Boogie traded to Giants

[HalftimeAdjustment]

How does a late round pick swap in 2025 work? Do we just assume we have the better 2024 record, or is the round contingent on which round we pick higher in? 

[ColoradoBills]

19 minutes ago, machine gun kelly said:

Colorado, I believe Poona’s making the team.  He was solid not when Carrol went to a 3-4, but the year prior in the 4-3.  He penetrates well.  Besides what’s the over/under on how many games Phillips lasts.  He’s great when he plays, but I just don’t know how long he’ll last so that begs other considerations.  Once Von is back, some of Groot’s snaps may come inside.  Shaq may be expendable.

 

I trust McD.  He knows what he wants.

 

I freely admit I don't know much about Poona.  For some reason I just haven't seen him do much (as I was watching) in preseason.

I trust you and the other guys to fill me in.

 

LOL, that's the reason I'm on this board!

[Beck Water]

5 hours ago, 78thealltimegreat said:

WGR speculating Von Miller is ready 

 

He's not.  It's announced he'll stay on PUP, meaning he must miss the 1st 4 games.

[machine gun kelly]

10 minutes ago, ColoradoBills said:

 

I freely admit I don't know much about Poona.  For some reason I just haven't seen him do much (as I was watching) in preseason.

I trust you and the other guys to fill me in.

 

LOL, that's the reason I'm on this board!

No worries brother.  It’s always harder for guys in the inside to make a splash if they’re name is not Aaron Donald.

 

Poona is a good penetrator and should be more durable than Jordan.  Please don’t take that I don’t like Phillips.  I do, but he’s no spring chkn and is likely to be hurt in 18 games.

[dollars 2 donuts]

5 hours ago, Roundybout said:

Definitely would have wanted Creed Humphrey. Oh well. 

 

I couldn’t stop hearing about Humphrey from a friend of mine who was so excited about him and believed he would be their in the second round for us, which he was.

 

Now I can’t even talk to him about it as it makes him sick.

 

 

 

 

[Chicken Boo]

5 hours ago, Coach Tuesday said:

 

Last year the Jets drafted two All Pros in Round 1 and the Bills drafted a 4th string corner.  Allen is saving Beane's job right now.

 

Coach dropping bombs. 

 

Let em have it!  

[HappyDays]

The Creed Humphrey obsession is so tired. I'll criticize Beane when it's warranted. But if we drafted Humphrey instead of Basham we would have the exact same number of Super Bowl wins right now. We're not talking about the league MVP here. It's just a center, the easiest position in football other than RB to find quality talent.

 

Failed day 2 and 3 draft picks is not why our team has floundered in January. The main reason is our free agency spending relative to the rest of the league has been mostly awful. Missing on a late 2nd round pass rusher is acceptable. Wasting money on the likes of Vernon Butler and Rodger Saffold is not.

[boyst]

Just now, HappyDays said:

The Creed Humphrey obsession is so tired. I'll criticize Beane when it's warranted. But if we drafted Humphrey instead of Basham we would have the exact same number of Super Bowl wins right now. We're not talking about the league MVP here. It's just a center, the easiest position in football other than RB to find quality talent.

 

Failed day 2 and 3 draft picks is not why our team has floundered in January. The main reason is our free agency spending relative to the rest of the league has been mostly awful. Missing on a late 2nd round pass rusher is acceptable. Wasting money on the likes of Vernon Butler and Rodger Saffold is not.

wow.

we really have been spoiled to have eric wood and mitch morse.

 

clearly you forgot geoff hangartner, among others.

 

center is not the easiest position in football. no position is truly easy but that you said this... is insane! like purely a lack of football knowledge.

 

the center generally calls the blocking schemes, helps call audibles, assures proper alignment, generally knows the entire play for all positions.

 

then do all of this while making sure the quarterback gets the ball with the laces up in a shotgun pass.

 

jesus... your take is so bad that you should delete it.

[Coach Tuesday]

4 minutes ago, HappyDays said:

The Creed Humphrey obsession is so tired. I'll criticize Beane when it's warranted. But if we drafted Humphrey instead of Basham we would have the exact same number of Super Bowl wins right now. We're not talking about the league MVP here. It's just a center, the easiest position in football other than RB to find quality talent.

 

Failed day 2 and 3 draft picks is not why our team has floundered in January. The main reason is our free agency spending relative to the rest of the league has been mostly awful. Missing on a late 2nd round pass rusher is acceptable. Wasting money on the likes of Vernon Butler and Rodger Saffold is not.

 

This is fair.  If you're going to whiff in the draft, at least do so on a premium position like passrusher.

[BrettFavre]

1 minute ago, boyst said:

wow.

we really have been spoiled to have eric wood and mitch morse.

 

clearly you forgot geoff hangartner, among others.

 

center is not the easiest position in football. no position is truly easy but that you said this... is insane! like purely a lack of football knowledge.

 

the center generally calls the blocking schemes, helps call audibles, assures proper alignment, generally knows the entire play for all positions.

 

then do all of this while making sure the quarterback gets the ball with the laces up in a shotgun pass.

 

jesus... your take is so bad that you should delete it.

Thanks for saving me the time. The Humphrey "obsession" is only such because so many Bills fans agreed that he was the obvious pick, which is a rare occurrence in any fanbase. Getting a "franchise" center to pair with your franchise QB in the same age group is a really nice luxury that fell into our laps. So yeah, people are still pissed about it just like they were five minutes after the pick.

[newcam2012]

1 hour ago, billsfan89 said:

Bills cutting their losses on this one. I am glad that McBeane is able to do so. There was a log jam at DE. Even with Von on the PUP you had Floyd, Shaq, Groot and AJ there. You then have Von coming back whose going to displace someone on the roster if they were carrying five DE's. Shorten the rotation a bit and see how those four play. Getting even just a late round pick back and stock up on the 2024 draft where you will need to acquire more cheap talent to replace some of the aging components on the team. 

Without a healthy Von I suspect the Bills pass rush will not be good enough. 

 

This season is mostly on the offense. 

[HappyDays]

7 minutes ago, boyst said:

wow.

we really have been spoiled to have eric wood and mitch morse.

 

clearly you forgot geoff hangartner, among others.

 

center is not the easiest position in football. no position is truly easy but that you said this... is insane! like purely a lack of football knowledge.

 

the center generally calls the blocking schemes, helps call audibles, assures proper alignment, generally knows the entire play for all positions.

 

then do all of this while making sure the quarterback gets the ball with the laces up in a shotgun pass.

 

jesus... your take is so bad that you should delete it.

 

For a rookie QB, sure. For an established QB like Josh Allen the only thing that matters is snapping the ball and holding up decently well. I am pretty confident based on things I've heard that Morse will be gone next year and Bates will slip into his spot without any measurable drop off. Morse is the better player. It just isn't the type of position where top quality matters as much.

[Gunsgoodtime]

14 minutes ago, HappyDays said:

The Creed Humphrey obsession is so tired. I'll criticize Beane when it's warranted. But if we drafted Humphrey instead of Basham we would have the exact same number of Super Bowl wins right now. We're not talking about the league MVP here. It's just a center, the easiest position in football other than RB to find quality talent.

 

Failed day 2 and 3 draft picks is not why our team has floundered in January. The main reason is our free agency spending relative to the rest of the league has been mostly awful. Missing on a late 2nd round pass rusher is acceptable. Wasting money on the likes of Vernon Butler and Rodger Saffold is not.

If you combine the two, not good at all

[Dan Darragh]

5 hours ago, Coach Tuesday said:

 

Last year the Jets drafted two All Pros in Round 1 and the Bills drafted a 4th string corner.  Allen is saving Beane's job right now.

I guess a 4 and a 10 really are worth a lot more than a 23.  Who knew???

[DrDawkinstein]

14 minutes ago, HappyDays said:

The Creed Humphrey obsession is so tired. I'll criticize Beane when it's warranted. But if we drafted Humphrey instead of Basham we would have the exact same number of Super Bowl wins right now. We're not talking about the league MVP here. It's just a center, the easiest position in football other than RB to find quality talent.

 

Failed day 2 and 3 draft picks is not why our team has floundered in January. The main reason is our free agency spending relative to the rest of the league has been mostly awful. Missing on a late 2nd round pass rusher is acceptable. Wasting money on the likes of Vernon Butler and Rodger Saffold is not.

 

Tough to say either of the bolded statements when Humprhey could have played OG for us his rookie year which would have been an immediate improvement in 2021, AND kept him off the Chiefs, so maybe that Chiefs playoff game plays out differently. Plus, we would not have had the need to sign Saffold.

 

Failed day 3 picks is not why we have floundered in January. But failed Day 1 and 2 picks certainly contribute.

 

Missing on a late 2nd round pass rusher, after you just drafted a DE with the pick prior, AND you need interior OL help, AND one of the top IOL prospects is sitting right there... is not as acceptable as you make it sound. Not saying fire the guy, but Beane does have to do better.

[GoBills808]

7 minutes ago, HappyDays said:

 

For a rookie QB, sure. For an established QB like Josh Allen the only thing that matters is snapping the ball and holding up decently well. I am pretty confident based on things I've heard that Morse will be gone next year and Bates will slip into his spot without any measurable drop off. Morse is the better player. It just isn't the type of position where top quality matters as much.

Travis Kelce said on his podcast that center is the easiest position on the oline to hide and his brother agreed lol

[DrDawkinstein]

8 minutes ago, HappyDays said:

 

For a rookie QB, sure. For an established QB like Josh Allen the only thing that matters is snapping the ball and holding up decently well. I am pretty confident based on things I've heard that Morse will be gone next year and Bates will slip into his spot without any measurable drop off. Morse is the better player. It just isn't the type of position where top quality matters as much.

 

Might have won the Vikings game last year with a different Center.

[78thealltimegreat]

2 hours ago, balln said:

Zack moss played at Utah. PAC 12 sucks 

Tell that to Caleb Williams 

[Beck Water]

6 hours ago, NewEra said:

Link?

 

Pelissero says "as part of", has not said that's the entirety of the compensation.

 

6 hours ago, Blank Stare said:

Terrible second round pick. Knew it then, confirmed now. 

 

I will say that Boogie Basham at pick 61 when Creed Humphrey was drafted 2 picks later has been "***** in my grits" for 3 years.

Fortunately, I don't eat grits at home, being, in fact, a DamnedYankee. 

But still.

4 minutes ago, DrDawkinstein said:

 

Might have won the Vikings game last year with a different Center.

 

I've just thrown down that I thought we should have tried if Humphrey could play G and had a C in waiting.

 

But if you're talking about that fumble in the EZ, I'm pretty sure that was on Josh.

[Dan Darragh]

6 hours ago, Bleeding Bills Blue said:

 

They also used the 2nd overall pick on zach wilson the year before.  So they got an all-pro corner, a NOT all-pro WR who looks to be a good player, and a worthless QB.  With More draft capital than buffalo has had if you combine probably the last 3 seasons if not more.  

The Jets whiffed on a QB at #2 and a QB at #3 in a three-year span

[HappyDays]

6 minutes ago, DrDawkinstein said:

Humprhey could have played OG for us his rookie year

 

For the first time in his career, including college? That was one of the question marks on him coming out of Oklahoma. Everyone knew he would likely be a solid center, but that's all he projected to be. He doesn't move the needle for me at all as far as identifying mistakes in Beane's tenure.

[mjt328]

Kingsley Jonathan made the roster.  

Which means Basham was almost certainly getting cut, if not for us swinging a trade first.

 

Very fair to call him Beane's worst draft pick so far.

[Warriorspikes51]

14 minutes ago, mjt328 said:

Kingsley Jonathan made the roster.  

Which means Basham was almost certainly getting cut, if not for us swinging a trade first.

 

Very fair to call him Beane's worst draft pick so far.

 

Cody Ford says hello...he was a Beane pick right?

Edited August 29, 2023 by Warriorspikes51

[BIGFOOTspaceman]

6 hours ago, May Day 10 said:

I like Beane... but I will say that the early round trash pile has been growing around this team, and they need to start getting some mileage out of some of these guys or they will lose ground

Too far gone. We’re going to see this monster rear it’s head in a year or two. 

[BruceVilanch]

27 minutes ago, 78thealltimegreat said:

Tell that to Caleb Williams 

And Justin Herbert

[C.Biscuit97]

Boogie sent DMs to my lady friend and I made a call to Beane. Sorry to any Boogie fans. 

[DrDawkinstein]

25 minutes ago, Beck Water said:

I've just thrown down that I thought we should have tried if Humphrey could play G and had a C in waiting.

 

But if you're talking about that fumble in the EZ, I'm pretty sure that was on Josh.

 

Oh for sure, I would assign the majority of the blame to Josh on that right now. However, when we have folks saying that Center isnt that important, they just need to snap the ball to the QB... And we just lost a game due to a mishandled snap... I can't help but wonder if Josh is a little more calm taking that snap from a young, strong, non-injured, known road-grader like Humphrey.

[Beck Water]

1 minute ago, DrDawkinstein said:

 

Oh for sure, I would assign the majority of the blame to Josh on that right now. However, when we have folks saying that Center isnt that important, they just need to snap the ball to the QB... And we just lost a game due to a mishandled snap... I can't help but wonder if Josh is a little more calm taking that snap from a young, strong, non-injured, known road-grader like Humphrey.

 

The people saying "center isn't that important they just need to snap the ball to the QB"  need to re-boot; I thought the critical role of the C in setting protections and communicating changes in protection was well-known by now

27 minutes ago, HappyDays said:

 

For the first time in his career, including college? That was one of the question marks on him coming out of Oklahoma. Everyone knew he would likely be a solid center, but that's all he projected to be. He doesn't move the needle for me at all as far as identifying mistakes in Beane's tenure.

 

FWIW, Humphrey pre-draft said he could play G.  What he had to back that up, I don't know.   Maybe the Bills thought "not enough evidence there".

 

Or, maybe Beane honestly felt Cody Ford could still "be that guy" in 2021.  I don't know.

[TheyCallMeAndy]

Aren’t the Giants a 3-4? They planning on using him at OLB?

[starrymessenger]

4 minutes ago, TheyCallMeAndy said:

Aren’t the Giants a 3-4? They planning on using him at OLB?

Yes and yes.

Edited August 29, 2023 by starrymessenger

[Beck Water]

6 minutes ago, TheyCallMeAndy said:

Aren’t the Giants a 3-4? They planning on using him at OLB?

 

Y to both

[RunninRebel37]

6 hours ago, Roundybout said:

You cannot call Elam a bust after a season and a half. 
 

Cook hardly played last season.

Then what term would you use to describe a 1st round pick that’s 4th on the depth chart at their respective position? 

6 hours ago, Bangarang said:

The core of this team? Like who? Tre and Dawkins? Who else is there?

If you don’t want to call them the core it’s a matter of semantics. But any conversation about mainstay players and building blocks, these are the players mentioned. If not tell me who I’m missin? 

[Beck Water]

 

22 minutes ago, Warriorspikes51 said:

Cody Ford says hello...he was a Beane pick right?

 

He was indeed.   But I would argue that the Bills at least got some value out of the 1607 snaps and 29 starts he played for us over 3 years.

They weren't uniformly bad; in fact, enough of them were neutral or positive that Beane was lured into thinking it was all injury probs and he would improve going into 2021.

Boogie Basham played 590 snaps and had 0 starts.  Most notably when he got his snaps in the playoffs due to injuries, he persuaded Beane to pursue DL in FA

 

[DCofNC]

2 hours ago, WyoAZBillfan said:

The Rams got a SB without a ton of hits from the draft, at least not their own drafts. There are other paths. 

And they made moves to get impact players, what have the Bills done to get any?

[OldTimer1960]

7 hours ago, Back2Buff said:

When is Beane going to be held accountable?

Well, when the team isn't in contention.  The league's rules are created to favor the weak teams and to create parity (draft order and salary cap) - those rules are doing exactly what the NFL wants.

 

It is a concern that the Bills seem less than stellar at drafting in the early rounds.  If you are an ultra-optimist, you can conclude that Beane is a wizard in the late rounds/UDFA.  If you are a pessimist, you can conclude that their approach to the draft is a total disaster.  I think the truth lies somewhere in the middle.  With recognition that they've been drafting late in each round now for several seasons and that talent levels in drafts vary from year to year, they really need to evaluate what has gone wrong with their evaluations of players like Cody Ford (2nd), Basham (2nd), Epenesa (though serviceable - 2nd).  It now looks a lot like neither Bernard (3rd) or more concerning Elam (1st) are going to become decent players.  There is something awry in their draft evaluations in the early rounds.

 

I am in the camp of giving them time to figure out and correct their issues in this regard as long as they are still contending.

 

Every team has draft "misses" in the early rounds, but the Bills' rate of early misses is becoming a concern.  They need to be evaluating how they've gone wrong and fix that - whether that be biases toward certain types or whether it means keeping some evaluators/decision makers out of the process.

 

[78thealltimegreat]

55 minutes ago, BruceVilanch said:

And Justin Herbert

Exactly 

[Warcodered]

 

[Beck Water]

Just now, Warcodered said:

 

 

Sheesh, that's gotta sting. 

 

A couple years ago, guy was drafted in the 2nd round 61 overall.

Today he just got traded for a 2025 6th round pick (not even a 2024 pick!) and the Bills had to give change in the form of a 2025 7th rounder.

 

Personally I think Beane got fleeced a bit, but likely the rest of the league was aware that it was a bit of a "fire sale" since someone had to be cut.

[RunninRebel37]

3 minutes ago, Warcodered said:

 

 Damn!!! There were kickers who got traded for more. 

[Since1981]

I find it hard to believe there wasn’t another player on this team ranked behind Boogs. Bad news on a 2nd. Worse news getting 7th