RD 3, Pick 91: LB Dorian Williams, Tulane

[3rdand12]

19 hours ago, aceman_16 said:

Well good thing I am not on twitter. I have been a long time board member (before this date just lost my info...I am old) as you have.l been. I have agreed with a majority of what you said over time. However, by saying Buffalo misses on LBers when one was a multiple time pro bowler who got paid a 72 million dollar deal with 50 million guaranteed in free agency and the other considered one of the best we have ever had and an all-pro as "meh no big deal dis team still suckz dudez when it comes to picking linebackers" is an absolute cold take and at this point you're bordering on troll status.

respect this too 👍
 

17 hours ago, In Summary said:

Besides Jones, what DT is going to keep these little guys clean? 

This was my point pre draft

Following another fine poster or two  here , in regard to drafting a 1 tech to back Jones

Was hoping we would even in the late rounds.

 Even more so seeing the LBs we will be fielding post draft etc

 

[3rdand12]

4 hours ago, SCBills said:

Cam Lynch compares him to Edmunds.   
 

Honestly, looking at his tape a bit … I see it. 
 

Obviously doesn’t have the freak size Edmunds has, but he processes, reads and reacts much more instinctually. 
 

If he can win the MLB, I’m starting to think this guy might be a stud in our defense.    Unlike Edmunds, he plays with bad intentions. 
 

 

Check the bolded

Thats all really asked for.
go f someone up Dorian 😋

9 minutes ago, Ethan in Cleveland said:

Every team in the NFL is in nickel more than 50% of the time. Johnson is a top 4 player on this defense

I am aware it a passing League.

 But last season he was asked to do too much. And it showed.

I think he is one of the best and loved him since year one !

[TheWeatherMan]

On 4/29/2023 at 4:47 AM, Reed83HOF said:

 

Top Reasons to Buy In:

Size and frame

Special teams resume and experience on defense

Movement skills and college production

 

Top Reasons For Concern:

Ability to take on and deconstruct blocks

Contact balance

Modest read and react skills 

Sounds like the same concerns we had with Edmunds…every year.  

[Augie]

20 hours ago, boyst said:

Follow me for more actual football knowledge. It may help you learn some X's and o's but until then. Xxx 😍

Not at all. I've been posting a very long time. I once got flamed for an entire dissertation on linebacker play and how Milano was more important to this team than Edmunds... And I got flamed by many.  This was after Edmunds rookie year.

 

 I need to post more so I can actually have some folks understand my knowledge of X's and o's or just not post at all. 

 

The Twitter style ***** hot takes posting folks do these days sucks.

 

But, beyond your football knowledge, I think we can all learn something about humility from you. Thank you for that.  😋

 

 

.

Edited April 30, 2023 by Augie

[SCBills]

11 minutes ago, TheWeatherMan said:

Sounds like the same concerns we had with Edmunds…every year.  

Interesting that Marino says he has modest read and react skills, because the ESPN guys raved about those skills for Williams and Overshown on back to back picks.  
 

And it wasn’t just them fluffing every player, because those same ESPN guys ripped Simpson and Henley a few picks earlier for being slow to read and react. 
 

Edited April 30, 2023 by SCBills

[boyst]

10 minutes ago, Augie said:

 

But, beyond your football knowledge, I think we can all learn something about humility from you. Thank you for that.  😋

 

 

.

... 😑🤣

[GreggTX]

Not that he'll be great, but a 4.49 40 time! That's crazy fast for a LB. In any case, he's a Bill so I wish him the best and who knows? Maybe he will be great after all. Stranger things have happened. There are a few UDFA's in the HOF after all. We can only hope he'll be the next.

[newcam2012]

Could be the sleeper of the draft. Pure athlete here. 

[Chaos]

5 hours ago, SCBills said:

Interesting that Marino says he has modest read and react skills, because the ESPN guys raved about those skills for Williams and Overshown on back to back picks.  
 

And it wasn’t just them fluffing every player, because those same ESPN guys ripped Simpson and Henley a few picks earlier for being slow to read and react. 
 

What is Marino's background as a college talent assessor? 

[PrimeTime101]

5 hours ago, TheWeatherMan said:

Sounds like the same concerns we had with Edmunds…every year.  

yes accept he can make it up with his quickness and slightly faster... Edmunds was horrible in coverage.. this guy is not. 

 

I will judge though when nfl practices and preseason games hit.

[Dan in Owego]

12 minutes ago, Chaos said:

What is Marino's background as a college talent assessor? 

That is a good question, the nfl draft network group as a whole have some odd takes. I keep leaning in a little more towards PFF for my draft takes, i just think they have a better group to breakdown prospects.

[Nephilim17]

Considering it's a passing league and our D has surrendered some big games to some upper-echelon tight ends, the following gives me some optimism:

 

"Remains disciplined with coverage assignments, gets depth on pass drops, and easily runs downfield with tight ends."

https://www.profootballnetwork.com/dorian-williams-lb-tulane-nfl-draft-scouting-report-2023/

 

" He has the athleticism to match up with tight ends and running backs in man coverage. In zone coverage..."

https://thegamehaus.com/nfl-draft/dorian-williams-2023-nfl-draft-profile/2023/04/24/

 

"He can cover tight ends man-to-man and plays well in zone coverage."

https://www.yardbarker.com/nfl/articles/amp/buffalo_bills_2023_nfl_draft_review/s1_17198_38762510

 

"Carries tight ends and running backs with solid speed down the field."

 

https://bleacherreport.com/articles/10073386-dorian-williams-nfl-draft-2023-scouting-report-for-buffalo-bills-lb

[Chaos]

Just now, Dan in Owego said:

That is a good question, the nfl draft network group as a whole have some odd takes. I keep leaning in a little more towards PFF for my draft takes, i just think they have a better group to breakdown prospects.

PFF grades each player in each college game all year.  You do not have to love their methodology but it does mean they have a group of people paying attention all season not just during “draft season”

 

[MrEpsYtown]

I watched the USC game today, which was touted as his best game. He was all over the place, but he was still a bit up and down. Really over committed on the rpo stuff, play action and counter stuff. He also made some ridiculous plays. I feel like he was a bit in conflict at times with what he was tasked to do, which looked like it was a lot. Got pushed around a bit, and had a bad missed tackle on a long USC TD but you can see flashes in his game. He destroys the running back on the 1 yard line which led to a safety that absolutely changed the game. He’s a playmaker. There is a lot to like here, but I am not sure he’s going to be ready to step in this year. JMO based on one game film. 

[John from Riverside]

I didn’t realize this, but it’s worth noting
 

Lavante David was the guy we were all clamoring for to replace Edmonds

 

Lavonte David is 61 233 pounds

 

Dorian Williams is 61 228 pounds

[MrEpsYtown]

4 minutes ago, John from Riverside said:

I didn’t realize this, but it’s worth noting
 

Lavante David was the guy we were all clamoring for to replace Edmonds

 

Lavonte David is 61 233 pounds

 

Dorian Williams is 61 228 pounds

Yeah I feel like a lot of fan’s expectations of the what a mike looks like is skewed by having a unicorn like Tremaine. 
 

Roquan Smith is 6-1, 232

Fred Warner is 6-3, 230
Demario Davis was 6-2, 235 when drafted…now he weights 248.

Eric Kendricks is 6-0, 232

 

With his length and frame I see zero reason why Williams couldn’t add 10-15 lbs of muscle. 

 

 

 

[Sierra Foothills]

2 hours ago, Nephilim17 said:

Considering it's a passing league and our D has surrendered some big games to some upper-echelon tight ends, the following gives me some optimism:

 

"Remains disciplined with coverage assignments, gets depth on pass drops, and easily runs downfield with tight ends."

https://www.profootballnetwork.com/dorian-williams-lb-tulane-nfl-draft-scouting-report-2023/

 

" He has the athleticism to match up with tight ends and running backs in man coverage. In zone coverage..."

https://thegamehaus.com/nfl-draft/dorian-williams-2023-nfl-draft-profile/2023/04/24/

 

"He can cover tight ends man-to-man and plays well in zone coverage."

https://www.yardbarker.com/nfl/articles/amp/buffalo_bills_2023_nfl_draft_review/s1_17198_38762510

 

"Carries tight ends and running backs with solid speed down the field."

 

https://bleacherreport.com/articles/10073386-dorian-williams-nfl-draft-2023-scouting-report-for-buffalo-bills-lb

 

It's fair to say that much of what the Bills do defensively is done with Kansas City in mind... more so than Cinci I think.

 

[Drew21PA]

This is a miss in my opinion 

[Doc]

9 hours ago, John from Riverside said:

I didn’t realize this, but it’s worth noting
 

Lavante David was the guy we were all clamoring for to replace Edmonds

 

Lavonte David is 61 233 pounds

 

Dorian Williams is 61 228 pounds

 

9 hours ago, MrEpsYtown said:

Yeah I feel like a lot of fan’s expectations of the what a mike looks like is skewed by having a unicorn like Tremaine. 
 

Roquan Smith is 6-1, 232

Fred Warner is 6-3, 230
Demario Davis was 6-2, 235 when drafted…now he weights 248.

Eric Kendricks is 6-0, 232

 

With his length and frame I see zero reason why Williams couldn’t add 10-15 lbs of muscle. 

 

Darius (I guess he's going by his miiddle name "Shaquille" now) Leonard is 6'2" and 230#.

[Buffalo_Stampede]

He definitely not small for todays game. He’s not big. His size won’t hold him back

 

It’ll come down to instincts.

[nedboy7]

Let’s not forget ….

 

Milano is small with limited speed, making him a liability against NFL blockers and when matched up in coverage against tight ends. He's a fit only for the 4-3 scheme, and he'll have to play in a "Sam" role. With a narrow frame, it's possible Milano is maxed out physically and wouldn't be able to add the bulk to better handle blockers and make plays in traffic. A lack of twitch in his game makes Milano a gamble outside of the later rounds of the draft.
 

[colin]

i think it's pretty clear w mcd taking over the d and the success we've had w milano he wanted an athletic heat seeking missile who he could coach up.

 

when it's at it's best, the mcd d is always guys just screaming toward the ball borderline over playing their lanes and the back 4-6 erasing long stuff but attacking quickly when they recognize what is in front of them.  

 

this guy might bust out or not, but he'll learn under mc d directly, and milano always plays like his hair is on fire, so Williams won't be confused as to what his play style will be.  I think he might be an effective starter by the end of the season.  that's a huge win vs paying edmunds nearly 20mm a year.

[Success]

Just curious - does anyone think we would have taken Overshown if Dallas hadn't picked him?

 

I know zilch about the college game & players, so wondering if these 2 were rated much differently.

 

[Buffalo_Stampede]

37 minutes ago, Success said:

Just curious - does anyone think we would have taken Overshown if Dallas hadn't picked him?

 

I know zilch about the college game & players, so wondering if these 2 were rated much differently.

 

I think if the Bills felt strongly about any of the LBs taken in the 3rd they would’ve traded up for him. 

[Sierra Foothills]

2 hours ago, Buffalo_Stampede said:

He definitely not small for todays game. He’s not big. His size won’t hold him back

 

It’ll come down to instincts.

 

Also, very few linebackers can overcome poor play by the d-line in front of them.

 

In order for most LBs to have success, they need to be protected from blockers.

 

In the present day linebackers have never been smaller and offensive linemen have never been larger.

 

Regarding LB size, it used to be Chuck Bednarik, Sam Huff, Ray Nietschke, Dick Butkus, Willie Lanier, Tommy Nobis, ad infinitum were as big as the o-linemen who were blocking them. That was back when Lombardi's "Run to Daylight" was the blueprint for NFL success.

 

In today's pass-crazy NFL, Tremaine Edmunds is an outlyer as was Ray Lewis. It's rare to see a 250 lb LB anymore.

 

 

 

[Buffalo_Stampede]

1 minute ago, Sierra Foothills said:

 

Also, very few linebackers can overcome poor play by the d-line in front of them.

 

In order for most LBs to have success, they need to be protected from blockers.

 

In the present day linebackers have never been smaller and offensive linemen have never been larger.

 

Regarding LB size, it used to be Chuck Bednarik, Sam Huff, Ray Nietschke, Dick Butkus, Willie Lanier, Tommy Nobis, ad infinitum were as big as the o-linemen who were blocking them. That was back when Lombardi's "Run to Daylight" was the blueprint for NFL success.

 

In today's pass-crazy NFL, Tremaine Edmunds is an outlyer as was Ray Lewis. It's rare to see a 250 lb LB anymore.

 

 

 

Yep. The talk should probably be about DL more than about 5-10 lbs on a MLB.

[Warriorspikes51]

I went back and looked at my spreadsheet big board for us and I see that I had him as a mid round pick potentially for us.

So I'm upset with myself for being upset haha 

[Augie]

6 minutes ago, Buffalo_Stampede said:

Yep. The talk should probably be about DL more than about 5-10 lbs on a MLB.

 

Beane is on record as saying Dorian the newest Williams will start on the outside. Do we not believe him? Do we think that won’t last long? Klein is very limited in coverage and would get picked on unless we scheme to protect him (as I think we adjusted to last year when he was forced to play). I still don’t know who the MLB will be replacing Tremaine. I doubt we change our scheme much, maybe just get a little more aggressive in implementation. So who is the next MLB? 

[Buffalo_Stampede]

28 minutes ago, Augie said:

 

Beane is on record as saying Dorian the newest Williams will start on the outside. Do we not believe him? Do we think that won’t last long? Klein is very limited in coverage and would get picked on unless we scheme to protect him (as I think we adjusted to last year when he was forced to play). I still don’t know who the MLB will be replacing Tremaine. I doubt we change our scheme much, maybe just get a little more aggressive in implementation. So who is the next MLB? 

Who knows, it’s May 1st.

 

Did you ever feel like Edmunds size was a factor in the run game? It was his size and length in the pass game that was talked about.

 

Im not even concerned at all about LB size defending the run, especially when we had slot CBs taking on OL in the past. It’s really a non factor for me.

 

What they are probably planning is matching personnel more. Meaning putting a more physical LB on the field vs obvious run personnel and going lighter vs pass personnel.

29 minutes ago, Warriorspikes51 said:

I went back and looked at my spreadsheet big board for us and I see that I had him as a mid round pick potentially for us.

So I'm upset with myself for being upset haha 

So you’re upset you were right? I honestly didn’t look at many mid-late LBs because I felt they’d get one in the 1st 2 rounds. Arm length was something I looked at. Henley was the guy I felt they’d fall for if they waited until the middle rounds because of arm length. Williams is similar.

Edited May 1, 2023 by Buffalo_Stampede

[Ralonzo]

8 minutes ago, Buffalo_Stampede said:

Did you ever feel like Edmunds size was a factor in the run game? It was his size and length in the pass game that was talked about.

 

Im not even concerned at all about LB size defending the run, especially when we had slot CBs taking on OL in the past. It’s really a non factor for me.

 

It's funny but what was most talked about for Edmunds was never how many plays he made, but how many plays he "prevented" by being so big and long and stuff that they didn't even attempt to make a throw. To which I always responded, 1) you really can't disprove a negative can you? and 2) did anyone ever watch a KC tape where Mahomes moves Edmunds all over the field with his eyes, like a cat with a laser pointer, opening up the throws to Kelce all game long. If the goal is to defend KC I don't think Edmunds was ever going to be the answer and I'm willing to see if someone - anyone - is.

[strive_for_five_guy]

34 minutes ago, Warriorspikes51 said:

I went back and looked at my spreadsheet big board for us and I see that I had him as a mid round pick potentially for us.

So I'm upset with myself for being upset haha 

[syhuang]

3 hours ago, Drew21PA said:

This is a miss in my opinion 

 

very unique take after 35 pages..... 😜😜

Edited May 1, 2023 by syhuang

[CapeBreton]

 

[Mat68]

34 minutes ago, Augie said:

 

Beane is on record as saying Dorian the newest Williams will start on the outside. Do we not believe him? Do we think that won’t last long? Klein is very limited in coverage and would get picked on unless we scheme to protect him (as I think we adjusted to last year when he was forced to play). I still don’t know who the MLB will be replacing Tremaine. I doubt we change our scheme much, maybe just get a little more aggressive in implementation. So who is the next MLB? 

He walked backed the Outside only.  He was told to learn both positions.  I feel Beane is hoping Bernard wins the mike and plays well.  Williams becomes the 3rd linebaker in 4-3 sets and primary backup to both positions.  Beane is tempering expectations and allow the guys who have been in the system a chance at Mike.  If no one takes it Williams is the next guy to get the shot.
 

5 years of Edmunds has made the size difference jarring but compared to Devin White, Fred Warner and Shaq Leonard he is about the same size.  Williams wingspan is unique to the other elite LB.  I like the way he plays and physicality he brings at the point of contact.  

[RoyBatty is alive]

On 4/28/2023 at 9:39 PM, jlgarsh said:

I went to Tulane. Let’s go!!!

I went to Grad School at Tulane.  What an incredible year we had, best football year in nearly a century.  No one alive would have realistically predicted at 12 win season topped off with beating USC in the Cotton Bowl.

 

Love the pick, smart kid with great versatility and speed!

[NewEra]

The more I watch and the more I read about him, the more I think he has a chance to play alongside Milano towards the end of the year and be an asset in the playoffs.  Not a star by any means, but good enough to do what McD needs.  
 

 

[Augie]

4 hours ago, Mat68 said:

He walked backed the Outside only.  He was told to learn both positions.  I feel Beane is hoping Bernard wins the mike and plays well.  Williams becomes the 3rd linebaker in 4-3 sets and primary backup to both positions.  Beane is tempering expectations and allow the guys who have been in the system a chance at Mike.  If no one takes it Williams is the next guy to get the shot.
 

5 years of Edmunds has made the size difference jarring but compared to Devin White, Fred Warner and Shaq Leonard he is about the same size.  Williams wingspan is unique to the other elite LB.  I like the way he plays and physicality he brings at the point of contact.  

 

It’s funny, but I didn’t have to see the jersey number or even the hair, Edmunds was THE BIG GUY out there! Then came Groot, but Edmunds always stood out as the first guy you want walking off the bus. 

[Buffalo_Stampede]

 

[MrEpsYtown]

4 hours ago, Mat68 said:

He walked backed the Outside only.  He was told to learn both positions.  I feel Beane is hoping Bernard wins the mike and plays well.  Williams becomes the 3rd linebaker in 4-3 sets and primary backup to both positions.  Beane is tempering expectations and allow the guys who have been in the system a chance at Mike.  If no one takes it Williams is the next guy to get the shot.
 

5 years of Edmunds has made the size difference jarring but compared to Devin White, Fred Warner and Shaq Leonard he is about the same size.  Williams wingspan is unique to the other elite LB.  I like the way he plays and physicality he brings at the point of contact.  

I don’t feel the love for Bernard, I feel it for Dodson the way Beane is talking. It sounds like it is clearly his job to lose. Bernard is a special teamer who has zero chance to win this job imo. He has no advantage physically or experience wise over Spector. Dodson isn’t as good an athlete but has 4 years experience in the system is still only 24. For Bernard, the only thing he has going for him was he was drafted in the 3rd round. 
 

Edited May 1, 2023 by MrEpsYtown

[Buffalo_Stampede]

4 minutes ago, MrEpsYtown said:

I don’t feel the love for Bernard, I feel it for Dodson the way Beane is talking. It sounds like it is clearly his job to lose. Bernard is a special teamer who has zero chance to win this job imo. He has no advantage physically or experience wise over Bernard or Spector. The only thing he has going for him was he was drafted in the 3rd round. 

Saw Bernard at OTAs and he looked like he hasn’t lifted all offseason.

Edited May 1, 2023 by Buffalo_Stampede