Has Miami really closed the gap?

[PBF81]

FWIW, we're 8-1 in our last 8 vs. Miami with that loss being the game in the insane heat, and 9-2 our last 10 with Allen as the starter. 

 

Average score of the 11 games:  33-20

 

I can see us going 2-0 against them and those two games as being the difference in our records and don't see why that changes this season. 

 

Same schedule except that we play Cincy, Jax, and Tampa, and they play the Baltimore, Tennessee, and Carolina.  

 

I'm more concerned about the Jets with Rodgers who can stay healthy, and given that they get to play Houston, Cleveland, and Atlanta, three teams that were a combined 17-33-1 last season.  

 

 

[buffblue]

3 hours ago, John from Riverside said:

Miami doesn’t even win a game against us last year if they’re not playing in a sauna
 

People are saying that they close the gap because they actually won a game

The fact is the Dolphins are the biggest threat to us, not the Jets. Both Buffalo and Miami can go back and forth about personnel missing in the 3 contests, but what I saw was two very evenly matched teams. 

 

The winning secret or advantage, if there is one for Buffalo, lies in the knowledge that we have the experience of owning recent divisional battles. I think it would be foolish to discount the Dolphins (assuming Tua's health of course). With all that said Buffalo is still the team to beat in the East until proven otherwise 

[Ya Digg?]

Haha I love this place! A couple of years ago the big complaint was the Bills couldn’t win close games. Now they have learned to win close games but that’s not good enough either! So somehow the team needs to make sure each win is a blowout, but make it a close blowout, but not too close

[90sBills]

A better question is: Have the Bills closed the gap to the Bengals? 🤔

[Dan in Owego]

1 minute ago, Ya Digg? said:

Haha I love this place! A couple of years ago the big complaint was the Bills couldn’t win close games. Now they have learned to win close games but that’s not good enough either! So somehow the team needs to make sure each win is a blowout, but make it a close blowout, but not too close

YES! Style points win close you suck, lose close you suck. See the circle lol

[PBF81]

BTW, and another FWIW, the Jets play the Cowboys on the road, but have the Chiefs, Eagles, and Chargers at home.  

 

We have the Cowboys and Jags at home but the Bengals, Chiefs, Eagles, and Chargers on the road.  

 

Big advantage for the Jets.  

 

 

[GoBills808]

They should be better but closing the gap implies they are at Bills level which I don't believe they are

[Augie]

3 minutes ago, PBF81 said:

BTW, and another FWIW, the Jets play the Cowboys on the road, but have the Chiefs, Eagles, and Chargers at home.  

 

We have the Cowboys and Jags at home but the Bengals, Chiefs, Eagles, and Chargers on the road.  

 

Big advantage for the Jets.  

 

 

 

Not really, but I’ll be thrilled to be there anyway. They will be on their second week there, after years of making it a routine. We have the better team, IMO, but we do NOT have home field advantage, so that makes it even tougher. 

[buffblue]

7 minutes ago, PBF81 said:

BTW, and another FWIW, the Jets play the Cowboys on the road, but have the Chiefs, Eagles, and Chargers at home.  

 

We have the Cowboys and Jags at home but the Bengals, Chiefs, Eagles, and Chargers on the road.  

 

Big advantage for the Jets.  

 

 

Well, that's what happens when you finish in last place like the perennial bottom feeder Jets. They will still suck

[buffblue]

Bills 1 

Miami 2

NYJ 3 

NE 4

 

OR

 

Miami 1 

Bills 2 

NYJ 3

NE 4 

 

OR

 

Swap Jets and New England in either scenario. The Jets are not going to be good 

[Inigo Montoya]

1 hour ago, SCBills said:

Agreed.  I low key like McDaniel. 

 

I think the jury is still out on how good of an NFL coach McDaniel is. 

 

I don't like him as a person because of how he handled Tua's injuries and then having the moxie to come out in a press conference and say that he would never put a player out there who wasn't safe to play....   right after the entire NFL watched him do just that!  

 

He put Tua back out against the Bills when he was clearly not safe to play, and to maintain the charade, he sent him back out 5 days later on a short week and nearly got him killed against the Bengals.

 

He said he would never sacrifice a player to get a win.  Does anyone believe that?   Not a fan.

[Bubba Gump]

3 hours ago, billsbackto81 said:

Do the numbers lie? Thoughts?

 

Personally I'm growing tired of how their fans and the media keep hyping this team. Yes, they have a decent team on paper but what have they proven? Constantly being mentioned in the same breath as KC, Cincinnati and Buffalo. Now I do realize the final score is all that matters. But is it really that close when you look at the numbers?

 

Week 3/ Miami 21 Bills 19

 

Total yards.  Miami 212 Bills 497

Passing.       Miami 171 Bills 382

Rushing.       Miami  41 Bills 115

Avg play.      Miami 5.  Bills 6

3rd Downs.  Miami  37% Bills 61%

TOP.             Miami  19:20 Bills 40:40

 

Wildcard Game/ Bills 34 Miami 31

 

Total yards.     Miami 231 Bills 431

Passing.           Miami 189 Bills 316

Rushing.             Miami 42   Bills  107

Avg play.            Miami  3     Bills 6

3rd Downs.      Miami 25%  Bills 56%

TOP                  Miami 27:47 Bills 32:13

 

I'll spare you the details of all the injuries and misfortunes that fell upon our team last year.

 

Buffalo has dominated this team more than any other. Statistically its not even close! I just don't get the hype.

 

 

 

 

 

Looking at those first game stats, you would've thought the score was Buff 52 Mia 14. It's almost embarrassing that they lost. The one, and only one reason the Bills lost, is because it was 182 degrees in muggy air you could cut with a knife. 

[SCBills]

57 minutes ago, PBF81 said:

As several others have pointe out, how good Miami is will depend upon Tua's health status.  

 

He averaged nearly 2 passing TDs/game last season, which over 17 games had he played more than 13, would have put him at 4th in the league right behind Allen.  

 

Allen owns Miami, but that Sklar Thompson game should be enough to cause us not to overlook them.  Thompson will be lucky to ever start another game in the NFL except for injury to a starter or even a 2nd-stringer.  

 

If Tua stays healthy, they should be as competitive as any team that's not the Chiefs, Bengals, or us.  

 

 

Eh.. I’m not reading into the Wild Card game. 
 

That team was in danger of losing to NE the week before and then didn’t even show up the following week against CIN. 
 

I don’t know who that was post-Hamlin injury, but it wasn’t the Bills. 

[Airseven]

2 hours ago, SCBills said:

Answer for me, the following questions:

 

With Ramsey out until December, who has the better.. (I’ll give you mine)

 

Safeties? (Bills) 

 

Cornerbacks? (Bills) 

 

Linebackers? (Bills)

 

Defensive Line? (Push)

 

OL? (Bills)

 

WR’s? (Dolphins)

 

TE’s (Bills)

 

RB’s? (Push)

 

QB? (Bills)

 

*Jevon Holland is a beast, but one Holland doesn’t overcome both Hyde & Poyer, with Rapp as depth 

 

*With a healthy Ramsey, I’d put the Dolphins ahead of the Bills at CB, but without him, Bills are better 

 

*Both teams have meh at one LB spot, and I like Long, but he isn’t Milano 

 

*DL, I want to go Bills, but the Fins DL is also nasty, and ours being better is dependent upon Von coming back at close to his pre-injury ability 

 

*Both OL’s enter the season with question marks, but Bills have more potential and more depth 

*WR’s, Hill and Waddle are monsters.. We only have one Diggs 

 

*TE’s, easily Bills with Knox and Kincaid 

 

*RB’s, too close to call.  Bills RB room is solid and Cook could be big time, but Miami’s has elite speed 

 

*QB, this isn’t worth an explanation 

There’s no point debating this if you think Mostert and Wilson are somehow a “push” with Cook and Harris. And of course, one Holland doesn’t “overcome” but yet one Milano surely does. You’re locked in and belong here. Let’s just hope you’re not disappointed this season.

[SCBills]

4 minutes ago, Airseven said:

There’s no point debating this if you think Mostert and Wilson are somehow a “push” with Cook and Harris. And of course, one Holland doesn’t “overcome” but yet one Milano surely does. You’re locked in and belong here. Let’s just hope you’re not disappointed this season.

1) Milano vs Long

 

2) Holland vs Hyde & Poyer

 

3) And then you squabble on two middle of the pack RB rooms 

It’s not being a homer to point out that you’re a hater … and I’m certainly not one to be over the top in my praise of this teams roster construction.  I’m sure plenty of posters could vouch for my frequent criticisms of Beane/McDermott and their asset allocation. 
 

That said.. we have a very talented team, with a QB who is elite tier.  
 

It could, and should, be better … but what it is, is still very talented and deep … more so than the Dolphins roster.  And you did not provide much pushback in your post.  

 

Edited July 29, 2023 by SCBills

[billsbackto81]

58 minutes ago, 90sBills said:

A better question is: Have the Bills closed the gap to the Bengals? 🤔

Give me a game with 2 evenly healthy teams and maybe we'll get an answer.

 

That game would've been different with a healthy Von, Micah and Daquan along with Tre, Gabe and Poyer less than 100%. Not trying to make excuses, all I'm saying is head to head 100% healthy this team can beat and at times embarrass anybody.

[PBF81]

26 minutes ago, SCBills said:

Eh.. I’m not reading into the Wild Card game. 
 

That team was in danger of losing to NE the week before and then didn’t even show up the following week against CIN. 
 

I don’t know who that was post-Hamlin injury, but it wasn’t the Bills. 

 

My point was that not overlooking them should mean a win for us.  

 

And yeah, I don't put much into that Wild-Card game at this time either.  

 

 

[chongli]

In the meantime, Dolphins fans are going gaga over Tua throwing "dimes" in practice:

 

https://www.instagram.com/p/CvQJVm0pIxw/?img_index=1

[PBF81]

5 minutes ago, chongli said:

In the meantime, Dolphins fans are going gaga over Tua throwing "dimes" in practice:

 

https://www.instagram.com/p/CvQJVm0pIxw/?img_index=1

 

LOL, that receiver looks like Agador in The Birdcage.  

 

 

[SoTier]

9 hours ago, Airseven said:

Yes. The three games last year are evidence. Dolphins eked one out in the heat. Bills eked one out in the snow. Bills eked out a home playoff game against a D-league QB. Dolphins have done a good job adding high end talent to their roster. There is no gap. Best of all the rivalry is back full throttle.

 

The gap between the Fins and Bills at QB is the size of the Grand Canyon.  Tua is a good QB but he's not in the same zip code as Allen, Burrow or Mahomes, and that's the Bills' trump card.

 

[SoTier]

6 hours ago, Inigo Montoya said:

 

I think the jury is still out on how good of an NFL coach McDaniel is. 

 

I don't like him as a person because of how he handled Tua's injuries and then having the moxie to come out in a press conference and say that he would never put a player out there who wasn't safe to play....   right after the entire NFL watched him do just that!  

 

He put Tua back out against the Bills when he was clearly not safe to play, and to maintain the charade, he sent him back out 5 days later on a short week and nearly got him killed against the Bengals.

 

He said he would never sacrifice a player to get a win.  Does anyone believe that?   Not a fan.

 

I'm also not sold on McDaniel.  Maybe he's the genius that he's been proclaimed to be, but the NFL's history is littered with coaches who seemed great in their first season but proved otherwise.   Most recently, Chip Kelly with the Eagles and Kliff Kingsbury with the Cards turned out not to be quite the geniuses they were considered early on.

[newcam2012]

7 hours ago, PBF81 said:

FWIW, we're 8-1 in our last 8 vs. Miami with that loss being the game in the insane heat, and 9-2 our last 10 with Allen as the starter. 

 

Average score of the 11 games:  33-20

 

I can see us going 2-0 against them and those two games as being the difference in our records and don't see why that changes this season. 

 

Same schedule except that we play Cincy, Jax, and Tampa, and they play the Baltimore, Tennessee, and Carolina.  

 

I'm more concerned about the Jets with Rodgers who can stay healthy, and given that they get to play Houston, Cleveland, and Atlanta, three teams that were a combined 17-33-1 last season.  

 

 

I'm not sure how relevant the last ten games vs Miami are. I think it's much more accurate to look at last year in a vacuum sort of speak. Why? 

 

Tua basically was in play only last year. With him they are clearly a different team and much more difficult to beat. It appears his teammates play hard for him and believe in him. If Tua is healthy (granted a big if) they will likely be a tough out. 

 

Also, you have to consider the Miami coach as well. First year coach who looked to be more than capable of leading his team to many wins. 

 

Lastly, you have to really examine the Bills three games vs Miami last year. It's pretty disingenuous to say the Bills should have won all three games. Everyone of those games were down to the wire. They truly could have gone either way. If memory serves me right, the Bills won one of those games on a controversial 4th call by coach McDaniels. Many thought that call blew the game for Miami. Additionally, the Bills playoff win was another great battle. Right down to the final play. 

 

In short, the Dolphins are more than capable of beating the Bills. Last year pretty much sums that up. I can totally see a split of 1 to 1. 

Edited July 29, 2023 by newcam2012

[Ridgewaycynic2013]

9 minutes ago, SoTier said:

 

I'm also not sold on McDaniel.  Maybe he's the genius that he's been proclaimed to be, but the NFL's history is littered with coaches who seemed great in their first season but proved otherwise.  

[transient]

7 hours ago, chongli said:

In the meantime, Dolphins fans are going gaga over Tua throwing "dimes" in practice:

 

https://www.instagram.com/p/CvQJVm0pIxw/?img_index=1

Look at the air he has to put under a 25 yd pass. 😂 If we had a healthy secondary at any point when we played them last year this isn’t even a thread. 

[Beast]

9 hours ago, Ethan in Cleveland said:

Bills better team. Dolphins better coach.

Allen as is in most cases is the difference. He almost willed a win in Miami and almost gifted them a wildcard win in Buffalo.

McDaniel over McDermott? That’s a complete garbage take.

[Don Otreply]

The Miami QB is physically fragile and with his on going history of concussions/brain injury, he is very seriously one hit from being out of commission for an extended period of time…, 

[BillsFan130]

Yes they have in my opinion.

 

I think bills are still a better team and will win the division.

 

But if Tua stays healthy, they got a damn good team over there.

That Ramsey injury is a big loss for them though 

[Mr. WEO]

14 hours ago, billsbackto81 said:

 

 

Personally I'm growing tired of how their fans and the media keep hyping this team. Yes, they have a decent team on paper but what have they proven? Constantly being mentioned in the same breath as KC, Cincinnati and Buffalo. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Link?  I see 2 power polls have them at 9, one at 7.  None in top 5 (like KC, Buff, Cincy, Phily).

[Big Turk]

You can't close the gap when your franchise QB is a player who has missed multiple games every year since senior year of high school. 

 

It's too hard to try and win any games without your starting QB unless you are San Fran where you can play mix and match QBs and it doesn't matter or your starter is terrible. 

 

So no...Tua won't stay healthy as per usual, and Fins will be capped at 9 or 10 wins because of it.

[Billl]

12 hours ago, GoBills808 said:

They should be better but closing the gap implies they are at Bills level which I don't believe they are

Did you have an issue with this line from the OP?  “Constantly being mentioned in the same breath as KC, Cincinnati and Buffalo”?

 

Bills fans don’t seem to have a problem putting themselves in the same category as the Bengals and Chiefs, but they tend to get offended when someone puts the Dolphins in the same category as the Bills.  So my question is, if Miami hasn’t shown that they belong in a conversation with Buffalo, what has Buffalo done to belong in a conversation with Kansas City?

Edited July 29, 2023 by Billl

[sherpa]

4 minutes ago, Billl said:

Did you have an issue with this line from the OP?  “Constantly being mentioned in the same breath as KC, Cincinnati and Buffalo”?

 

Bills fans don’t seem to have a problem putting themselves in the same category as the Bengals and Chiefs, but they tend to get offended when someone puts the Dolphins in the same category as the Bills.  So my question is, if Miami hasn’t shown that they belong in a conversation with Buffalo, what has Buffalo done to belong in a conversation with Kansas City?

 

Beat them twice in the past two years regular season in Kansas City.

Took them to an overtime coin toss in Kansas City in the playoffs.

Not sure how you could be closer.

 

I'm not saying the Bills are better. They certainly were a franchise hurting at the end of last season, but to suggest that they "don't belong in the conversation," is not valid.

Miami absolutely has improved, and I have no problem acknowledging that.

[Generic_Bills_Fan]

I don’t think the Miami offense is gonna snap right back to how good they were the first third of last season.  It’s been overshadowed by the tua injuries later on but defenses started to adapt to tuas tendencies and things were getting more difficult for them as time went on.  They didn’t really improve at coverage linebacker either which hurts them against us and their offensive line is virtually the same without a lot of depth
 

They had a good game against us late in the season but our defense was pretty much in shambles after von went down we just didn’t play a lot of high power offenses in the second half of the season 

 

the playoff game was a bit of a fluke as far as our offense against them goes, we were a few near misses from racking up tons of yards and points but virtually everything that could go wrong did 

 

without Ramsey for most of the season, the dolphins didn’t improve even close to as much as the bills and jets this offseason 

Edited July 29, 2023 by Generic_Bills_Fan

[Billl]

2 minutes ago, sherpa said:

 

Beat them twice in the past two years regular season in Kansas City.

Took them to an overtime coin toss in Kansas City in the playoffs.

Not sure how you could be closer.

 

I'm not saying the Bills are better. They certainly were a franchise hurting at the end of last season, but to suggest that they "don't belong in the conversation," is not valid.

Miami absolutely has improved, and I have no problem acknowledging that.

So you seem to agree that if Buffalo belongs in the conversation with Kansas City then Miami belongs in the conversation with Buffalo, which is fair IMO.  It’s the people who seem to think that it’s an insult to the Bills being compared to the Dolphins (because of the Dolphins’ relative lack of achievements) but assume that the Bills are on the same level as the Bengals and Chiefs who have a skewed perspective.

[SCBills]

Just now, Billl said:

So you seem to agree that if Buffalo belongs in the conversation with Kansas City then Miami belongs in the conversation with Buffalo, which is fair IMO.  It’s the people who seem to think that it’s an insult to the Bills being compared to the Dolphins (because of the Dolphins’ relative lack of achievements) but assume that the Bills are on the same level as the Bengals and Chiefs who have a skewed perspective.

I think most here believe that there are 3 teams that talent/qb are above all others in the AFC:

 

Chiefs.  Bills.  Bengals. 
 

That said, most of us also acknowledge that KC is on top until dethroned and the Bengals have made it to the Super Bowl.  
 

Bills have some work to do in the postseason department and, until we do, our coaching seems to be what is called into question compared to KC and CIN… and that’s fair. 

[Doc]

They did until Ramsey went down.  

[SCBills]

1 minute ago, Doc said:

They did until Ramsey went down.  

With Ramsey, I have the Dolphins entering the season with a better WR room and better Secondary than the Bills.  
 

Pretty equal everywhere else, with the Bills having better TE’s and more potential on the DL and OL, depending on Von’s recovery.  
 

Essentially coming down to Allen vs Tua … heavy edge to Buffalo at QB. 
 

Without Ramsey.. The only definitive edge the Fins have on us is at WR. 
 

That’s not enough.  

[billsbackto81]

3 hours ago, Mr. WEO said:

 

 

Link?  I see 2 power polls have them at 9, one at 7.  None in top 5 (like KC, Buff, Cincy, Phily).

Never mentioned a link. Referring mostly to YouTube sports videos, Twitter, podcasts and fans in general. 

[noacls]

I am a Bills Fan, however:

Dolphins have better coaching

Bills almost lost to backup QB in playoffs 

 

No one can make excuses like a Bills Fan

 

More worried about Miami than Jets. Bills do not do well with speed. Miami is all speed

Edited July 29, 2023 by noacls

[Rc2catch]

Fangio probably does elevate that defense to close the gap some on buffalo. I’m just not sold on McDaniel and the offense. They had their best games against weak defenses. The whole offense is based on going over the middle and they feasted on teams like the lions and bears. When they played better defenses he abandoned the run and when the middle was taken away Tua couldn’t adjust. Maybe they expand on that, their speed and pre snap motions seemed to work well. I think if they establish a consistent run game this year they’ll be able to compete with anyone. But until someone dethrones Buffalo from the east or Miami does anything in the playoffs I wouldn’t hype them too much. Just another team like a handful of others that are about to breakout as a threat for the next 2-4 years or blow the whole thing up 

[billsbackto81]

3 hours ago, sherpa said:

 

Beat them twice in the past two years regular season in Kansas City.

Took them to an overtime coin toss in Kansas City in the playoffs.

Not sure how you could be closer.

 

I'm not saying the Bills are better. They certainly were a franchise hurting at the end of last season, but to suggest that they "don't belong in the conversation," is not valid.

Miami absolutely has improved, and I have no problem acknowledging that.

I don't feel it is valid.  Yes they have improved, so has every other team to an extent.  Do they belong in the conversation with other perennial playoff teams? IMO, no. Buffalo has beaten the Dolphins I believe 9 out of 11 since JA17, most in dominant fashion. They have been in the postseason 4 consecutive seasons (4 wins) and have 3 consecutive division titles.

 

Miami? Backed into the playoffs last year and hasn't won one in 20 years.

 

Great team on paper though 😂

 

I understand this can change at any time like it did with our Bills and it just might this season, maybe.