, slow rook.  And our QB's accuracy is a works-in-progress.  Our  OL consists entirely of "lunch pail" guys.

 

This doesn't look like the roster of a high-flying offense.  

 

But it doesn't have to be.  If our D is as good as we think it is, we'll be in good shape if our O can just average something like 24 points/game.  If Allen steps up this year, that's do-able.  The big plays will come off his arm.  

Didnt look so slow on that 9 yard scamper to the endzone around the right side in game 3...

 

Big difference between 40 times and playing speed. Very rarely do you run 40 yards in a straight line. Accleration in and out of cuts and starts ans stops is far more important on an every play basis and Singletary has that in Spades

Edited September 3, 2019 by matter2003

[C.Biscuit97]

1 hour ago, Buffalo716 said:

So John Brown and Robert "led the league in YPC" Foster aren't explosive?

 

What about McKenzie

John Brown is on his 3rd team and averages like 600 yards a season.  He’s a nice complimentary piece but should not be a top receiver.  And counting on Foster at this point seems questionable.  Is he the guy from the second half of last year or the guy we cut last preseason?  He has shown no consistency through his career.  

 

We really don’t have players who scare defenses.  We are better than last year but we still have a long way to go.

7 minutes ago, Buffalo716 said:

He hasn't allowed a sack in 4 years I believe. That's elite

 

And the Bills said he was kneed in the head on a freak play which was described as "once in a lifetime play"

When you get multiple concussions, those freak plays tend to happen more. 

[JerseyBills]

Smokey , Big play Bob don't have home run potential?!? 

Then Knox / Sweeney at TE as well.  

I understand skepticism for the O but this is disrespectful to the D...

Jerry Hughes , Edmunds in year 2 , who might turn out to be the scariest Mlb in the game. Milano ? Lorax? 

Tre/Hyde/Poyer. 

Oliver? I see a ton of "home run" talent that should have an immediate impact. They have # 1 defense potential. Deep n talented. 

11 minutes ago, C.Biscuit97 said:

Whaley’s team were loaded minus QB, and even as flawed he was, Tyrod did “make” a pro bowl.  The Whaley hate is so misplaced (not saying you’re hating on him but those were some talented teams).

The knock on Whaley though is his contracts , inconsistent drafting and inability to build a culture . Something Beane has already done. He had a collection of talent, not a team. This is a team where The Whole is Greater thanthe Sum of its Parts.

There's what , 3-4 guys that were here before 2017! Phenomenal job building this roster.

Edited September 3, 2019 by JerseyBills