So are we just done expecting Von Miller to do anything?

[colin]

43 minutes ago, without a drought said:

He injured his knee on thanksgiving and had surgery Dec 7th. 

 

 

based on my calculations that makes it 42 months, which is a long time for Edmunds to be in his rookie year, but here we are.

[without a drought]

4 minutes ago, colin said:

 

 

based on my calculations that makes it 42 months, which is a long time for Edmunds to be in his rookie year, but here we are.

Edmunds was only 12 years old 42 months ago.

[Buffalo03]

13 hours ago, SCBills said:

I do not understand why anyone would choose this game, of all the games he’s played this year, to convey this message. 
 

He actually affected Mahomes late in the 4th a few times.  Looked like he finally started figuring some things out. 

The OP is clearly not paying attention. He saw Miller's name and number hit Mahomes on Sunday and didn't know what the hell he was looking at

Edited December 13, 2023 by Buffalo03

[pi2000]

This was his first week without the brace as planned, he mentioned this weeks ago.    He'll continue to get better I have no doubt.

[SoMAn]

The real question is whether his reduced production is temporary and solely attributed to working his way back from the ACL, or is Father Time the real fly in the ointment?  Looking at a hypothetical scenario in which the injury never occurred, would his current production be similar to what we’re now witnessing? 
In a nutshell, how much is it the injury or inevitable age and hitting that wall? 

[BillsShredder83]

12 hours ago, Alpo Chino said:

Damn imagine if he regain 75% of his old form and Daquan comes back.... 

speaking of Daquan.... what was his injury again? something he can hit the field running from when he comes back, or something wed expect a slow start from? anyone know, been weird how hush his whole thing has seemed

[Rubes]

2 minutes ago, BillsShredder83 said:

speaking of Daquan.... what was his injury again? something he can hit the field running from when he comes back, or something wed expect a slow start from? anyone know, been weird how hush his whole thing has seemed

pectoral tear. Very tough injury to deal with, need to come back pretty carefully, though others have done it. I think he could see the field by the end of the season if we’re still in it.

 

[Straight Hucklebuck]

15 hours ago, dayman said:

Idk about the rest of you but it’s basically looking like he’s done. Obviously eating eat huge cap now and in the future, and no signs of ever being a difference maker.

There is no magic to do anything about this. 

 

His contract makes him unable to get rid of or trade, and now Epenesa is out week to week, so he's going to have to play. 

 

The Bills have no choice but to try and make this work. 

[Mojo44]

57 minutes ago, without a drought said:

Edmunds was only 12 years old 42 months ago.

And yet, inexplicably, he is still 12 years old.

[C.Biscuit97]

As the great Gin Blossoms once said:

 

”And if you don't expect too much from me
You might not be let down”

 

awful contract but sunken cost. Felt weird watching him Sunday but I guess anything he does is a bonus now. It’s such a low bar but he looked better last game. 
 

personally, I kinda wish he could be long term IRed and the young guys would step up. 

[Shaw66]

5 minutes ago, C.Biscuit97 said:

 

awful contract but sunken cost. Felt weird watching him Sunday but I guess anything he does is a bonus now. It’s such a low bar but he looked better last game. 
 

personally, I kinda wish he could be long term IRed and the young guys would step up. 

I just don't get this.   I'm expecting him to be a true difference maker, if not by the end of this season, then certainly next season.   He works hard, he stays in shape, he has unusual (to say the least) talents.   He's motivated.  

 

Bills brought him to Buffalo to pressure the passer in the fourth quarter of big games, and even though by most measures he shouldn't be expected to be fully recovered yet, in the fourth quarter of a big game three days ago, he pressured the passer.   

[Eastport bills]

It seems like Von is either hesitant to bull rush or make the turn when he rushes wide. Maybe he still doesn’t trust the knee. He’s got to put his stamp on one or two of the remaining games in order to be counted on going forward. Otherwise we will be taking a big hit for no production at a vital position.

[Dick_Cheney]

Not sure how people are missing that this was his first game without the brace and it was by far the most impact he's had this season. I fully expect him to be an impact player against Dallas.

[par73]

Strange time to post this, since he did actually have an impact on Sunday.

[Shaw66]

13 minutes ago, Eastport bills said:

It seems like Von is either hesitant to bull rush or make the turn when he rushes wide. Maybe he still doesn’t trust the knee. He’s got to put his stamp on one or two of the remaining games in order to be counted on going forward. Otherwise we will be taking a big hit for no production at a vital position.

I don't get this.  The guy is a first-ballot Hall of Fame player.  Before his injury, he was playing at essentially the same level as in previous seasons (he averaged 10 sacks a season, and playing part-time last season he had 8, he's recovering from an injury that takes 12-18 months for full recovery), and yet you say if he doesn't make an impact in the next four games, he's history.  Makes no sense.  

[Mark Vader]

As usual the OP of this thread has not responded to anyone who has questioned their take.

 

We have plenty of threads like this where someone complains and after they do that, they disappear.

Looks like @dayman just wants attention and is not interested in this discussion.

[first_and_ten]

16 hours ago, dayman said:

Idk about the rest of you but it’s basically looking like he’s done. Obviously eating eat huge cap now and in the future, and no signs of ever being a difference maker.

 

He's done this year. WE have to give him until next year because it takes time to get back to normal

[Eastport bills]

21 minutes ago, Shaw66 said:

I don't get this.  The guy is a first-ballot Hall of Fame player.  Before his injury, he was playing at essentially the same level as in previous seasons (he averaged 10 sacks a season, and playing part-time last season he had 8, he's recovering from an injury that takes 12-18 months for full recovery), and yet you say if he doesn't make an impact in the next four games, he's history.  Makes no sense.  

History, never said that. He’s guaranteed 70 million over 5 years and he’s a liability if he gets no sacks or tackles. The problem is Beane signed a 33 year old, with injuries in his history, to a monster contract and it is adversely affecting the roster for minimum 2more seasons.

[Einstein]

16 hours ago, RiotAct said:

He showed signs of improvement in the Chiefs game.  Collapsed the pocket decently on at least a few of his snaps.

 

Honest question - When did this happen?

 

I can only think of one play where he (sorta) did this.

[RiotAct]

10 minutes ago, Einstein said:

 

Honest question - When did this happen?

 

I can only think of one play where he (sorta) did this.

a few times, but on the final Chiefs offensive play (the 4th down), he got some pressure on Mahomes and seemed to force the throw a little earlier than he wanted to release it IIRC.

[BlazinBill]

16 hours ago, RiotAct said:

He showed signs of improvement in the Chiefs game.  Collapsed the pocket decently on at least a few of his snaps.

He did- it was also against a rookie whom never started though correct?

[C.Biscuit97]

1 hour ago, Shaw66 said:

I just don't get this.   I'm expecting him to be a true difference maker, if not by the end of this season, then certainly next season.   He works hard, he stays in shape, he has unusual (to say the least) talents.   He's motivated.  

 

Bills brought him to Buffalo to pressure the passer in the fourth quarter of big games, and even though by most measures he shouldn't be expected to be fully recovered yet, in the fourth quarter of a big game three days ago, he pressured the passer.   

I hope you’re roght. Honestly, the bye week situation just seemed like the icing on the cake a bad FA signing (I get why). 
 

but the guy is getting old and struggles to stay healthy. Age and injuries are a bad combo in the nfl. Look at Mario Williams. He had 38 sacks in 3 years here and was out of the league 2 years later. Poyer might be on the same path. The nfl is the most unforgivable sport around. 

[Shaw66]

45 minutes ago, Eastport bills said:

History, never said that. He’s guaranteed 70 million over 5 years and he’s a liability if he gets no sacks or tackles. The problem is Beane signed a 33 year old, with injuries in his history, to a monster contract and it is adversely affecting the roster for minimum 2more seasons.

We will have to wait to know if he is adversely affecting the roster for the next two seasons.   He won a Super Bowl just a couple of years ago.   He hadn't lost anything playing last season, and he's still recovering from a serious injury.  He's a serious worker and a great team leader.   

 

His age?  Yeah, maybe it's a factor, but the true greats, and Miller is one, often have a way to play longer than the ordinary guys.   And in Buffalo he has the benefit of playing in a rotation, which can be expected to help extend his career.  

[Shaw66]

4 minutes ago, C.Biscuit97 said:

I hope you’re roght. Honestly, the bye week situation just seemed like the icing on the cake a bad FA signing (I get why). 
 

but the guy is getting old and struggles to stay healthy. Age and injuries are a bad combo in the nfl. Look at Mario Williams. He had 38 sacks in 3 years here and was out of the league 2 years later. Poyer might be on the same path. The nfl is the most unforgivable sport around. 

I hear you, and obviously I have no crystal ball.   However, you're stretching the facts when you say he "struggles to stay healthy."   He played 15 or 16 games every season except when he had a knee injury in Denver many years ago, and now this injury.   That's not a struggle - those are just two injuries that, with time, allow the player to come back.  He's in much better shape than Mario Williams, he weighs 50 pounds less, and has the competitive spirit that Williams lacked.  

 

There simply is no reason to write him off yet (unless, of course, he goes to prison).  

 

As others and I have been saying, last Sunday he showed cleared progress.  Earlier in the season he was just playing himself into shape.  He was on a pitch count (probably still is).  His training camp is just ending now, and we'll see what he does over the next four weeks.  My guess is he takes down Dak at least once on Sunday.  

[BillMafia716ix]

Von looked good on Sunday. He finally got rid of the kneee brace and looked explosive. He collapsed the pocket more than a few times

[Rubes]

People seem to expect Von to have already returned to form by now, and because he hasn’t he’s a bust. That’s just not how these injuries work. He’s making slow, gradual improvement and won’t be back to his old form until next year. But that doesn’t mean his rehab isn’t going well and that he can’t have even some small impact this year. It just takes time to get back into form. People just need patience, which I know is asking a lot of some folks.

 

[TrentEdwardsCheckDownOn4th]

He had a huge pressure on third down late in the game to get mahomes off the field. Were we watching the same game ? This was definitely his best game since the injury.

[TheWei44]

He almost got a sack last weekend and definitely caused problems for Mahomes on other plays as well.  And his slow emergence (fingers crossed) happens to be coming when AJE got hurt.  Very beneficial timing!  Putting the off-field stuff aside, a glass-half-full view of things is that we're going to start seeing a healthy dose of the old Von. 

Edited December 13, 2023 by TheWei44

[CA OC Bills Fan]

8 minutes ago, Rubes said:

People seem to expect Von to have already returned to form by now, and because he hasn’t he’s a bust. That’s just not how these injuries work. He’s making slow, gradual improvement and won’t be back to his old form until next year. But that doesn’t mean his rehab isn’t going well and that he can’t have even some small impact this year. It just takes time to get back into form. People just need patience, which I know is asking a lot of some folks.

 

Completely agree with this. From my observations, most players aren't at their full post ACL form until 18 months or so post surgery. Many here were saying the same about Tre last year and sure enough, the beginning of this season, until he got injured again, he looked close to his old self. For Von, of course he's older and therefore a higher probability that he is actually done, but I'll reserve judgement on this until next season.

[Eastport bills]

2 hours ago, Shaw66 said:

We will have to wait to know if he is adversely affecting the roster for the next two seasons.   He won a Super Bowl just a couple of years ago.   He hadn't lost anything playing last season, and he's still recovering from a serious injury.  He's a serious worker and a great team leader.   

 

His age?  Yeah, maybe it's a factor, but the true greats, and Miller is one, often have a way to play longer than the ordinary guys.   And in Buffalo he has the benefit of playing in a rotation, which can be expected to help extend his career.  

You know, ordinarily I would dismiss your contention that he’s the exception to the rule, but he has a HOF career and maybe it takes a year to get his confidence about the knee. I hope you’re right.

[FLFan]

In general, fan expectation regarding Vonn’s potential performance this year were wildly over optimistic.  I think we are getting about what we could reasonably expect for a player his age coming off such a serious injury.  None of us at this point can predict whether he will ultimately reclaim anything close to his pre-injury form eventually.  His age argues against it, but he is a special athlete and highly motivated.  I would not bet against him, but next year is the timeframe to be expected.  If he can make  a few contributions down the stretch toward Buffalo’s run, it would be pure gravy.  

[billsfan89]

3 minutes ago, FLFan said:

In general, fan expectation regarding Vonn’s potential performance this year were wildly over optimistic.  I think we are getting about what we could reasonably expect for a player his age coming off such a serious injury.  None of us at this point can predict whether he will ultimately reclaim anything close to his pre-injury form eventually.  His age argues against it, but he is a special athlete and highly motivated.  I would not bet against him, but next year is the timeframe to be expected.  If he can make  a few contributions down the stretch toward Buffalo’s run, it would be pure gravy.  

 

The most reasonable expectations (and these were my expectations) we won't start to see what we have with Von for a stretch run until after the bye week. Well, we have one game after the bye week and he looked better than he had at any point this season but there's still some ways to go. If this team makes the playoffs I think Von with another month and 4 games under his belt will have a chance to make plays as a situational rotation player. But its a long process that will only yield slow and steady results going forward. 

[Shaw66]

1 hour ago, Eastport bills said:

You know, ordinarily I would dismiss your contention that he’s the exception to the rule, but he has a HOF career and maybe it takes a year to get his confidence about the knee. I hope you’re right.

I would agree with you that it's unlikely for an ordinary DE.  But I took a look at the careers of Reggie White, Bruce Smith, and a couple of other guys.  They played as long as Miller's contract, and they were still racking up sacks late in their careers.  Given Miller's relatively low weight (like Bruce), his workout dedication and his focus, I think he actually could give the Bills at least a couple more solid seasons.  Obviously, I don't know, and for all I know, he could fade dramatically at any time.  (His arrest could change his life, for instance.)  Like you, I hope I'm right. 

45 minutes ago, billsfan89 said:

 

The most reasonable expectations (and these were my expectations) we won't start to see what we have with Von for a stretch run until after the bye week. Well, we have one game after the bye week and he looked better than he had at any point this season but there's still some ways to go. If this team makes the playoffs I think Von with another month and 4 games under his belt will have a chance to make plays as a situational rotation player. But its a long process that will only yield slow and steady results going forward. 

Tre White was in exactly the same situation last season, and it simply wasn't enough time for him to get all the way back.  

[Spiderweb]

16 hours ago, C.Biscuit97 said:

I hope you’re roght. Honestly, the bye week situation just seemed like the icing on the cake a bad FA signing (I get why). 
 

but the guy is getting old and struggles to stay healthy. Age and injuries are a bad combo in the nfl. Look at Mario Williams. He had 38 sacks in 3 years here and was out of the league 2 years later. Poyer might be on the same path. The nfl is the most unforgivable sport around. 

I think the first of our safety duo to depart will be Micah Hyde. His neck injury from 2022 seems to be rearing its ugly head again this year too with the stingers....

[VaMilBill]

15 hours ago, Rubes said:

People seem to expect Von to have already returned to form by now, and because he hasn’t he’s a bust. That’s just not how these injuries work. He’s making slow, gradual improvement and won’t be back to his old form until next year. But that doesn’t mean his rehab isn’t going well and that he can’t have even some small impact this year. It just takes time to get back into form. People just need patience, which I know is asking a lot of some folks.

 

I think the bust status on this season was because not only was he not getting any pressure, but he was running himself completely out of plays or taking out other defenders because he had no strength, speed or agility to defeat a defender. He was a liability and not an asset at all. 
 

However, he did show some signs of life against the chief. I’d still grade him as a C overall for the game due in large part to that big pressure that was initially called a fumble (reversed, forced a chiefs FG) and on the last drive he forced some pressure. He definitely improved. Outside of those few plays, he was a non-factor (however not a complete liability). Hopefully he can build on his improved play going forward. 

[C.Biscuit97]

2 hours ago, Spiderweb said:

I think the first of our safety duo to depart will be Micah Hyde. His neck injury from 2022 seems to be rearing its ugly head again this year too with the stingers....

It sucks. Love those guys. But Father Time is just ruthless in the nfl. 

[DrDawkinstein]

19 hours ago, Einstein said:

 

Honest question - When did this happen?

 

I can only think of one play where he (sorta) did this.

 

Check out this weeks Cover1 Film Room video. They highlight his plays a bit. He isnt 100% his old self yet, but it was a major leap from what we've seen and he got a couple of good pressures in. There's at least one play he is directly responsible for the incompletion.

[T master]

As some here have said last week he did more than in most every week prior to that one & i feel the coaches were thinking or hoping that he would more so hit his stride toward the end of the season when teams should be playing their best ball & if he does that would fit the plan perfectly .

 

Hopefully he get's back toeing himself, Daquan comes back playing close to what he was before his injury & the entire team turns the switch on & makes a deep run into making history & brings home the big one !! 

 

GO BILLS !! 

[CircleTheWagons99]

I expect Von to have his best game against Dallas and start his Season.

[Warriorspikes51]

Considering Von wanted to be a Cowboy and would have gone there if they offered more $$$

I expect a really big game from him Sunday