OK. I'll Say It-Allen will be best Bills QB ever

[Alphadawg7]

1 hour ago, oldmanfan said:

No.  Like what I see so far, but if you look at the HOF out of hundreds of guys who have played QB in the NFL there are roughly 30 that made the grade.   And we had one of them.

 

Allen may have a very long and successful career, maybe even HOF worthy.  But no way you say he's going to be better than Kelly at this point.

 

As much as we all love Kelly, he wasn’t as good as Bills fan lore.  Great QB obviously, but not in the top 10 discussions, not sure even top 20 is a lock unless you’re talking to a Bills fan (For the record, I have him in the top 20, but again I am a Bills fan).

 

I love the guy, one of my all time favorite players, but it’s not like his career arc is so high it’s not possible to exceed it.  So I think it’s quite possible Allen can achieve this.  

 

Is it a premature statement, sure, but arent all projections premature even if talking just next year?  That’s why it’s a projection or belief.  I don’t think it’s crazy to believe Allen could go down as best Bills QB ever when you look at all his tools, leadership, passion, work ethic.  He has a massive amount of work over the next decade ahead of him to make that case, but he certainly has all the tools to pull it off if he can keep growing on the field.

[buffaloboyinATL]

Let’s hope so!

[John from Riverside]

1 hour ago, beacon said:

I know it's blasphemy, but Josh Allen will have every Bills QB record by the time he retires. Yards, TD's, Rushing, Wins.They have their QB for the next 10/15 years. He is the most exciting Bill since SB days. Nobody knew what a great runner he is. Reminds me of Elway, only faster and shiftier. He is going to be a stud.  His game of pass/run is going to be sweet to watch.   Fill a few holes on O-line next year, grab a receiver or two, cut Benjamin, Clay and Shady.  Doesn't matter what city it is, good players want to play with good/great QB's. He will make everyone around him better. Then they all can make even more  $$$$$$.  Can't wait until next year. 

OK Look.....Jim Kelly holds that honor until someone actually shows they can wrestle it away.

 

And i am a big Josh Allen fan

[Seasons1992]

1 hour ago, Royale with Cheese said:

I certainly hope he breaks all of Kelly's records since they aren't really gaudy numbers due to him only playing 10 years and it wasn't as much a passing league back then.

 

If Allen becomes the greatest or is in the conversation as greatest of All Time in in 7-10 years....I'll get this tattoo on my back.

 

 

 

*saves this post on his personal laptop and sets a timer*

[oldmanfan]

24 minutes ago, Alphadawg7 said:

 

As much as we all love Kelly, he wasn’t as good as Bills fan lore.  Great QB obviously, but not in the top 10 discussions, not sure even top 20 is a lock unless you’re talking to a Bills fan (For the record, I have him in the top 20, but again I am a Bills fan).

 

I love the guy, one of my all time favorite players, but it’s not like his career arc is so high it’s not possible to exceed it.  So I think it’s quite possible Allen can achieve this.  

 

Is it a premature statement, sure, but arent all projections premature even if talking just next year?  That’s why it’s a projection or belief.  I don’t think it’s crazy to believe Allen could go down as best Bills QB ever when you look at all his tools, leadership, passion, work ethic.  He has a massive amount of work over the next decade ahead of him to make that case, but he certainly has all the tools to pull it off if he can keep growing on the field.

An interesting discussion to be sure

[longtimebillsfan]

2 hours ago, beacon said:

I know it's blasphemy, but Josh Allen will have every Bills QB record by the time he retires. Yards, TD's, Rushing, Wins.They have their QB for the next 10/15 years. He is the most exciting Bill since SB days. Nobody knew what a great runner he is. Reminds me of Elway, only faster and shiftier. He is going to be a stud.  His game of pass/run is going to be sweet to watch.   Fill a few holes on O-line next year, grab a receiver or two, cut Benjamin, Clay and Shady.  Doesn't matter what city it is, good players want to play with good/great QB's. He will make everyone around him better. Then they all can make even more  $$$$$$.  Can't wait until next year. 

I hope you are right.  He has a skill set like no other quarterback the Bills have ever had.  Flutie could run, but did not have the cannon of an are like Josh.

 

I look forward to watching him each week.  I am already pumped up for next season.

 

Go Bills!!!

[OldTimeAFLGuy]

....wow....from the outhouse to the penthouse.......a TBD "bust to a must"..........gotta be a record.............

[Lurker]

Over and out...

[PlayoffsPlease]

2 hours ago, oldmanfan said:

Because it's a chat room.  So we chat.

I like Allen a lot and think he's our long term guy.  But say hi to John Elway.  Steve Young also sends his regards.

Neither Elway nor Young come close to the velocity that Allen can throw a ball.   

Also, I will not be sad, if Allen only ends up being as good as Elway or Young. 

Also Steve young was 40 pounds lighter and 3 inches shorter than Allen. 

Edited December 4, 2018 by PlayoffsPlease

[NoHuddleKelly12]

1 hour ago, Alphadawg7 said:

 

As much as we all love Kelly, he wasn’t as good as Bills fan lore.  Great QB obviously, but not in the top 10 discussions, not sure even top 20 is a lock unless you’re talking to a Bills fan (For the record, I have him in the top 20, but again I am a Bills fan).

 

I love the guy, one of my all time favorite players, but it’s not like his career arc is so high it’s not possible to exceed it.  So I think it’s quite possible Allen can achieve this.  

 

Is it a premature statement, sure, but arent all projections premature even if talking just next year?  That’s why it’s a projection or belief.  I don’t think it’s crazy to believe Allen could go down as best Bills QB ever when you look at all his tools, leadership, passion, work ethic.  He has a massive amount of work over the next decade ahead of him to make that case, but he certainly has all the tools to pull it off if he can keep growing on the field.

QB lists are always so subjective anymore, given the different rules, eras, etc. to compare across generations, but as a Bills fan, I think it's hard to keep him off of a top 10 list, if we are going by what he meant to the team and ability to lead it to W's consistently, along with being the franchise leader in basically all statistical categories, and being a 1st ballot HOFer. Agreed that his stats are by no means astronomical, especially today, but he also sloughed off 2 years in his prime in the USFL that should've been in a Bills uni. Regardless, I do hope Allen takes the torch from Kelly and runs with it to places we've never seen, like a SB title. Nothing would make me happier, and that's coming from the biggest Kelly homer out there. (Seriously, I challenge anyone to lay claim to being a bigger Kelly fanboy than me, lol). And also to his credit, I'd bet anything that Kelly also wants the Bills to find unrivaled success with Allen at the helm beyond what he gave the franchise. 

[Bangarang]

Forget the best Bills QB ever. Allen will be the best QB to ever play in the NFL. 

[DaBillsFanSince1973]

1 hour ago, clayboy54 said:

Now that Benjamin is gone, Josh's completion percentage will go through the roof. Accuracy issues? What accuracy issues!

imagine if you will a te that can catch. he's already building a chemistry with zay. add a couple more competent weapons and next season the completion % would certainly move up.

[KD in CA]

I sure hope so, but the last few days sets a record for highest Bills fan optimism following a loss ever!

[CincyBillsFan]

I love the optimism - even if it's a tad bit premature!

 

Kelly was special and that's why he has a statue in Canton Ohio.  Allen has an enormous amount of work ahead of him to even be discussed in the same terms as Jim Kelly.  But the tools are there and that's why the Bills moved up and took the guy with the highest upside at QB in the last draft.

 

But let's all take a breath and keep in mind that Allen is going to have at least one very bad game between now and the end of the season.  That's what rookie QB's do. 

 

But like I said the optimism of this thread is refreshing and if we have to endure pessimistic, end of the world wailing about how Allen will be the biggest QB bust in history then we sure as heck can have a thread that dares us to contemplate the opposite - a 2nd HOF QB.  Why not?  It sure beats the alternative. 

 

 

 

[BuffAlone]

2 hours ago, colin said:

FavrElway baby!

Tom FavrKellwayino!

[cba fan]

Test

35 minutes ago, Bangarang said:

Forget the best Bills QB ever. Allen will be the best QB to ever play in the NFL. 

He will be the first QB to be voted into the HOF before he retires. ?

[mmichii]

2 hours ago, TheFunPolice said:

let's go slowly here... A couple weeks ago people on here wanted Matt Barkley to start

 

It's encouraging to see some progress, so let's hope it continues!

i think it was mostly out of the fear that 17 would get hurt again behind that porous line.  At least that was my own reasoning.  At least this last game he was trying to be smart and not take those big shots when running.  Actually at this point I would rather see him run because it seems he takes bigger shots in the pocket.  I can't wait to see what he becomes once they overhaul the offense and its not all on him. 

[The Senator]

3 hours ago, beacon said:

I know it's blasphemy, but Josh Allen will have every Bills QB record by the time he retires. Yards, TD's, Rushing, Wins.They have their QB for the next 10/15 years. He is the most exciting Bill since SB days. Nobody knew what a great runner he is. Reminds me of Elway, only faster and shiftier. He is going to be a stud.  His game of pass/run is going to be sweet to watch.   Fill a few holes on O-line next year, grab a receiver or two, cut Benjamin, Clay and Shady.  Doesn't matter what city it is, good players want to play with good/great QB's. He will make everyone around him better. Then they all can make even more  $$$$$$.  Can't wait until next year. 

????????

 

I’ll see your post, and raise you one...

 

Josh Allen will be the 1st NFL QB since Bob Griese to lead his team to a perfect season...

 

19 and 0baby!!!!

 

GO BILLSSS!!!!!

 

?????

[26CornerBlitz]

1 minute ago, The Senator said:

????????

 

I’ll see your post, and raise you one...

 

Josh Allen will be the 1st NFL QB since Bob Griese to lead his team to a perfect season...

 

19 and 0baby!!!!

 

GO BILLSSS!!!!!

 

?????

 

With Kareem Hunt setting a new Bills' rushing record. 

Edited December 4, 2018 by 26CornerBlitz

[Success]

I’ll one up it.  He wins 4 Superbowls to even up our record.

[Andy1]

I have no idea how he is going to turn out but I think the future is very bright for him. He most reminds me of a young Elway. I remember being amazed at the velocity he threw with and with his running ability too. He could beat you either way. I never paid attention to young Favre so cant comment on him. 

 

Any comparisons to Kelly need to take into consideration that Bills fans never saw Jim as a rookie. He had already made his rookie mistakes in the USFL for 2 years. 

[The Senator]

10 minutes ago, 26CornerBlitz said:

 

With Kareem Hunt setting a new Bills' rushing record. 

 

Good one! ???

.

[Mat68]

I'm a Josh Allen nut hugger and I even say this is too far.  I think pure talent stand point gives him the potential to be, but he still has to produce on the field to be that, and continue improving.

[The Senator]

1 minute ago, Andy1 said:

 

Any comparisons to Kelly need to take into consideration that Bills fans never saw Jim as a rookie. He had already made his rookie mistakes in the USFL for 2 years. 

 

Well, yeah, if you consider breaking Marino’s NFL record with over 5000 passing yards a “rookie mistake”.

 

Then again, after all, it was the USFL.

.

[Bing Bong]

Golly were we like this when EJ Had 2 good games in his rookie year?? Honestly don't remember but can we pump the breaks. A. You're jinxing Josh. B. This hyperbole is contagious and let's take it one season at a time (even if he doesn't win MVP next year). Expectations are going to drive us crazy.

[Nuncha]

Wow! - bold prediction there.  I like the confidence and I certainly hope you are right!  It will be tough to beat out Jimbo for that mark.

[Alphadawg7]

2 hours ago, NoHuddleKelly12 said:

QB lists are always so subjective anymore, given the different rules, eras, etc. to compare across generations, but as a Bills fan, I think it's hard to keep him off of a top 10 list, if we are going by what he meant to the team and ability to lead it to W's consistently, along with being the franchise leader in basically all statistical categories, and being a 1st ballot HOFer. Agreed that his stats are by no means astronomical, especially today, but he also sloughed off 2 years in his prime in the USFL that should've been in a Bills uni. Regardless, I do hope Allen takes the torch from Kelly and runs with it to places we've never seen, like a SB title. Nothing would make me happier, and that's coming from the biggest Kelly homer out there. (Seriously, I challenge anyone to lay claim to being a bigger Kelly fanboy than me, lol). And also to his credit, I'd bet anything that Kelly also wants the Bills to find unrivaled success with Allen at the helm beyond what he gave the franchise. 

 

All fair points.  But even as a huge Kelly fan, if I remove my Bills colored glasses I can’t get him in the top 10.

 

Top 5 for me are set.  

1 Brady (I give him the nod over Joe only because Joe had so much more talent around him over his career than Brady had). 

2 Montana 

3 Steve Young

4 John Elway

5 Drew Brees (his record has been held back by the lack of balance between offense and defense on those saints team, but Brees has been exceptional every single year)

 

Next 5

6 Peyton Manning (he would be higher if he hadn’t gone one and done an NFL record 9 times in Indy)

7 Johnny Unitas (Probably higher on other lists but since I didn’t watch him play can’t put him higher)

8 Kurt Warner 

9 Dan Marino

10 Aaron Rodgers

 

I don’t know who I bump there for Kelly.  Warner was one of the greatest post season QBs ever, Marino has the gaudy stats, and Rodgers likely finishes his career in the top 5 (and may have a case for it now).

 

Curious to what others say, so googled top QBs all time and this top 25 list came up first and Kelly wasn’t listed in the top 25.  I’ve also seen plenty of lists with him there, so like you said it’s in the eye of the beholder and how people way eras.  I have him personally inside the top 15 though.

 

https://www.google.com/amp/s/touchdownwire.usatoday.com/2018/02/28/top-25-nfl-quarterbacks-of-all-time/amp/

[stinky finger]

5 hours ago, PlayoffsPlease said:

Josh Allen has the physical skills to be the greatest QB in NFL history.  No other current QB can make that claim.  But Allen's combination of size, speed, agility, arm strength and total strength are unmatched in NFL history.  Clealy mentally acuity and brilliant eye hand coordination are critical elements to becoming a great QB.  Hopefully Allen can add those to the mix and make the next GOAT also an AFC east guy. 

 

Cue the inaccurate idiots

[Boca BIlls]

Sadly that isnt a very tall order...

[stinky finger]

25 minutes ago, Alphadawg7 said:

 

All fair points.  But even as a huge Kelly fan, if I remove my Bills colored glasses I can’t get him in the top 10.

 

Top 5 for me are set.  

1 Brady (I give him the nod over Joe only because Joe had so much more talent around him over his career than Brady had). 

2 Montana 

3 Steve Young

4 John Elway

5 Drew Brees (his record has been held back by the lack of balance between offense and defense on those saints team, but Brees has been exceptional every single year)

 

Next 5

6 Peyton Manning (he would be higher if he hadn’t gone one and done an NFL record 9 times in Indy)

7 Johnny Unitas (Probably higher on other lists but since I didn’t watch him play can’t put him higher)

8 Kurt Warner 

9 Dan Marino

10 Aaron Rodgers

 

I don’t know who I bump there for Kelly.  Warner was one of the greatest post season QBs ever, Marino has the gaudy stats, and Rodgers likely finishes his career in the top 5 (and may have a case for it now).

 

Curious to what others say, so googled top QBs all time and this top 25 list came up first and Kelly wasn’t listed in the top 25.  I’ve also seen plenty of lists with him there, so like you said it’s in the eye of the beholder and how people way eras.  I have him personally inside the top 15 though.

 

https://www.google.com/amp/s/touchdownwire.usatoday.com/2018/02/28/top-25-nfl-quarterbacks-of-all-time/amp/

 

I enjoy QB rankings.....no right/wrong answers. It's fun.

 

I find it more and more difficult comparing QBs of 70s, 80s, 90s to today's version.

 

Different game being played. 

[RobH063]

OP, I fully understand your thought process on this. Actually, I was with Kevin Costner at last Sunday's game in Miami and we just sat there with our eyes bulged out every time the Joshster (that's what I call him because we've become so close) touched the football. Then Kevin turned to me and said...Rob, is this heaven? I just calmly said..No, Kevin, this is Miami but that guy down there wearing number 17 is Jesus and we had a catch just the other day.

[CodeMonkey]

5 hours ago, beacon said:

I know it's blasphemy, but Josh Allen will have every Bills QB record by the time he retires. Yards, TD's, Rushing, Wins.They have their QB for the next 10/15 years. He is the most exciting Bill since SB days. Nobody knew what a great runner he is. Reminds me of Elway, only faster and shiftier. He is going to be a stud.  His game of pass/run is going to be sweet to watch.   Fill a few holes on O-line next year, grab a receiver or two, cut Benjamin, Clay and Shady.  Doesn't matter what city it is, good players want to play with good/great QB's. He will make everyone around him better. Then they all can make even more  $$$$$$.  Can't wait until next year. 

Homer it up baby.  No reason not to have some fun with it

[BADOLBILZ]

5 hours ago, beacon said:

I know it's blasphemy, but Josh Allen will have every Bills QB record by the time he retires. Yards, TD's, Rushing, Wins.They have their QB for the next 10/15 years. He is the most exciting Bill since SB days. Nobody knew what a great runner he is. Reminds me of Elway, only faster and shiftier. He is going to be a stud.  His game of pass/run is going to be sweet to watch.   Fill a few holes on O-line next year, grab a receiver or two, cut Benjamin, Clay and Shady.  Doesn't matter what city it is, good players want to play with good/great QB's. He will make everyone around him better. Then they all can make even more  $$$$$$.  Can't wait until next year. 

 

 

Hope you are right...............we sure as hell deserve it.

[Orlando Tim]

2 hours ago, The Senator said:

????????

 

I’ll see your post, and raise you one...

 

Josh Allen will be the 1st NFL QB since Bob Griese to lead his team to a perfect season...

 

19 and 0baby!!!!

 

GO BILLSSS!!!!!

 

?????

I was breezing thrpugh post and was about to tell some young kid to stop stealing the senators place here- then i realized it was you and felt better about the world.

[RedandBlue]

Honestly, it wouldn’t surprise me. I wanted one thing from this season, progress from the young guys especially Allen. He is delivering. 

 

He may have a stinker of a game before the year is out, maybe not. But he has surprisingly already given me what I wanted to see, more Minnesota type games.

 

Go hard on the O-line in the offseason and the rest will fall into place. He’s going to be a good one.

 

We are about to take over the AFCE for a while.

 

 

[wppete]

[Troll Toll]

Get him an O-line and we may see this come to fruition. We’ve seen so many guys who never come close to realizing their potential. Josh is already getting there, flashing ridiculous throws, wild runs, and those wonderlic smarts to learn from his mistakes. In spite of what I and many others would consider one of the worst possible situations for developing a QB, Josh has beaten the odds thus far and seems to have put the toughest learning times behind him. He appears to be at a point where he only needs to make modest improvements to his game. To play the way he did on Sunday (as a rookie) blows my mind.

 

His vision blows my mind. He not only is willing to attack anywhere on the field, but sees the entire field as well. He is doing an excellent job avoiding pressure and buying time despite being the most pressured QB in the NFL in under 3 seconds. His arm and legs are outstanding AND he is showing signs of developing touch.

[Alphadawg7]

39 minutes ago, inaugural balls said:

 

I enjoy QB rankings.....no right/wrong answers. It's fun.

 

I find it more and more difficult comparing QBs of 70s, 80s, 90s to today's version.

 

Different game being played. 

 

Yeah totally agree, no wrong answers really and certainly entertaining to discuss while also difficult to weigh the different eras.  

[DuckyBoys]

If the Bills surround him with some better talent Josh could be putting up Tecmo Bowl numbers.  I fear because of his size/running ability the refs wont protect him the same  Much like some of the hits that dont get called on Cam.  Just because a qb can run doesnt mean he should not get the same protection when he is in the pocket

[row_33]

Hopefully the best Bills QB ever for those currently under 35 years of age